Spice and Wolf - Episode 5 Discussion / Poll

[Irenicus]

I think a part of her just wants him to charge in, shining sword in hand, horsed on a great stallion, loudly demand her release and consequences be damned. Must be a bit disappointing that he plays the thief instead of the fighter. Can't blame him though, he's a merchant.

Another part of her just luv'd it that he went for her after all.

I tell you, she's evil. It's five episodes in and he's already ready to die for her.

It's quite interesting though. Despite her constant proclamations of her aged (ageless?) wisdom, she appears to be quite the emotional wolf. A merchant boy of 25 rescuing her is enough to bring out a big reaction. I guess I thought she'd be more composed what's with having lived for centuries and probably experienced her share of excitements. Guess not.

I don't mind either, it's cuter this way.

Despite the rising Chloe-hate, I can see how she views it that way. Besides, she makes a good antagonist, with just enough complicated intentions to be believable and also just enough connections with the main character to create drama, not to mention just enough cuteness to be even likable. I'm still curious though, who's the shepherd girl? Is she a volume 2 character since she's not likely to show up next episode any time soon?

Otherwise, another fun episode of mercantile schemes and secret operations; though I seriously don't like next episode's title! >_<

[Random Wanderer]

Revenge is needed for Chloe shocking Horo enough to make her cry.

Henceforth, the Horo mask from the festival needs to follow Chloe around. Anytime she's alone, it must be there. Say, when she goes into her bedroom it shall be hanging on the inside of the door, or even better: hidden under the blankets so she won't see it right away. No matter where she leaves it, no matter how she tries to get rid of it, it must return and be waiting for her everywhere, grinning at her, haunting her. Driving her mad.

A pity that won't happen.

As for Chloe and her role in things, some people have said that she's actually been put in the place of a manga character, which suggests that the true story can still be followed even with her involved.

Horo wasn't quite thinking her best, getting angry at Lawrence. Sure, he didn't show up in person to rescue her and attack their enemies, but he's not a wolf. He fought for her using HIS weapons: diplomacy, cunning, blackmail, and did so quite effectively. You don't expect a stag to fight with tooth and claw: they use their antlers. Just the same, don't expect a merchant to fight like a soldier: instead he'll use the weapons he knows.

Adorable Horo is adorable!

I LOVE how she's all trying to define their relationship as pure business "I would have cried even if it wasn't you, don't misunderstand" and he goes along with it and she gives him that sad, abandoned look of hers:

"Isn't that unfair?"
"It's the special privilege of being female."

[Vexx]

I'm speculating the purpose of the Chloe insertion into that character role in the anime is to show that Lawrence *has* an escape route back to "normal human living" ... and the fact that he doesn't take it (so far) emphasizes what he feels about Horo to a viewing audience. Concrete examples work better in visual medium than verbal exposition.

edit: I didn't realize it but grey_moon a few posts down, astutely points out my idea as basically a "red pill or the blue pill" choice for Lawrence though he makes it on a daily basis rather than as a pivotal event.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by Random Wanderer

Revenge is needed for Chloe shocking Horo enough to make her cry.

Henceforth, the Horo mask from the festival needs to follow Chloe around. Anytime she's alone, it must be there. Say, when she goes into her bedroom it shall be hanging on the inside of the door, or even better: hidden under the blankets so she won't see it right away. No matter where she leaves it, no matter how she tries to get rid of it, it must return and be waiting for her everywhere, grinning at her, haunting her. Driving her mad.

A pity that won't happen.

Now I really want that to happen . Would be just a ton of fun to watch. Toss in some horror music each time the mask just appears there when she turns her head. Will never happen, but would be a ton of fun .

I'm sure Horo knows that Lawrence fought in his way. Though you can't help but want the big spectacular rescue. Your companion coming in to your rescue with sword raised high. Sadly Horo is too human to actually fulfill that kind of expectation.

Not that surprised that she has had a couple crying moments in the series. No matter how experienced you are hundreds of years in isolation are going to be hard on you.

[Vexx]

You can be a *thousand* years old and still be touched that someone cared for you after being lonely for so many years....

[Rhyel]

I don't like much, something is missing.

The Horo rescue was boring.

What is priority to Lawrence? silver king coins or travel with Horo to North?

[Masanori Ota]

Originally Posted by Rhyel

I don't like much, something is missing.

The Horo rescue was boring.

What is priority to Lawrence? silver king coins or travel with Horo to North?

It gets more exciting new episode, but WaS isn't an action anime. It'll never be explosively awesome. Extremely cute, perhaps.

[Sinestra]

So i have seen the subbed version now my thoughts are pretty much the same as they were before with a little extra.

What made this episode for me were 2 parts. The first being how well Lawrence handled himself in the plans to rescue Horo, which was his major concern. I feel he did all he could and the deal he made with Milian company worked for ensuring Horos resuce.

The second which was my favorite of all, was the interactions of Horo and Lawrence after the rescue. Horo was really pissed when she says something she means it and she told Horo to come for her, as romantic as that would have been it would not have been a good idea. However once again we are treated to range of emotion from Horo as well as Lawrence. Lawrence patting her head and her wiggling her ears was just too cute. Several moments hinted quite heavily at developing feelings on both sides but i really cant tell for sure. But when Lawrence said he thought Horo was cute she blushed and took his hand and stated "that makes me happy" It could be perceived as Horo being playful again but i didnt get that feeling this time. So in mind a developing romance is still viable. Since i think Horo is starting not to think of Lawrence as just some human.

Chole is still on my shit list for making Horo shed tears of sorrow. Its funny because i see why Chole thinks the way she does. People just dont understand how the nature of land works. Horo gave them some bad harvest to let the land rest so it would not be overworked. The people still received more bountiful harvests that most villages should have had. In all honesty if it had not been for Horo the humans probably would exhausted the land long ago. Now that Horo has left that land to head North you can bet that the village will not be seeing as good harvests anymore as Horo is not blessing the land.


Best Horo Quotes of episode 5

1."If youre a male you shouldve sharpened your fangs and gone into battle." (This was definitely the wolf side of Horo talking here LOL)

2. "Im cute, so even human males fall in front of me. But no human can take me. Told them their thing would fall off if they touched me. They all turned blue with fear."

(OMG i almost pissed myself I was laughing so hard. So um if i was Lawrence i would try to confirm somethings like could a human and a wolfgod get it on if they wanted to?)

[arkxkra]

good episode, no regret watch it. Happy to see Horo save and unharm, but that words was really hurt her. Hate that girl....

From the preview, Horo transform to real form, failed to run? Hopefully wont be a sad episode.

[FlareKnight]

My god I'm an idiot. I watched that preview 10 times (or something) and just figured out that it was Horo's wolf form picking up the pouch. I need to sit down, how did I not see that? Wasn't sure what it was for a while .

So yeah the only people who are going to be sad are the fools that force Horo to go into her wolf form. But if she is changing down there its going to be pretty cramped.

[orion]

Originally Posted by Sinestra

Chole is still on my shit list for making Horo shed tears of sorrow. Its funny because i see why Chole thinks the way she does. People just dont understand how the nature of land works. Horo gave them some bad harvest to let the land rest so it would not be overworked. The people still received more bountiful harvests that most villages should have had. In all honesty if it had not been for Horo the humans probably would exhausted the land long ago. Now that Horo has left that land to head North you can bet that the village will not be seeing as good harvests anymore as Horo is not blessing the land.

Chloe is being used I bet by Medioh and that Count.

If she was really doing it for the village, then she wouldn't have to turn Horo in. The village was using Horo's festival as one big party now anyways. Turning in their deity to the Church for execution is going to create some bad blood for her in the village afterwards. No excuse to party if Horo's gone. She interrupted the festival to be taken away on business. I bet they were a little miffed at that prospect. She's not even home taking care of business so she might be losing income at home on this coin venture.

If that Count was really teaching them, then she should have been told about resting the land, crop rotations etc and not have to spout stuff about Horo's whims.

She's gonna be in a bad way when it blows up in her face imo.


I still bet that DVD only episode involves a Lawrence x Horo sex scene. Watch ep. 7. Find out if something important to Lawrence really falls off. Remember fans, it's DVD only.

[grey_moon]

@Vexx - Love the theory about Chole being the blue pill

@Sinestra - Even if the "thing" does fall off, would you not sacrifice it for one moment of happiness oO

@FK - Phew thank you for confirming it was Horo picking it up, I was fearing some bugger had gotten their hands on it.

@Orion - Wow you make a really good point. The village are going to feel a wee bit sheepish if they find out that Horo is actually real and now if they have bad crops they would most likely blame her!

Also the main difference between Chole the Lawrence wannabe is the speed of his merchant mind. I don't believe at al that if the roles were reversed that Lawrence would be acting as the agent of the church, instead he would be making a killing off it

[Sinestra]

@Grey_Moon we all have to make sacrifices and that would be one i make in a heartbeat lol, live for the moment i say

@Orion I agree with you i dont believe the village knows what Chole is up to. Her youthfulness and inexperience as a merchant is making her hasty. I feel she is going along with this because she is trying to prove herself to Lawrence that she is not a child anymore. Remember episode 1 where she was talking about building a house and going into business together. Its obvious she wants to marry Lawrence but she feels she needs to prove herself after their last conversation. If the village starts to have bad harvests they are going to blame Horo but in reality it would kind of be Chole's fault to. Your right this whole scheme is going to blow up in her face, she is so being used. I still have no sympathy for her because she made Horo cry

[Tri-ring]

Originally Posted by Sinestra

@Grey_Moon we all have to make sacrifices and that would be one i make in a heartbeat lol, live for the moment i say

@Orion I agree with you i dont believe the village knows what Chole is up to. Her youthfulness and inexperience as a merchant is making her hasty. I feel she is going along with this because she is trying to prove herself to Lawrence that she is not a child anymore. Remember episode 1 where she was talking about building a house and going into business together. Its obvious she wants to marry Lawrence but she feels she needs to prove herself after their last conversation. If the village starts to have bad harvests they are going to blame Horo but in reality it would kind of be Chole's fault to. Your right this whole scheme is going to blow up in her face, she is so being used.

I don't know, if you rewatch ep.1 you'll see that the the village was collect trinty silver coins, the same silver coins that is being set-up for the scam and it was done through Chole's instructions.
She also talks to Lawrence about a big business deal that she is into without going into details and wanted Lawrence to join, I wonder if she was going to let him into the scam or scam him out?

[Sinestra]

Originally Posted by Tri-ring

I don't know, if you rewatch ep.1 you'll see that the the village was collect trinty silver coins, the same silver coins that is being set-up for the scam and it was done through Chole's instructions.
She also talks to Lawrence about a big business deal that she is into without going into details and wanted Lawrence to join, I wonder if she was going to let him into the scam or scam him out?

I cant imagine her scamming him its obvious she is in love with him, not the best way to gain the affection of the one you love. But I think its safe to assume the original deal Chole was talking about is the one taking place at the moment. I dont think Lawrence would have gone along with the deal after taking a risk assessment hes fairly smart. Im just wondering what his reaction is going to be when he meets Chole again after learning that not only was she part of the scheme but she helped kidnap and hold Horo as well. Chole's reaction to finding out Horo is Lawrence's traveling parter and business partner will most interesting especially since every episode Horo and Lawrence get a little bit closer in a certain aspect.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by Sinestra

@Grey_Moon we all have to make sacrifices and that would be one i make in a heartbeat lol, live for the moment i say

Sometimes you just need to live for the moment and worry about consequences like that later. Luckily it was an empty threat or Lawrence would have been in big trouble a long time ago .

@Orion I agree with you i dont believe the village knows what Chole is up to. Her youthfulness and inexperience as a merchant is making her hasty. I feel she is going along with this because she is trying to prove herself to Lawrence that she is not a child anymore. Remember episode 1 where she was talking about building a house and going into business together.

Its obvious she wants to marry Lawrence but she feels she needs to prove herself after their last conversation. If the village starts to have bad harvests they are going to blame Horo but in reality it would kind of be Chole's fault to. Your right this whole scheme is going to blow up in her face, she is so being used. I still have no sympathy for her because she made Horo cry

I agree the village probably doesn't know much about what Chloe is up to. Most don't really believe in Horo anyways so the festival will probably continue regardless of what happens. Since if there is one thing a peasant village appreciated it was an excuse to party . Life is pretty hard so a chance to enjoy yourself won't be given up easily.

Plus I would the church would go broadcasting that they had Horo or had executed her? My memory of their policy during that kind of period is a bit fuzzy. Maybe it would be recorded somewhere, but not sure they would be proclaiming it. Unless of course they wanted to really deal a blow to the villages faith in her and get them on side.

Unsure just how much Chloe is being used. Certainly wants to show Lawrence what she can do. Probably believes that making this big score and 'freeing' the village from the whims of Horo is going to accomplish that. She is less experienced in things like this than Lawrence and even he made some miscalculations and would have been in trouble without Horo. But regardless little pity for anything that happens to her. Making Horo cry...such things can not be forgiven.

Anyways I'm pretty certain Horo is picking up the pouch. The colouring seems to fit with that orange streak at the top. Unless a relative of hers shows up and even then there would probably be differences to help us tell them apart .

[Mr Hat and Clogs]

great episode this one. The rescue while not an action packed sword flinging sequence was interesting because it suited the type of character lawrence is. he isnt a solider, he is a merchant, so its talking, diplomacy and so on.

Horo as usual was adorable. I think that some of her disappointment about her rescue stems a lot from her wolfish side. the pack helps the pack regardless. however, her comments about scaring males, and the female prerogative of being difficult was quite funny. men just cant get a break, lol.

Will be interesting to see how things go down with the two companies, the chrch and the king, as well as how things go with the escape of horo and lawrence from those searchingfor them. looks like next episode we get to see horos wolf form in full, scary. the wolf head in the preview is huge, way to big to be anything 'natural' so unless one of her pack-mates rock up, then id say it was her.

[Onizuka-GTO]

Originally Posted by Flo

Even though I have 4 volumes of the novel (in Chinese), I do not 100% understand the words (even though I'm Chinese :heh), too chim* (hard to understand). And honestly speaking I bought them solely for the pictures.

what? Chinese of Ookami no Koushinryou??!

Dammn I need those raws! Only got Japanese, you know how hard it is to find those Japanese translators these days, all snapped up by fansubs.....

eh? why? oh..erm...for..personal....reading....Yeah!




but back on topic, is quite a bitter sweet moment seeing Chole, i swear my heart leaped, and came crashing down, it was painful to hear her say those words at Horo.

who needs a pitchfork squad, when a pack of sharpened fanged males will be better?

*runs with the hunting pack*

[TinyRedLeaf]

Just managed to catch the subbed version of episode 5. Hmm. My initial response is lukewarm, due to a variety of factors. The animation quality seemed poorer than usual. The background music was a tad jarring in a few scenes. Horo was more irritating than she was endearing.

But mostly, I felt that the whole situation seemed a bit too contrived, too convenient. It never felt as though Horo's rescue was ever in doubt, so I didn't feel any dramatic tension throughout the episode.

I guessed right about Chloe, and also about the Count's involvement in the plot. If I were to guess further, I'd say that the Church is backing Medioh as well, most probably to destablise the King of Thoreni.

Now that Lawrence and Horo are on the run, I guess it's back to travelling again. Well, events might become more interesting next week. "Silent farewell" eh? Seems to imply that Horo is forced to go a separate way. Time will tell.

[LKK]

I was little disappointed by the episode. I think it's because I read all these comments about how emotional people felt after seeing the show. As a result, I was expecting more than the episode seemed designed to deliver. The emotional drama I expected to see wasn't there to the extent I expected based on the reactions. When I rated the episode, I tried to judge it as if I had seen it before I read any of the discussions. I gave it an 8 using that criteria. But a true rating of how I felt watching the episode after reading the comments beforehand should have been a 7.