Sword Art Online - Character Discussion - Kirito

[Wild Goose]

I spent two years of my life studying for a law degree, I gotta use my debating skills somewhere.

Well, I think I've conclusively answered the troll. It's like launching a Time on Target barrage on a machine gun nest Or calling in an Arclight.

Again, while I may be backslidden in my religion, I do take one of the suggestions of my religious text to heart: answer fools in such a way that their foolishness becomes evident.

[sky black swordman]

I spent two years of my life studying for a law degree, I gotta use my debating skills somewhere.

Then how are some of us supposed to win.

[Eratas123]

Okay, let's go talk about something else: Has Kirito's schooling been acknowledged at all? He did miss 2 years of high school, and missing school is very debilitating in Japan.

[lansglenn]

Originally Posted by Eratas123

Okay, let's go talk about something else: Has Kirito's schooling been acknowledged at all? He did miss 2 years of high school, and missing school is very debilitating in Japan.

Maybe I'm not understanding the question, but shouldn't the answer be evidently "yes"? I mean he's stuck in the game so there's no way he can attend school. 0_o

And to my knowledge, before the SAO incident, Kirito was a pretty cookie-cutter standard boy -- which includes going to school.

[Eratas123]

I meant do they make him go back and repeat the first two years or not? I heard he was about to go to college in Mother's Rosario (Just finished reading GGO), but I don't know if that's true.

[joshuafaramir]

Kirito is the MODERN VERSION of Kenshin Himura (Rurouni Kenshin for those who don't know).

[Wild Goose]

I'll answer this question here:

Spoiler for Schooling:

Kirito goes back to school after SAO. The government opens up a special school for the kids who were trapped in SAO. Asuna, Scilica and Lizbeth are also students there.

During Alicization, he's in his second year of high school, while Asuna is a 3rd year student and prepraring for her uni entrance exams.

[Eratas123]

Alright, thank you for answering Then again, I'm worried about Klein. I always figured he was in college, but I could be wrong.

[Wild Goose]

Regards Klein:

Spoiler for What is Klein doing:

He's a white collar worker in an import-export company. He grumbles alot, but the pay is apparently decent and his boss covered his bills during the time he was in SAO, and gave him his job back once he got out of rehab. Klein may not totally like his job, but he's loyal to his boss.

[Eratas123]

Okay, that's all my questions

[joshuafaramir]

Gotta say after backreading "most" of the posts here, I came to the conclusion (based on what I've read in LN, which is pretty much everything except for Alicization) that KAZUTO is not Gary Stu. He comes close though. He's pretty OP tbh with all his lightning fast reactions but I've played enough MMOs and FPS (MMW, CSS etc.) to know that there are people/players that are borderline OP

Kenshin > Kirito. Just saying and Kenshin is definitely not Stu.

[Sixth]

For those who read the novel, how many girls that Kirito going to fathered them...soon?

[joshuafaramir]

Just Asuna, he's pretty faithful AND decisive afterall. Unlike oh-so many MC in Light Novels/Animes.

[Sixth]

Originally Posted by joshuafaramir

Just Asuna, he's pretty faithful AND decisive afterall. Unlike oh-so many MC in Light Novels/Animes.

Perhaps I should put my word more clearly. How many girls are lusting for his sperm?

[Randomzx]

Originally Posted by kyp275

Should probably just stop feeding the troll goose, let it die a hungry death :P

Apparently according to your definition, Troll = Somebody that doesn’t agree with me

To Wild Goose:

Spoiler:

And I bet you haven't actually read any of my posts, given that you won't respond to anything that I've posted. Again, you're missing the point that a Mary Sue is a fanfiction character. Mind you, to follow TV Tropes, Canon Sue might be a better description. But then by your examples and your interpretations, it would seem that Harry Dresden would be a Sue, Richard Winters is a Sue, and every member of Delta Force is a Sue.

Mary Sue by definition is not limited to fanfiction, but it’s often found in fan fiction. Canon Sue is a subset of Mary Sue, not a separate term from Mary Sue.

One last thought before I go: The yardstick that you use? Apply it to any one of the Avengers in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, and you'd get a whole team of Sues. Yet The Avengers was regarded as one of the most entertaining films of this year. Think about that.

Again you still don’t get what Gary Stu/Mary Sues truly entails and randomly claim that the Avengers would fit ‘mine’ definition (when its pretty much the standard definition) by your square-peg & round hole logic. It’s pretty clear you never done any research or read any of my starter links on the previous page.

The Avengers are pretty much the quintessential ragtag team of misfits with more personal and social problems than you can shake stick at. Before they even start really working together, they are pretty much at each other’s throat doing more harm than good. But setting their priorities straight and actually focusing on the goal they can act with a semblance of a team. But even then, they struggled against a serious enemy force.
The Avenger is only at best a decent movie, but its far better at characterization than SAO ever could.

You forget that being a Mary Sue is an instant I Win button, which does not happen for Kirito, who goes through a lot of shit and has to work to get his happy ending.

Being a Gary Stu/Mary Sue doesn’t freaking require an instant I win button. You seriously didn’t even do any research on the term and still regurgitate your spurious concept of mary sue.
if you even bother checking http://ppc.wikia.com/wiki/Drizzt_do%27Urden link in the last post, you would at least an idea of that.

Except that what you forgot is that GGO contains melee weapons also, and that a fair number of players carry combat knives of some sort as a backup/weapon of last resort. And you seem to not be aware of the American GGO player who does one better than Kirito, and fights unarmed, in a game about guns. He takes his bare hands into the game as his weapons, and uses CQC on players to take them down and steal their guns. (Granted, it was speculated in-universe that he was a special forces soldier, but still. That would hardly work very well in the real world.)

Except Kirito uses the sword as his primary weapons to rise through the ranks. As for the other character, he’s neither the focus nor utilized much enough to be judged as a character.

Firstly, dodging multiple bullets from an automatic weapon in a game isn't as surprising as you make it out to be - or do you not play any shooters online? As long as the weapons are not hitscan weapons, and so long as the game's engine must track and model the individual rounds being fired, there is alwyas the chance, however slim, in dodging incoming fire. Let's also not forget that with an assault rifle or a machine gun firing at full auto, the recoil would succeed in throwing your aim off by a lot, even if you were in a Nanosuit 2.0. I've dodged enemy fire at times, enemies have dodged my fire at times. When playing Modern Warfare, I was never killed by someone using up their entire mag on me, but by careful players using controlled burst. Why? Because full auto is inaccurate by nature, thanks to recoil.

You don’t dodge an automatic weapons (all of your so-called dodging is nothing more than the bullets missing due to spray), you either bait your enemy’s firing pattern or flank them. And the Modern Warfare [brought forth some of the worst trends in online shooter] is a poor example of a shooter to use, and is the one of the primary offenders to change the focus from blazing fast shooters to crawling speed shooters (partly because of the control limitations of consoles compared to the keyboard and mouse combo).
What Kirito did is nothing more than bullshit, its because of the random bullet pattern (moving at several times the speed of sound) in an full burst that severely limits your dodging capabilities to near nothing, instead Kirito fucking dodges more than humanly possible.

The other thing you're not taking into account is that GGO's engine is using The Seed, which was SAO's engine. The underlying base code of The Seed allows skills from characters in one game to be transferred and used passively in another game that doesn't have those skills - which made Kirito quite dangerous, because he had 2 years worth of leveled skills and reflexes, as well as the enemy detection skill that didn't exist in GGO.

And you're forgetting that GGO has a bullet path indicator, which was something Crysis 2 had. Also, the only way Kirito is dodging is because his SAO-honed reflexes give him an instant of warning just before the bullet path indicator kicks in. Frankly, it's no different from the Pointman or Beckett being able to bullet time and dodge bullets. Or are you going to say that those two are also Sues?

You are still missing the point that Kirito was dodging a random rapid firing bullet spread from less 3 meters with his freaking ‘reaction speed’. No amount of game sense or ‘skill’ allows a player to perform at super human level.
Not to mention, apparently he dodge the bullets predicted flight path, and he did so by watching the gunman's eyes, knowing that it would shoot where the gunman was looking.
so he can calculate exactly when the gunman's eyes correlate to where he's gonna shoot with an automatic weapon by just eagle-level sight alone.
Seriously, just by looking at the eyes would hardly give you enough information (let alone process in such short times) to even start doing it.

Contrived? Well, Lizbeth went through a life-or-death situation with him, which formed the basis of her crush. Scilica's meeting with him is a rescue romance of sorts, given that he saved her from getting killed and helped resurrect Pina. Shino is a mix of Fire Forged Friends and Defeat Means Friendship. And Asuna... of all of them, she's been friends with him for the longest. Their relationship happened even before he knew anything about her.

Basically events that MC just HAPPENS to come along and solve rather handily to make them gather to them.

Also, just a note - Asuna would not be likely to inherit much of RECTO, given that she's the younger child and her older brother is being groomed to take over the company.

The point is she is conveniently rich and daughter to the CEO of a company tied to the MMO world for our MC. Not mention, they also get an AI ‘daughter’ that does all sorts of crap even in the real world fort them.

Besides, pettiness is an inescapable part of life. Aren't you being quite petty right now?

The point is, all the people that matters that hate Kirito are also flanderized as pretty much psychopaths. Its as if it’s the ultimate evil to oppose him.

Yes and no. Kirito doesn't like that effeminate appearance because it causes people to not take him seriously, and doesn't really suit his loner feelings. At first. That said, I salute him for not being unwilling to take advantage of his trap face in GGO. That said, this doesn't appear to be portrayed as a flaw, but rather as something he's not happy about. Every teenager has had something they were unhappy about their looks.

The point is that this is one part of Kirito’s Gary Stu aspect despite how much he doesn’t like it.

As for best gear, part of that is due to luck and the Random Number God, and the other is that Lizbeth is a damn good blacksmith. Dark Repulser and Lambent Light were made by her, afterall.

RNG in literature is pretty much the same thing as asspull.

And you don't seem to have truly understood Caliber, because if you did, you would know that Kirito, Asuna and Suguha made one attempt at the Excaliber quest and had to run away because they were too weak to clear it; they needed their full team to get through the quest in the book. And none of them had the best gear. In fact, if Shinon wasn't there, Kirito wouldn't have gotten Excaliber at all, something which he reinforces to himself at the end: he can't do things alone, and needs the help of his friends.

You seem to be under the impression that a Gary Stu/Mary Sue is required do all the heavy lifting in team fights or fight alone. The issue with Gary Stu/Mary Sue have more to do with their affects on the story.

So, that would then mean that high level characters in MMOs are then sues. Hell, that would mean that I'm a Sue, given my N7 ranking and the fact that I'm one of those players.

Again you miss the point that it was suppose to be a lower-level player’s IMPRESSION of those players. To them, the high level players are larger than life, and the author specifically said he intended to write them like that to capture that feeling.

"Yes, hooking up a couple of webcams to a laptop, and using servos to controll their movement is truly cutting edge stuff. Why, it's not as if the technology for yui's laptop rig hasn't existed for DECADES. And he IS studying mechatronics, y'know.

You are not answering this point

He's apparently now a mechatronics engineer with proficiency in mechanical, electrical, and computer software engineering able to create technology decades ahead of his time

, which refers to what he would become.

"As for fighting in the real world, you apparently overlooked the bit about him having taken up kendo before, IRL. And i wonder how far you've read, because he's been in two irl fights, managed to survive the first from luck, and got his ass kicked in the second."

My statement was that ‘I wouldn’t be surprised’ if he could fight in IRL like he could online which obviously spoken in jest.

Nope, I don't see anything like that. He's just a high school student who took mechatronics as one of his electives and works part time as an MMO beta tester over the weekend.

Note the word ‘eventually’.
And its not like the Accel World and Sword Art Online are that separate considering the side story Versus (Accel World crossover).

Emphasis mine. You do realise how sad this is, don't you? You had no opinion of your own, but latched onto the opinions of others, and use that to prop yourself to a position of superiority, whereby you attempt to lecture us all. You cannot even argue your opinion, because it isn't your opinion, it's the opinion of others that you are just regurgitating.

There's a fine line between quoting an agreeing opinion, and simply blindly following the crowd.

Except I’ve constant gotten that impression of Kirito when I read the LN before I into any discussion (the crappy LN writing doesn’t help, made several times worse with translations barely above google translate).
You are still not accounting for the point that most people (particularly of discerning taste) agree that Kirito is a Gary Stu. I seriously doubt you need an unique opinion to determine if a character is bad.

I was wondering when you were going to throw out the ad hominem. It's a notoriously weak logical argument, and is often used to distract the focus of a discussion - to move it from an indefensible point (Kirito is a supposed Sue) and attack the opponent (Aphrah, since you seem to be ignorign me).

The fact that you must resort to this should be evident enough that your position cannot hold.

And yet you are constantly using it throughout most of your posts, hell you just used it in the two points above. So you can discount everything I said but I have to accept your attack? Aren’t you a hypocrite?

Seriously I think no matter what anybody says or how much they argue, you will simply not acknowledge your favorite character as a Gary Stu. No amount of words is gonna make you change your mind.

[Rovert10]

So obviously your opinion must be correct... you say it as your statement he's a gary stu must be fact.

You are guilty of the same situation that no matter what they say that he's not a stu, you won't change your mind.

Hard to believe you are a troll since you right walls of text like everyone else but you share the same stubborness as anyone else in this forum.

[sky black swordman]

Originally Posted by noobita

Perhaps I should put my word more clearly. How many girls are lusting for his sperm?

Spoiler for Dont open if you dont to be spoiled:

Spoiler for Are you sure you are ok with this ? then open.:

Asuna aside there is Lizbet ,Scilica , Lyfa ,and Shino so 4 or 5 if you count Asuna the legal wife.

Well 6 if Sachi lived.....

But if she idid then would she not be the legal wife?

But like @joshuafaramir said

Just Asuna, he's pretty faithful AND decisive afterall.

[Wild Goose]

You know what, screw this. I'll reply later when i get home - I have neither the time nor inclination to type yet another wall of text on an iPad. Expect a response sometime in the next 12 odd hours or so.

I'll just point out one thing before i go - Randomzx believes that my disregard of his actions and methodology is a personal attack. I beg to differ - i am attacking his actions and statements, and not his person. Any conclusions I have come to are derived from the displayed actions in his previous posts.

Also, I'll freely debate on his most recent post, but I do wonder why my post that was put up one hour before his is evidently unworthy of reply. A tacit acknowledgement of defeat, perhaps? ( Hey, I can dream. Only thing that keeps me sane through the daily slog.)

[novalysis]

Here's another topic that I think might be interesting to explore.

How would a Genderbent Kirito (aka, Kiriko) be like in terms of character? The closest I can think off is those kind of "mad inventor" girls you see in certain Harem shows, like Rika from Hagani. However, the unique thing is that you get to see the world from the eyes of such a character, and come up with a somewhat plausible "mad inventor girl" character- as in, someone who is very innovative and intelligent, but working on projects no grander than allowing

Spoiler for Mother's Rosario:

Yuuki to go to school in Mother's Rosario with that contraption.

[Swordstriker21]

Originally Posted by novalysis

Here's another topic that I think might be interesting to explore.

How would a Genderbent Kirito (aka, Kiriko) be like in terms of character? The closest I can think off is those kind of "mad inventor" girls you see in certain Harem shows, like Rika from Hagani. However, the unique thing is that you get to see the world from the eyes of such a character, and come up with a somewhat plausible "mad inventor girl" character- as in, someone who is very innovative and intelligent, but working on projects no grander than allowing

Spoiler for Mother's Rosario:

Yuuki to go to school in Mother's Rosario with that contraption.

ROLFMAO!!! Kiriko I guess the closest image I get would be him from the GGO arc. I don't know about the "mad inventor girl" thing. It just doesn't seem Kirito(ko)-like to me. But why do I get this strange feeling Kiriko would be a tsundere?...