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Old 2007-11-29, 03:51   Link #1
babybro
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Inspiring Manga Artist! Information on being published in japan!

I'm not entirely sure if this is the right forum to discuss this, but a fellow poster was interested in a thread to discuss this so I decided to make one here. So let's get down to business


I am an inspiring artist living in saitama japan, a friend's sister is an famous illustrator located in ikebukuro Tokyo. We went over her house to gather so information how to make it as an manga artist.

Here is some things that is not entitled to me but specifically for you guys. One of your biggest obstacle will be how to live in japan. Because the manga industry has so much to choose from, they probably won't provide working visa's to foreigners. So you will have to find a way to live her permanently. The biggest way, (and biggest decision) way, is of course to get married to a japanese person. By getting married, you will be allowed to permanently stay in japan and work any type of job in japan as long as your married. Once your married, you can get a permanent resident card which will allow you to stay in japan even if you get divorced. There is a couple other way to get to japan, student visa is second most common but to work at a manga company, you would have to fulfill some paperwork and ask permission from the college if you can work there.

I am currently married to a japanese person so I can work whenever, wherever.
So now on to the advice given to me.


First, I explain to her about how I was worried about my art. My art looks very good according to her and everyone I talked to, but I am not satisified with it, mostly because I have never took an art class and never went to art college. So I asked her, what I should focus on.

Her Answer: Art doesn't matter in the manga world. You can draw like absolute crap (like some manga does aka pokemon) but if you have an interesting, enthralling storyline, that is all that matters. So while it's okay to work on your art, here in japan, your storyline is immensely more important. So to all you artists out there, you need to become, well basically writers lol. Learn how to make deep characters that people can relate to, or enjoy seeing.

I than ask the question, still a bit worried about my art because in the states, art is more important than story on many occasions, should I go to an art college first, than go to a publisher next.

Her Answer: No, I need to submit a complete copy of like a short story or chapter that is finish, ink and everything to the publisher and let them decide first. As entitle to question one, as long as the story is great, everything will be fine. (So less spending money for me, yahoo!!) She than tells me she knowns a few publishers and will take me to see them after she see's the manga.

Other Advice: Make sure to make a manga that the audience wants to read. Basically, tailor it to the market. Trying something too different in japan can sometimes lead to disaster. That's why some companies come out here, and than leave after a while saying the market is too tough. (This one she mention specifically to me, but I think can apply to all non-japanese) She stated that being african american will be a blessing for some publishers and a curse for others.
Some publishers will want to jump on the title as "First African American Manga Artist" to attract customers. Other publishers will shoo me away as trying to invade on the territory. And others wouldn't care, judging me as an artist.

Those were the major points in our conversation. If you have any questions, please let me know.

Last edited by babybro; 2007-11-30 at 10:46. Reason: speilling error
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Old 2007-11-29, 05:46   Link #2
Risaa
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One small comment: I think it's foolish to rule out the importance of nice artwork. Like a first impression, people are drawn to what physically appeals to them even before getting to know what it really is. (For a non-manga-related example, I have a friend who loves to cook, and he told me that he has a friend who can make even better-tasting foods then he can. However, when people are given a choice between whose dishes to try, they always go with the not-as-tasty one. Why? In his own words, "my friend's food is excellent but looks like dog chow".)

There are some manga series I really like the story of, however I will not buy the manga because I dislike the artwork. Likewise, if I see a series with appealing artwork I'd never heard of before, I'll most likely buy it. There are many fans who are similar.

I agree that you do not necessarily have to go to art school or take any lessons whatsoever. But I strongly suggest that you don't lower yourself to drawing crap and *only* focusing on the storyline.
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Old 2007-11-29, 06:41   Link #3
babybro
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Originally Posted by Risaa View Post
One small comment: I think it's foolish to rule out the importance of nice artwork. Like a first impression, people are drawn to what physically appeals to them even before getting to know what it really is. (For a non-manga-related example, I have a friend who loves to cook, and he told me that he has a friend who can make even better-tasting foods then he can. However, when people are given a choice between whose dishes to try, they always go with the not-as-tasty one. Why? In his own words, "my friend's food is excellent but looks like dog chow".)

There are some manga series I really like the story of, however I will not buy the manga because I dislike the artwork. Likewise, if I see a series with appealing artwork I'd never heard of before, I'll most likely buy it. There are many fans who are similar.

I agree that you do not necessarily have to go to art school or take any lessons whatsoever. But I strongly suggest that you don't lower yourself to drawing crap and *only* focusing on the storyline.

Excellent statement yet one small problem, the food example revolves around the states, as well as your being an american. In the states, (believe me I know, I was trying to get manga publish in the states first) art is very important, just as important as the story. So that is why I wanted to go to the art institute of california to truly become professional. But here in Japan, art isn't all that's needed. It's just a side bonus to the main diss which is most important, storyline. Perhaps it's because of the two different cultures, but this also explain why the two most popular anime on television are drawn like crap, (chibi-maruko and sazae-san.)

Of course, me personally being from the states, I will always have the constant will to improve and become better, and even if I get famous, I still want to go to art college in japan. But that's the american in me, japan doesn't care about the art, they care about the story.
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Old 2007-11-29, 07:07   Link #4
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Still I'm pretty sure Oh Great works do even good in Japan. Honestly the only good thing about Tenjou Tenge is the art and also Air Gear to some extend.

While you don't need good art, having decent art is a must especially if you are starting out.

Maybe the novel world might be better(though I can imagine the competition here is even greater) and after a while teaming up with an artist for manga.

Though this is all in the perspective of how I see it. But I'm sure there is at least some truth in what I said.
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Old 2007-11-29, 07:45   Link #5
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Originally Posted by 2H-Dragon View Post
Still I'm pretty sure Oh Great works do even good in Japan. Honestly the only good thing about Tenjou Tenge is the art and also Air Gear to some extend.

While you don't need good art, having decent art is a must especially if you are starting out.

Maybe the novel world might be better(though I can imagine the competition here is even greater) and after a while teaming up with an artist for manga.

Though this is all in the perspective of how I see it. But I'm sure there is at least some truth in what I said.

Oh this isn't specifically about me. The lady says I already draw good enough to be a manga artist, which boosted my confidence a bit. But she was basically drilling into my head that art is only a back-up to my story. She says there is much worse art publish than mine, but they are publish because of there interesting story.

But I do agree with you on tenjou tenge, but I say less on the art, and more on the ultra fan service and free boobs everywhere LOL!
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Old 2007-11-29, 12:15   Link #6
siya
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I sorta agree with Risaa...In my opinon, It depends on who you are. For some people the art doesn't always matter, it's just the storyline. From what I can tell (this is my opinon, does not make it true), the people who are more for the story line than art are people who are really into reading novels due to the fact they can visualize. So if the art work is crap, by reading the manga it wouldn't be hard to image better drawings. Now, then you have people that are attracted more to the art. These people tend to be more observant then anything (again..my opinon). Then you have people who are attracted by both. I for one like both. But I'm not going to read a manga if it has crappy storyline and good art. I'm more attracted to the storyline, though good art is something I enjoy as well. You can tell what people are more attracted to by looking at the less popular series. There are alot of series that have amazing drawings but the storyline is a bit dull and so they are not that popular. This is also vice versa. There are alot of series that have amazing storylines but not so much good art that arn't popular. It depends on the target adiunce. People enjoy different things. I feel that people are more for storylines that relate to you but are still out there. This is why I believe that Naruto and thems are some of the more popular. Now, there problems are a bit out there, but they can be linked back to a problem you have. I for one can, Naruto is shunned for having the Kyuubi inside him. As a child I was shuned for acting different. It relates, that's why I'm big with Naruto, because I for one like both the art and story. It relates back to me. It's just like what you said with the food. They choose the beter looking one. Now this is true. If you watch alot of cooking contests, you'll notice that the judges rate your food on both taste and look. Not everyone wants to eat something that looks like it just came out of the sewer. I for one would try both. To me look doesn't matter. If it tastes good, them give me it. I prefer taste then look, but anywho...Manga it self really depends on the person. Now, going aganinst what I said, My art is good, people tell me it is, like you, but I don't like it. It's not something that satisfies me. due to this, I end up throwing away so many good drawings. To me, if I don't think it looks good, I don't want other people see it. This is just because of what I think..I believe in everything I said above, but I still do this. I don't know why. I'm a werid person..then again..arn't we all?

Now as for living there to become it. Seems a bit...far fetched. Like what you already mention, I plan on getting a student visa and going to colledge over there. I'm 15 so yea...But no point in trying to gain a citizenship just to have your manga be turned down or not work out. If this happens, then what do you do? Your stuck in a foreign country. So, with a student visa I will be able to stay there untill a few weeks after I graduate colledge. So if my manga were to work out, I would be allowed to stay longer because normally you would be bounded by a contract, and if it doesn't work out, I can just come back to the US. Of course I wouldn't give up. I would examine my work and find what the problem might be, have different people tell me what they don't like and fix it and keep going for it. Now of course, I don't plan on making this my life. I will have a good paying job, in turn which will make it easer for me to do this stuffs (depending on the job really...if it's one of thems where I work like 20 hours a day, then that would be a different thing...but yea).

Last edited by siya; 2007-11-30 at 08:02.
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Old 2007-11-29, 16:25   Link #7
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Artwork is important, it's what decides my factor on artists. I don't really inspire to be a artist like that and i don't expect to go professional, so i'll just release it as fan work online for others to enjoy ^^. If someone catches me and like my artwork, they'll contact me and maybe offer me a job ^_^, stuff like that.
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Old 2007-11-29, 21:10   Link #8
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Becoming an manga-ka is like making a movie, you'll have to do the screenplay, directing, camera angle supervisor, special effect supervisor, dress coordinator, information advisor and producer all in one because all talent is needed to become successful.

Artwork can be counted as style where one person may like it while the other does not. The only real thing that matter is having consistency within the artwork and being able to draw emotion into the characters so they can reach out to the readers. This is the director part plays in.

Next is how you configure one frame to the other so you gain flow and dynamism into the scene, this is where camera angle supervisor role plays in.

Special effect is the sound graphics, back drop painting and other images that gives the art work "movement" giving a sensation to the readers as if they are actually watching a movie.

Dress coordinator and information advisor parts are needed to place reality into the story line.

Producer part plays in to adjust a story to fit into a slot assigned by the publisher, if they say 20 pages you'll have to adjust the episode into 20P if 15 then adjust accordingly. You'll always what to create a cliffhanger at the end so you drive the readers crave for the next issue.

Last screenplay, well this is the part which differs from a writer since a writer does mostly what I wrote above within his writing while in manga it is just lines for the characters so it is more associated with screenplay or script writing.

Once you got all of it done send it to a manga publisher, if they find it interesting they will contact you but be warned they recieve literary tons of material. There are annual mangaka contest so applying to one of these contest is another route to be recognized, but the mainstream to becoming a mangaka has always been to become an apprentice of one of the major manga-ka.
Most big names of today spent one time or another under a famous mangaka so they can accumulate experience and knowledge from their masters.
If the master think you have talent the master may even introduce you to a publisher and visce versa where a publisher introduce you to a big name mangaka who needs assistance.
Patience is the key word here.
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Old 2007-11-29, 21:19   Link #9
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I don't know what percentage of people do this, but I know a couple people in the manga industry- and none of them draw. They're all story writers, and at most they might do a bit of sketching. Whether or not you should get a writer depends on your ability to digest somebody else's story or your own story creativity.

I've seen a number of artists who art makes me want to scream "learn at least the basics of proper art!" but I usually forgive them for an amazing story. (I'm surprised at how many manga artists I've seen that heed none of the basics of Western art and still get amazingly popular.) I simply think that art skills might limit your ability to tell certain stories. For example, I suppose one can make a good comedy drawing nothing but chibis. But some genres ask for very detailed art once in a while; though I suppose this can be overcome by amazing creativity.
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Old 2007-11-29, 22:13   Link #10
Tri-ring
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Originally Posted by kitedragon View Post
I don't know what percentage of people do this, but I know a couple people in the manga industry- and none of them draw. They're all story writers, and at most they might do a bit of sketching. Whether or not you should get a writer depends on your ability to digest somebody else's story or your own story creativity.

I've seen a number of artists who art makes me want to scream "learn at least the basics of proper art!" but I usually forgive them for an amazing story. (I'm surprised at how many manga artists I've seen that heed none of the basics of Western art and still get amazingly popular.) I simply think that art skills might limit your ability to tell certain stories. For example, I suppose one can make a good comedy drawing nothing but chibis. But some genres ask for very detailed art once in a while; though I suppose this can be overcome by amazing creativity.
The difference of american comics(up to the ~90's) and Japanese manga is that American comics were more of a consistant flow of illustration inserts what you would find in Charles Dicken's Alice in Wonderland or Conan Doyle's Lost World which captures an instant within a story. Manga on the other hand, thanks to Tezuka Osamu, takes a more movie type approach where the illustrator wants to rely motion to the readers. Destortion of a frame like using a fish lens, maybe not seem as if following basic sketching methods but if you take a single frame from a movie it too would probably look distorted. It is difference in approach.
As for writing yes there are many who just writes stories, most are introduced in the manga accordingly, 原作 (Story by) XX, 作画 (illustrated by) OO, an example would be Fist of the Northern Star, story by Bu-Ronson illustrated by Hara Tesuo. There is nothing to be ashamed of that. Division of labor makes the overall piece more appealing to people and the authors to concentrate on their share of work.
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Old 2007-11-30, 05:03   Link #11
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Originally Posted by siya View Post
I sorta agree with Risaa...In my opinon, It depends on who you are. For some people the art doesn't always matter, it's just the storyline. From what I can tell (this is my opinon, does not make it true), the people who are more for the story line than art are people who are really into reading novels due to the fact they can visualize. So if the art work is crap, by reading the manga it wouldn't be hard to image better drawings. Now, then you have people that are attracted more to the art. These people tend to be more observant then anything (again..my opinon). Then you have people who are attracted by both. I for one like both. But I'm not going to read a manga if it has crappy storyline and good art. I'm more attracted to the storyline, though good art is something I enjoy as well. You can tell what people are more attracted to by looking at the less popular series. There are alot of series that have amazing drawings but the storyline is a bit dull and so they are not that popular. This is also vice versa. There are alot of series that have amazing storylines but not so much good art that arn't popular. It depends on the target adiunce. People enjoy different things. I feel that people are more for storylines that relate to you but are still out there. This is why I believe that Naruto and thems are some of the more popular. Now, there problems are a bit out there, but they can be linked back to a problem you have. I for one can, Naruto is shunned for having the Kyuubi inside him. As a child I was shuned for acting different. It relates, that's why I'm big with Naruto, because I for one like both the art and story. It relates back to me. It's just like what you said with the food. They choose the beter looking one. Now this is true. If you watch alot of cooking contests, you'll notice that the judges rate your food on both taste and look. Not everyone wants to eat something that looks like it just came out of the sewer. I for one would try both. To me look doesn't matter. If it tastes good, them give me it. I prefer taste then look, but anywho...Manga it self really depends on the person. Now, going aganinst what I said, My art is good, people tell me it is, like you, but I don't like it. It's not something that satisfies me. due to this, I end up throwing away so many good drawings. To me, if I don't think it looks good, I don't want other people see it. This is just because of what I think..I believe in everything I said above, but I still do this. I don't know why. I'm a werid person..then again..arn't we all?

Now as for living there to become it. Seems a bit...far fetched. Like what you already mention, I play on getting a student visa and going to colledge over there. I'm 15 so yea...But no point in trying to gain a citizenship just to have your manga be turned down or not work out. If this happens, then what do you do? Your stuck in a foreign country. So, with a student visa I will be able to stay there untill a few weeks after I graduate colledge. So if my manga were to work out, I would be allowed to stay longer because normally you would be bounded by a contract, and if it doesn't work out, I can just come back to the US. Of course I wouldn't give up. I would examine my work and find what the problem might be, have different people tell me what they don't like and fix it and keep going for it. Now of course, I don't plan on making this my life. I will have a good paying job, in turn which will make it easer for me to do this stuffs (depending on the job really...if it's one of thems where I work like 20 hours a day, then that would be a different thing...but yea).

I understand where your coming from as well as everyone else, however again, as mention in the previous post. I am american, I am assuming your american, as well as the others who commented and gave their opinion on why art is important. Believe me, I believe the same exact thing. However, Japanese does not care for art. This is the key difference. Now true, if you want to take your overseas to the states, (and other countries, depending on the value of art there) than yes, you would have to worry about it alot more. But SPECIFICALLY in japan, you do not have to worry about art much, what you have to worry about is the story. Again, this information was passed to be my a person who works in the art field of japan (illustrated multiple books in japan.) and knowns many publishers in the business (therefore allowing me to bypass someone who doesn't have connections. So again, I believe she knowns what she's talking about.
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Old 2007-11-30, 05:29   Link #12
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o_O... Draw crap if you like, but it certainly doesn't ever *hurt* to have beautiful artwork.

//end of my 2 yen
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Old 2007-11-30, 05:33   Link #13
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Originally Posted by Risaa View Post
o_O... Draw crap if you like, but it certainly doesn't ever *hurt* to have beautiful artwork.

//end of my 2 yen
He never intended to draw crap. He is just saying that in Japan, the story is far more important compared to the importance of the art.
Though I definitely could see where his friend is coming from, considering if artwork is really important, manga like One Piece would have never made it in the first place.

No offence to One Piece fans, but you gotta admit the style is definitely unique.
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Old 2007-11-30, 08:11   Link #14
siya
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I understand where your coming from as well as everyone else, however again, as mention in the previous post. I am american, I am assuming your american, as well as the others who commented and gave their opinion on why art is important. Believe me, I believe the same exact thing. However, Japanese does not care for art. This is the key difference. Now true, if you want to take your overseas to the states, (and other countries, depending on the value of art there) than yes, you would have to worry about it alot more. But SPECIFICALLY in japan, you do not have to worry about art much, what you have to worry about is the story. Again, this information was passed to be my a person who works in the art field of japan (illustrated multiple books in japan.) and knowns many publishers in the business (therefore allowing me to bypass someone who doesn't have connections. So again, I believe she knowns what she's talking about.
Yes, I'm in US...But the true thing that I honestly believe that matters is the person it's going toward. In all acually, the story is the biggest thing in almost everything. Most people wont read a manga with a crappy storyline because it's something they don't like. Now, alot wont read a manga if it has a good storyline and bad drawings just because of the fact they don;t like to look at the drawings. Anime is like live-action, If it has a stoyline that noone likes, they are not going to watch it. Another idea is that if you can't draw for crap, your not comfortable showing crappy work, but you have an amazing story line, here could be a few ideas, Yuo can take some writing classes and right a novel or you can do one of them partner things, you do the story, someone else does that art. Just a few ideas
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Old 2007-11-30, 09:48   Link #15
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Originally Posted by MaxwellDemon View Post
He never intended to draw crap. He is just saying that in Japan, the story is far more important compared to the importance of the art.
Though I definitely could see where his friend is coming from, considering if artwork is really important, manga like One Piece would have never made it in the first place.

No offence to One Piece fans, but you gotta admit the style is definitely unique.
Quote:
Originally Posted by siya View Post
Yes, I'm in US...But the true thing that I honestly believe that matters is the person it's going toward. In all acually, the story is the biggest thing in almost everything. Most people wont read a manga with a crappy storyline because it's something they don't like. Now, alot wont read a manga if it has a good storyline and bad drawings just because of the fact they don;t like to look at the drawings. Anime is like live-action, If it has a stoyline that noone likes, they are not going to watch it. Another idea is that if you can't draw for crap, your not comfortable showing crappy work, but you have an amazing story line, here could be a few ideas, Yuo can take some writing classes and right a novel or you can do one of them partner things, you do the story, someone else does that art. Just a few ideas


Max: Thank you max, someone my words got twisted which I don't know how. I have no plans of drawing like crap. I told my wife that even if I get famous, I still want to go to manga college here in japan to increase my knowledge of art and improve my skills who knowns how times over. I also agree with you on the one piece part, an excellent example of below average art with an great storyline equals mucho money lol.

Siya: Oh no, lol, I'm not saying I can't draw well. The lady already stated my art was excellent, it's more like myself having the curiousity of what can I draw like if I actually took an art class. I am also a little hard on myself. My wife says my current project actually looks like a real manga, and alot better than books she seen. So while I don't have much confidence (without training anyway's) in myself, I'm receiving word from everywhere saying I already have the skills to do it. The part about storyline over art is dedicated toward those who can't really draw to well but still want to draw manga. This gives hope towards those people by letting them know your manga can be a successful hit in japan as long as the storyling is enthralling. Now once it hits the states, that's a different story LOL!
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Old 2007-12-01, 00:55   Link #16
siya
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Originally Posted by babybro View Post
Max: Thank you max, someone my words got twisted which I don't know how. I have no plans of drawing like crap. I told my wife that even if I get famous, I still want to go to manga college here in japan to increase my knowledge of art and improve my skills who knowns how times over. I also agree with you on the one piece part, an excellent example of below average art with an great storyline equals mucho money lol.

Siya: Oh no, lol, I'm not saying I can't draw well. The lady already stated my art was excellent, it's more like myself having the curiousity of what can I draw like if I actually took an art class. I am also a little hard on myself. My wife says my current project actually looks like a real manga, and alot better than books she seen. So while I don't have much confidence (without training anyway's) in myself, I'm receiving word from everywhere saying I already have the skills to do it. The part about storyline over art is dedicated toward those who can't really draw to well but still want to draw manga. This gives hope towards those people by letting them know your manga can be a successful hit in japan as long as the storyling is enthralling. Now once it hits the states, that's a different story LOL!

Well once it hits states it's going to be ruined....xD
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Old 2007-12-01, 01:48   Link #17
MaxwellDemon
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Originally Posted by siya View Post
Well once it hits states it's going to be ruined....xD
Well... One Piece is still pretty popular as it is, no?
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Old 2007-12-02, 02:43   Link #18
siya
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Well... One Piece is still pretty popular as it is, no?
Couldn't say for sure, I for one couldn't really get into One Peice..anywho, getting of subject of this thread xD
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Old 2007-12-02, 12:18   Link #19
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The best solution would be to get an agent, I guess.

I read on some blog that in the US it's reversed, i.e you have lots of writers (probably those who write fanfic ) that are looking for illustrators to kick off their daily comic strip.

CU,
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Old 2007-12-13, 02:26   Link #20
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Need a little help before I submit my manga to kodasha pub.

Hi all,

I got this great hook up for this lady to introduce me to a publisher in kodasha. I'm staying in japan and am half way through my manga when some interesting questions came up that I have no clue about. I hope you guys can help me out with this.


1) It seems in manga, there are like genre names like bishonen and shonen and stuff like that. A friend asked me what genre is my manga in and I have no clue. Mostly because I do not know what are the genre names and what do they stand for. Also I do not know what my manga would be classified as. Let me provide a brief description of what I'm aiming for and about the manga.



{ The manga is about a young black shinobi (12 years old) being raised in a shinobi village. He was adopted by the head leader of the clan because they found him in the village and his son died shortly before his discovery, giving the believe that the father thought this baby was nothing more but fate. Of course many villagers doesn't tolerate this and gives him a large time, as he doesn't have any friends, and many people actually be cruel towards him. One of his own sisters hates him for a few reasons. So the only person he has left is his oldest sister who takes care of him and the oldest brother, who is the current leader of the clan. The bond between the sister and him is extremely strong because she knowns he doesn't have anyone else besides her and their brother.}


The story drifts off into other things as well, but that's one of the main focus points. Now what I'm aiming at in this manga is to provide a deep meaningful manga, alot like samurai x has. Very little comedy involved (especially at the beginning) with mostly meaningful conversations that make you think alot. It's also aim to provide the "kawaii so..." approach to the main character, as he goes through quite alot of stuff just for being "different"

So I'm not sure exactly what genre this manga would fit in. I hope you guys can help classify this for me.




2) The next question that I do not know is what audience is this manga aimed after. For example, what might be suitable for young adults might not be suitable for kids. The author of naruto first created a baseball book that would have been suitable for adults and young adults, but was too dark for kids. The problem I have is that the main character is a 12 year old, but the discussions and messages are quite deep. So I'm not if the young adult audience would be okay with a 12 year old main character, or if the kids would have a hard time understanding the discussions and messages of the manga.


If you guys can help me out,I would gladily appreciate it.
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