AnimeSuki Forums

Tyabann · 2009-03-04, 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by BetoJR

Well, when you put apart the story, the characters and the setting, yeah. They are pretty much the same thing.

This can be said for every damn high school anime.

Ryuuji is nothing like Yuuji though. Thank god.

Vexx · 2009-03-04, 13:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElementSun

Toradora is basically Shakugan No Shana without the supernatural stuff.

ummmmmm, no? Unless you're willing to also say that Akane-Iro ni Somaru Saka is "basically" Clannad. Okay, that was a bit extreme, but just because they have some similiar piece elements doesn't make them "the same"

Also, are you discussing the anime adaptations or the novels? The anime adaptation of Shana largely ground up whatever complexity the characters had. Toradora's anime adaptation has mostly avoided that. Taiga in particular stepped way out of the "usual tsundere" cardboard archetype within the first two episodes. Only Ryuuji seems to have suffered in adaptation - ending up looking denser and more non-sexual that he was in the novels.

If the two were "the same" then I wouldn't be watching and reading Toradora. I didn't care for the anime versions of Shakugan no Shana (nor ZnT, the other series some people seem to want to compare this to). The anime characterizations were static and flat with very little evolution compared to Toradora.

ElementSun · 2009-03-04, 22:13

That's the thing though, I really liked the romantic aspect of Shakugan no Shana, but kind of disliked the confusing complexity that the storyline is drags you through.

So in a way, Toradora was a formula for win to me. :<

Ryuou · 2009-03-04, 23:38

I love Shakugan no Shana but JC Staff could've done a much better job with it instead of forcing certain aspects of it to fit typical anime molds. Compound the disappointments there with ZnT, and that makes the good work they're doing with Toradora! quite refreshing.

NeoSam · 2009-03-05, 04:56

The cover of the 10th and last volume of the shounen light novel series Toradora!:

Shounen light novel.
Published under the shounen light novel label Dengeki Bunko.
Official release date: March 10th, 2009.

k'2 · 2009-03-05, 20:37

sure TAIGA looks cute on that cover

too bad it's the last one

Argent · 2009-03-06, 05:32

Ya know, all I can say is I hope there's some big twist in the final book because for some reason the reported developments of volume 9 (it hasn't been translated yet, so I have to go with the reported spoilers), really bugs me and are not where I would like to see this story end.

The change in tone has already ripped away most of the charm this series held, it'd be a very sad thing if the plot runs down familiar lines from here as well.

npal · 2009-03-06, 06:14

You mean you actually don't expect it to end the cliched way? :P Too bad, cause the way I see it, that's exactly how it's gonna end.

Well, at LEAST it WAS a novel approach to a cliche relationship, so I can forgive it a bit, unlike all the rest (tsundere) loli stories that have grown old and irksome.

BetoJR · 2009-03-06, 06:52

Is it really all that unexpected for the series to actually end like the 10th novel spoilers are purporting? I really don't see how it could end any other way.

npal · 2009-03-06, 07:03

Oh, that's not a spoiler, I haven't touched the novels or got spoiled from any forum. But seeing the way the anime is going, there's little doubt in my mind it's gonna end like everything else before it. I still have a tiny hope of being pleasantly surprised but meh...

Or are you talking about other spoilers?

Tyabann · 2009-03-06, 10:09

I find it funny you guys are complaining about 'cliche relationships' when the only show like this that I can remember where the male lead and the tsundere ACTUALLY GET TOGETHER is ZnT... and ZnT doesn't take it seriously at all.

npal · 2009-03-06, 10:13

Spoiler for other tsundere+main:

chaosprophet · 2009-03-06, 13:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

I find it funny you guys are complaining about 'cliche relationships' when the only show like this that I can remember where the male lead and the tsundere ACTUALLY GET TOGETHER is ZnT... and ZnT doesn't take it seriously at all.

The cliche part of it is not that Taiga is a tsundere but that she is the female lead getting together with the male lead. Not that I care about if it's cliche or not... I'm on the group "the important is not the destination but the journey".

Tyabann · 2009-03-06, 13:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by npal

Spoiler for other tsundere+main:

Spoiler for response:

Quote:

Originally Posted by chaosprophet

The cliche part of it is not that Taiga is a tsundere but that she is the female lead getting together with the male lead. Not that I care about if it's cliche or not... I'm on the group "the important is not the destination but the journey".

...That's what happens in romance anime. The female and male lead get together. This is what happens.

It's not "cliche". It's the logical progression of both genre and plot.

Vexx · 2009-03-06, 14:07

I think some people are misusing the word "cliche" ... :P

Really... the only cliche ending I can think of are the ones that take 12/24 episodes before anyone gets the nerve to say "suki desu" and they hardly even touch each other. Almost everything else is unusual in this genre.

SageGaiGar · 2009-03-06, 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

Spoiler for response:

Spoiler for :

At first, I was in the camp of "It'd be nice of they stick as BFF" but with the latest developments and storyline I don't mind and even like the progression. As for cliches, remember in writing there is *nothing new*, only new ways for it to happen.

Spoiler for LoveCom:

Tyabann · 2009-03-06, 14:38

Wait, is the female lead of LoveCom a tsundere?

In any case, LoveCom is shoujo, where developments like this are more common...

Toradora, though written from a distinctly female perspective, is still a shonen romance series... it's not common you see a shonen series actually go anywhere with the romance, especially with a tsundere lead...

I'm just really impressed, is all.

SageGaiGar · 2009-03-06, 15:17

Opps.

I didn't mean to imply LoveCom's heroine's a tsundere.(She's not) Just raised a point at the 'leads always get together bit'.

Heh and I was thinking it's a shonen written like shoujo. With the style and traits.

frivolity · 2009-03-06, 15:38

Kinda off-topic, but of Rie's 5 main tsundere characters, only Yuuhi did not truly end up with the male lead, but even then it was a harem ending. Perhaps it's because the change in a tsundere's character is almost always a major part of her development, and substantial content has to be devoted to it. Barring character death, there would be no point in transforming the character in such a way only for her not to end up with the male lead.

Deathscyther · 2009-03-06, 16:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by frivolity

Kinda off-topic, but of Rie's 5 main tsundere characters, only Yuuhi did not truly end up with the male lead,

Only Yuuhi didn't end up with the male lead...?

I'll base the following on anime only:

Shana -> not together with Yuji...we can only speculate what happened in the end.

Louise -> together with Saito

Nagi -> not together with Hayate

Yuuhi -> didn't end up together with Yunichi

Taiga -> all speculation at this point

As far as I can see, Louise is the only one who is truly together with the male lead right now :/

2009-03-05, 04:56	Link #1365
NeoSam Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Age: 43	The cover of the 10th and last volume of the shounen light novel series Toradora!: Shounen light novel. Published under the shounen light novel label Dengeki Bunko. Official release date: March 10th, 2009. __________________

2009-03-06, 06:14	Link #1368
npal I desire Tomorrow! Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: As far away from reality as possible Age: 41	You mean you actually don't expect it to end the cliched way? :P Too bad, cause the way I see it, that's exactly how it's gonna end. Well, at LEAST it WAS a novel approach to a cliche relationship, so I can forgive it a bit, unlike all the rest (tsundere) loli stories that have grown old and irksome. __________________

2009-03-06, 07:03	Link #1370
npal I desire Tomorrow! Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: As far away from reality as possible Age: 41	Oh, that's not a spoiler, I haven't touched the novels or got spoiled from any forum. But seeing the way the anime is going, there's little doubt in my mind it's gonna end like everything else before it. I still have a tiny hope of being pleasantly surprised but meh... Or are you talking about other spoilers? __________________

2009-03-06, 10:13	Link #1372
npal I desire Tomorrow! Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: As far away from reality as possible Age: 41	Spoiler for other tsundere+main: Remember Shakugan no Shana? :P Remember Love Hina + OVA? :P Remember X anime with tsundere and main? :P __________________

2009-03-06, 14:07	Link #1375
Vexx Obey the Darkly Cute ... Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ... Age: 66	I think some people are misusing the word "cliche" ... :P Really... the only cliche ending I can think of are the ones that take 12/24 episodes before anyone gets the nerve to say "suki desu" and they hardly even touch each other. Almost everything else is unusual in this genre. __________________ "It Really IS Rocket Science", Novel series rough drafts; vol. 1 thru vol. 3 complete Volume 4 in work, Visit the thread for short stories!

2009-03-04, 22:13	Link #1363
ElementSun Member Join Date: Aug 2007	That's the thing though, I really liked the romantic aspect of Shakugan no Shana, but kind of disliked the confusing complexity that the storyline is drags you through. So in a way, Toradora was a formula for win to me. :<

2009-03-04, 23:38	Link #1364
Ryuou 進む道は武士道のみ Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Dying to get back to Japan (but currently near Chicago) Age: 36	I love Shakugan no Shana but JC Staff could've done a much better job with it instead of forcing certain aspects of it to fit typical anime molds. Compound the disappointments there with ZnT, and that makes the good work they're doing with Toradora! quite refreshing.

2009-03-05, 20:37	Link #1366
k'2 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Cairo in Egypt Age: 35	sure TAIGA looks cute on that cover too bad it's the last one

2009-03-06, 05:32	Link #1367
Argent Member Join Date: Jan 2006	Ya know, all I can say is I hope there's some big twist in the final book because for some reason the reported developments of volume 9 (it hasn't been translated yet, so I have to go with the reported spoilers), really bugs me and are not where I would like to see this story end. The change in tone has already ripped away most of the charm this series held, it'd be a very sad thing if the plot runs down familiar lines from here as well.

2009-03-06, 10:09	Link #1371
Tyabann Homo Ludens Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Canada Age: 34	I find it funny you guys are complaining about 'cliche relationships' when the only show like this that I can remember where the male lead and the tsundere ACTUALLY GET TOGETHER is ZnT... and ZnT doesn't take it seriously at all.

2009-03-06, 14:38	Link #1377
Tyabann Homo Ludens Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Canada Age: 34	Wait, is the female lead of LoveCom a tsundere? In any case, LoveCom is shoujo, where developments like this are more common... Toradora, though written from a distinctly female perspective, is still a shonen romance series... it's not common you see a shonen series actually go anywhere with the romance, especially with a tsundere lead... I'm just really impressed, is all.

2009-03-06, 15:17	Link #1378
SageGaiGar You are Next Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: NE USA	Opps. I didn't mean to imply LoveCom's heroine's a tsundere.(She's not) Just raised a point at the 'leads always get together bit'. Heh and I was thinking it's a shonen written like shoujo. With the style and traits.

2009-03-06, 15:38	Link #1379
frivolity My posts are frivolous Join Date: Nov 2008 Age: 35	Kinda off-topic, but of Rie's 5 main tsundere characters, only Yuuhi did not truly end up with the male lead, but even then it was a harem ending. Perhaps it's because the change in a tsundere's character is almost always a major part of her development, and substantial content has to be devoted to it. Barring character death, there would be no point in transforming the character in such a way only for her not to end up with the male lead.