[GSD] Does anyone else think Shin is a bastard?

[kikko_s]

Hey does anyone else think that the main guy, Shin, is just a total buttcrack? As a pilot and soldier, he's nowhere near as good as Kira or Athrun.

Why Kira is better:
Duh! Supreme Coordinator. Could change Strike's parts midair WITHOUT laser guidance. Kira kicked Isaac's arse, and Shin could never hope to do that.

Why Athrun is better:
He's probably the only person that could fight toe to toe with Kira. And in Episode 6, we saw how amazed Shin was at the old-dudes' piloting abilities. In episode 7, he was shocked at how good Athrun could shoot implying he's nowhere hear as good.

Aside from the fact that he's not as good a soldier, he's a dick too. Sure, he lost his family. But so have Athrun and Cagalli. How can he say the things he says? While Cagalli works to end such tragedies, Shin defects and joins the military out of anger. I don't know if they realize that if Patrick Zara had been allowed to fire GENESIS on Earth, Shin might not even be alive!

That is all...

[[UKE]Auel]

Kira is cool, but I have no beef with Shinn. I feel like yelling at Cagalli half the time anyway. And Athrun is just lame

[liujeffqi]

Man Athrun is really lame in GSD and Cagalli come a stupid girl like hell and Shinn just a crappy whining kid........ he should die for 1000 times..... just wish some body kill him soon.....(which is not possible)

[Tron Bonne]

Shinn is a rookie, I hope he wouldn't be better than Kira and Asuran right from the start. They are older, trained, vetern pilots who fought a whole war. Ausran is a trained solider for many years, he should be better than Shin. Shinn isn't whinny, he's angry because a war is starting again. He hates wars because he knows people will die. He suffered something terriable, something no one should have to suffer. Kira lost friends, but he never had to see their mangled dead bodies, he was never close enough to touch them. Shinn was there, he saw his little sister's body torn apart, Kira saw his friends die, but he never had to see the mangled bodies. Asuran had to watch his father die, he can understand Shinn's pain. Caglli's father was the cause of Shinn's family's death, he was the cuase of Orb being destroyed and many of his people dying. I doubt he would care, he doesn't have to care. He can be angry at Cagllia because it is her duty to protect her people, but she isn't doing that, she is saying there should be no weapons. She is saying there should be no way of protecting people. It's a nice idea not having weapons, but as a leader should always have a means for protecting your people. Just because you won't attack, that doesn't mean someone won't attck you. Cagllia is making her people defencless, if she was attacked, her people would die, that's why he is anrgy.

[kikko_s]

Originally Posted by Tron Bonne

Shinn is a rookie, I hope he wouldn't be better than Kira and Asuran right from the start. They are older, trained, vetern pilots who fought a whole war. Ausran is a trained solider for many years, he should be better than Shin. Shinn isn't whinny, he's angry because a war is starting again. He hates wars because he knows people will die. He suffered something terriable, something no one should have to suffer. Kira lost friends, but he never had to see their mangled dead bodies, he was never close enough to touch them. Shinn was there, he saw his little sister's body torn apart, Kira saw his friends die, but he never had to see the mangled bodies. Asuran had to watch his father die, he can understand Shinn's pain. Caglli's father was the cause of Shinn's family's death, he was the cuase of Orb being destroyed and many of his people dying. I doubt he would care, he doesn't have to care. He can be angry at Cagllia because it is her duty to protect her people, but she isn't doing that, she is saying there should be no weapons. She is saying there should be no way of protecting people. It's a nice idea not having weapons, but as a leader who should always have a means for protecting your people. Just because you won't attack, that doesn't mean someone won't attck you. Cagllia is making her people defencless, if she was attacked, her people would die, that's why he is anrgy.

Hmm, that's an interesting way to think about it. I still think he's just pissed off at the Asha family that his family died. During the EA's assault on Orb, they DID stand and defended themselves, but one country can only do so much against the EA. But what would you have them do?

Anyway, I think Cagalli is working to protect her people. She advocates that if EVERYONE had disarmed, there would be no need for MS or battleships in the first place. That's why she travelled to PLANT. If Orb and Earth nations are in the process of disarming, why are PLANT and ZAFT expanding its military capabilities?

I'm not downlplaying Shin's tragedy, I'm just saying that after Yakin Due, there's no longer anyone to blame for it and his attacks on Cagalli make him appear like an immature person.

[Colonel-]

That is because he IS immatured. Character development and growth is a big part in story telling you know...

[dreamless]

well, obviously neither Orb nor any country in EA is in the process of disarming... the EA is always preparing to eradicate all coordinators, Gilbert said Orb was strengthening its military power, and I doubt he's lying since Cagalli didn't retort him.

Also I guess it's one of a leader's responsibilities to listen to people's complaints, if you don't want your every single action scrutinized and people complain a lot about you, then don't become a leader... honestly, I'd say the main problem here is that Cagalli is not suitable for a leader.

[Godtype]

Yes, he IS one heck of a bastard. But just watch, he'll become an even bigger one.

Guaranteed.

P.S. Anyone else notice how he's a few angst-fits' short of telling Athrun to dump Cagalli and come slaughter some more EA's just like the old days?

[kikko_s]

Originally Posted by dreamless

well, obviously neither Orb nor any country in EA is in the process of disarming... the EA is always preparing to eradicate all coordinators, Gilbert said Orb was strengthening its military power, and I doubt he's lying since Cagalli didn't retort him.

Also I guess it's one of a leader's responsibilities to listen to people's complaints, if you don't want your every single action scrutinized and people complain a lot about you, then don't become a leader... honestly, I'd say the main problem here is that Cagalli is not suitable for a leader.

Perhaps the translating on the sub that i dl'd was wrong, but I refer you to the first episode of GSD, where Cagalli explicitly says that the nations of earth are currently in the process of disarming while ORB has already almost completely dismantled its navy and its military technology.

[dreamless]

Originally Posted by kikko_s

Perhaps the translating on the sub that i dl'd was wrong, but I refer you to the first episode of GSD, where Cagalli explicitly says that the nations of earth are currently in the process of disarming while ORB has already almost completely dismantled its navy and its military technology.

Hmm... can you give a rough time at which this is mentioned? I don't seem to remember anything like that. and I don't really want to watch through the whole episode again... I only clearly remembers that Gilbert said to Cagalli that even Orb is strengthening its military. For Orb's military power, well, it was mostly destroyed during the last war when it's taken over by EA, and now it is slowly rebuilding it (not so easy since Uzumi blew up the factories)

[brightman]

Originally Posted by Godtype

Yes, he IS one heck of a bastard. But just watch, he'll become an even bigger one.

Hmm... Where did it say that Shinn is a bastard? He seemed to have some pretty loving and faithful parents to me...

[Godtype]

Originally Posted by brightman

Hmm... Where did it say that Shinn is a bastard? He seemed to have some pretty loving and faithful parents to me...

His parents weren't soup for about 20 seconds. I'm sure you're going to claim that people rush to judgment only when it's convenient for you.

[kikko_s]

Ok brightman, so maybe not a bastard...but an a$$hole maybe. I just didn't want to put the word 'a$$hole' in the name of the thread.

Oh and the discussion about Earth and Orb demobilizing is about 10 minutes into the episode. Dulindal and Cagalli are sitting in some sort of lounge overlooking one of those PLANT lakes. Athrun is in the room with some guys in suit and tie, and some of Dulindal's military aids are there as well.

[brightman]

Originally Posted by Godtype

His parents weren't soup for about 20 seconds. I'm sure you're going to claim that people rush to judgment only when it's convenient for you.

Its a joke, man. Don't take everything too seriously... Its bad for your health...

Originally Posted by kikko_s

Oh and the discussion about Earth and Orb demobilizing is about 10 minutes into the episode. Dulindal and Cagalli are sitting in some sort of lounge overlooking one of those PLANT lakes. Athrun is in the room with some guys in suit and tie, and some of Dulindal's military aids are there as well.

I think it is your translation then... They were mainly talking about ZAFT using Orb resources for military purposes... I really don't recall anything about EA and Orb's disarmament.

[kikko_s]

Originally Posted by brightman

I think it is your translation then... They were mainly talking about ZAFT using Orb resources for military purposes... I really don't recall anything about EA and Orb's disarmament.

That's the trouble with downloading the first sub that comes out...rush jobs can't be that great. Still doesn't change my mind about Shin though. Perhaps my opinion of him will change as the rest of the series unfolds, but he's almost as bad as Kira was in the beginning of SEED.

Also doesn't change the fact that Cagalli is in fact working for universal disarmament, which is a noble quest that doesn't deserve to be trampled on by some punk who's fighting because he can't let go of his dead family.

[brightman]

Originally Posted by kikko_s

Also doesn't change the fact that Cagalli is in fact working for universal disarmament, which is a noble quest that doesn't deserve to be trampled on by some punk who's fighting because he can't let go of his dead family.

I don't see how this works...

"OOHHHH NOZ MY FAMILY DIED!!!!!111 NOW I GO OFF AND JOIN THE ARMY OF A FOREIGN COUNTRY BECAUSE I AM SAD!!!!!!!1"

Its not like Shinn is looking for revenge either, because he's joining ZAFT whereas he seems to think that Orb is responsible, or (according to previews) Freedom. Plus he is antiwar, which is a position that makes it kinda hard for him to seek revenge.

Obviously he's fighting because his family's death changed his ideas about the world and about pacifism and neutrality. He recognizes that in order to protect, he needs power (this line is taken straight from the Zero Attack preview, so I guess its true... Even if he hasn't gotten time to say it yet), and he joined ZAFT because he wants power and Dullindal shares the same ideal as him.

[JokerD]

Well since everyone is saying that Orb will join the EA in the next few eps, I guess Shin can see what happens when the country gives up it's neutral policy. Since if Orb joined EA in Seed his parents would not have died.

However being on the other side of the fence when the country turns your enemies is not gonna be fun. Hopefully he learns something from this.

[Tron Bonne]

Shinn is not looking for revenge. If he was then why join Zaft? Why not go straight to Orb? Why not try and kill Cagilla? He's anrgy at Orb's failure to protect his family. He trusted them and their idea's and look what it got him. He has everyright to be anrgy. Cagilla comes in and blames them for this war starting, she said if they weren't making weapons this never would have happened, right after his friends and himself risked their lives to protect her.

[Godtype]

Originally Posted by Tron Bonne

Shinn is not looking for revenge. If he was then why join Zaft? Why not go straight to Orb? Why not try and kill Cagilla? He's anrgy at Orb's failure to protect his family. He trusted them and their idea's and look what it got him. He has everyright to be anrgy. Cagilla comes in and blames them for this war starting, she said if they weren't making weapons this never would have happened, right after his friends and himself risked their lives to protect her.

Protected her from the very weapons' they developed, chief.

[Tron Bonne]

Originally Posted by Godtype

Protected her from the very weapons' they developed, chief.

No, that Orb developed, remember, Orb made the Gundams and gave them to EA to kill coors.