Attack on Titan - Episode 23 Discussion / Poll

[Saschavykos]

How did the villagers know she was a Titan and stopped her in time? Did they pull her from that female titan? Why wasn't she getting imprisoned like eren?

Also why was she afraid of going down into that tunnel? Was she playing or serious?

Sorry i haven't read the manga.

[Saschavykos]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

You got it wrong on the details. Annie can't transform underground.

Titans move during daylight. Hanji experimented on Sawny and Bean discovering that they become more lethargic without solar energy.

Eren participated in an experiment if he can transform without sunlight under a well.

What happened is that his regeneration won't work and he can't transform.

So yes underground is where Annie is most vulnerable. As she is rendered plain normal.

Ahh this answers my questions. That's why she didn't want to go underground. But why did she go all psychotic all of a sudden? Did she know that she was being watched? That's interesting. They should start going out at night and killing titans then.

[Nikkan]

Originally Posted by Marc05

Could someone explain this episode? At what point did they figure out that it was Annie? Is everyone in on it (if not, why where those random people hiding)? I'm also getting some hints from reading the comments that apparently Armin and Annie have a thing going on? Man... I have to rewatch this show. Also, what bet are they talking about?

Originally Posted by Saschavykos

How did the villagers know she was a Titan and stopped her in time? Did they pull her from that female titan? Why wasn't she getting imprisoned like eren?

Also why was she afraid of going down into that tunnel? Was she playing or serious?

Sorry i haven't read the manga.

These questions will be answered in the next episode

[Marc05]

Originally Posted by Nikkan

These questions will be answered in the next episode

That's f*cked up.

[monir]

Originally Posted by Marc05

At what point did they figure out that it was Annie?

From the episode, Annie couldn't explain to Armin why she had Marco's 3D Gear. Armin recognized the gear because he worked on it with Marco. If you recall, Marco has been dead few episodes back.

Armin filled everyone in, I'm guessing, about his suspicion. And today was the day they were going to verify their suspicion. Once Annie realized the jig was up, she stopped pretending. Hope this helps.

[Revolutionist]

Is that sympathy for Annie I'm sensing in this thread? She just brutally murdered a lot of good men and women during that expedition. At this point I don't really care about her reasons, I keep coming back to Petra's lifeless body crushed against the tree, the guy begging for his life as she spun him in the air, the rest of Levi squad...Yeah, I'm with Mikasa, Annie needs to be put down because she needs to pay for her crimes.

[monir]

Originally Posted by Nikkan

But the thing is Annie is not the type of character who loses it. In the manga she is saying things like “I'm just a poor girl who can't fight” and other bad things about herself but you can tell by her expression she's mocking them because she’s very stoic and doesn't really bother even trying to fake it. The anime makes her appear unstable and crazy when she really was not.

I'm not sure who's decision it was to simplify her character and think that Annie is someone who would put on a tsundere/yandere smile and giggle but it really changes the whole mood of the scene and non-manga viewers look on Annie.

If the episode was true to the manga event for the most part, I could rationalize the laugh. Her behavior seems to indicate she has reached a point where she doesn't care anymore, probably for the human element. I believed her when she said to the goody-two-pants guy that if he wants to take those two corrupt MP out, that if he wants to start something, to change something, to make things right..... that she would help.

There is also the tear streaming down her eye in her FT form in the last episode after her confrontation with Levi. These things seem to indicate there are conflicting emotion at work which has ripped Annie apart psychological. And yet, she still killed people and felt she needed to keep up with the act. Once she has realized the jig is up, she can finally stop pretending. I guess in her laugh where she seems like she is having an orgasm pretty much indicative of Annie who doesn't need to carry the burden any longer. She is free, finally. Free to do whatever.

So as far as the laugh goes, I can rationalize it.

As for, why she had to do all of this up to this point? I'm staying tuned to find out.

Originally Posted by Revolutionist

Is that sympathy for Annie I'm sensing in this thread?

No. No sympathy! Just appreciating a fascinating character. She is still a monster regardless of her reason. That said, I still want to know why she did all of this. What lead to it? What compelled her?

[Nikkan]

Originally Posted by monir

If the episode was true to the manga event for the most part, I could rationalize the laugh. Her behavior seems to indicate she has reached a point where she doesn't care anymore, probably for the human element. I believed her when she said to the goody-two-pants guy that if he wants to take those two corrupt MP out, that if he wants to start something, to change something, to make things right..... she would help.

There is also the tear streaming down her eye in her FT form in the last episode after her confrontation with Levi. These things seem to indicate there are conflicting emotion at work which has ripped Annie apart psychological. And yet, she still needed to keep up with the act. Once she has realized the jig is up, she can finally stop pretending. I guess in her laugh where she seems like she is having an orgasm pretty much indicative of Annie doesn't need to carry the burden any longer. She is free, finally. Free to whatever.

So as far as the laugh goes, I can rationalize it.

As for, why she had to do all of this up to this point? I'm staying tuned to find out.

Yeah no, I agree with you on the things you said! Annie is a very, very tragic character who is anything but bloodthirsty. After you look beyond her facade of being a monster, you realize she is just a poor little girl who was forced to do something beyond her control.

My issue was just how they adapted the scene. In my opinion it gives off a feeling of Annie enjoying it contrast to the manga were she has more of a broken and despair look which I think is bothering a lot of people. Annie wouldn't laugh and blush like that, there is nothing to laugh about. She doesn't enjoy killing people or fighting Eren. She realizes there is no way out and despite of what she wants, this is the only way.

Spoiler for size:

[Haruyasha]

Why no sympathy for Annie? The girl was crying! (Indicates reason for doing what she was doing.)

I mean, what would you do if there were a bunch of ants buzzing all over you trying to kill you ... ?

I dunno about you guys, but I'd smash them to pieces, too.




May I also remind you that Eren (and Mikasa) were both ready to kill anyone who'd stand in their way, when the cannon was pointed at them.

War is war .. Allies can easily become your enemies.

[monir]

Originally Posted by Nikkan

Spoiler for size:

http://31.media.tumblr.com/417601613...32p7o1_500.jpg

The manga portion is there too in the anime as far as I can tell. I can't take a screenshot right now but feel free to look at the timecode 21:40 to verify. I guess the orgasmic Annie was an add-lib by the animators which I didn't mind at all and thought it actually added to the message, to clarify things about her character further.

Btw, sympathizing with any group that are fighting each other is extremely difficult. Yeah, Annie wasn't "bloodthirsty" per se, but she still killed a lot of people. I can't sympathize with Petra (don't throw vegetables at me, oh, the horde of Petra-fans.. I'm just voicing my opinion. ) either cause she was trying to kill the female titan just as much. It's just the enemy, Annie, was simply too strong. If Petra was able to kill FT and found out later that FT was Annie, I'm pretty sure Petra wouldn't have lost any sleep over it for killing another human. This is war. There is no rationalizing. It's only about killing or be killed. No sides get sympathy. Only pity!

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by Haruyasha

Why no sympathy for Annie? The girl was crying! (Indicates reason for doing what she was doing.)

I mean, what would you do if there were a bunch of ants buzzing all over you trying to kill you ... ?

I dunno about you guys, but I'd smash them to pieces, too.

She have taken their trust. She fooled them. And smashed them. My battle cry...

"Remember PETRA!!!! She died a virgin!!!!"

Originally Posted by Haruyasha

May I also remind you that Eren (and Mikasa) were both ready to kill anyone who'd stand in their way, when the cannon was pointed at them.

They're just kids. It's simple self defense.

[Haruyasha]

Originally Posted by NoemiChan

"Remember PETRA!!!! She died a virgin!!!!"

And how would you know that?

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by Haruyasha

And how would you know that?

Episode 21 12:16 > Petra was stepped on by Annie Titan's right foot.

Episode 22 21:01 > Seems like Petra's father is trying to ship her to Levi. I can assume that she is a virgin.

Either way... don't take me seriously.

[Ichigo91]

Great episode!

But why did Mikasa stop from Eren going forward to Annie? he might have stopped her spilling blood to transform into Titan

[ninryu]

It ended way too early! Aaaa, where's the next episode!

[DXMichael]

Annie is probably pretty unstable at this point in time before her transformation at the end of the episode. With everything that's happened to her, it's not surprising it's taken a mental effect on her.

Let's start waaay back when the female titan first appeared and go along the list of what happened. She transformed, killed several humans, ran God knows how much, had plenty of rough encounters that wounded her, baited into a trap that involved firing hundreds of spears into her and causing her to show obvious signs of fear, eaten alive by a horde of titans, she transformed again (Who's to say how much transforming a second time can take out of you? Eren can only do it only once without falling unconscious after exiting the titan), she was given the beat down by Petra and the others before causing their unkindly demise, faced off with a very pissed off Eren that greatly exceeded her expectations (As shown by her facial expressions), finally capturing him before having all that work and trouble she went through taking away from her by Levi and Mikasa who severly gave her a bigger beat down, followed by her having to get back behind the walls before the others without being found out and most likely getting a few hours sleep, foolllloowweeeddd by having her trust and friendship betrayed by Armin and the others. Adding on top that her cover is blown and she can't stay undercover within the walls anymore, it's icing to the cake.

Her reactions at the end were no surprise to me at all XD But she really is a mystery. She looks like she's enjoying herself one moment, and he next moment she feels guilty. I remember back in episode 13, she looked like she was in utter distraught when looking at Marco (Or someone else, I can't fully remember) and saying "Sorry" with a troubled look on her face. It's like a hormone thing lol, maybe she likes it sometimes when in the mood, maybe it's just an annoyance for her when she's not in the mood

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by monir

This episode puts huge question mark to that assessment. Skill is one thing but without honing ones skill, it becomes dull. So even if these MP's were on top of their recruiting class during their academy years, they shouldn't have a shred of chance if they engage the Titans when the occasion calls for it once in a blue moon. Recon Corp, on the other hand, seeks out and engages the Titans on a fairly regular basis. The combat experience alone puts any surviving Recon Corps soldier shoulders above any of the Military Police that never fought a Titan. So I have my doubts the MP will be effective as much as Recon Corp when it comes to fighting Titans. Humanity goes bye bye as soon as Recon Corp is dismantled. This episode makes a very strong case that the MPs aren't going to save the day.

I think this assessment also missed out on a critical fact. Even though our main characters from the 104th trainee corps were literally the best theoretical titan Killers out of their entire class in training...and most of them were barely keeping their wits about them in combat. Hell. Aside from Mikasa (who is according to our good Gunny Drill instructor, was a once every few decades level prodigy), none of these elite *star* recruits were considered good enough to be assigned to Trost's elite troop detachment. They were tossed in the midst of the regular recruits, and just as scared and terrified as any other grunt. Not much different in the Recon Corps, where our trainees are completely subordinate and reliant on the more experienced soldiers to survive.


A military formation that consisted of people like Sasha, Connie, Christa, Jean and Marco, who never were challenged for forced to hone their skills? It just doesn't add up that you'd get a military formation comparable to the Recon Corps.



Though the level of corruption, bad discipline and poor leadership on display in this episode? It seems unlikely that the MP's would match up fitness wise to even one of the frontier garrisons. Especially one commanded by someone as capable as say, Pixas, who'd never tolerate that level of chicanery.

Originally Posted by Haruyasha

Why no sympathy for Annie?

Annie IS a traitor who sought out her comrades in uniform and attacked and killed them. Most martial traditions tend to overwhelmingly look down upon people like that. And it's not like Annie could claim self defense or anything since she sought out the Recon Corps and engaged them. Nothing was compelling her to do what she did...aside from whatever convictions and agenda she's been secretly holding.

Originally Posted by Ichigo91

But why did Mikasa stop from Eren going forward to Annie? he might have stopped her spilling blood to transform into Titan

How? If half a dozen trained security personal (which is honestly what those people were. Civie clothing is probably a disguise) couldn't keep Annie from transforming, what was Eren supposed to do?

[-Sho-]

Finally the awaiting revelation , well i think almost all people expected this

But goddamn , Eren needs to chill out.....

[kitten320]

Originally Posted by NoemiChan

They're just kids. It's simple self defense.

I know you are joking but Annie is the same age.

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by kitten320

I know you are joking but Annie is the same age.

Where was Annie when Eren met Mikasa for the first time?