Higurashi Episode 18 Discussion / Poll

[BakaOnna]

That was an excellent episode. The footsteps were really freaky, esp. when Shion was in the Shrine and at the last few minutes of the episode. I think this episode had the same creepy aura as Onikakushi-hen, which I still think is the scariest arc. But one question, did Studio Deen purposely leave out the footsteps in the questions arc, since we've never seen Keiichi experience them in the anime, but it's in the TIPS and stuff? I think if they left the footsteps in, it'll be 5x as scary as it was. Anyway, with this episode, I can basically piece together the rest of Watanagashi-hen. On a final note, yay! Kei-chan is back!

[Alu]

Indeed a great episode

Much like following the previous one, slowly giving us answers and connections to the "why's" and "how's" of certain events in Watanagashi-hen.
The information given so far in Meakashi-hen has clearly given light to alot of doubts, and I have a feeling the best is still to come

Now to review the episode.., time for spoil-tags

Spoiler:

The first thing that I have to stand out was that, on this episode we finaly saw on how the connection between Shion & Keiichi started.., which then lead to the events we saw in Watanagashi-hen.

This to me was a extreamly important part of the episode.., since as we remember.., the first time we saw Shion was she met with Keiichi at Angel Mort, and we then had no idea that she had been rescued by Keiichi before, the exact same way as she was by Satoshi-kun. Which finaly explains her attitude towards Keiichi as kind of embarrased when we first saw her on Watanagashi-hen.

Her first meeting with Keiichi under the same circustances as she met Satoshi also is extreamly important for how I belive Shion will develop as we saw and what happened after.

This because.., and we saw parts of this on this episode and on her monologues aswell, Shion not only begins to see Satoshi in Keiichi, but also to see herself in her sister, or to wish for such would be better said..., as in.., there is nothing rong with Mion beeing with Keiichi.., as on the contrary she could not be with Satoshi.
And all of this envy, jealousy and hatred for what the Sonozaki did will eventualy lead to the reasons as to what we saw happening to Mion, Keiichi and everyone else as we saw in Watanagashi.

Shion still loves Satoshi.., and she clearly finds the entire situation to be unfair.., specialy after all she went through.
What we will see in the next episode hopefully will be the trigger as in how or what finaly made her "snap" or awakened the dormant demon inside

We also saw that a couple of things that we first thought Shion was only doing with Keiichi to make Mion envious; not that this wasn't the reason aswell but.., they had some other foundations to it.

Clearly the holding hands part when Keiichi was with Shion and then ran into Mion was a mistake.., this because Shion only did such because Keiichi reminded her of Satoshi-kun.

And the situation by the festival was also Satoshi related.., for Shion's main interest was to investigate the storage-house for clues regarding him.., she mostely only decided to take Keiichi because she thought if they got caught.., Mion then would let them go easy ^^

I belive Shion better then anyone understands what is like to love someone and wanting to be happy with that someone.
Thus when Mion told her what happened with the doll she clearly understod that Mion loved him very much.

Thing is.., that love is possible.., while her's was denied.., which clearly the envy I previously stated on behalf of Shion.., even though she does not wish to do such as we saw in her monologues.

This doll part was also another good answer to alot of speculations, we finaly can comprove that Mion does love Keiichi.., and that she felt terrible for him not seeing her as "that type" of girl.., and went and gaved the doll to Rena..

Speaking of Keiichi now..., its unbelivable how he even more and more after what we all had seen can resemble Satoshi.., specialy now in Shion's eyes..
Its this resemblence though will probably kept Shion from performing a Watanagashi special on him.., as in when she stoped and said "why can't I do it.."
However.., I can't help to wonder what realy happened to Satoshi..

We are absolutly sure now that judging by the last episode he was the one who killed his aunt.., and most probably that the dead drug-addict was a set-up by the Sonozaki family.

Thing is.., and Mion even "showed distinction" for this as we saw.., Satoshi was suposed to have been left alone.
However.., he still dissapeared..

We are left with 2 choices on this then...

One is.., Mion's "distinction" served no purpose for the Sonozaki had already decided Satoshi's fate, which would bring us to the possibility that Oiishi-san's speculation regarding what happened to him which he told Shion to be true.

Or the other was that he realy was.. "demoned away".

But currently as what we have been seeing..., to me Oyashiro-sama's curse seems more and more to have "some" true reason on all of this.., and its not just fiction as I first thought.

First we get the footsteps which are only heard by those who are witnessing the forewarming of the curse..., at the begining I belived this to just be in the character's mind.., but then when Rena told Shion about them and clearly stated that she had felt them too, was too much to be a coincidence.

This proves that Rena felt them, we saw Keiichi feel them aswell.., and now Shion.
Adding this to what we saw in Rika's premonitons.., something un-natural is definitly taking place.

Hopefully by the end of the last arc we will come to a good conclusion regarding both the un-natural and reason aspects.., or as I hope.., in which they will complement each other.

Anyway, I just can't wait for the next episode

Ah.., one last thing.., is it possible that..
When Takano met with Shion on the library and handed her her manuals on the Watanagashi Ritual.., Shion then used these to learn how to do the Watanagashi on.. Satoko ?

As I remember on Watanagashi-hen she said to Keiichi that she had performed the Watanagashi flawlessly..; using Takano's notes would explain how she was able to pull this off.

Thanks for reading

[Eric the Grey]

Originally Posted by SpaceDrake

<3, LostBlue, get it done when you can. Quality > speed.

I agree. We'll be here waiting.. impatiently, but we’ll be waiting.

Oh, and thanks for doing the sub. You guys (the WIND crew) are great!

Originally Posted by Wanderer

All I can say is that I am absolutely shocked at how wrong this makes me. I literally am not sure that I believe this outcome so far.

So everyone, what do you think? Different viewpoint of the exact same set of events, or different viewpoint and a (maybe only slightly) different set of events?

I believe it is different viewpoints, all clouded by individual experience and possibly outside influence. I do not believe that the events actually happened the way any of the various chapters have shown. Because each is from a slightly different viewpoint, they are colored by something else.

Spoiler for my theory:

I am leaning towards swamp gas with some form of psychedelic or narcotic effect on the people who live in Himazawa. This would be the same swamp gas that eventually bubbles up and kills most of the people in town. This would be the reason for the various different views of the events that led up to the finale (the death of the town). The people affected by said gas experience a somewhat colored view of events causing them to act out of character (ie: taking a baseball bat and chasing down someone in the forest...).

Keiichi also mentions a taste to the air when he comes to Himazawa the first time. “I learned for the first time that air has a taste.” Perhaps this is simply something that those who live there for a long time don’t notice any more.

As far as this episode goes, I loved it. It had a slightly creepy feel to it, and made a lot of fuzzy things clearer. I can’t wait for the next one to see how it plays out.



Eric the Grey

[Sinestra]

great episode i got a lot of my questions answered in this one. Some key elements are coming together espcially about Keiichi and Satoshi.

Spoiler for My thoughts:

Watching Shion try to strangle the living hell out of Mion was a surprise to me another one i didnt see coming. Its intresting how Mion and her grandmother had found out so quickly that they had entered the shrine. I did enjoy watching Mion's cute side with her trying to get Keiichi to notice her during this conversation they looked and sounded like normal sisters. I now do think that both sisters did have a thing for Keiichi but for diffrent reasons. the whole foot steps behind you thing really freaked me the hell out that so damn creepy man this series is messed up i love it
Shion/since he reminded her of Satoshi
Mion/ likes for who he is

I did notice something really intresting. There have been a lot of theroies over who called Keiichi back in the other chapter . Also a lot of us kept thinking that the twins were switching places. Well in episode 18 Mion has three of her nails ripped out too just like Shion did. With this done there really is no way to tell them apart Shion could kill someone while dressed like her sister. At this point in time the only way to tell them apart was Shions busted nails (which she should not be picking at by the way) Does anyone else have a speculations on this? cause this would also explaini how Mion knew so much about what Keiichi did while she was pretending to be her sister. Also i think that someone is finally going to get the tazer in the next one episode. I do think that all the chapters do tie into one another just diffrent view points like a few others have stated, maybe the stories are told out of order but if you watched them in the right order everything would make senese im just guessing though

[Cardiac Glycoside]

I have a really fscked-up theory--

Spoiler:

What if K1 IS Satoshi?

[LuckyCat]

but he's not

[Cardiac Glycoside]

Oh you know how this anime works. It doesn't.



For all we know, maybe the blue-haired teacher is the one behind all the murders.

[LostBlue]

Originally Posted by Cardiac Glycoside

For all we know, maybe the blue-haired teacher is the one behind all the murders.

-- The Clue Game --
The culprit: Ciel-err-Rumiko sensei
The scene of the crime: the curry garden
The murder weapon: the spoon
The accomplice in crime: Type-moon.

[Deathkillz]

just watched it...and im totally confused to wheather mion is good or bad >.< shion on the other hand is a love tragity...i feel for her in the name of love she had to suffer and K1 is getting the demon side of her out...
so many things have been sed already i dnt even know wht to say anymore

[FatPianoBoy]

Takano did it. No one that creepy could be innocent. I almost threw my fork (I was eating a burrito) when she popped up at the library
Heck, she still startled me the second time I watched it. Scary woman, she is.
And I wanna read that notebook.

Interesting point: Oryou and Mion were talking about Takano and Tomitake going into the shrine, but we didn't hear anything about Shion and K1. Doesn't mean they don't know, but they may not.
Also, Oryou talked about them angering Oyashiro-sama. I found this really odd. Why would she speak about Oyashiro-sama like that in private if it was just a scapegoat? There's no reason for her to fool Mion, since Mion would likely know whether it was real or not. Hmm...

[Alu]

Originally Posted by Deathkillz

just watched it...and im totally confused to wheather mion is good or bad >.<

Mion is Definitly NOT bad...
I understand how you got this idea though.., after the display of coldness we saw in her in the last episode.., but understand this.., she "had" to do that; as in.., she has to act in the way she did.

As to make clear to Oni-baba and the rest present in the room that she was able to act as the Lead Head of the Sonozaki in a situation such as that.., but also and mostely to shorten the entire process; as it to be less painfull for Shion.

From the moment Shion declared her love for Satoshi and after all she had done.., clearly she had to take some sort of penalty.., otherwhise those who where involved in the story like Kasai for example would probably face a much greater punishment..

So as to make Shion realise this Mion toke upon herself the burden to be the one who would act as the excutioner sort of speak.., she knew that Shion would not be able to leave there until some sort of punishment was given.., thus she went straight away and did what she had too..., even though she inside was absolutly against it.., but she knew it had to be done.

In fact.. we even see her vacilate when Shion is unable to perform the last distinction.., as in she tries to calm her down.

And then like we saw in this episode.., Mion herself too then also toke the distinction for Oni-baba in order for her to leave Satoshi alone.
But mostely Mion did this aswell.., because like she herself said.., it was unfair that only Shion had to go through that.., when they are both sisters.

Mion in fact ends up to be the person who probably suffers the most in Wataganashi-hen / Meakashi-hen.

She suffers for having seen Shion been put through much pain.., she suffers for having gone through the same punishment as Shion, she suffers when Keiichi doesn't view her as "that type" of girl even though she loves him so, she suffers when she heards that Keiichi and Shion went into the storage house; and in the end.. well.., after not only Shion takes her place but she imprisions her and will unleash all of her anger at her.
And is if at that wasn't enough.., when Keiichi arrives.., he mistakes her for Shion..

I belive the last part regarding on how Shion after "awakening" unleashed all the hatred and blamed everything on Mion could have been avoided if only... Mion had not acted as cold as she did previously..
But allass and this is where the irony lies.., Shion could not see that Mion inside did not wish to do as such.., and she above all.., view her as an equal.

Both stories are extreamly tragic.., and its what makes it all so perfect.., and why I so much love Mion & Shion

[LuckyCat]

I like Mion too but I wouldn't call her completely innocent here. She tipped off Oni-baba about Shion's love for Satoshi and it seems likely she was indirectly involved in the last few "Curse of Oyashiro" murders.

They both have a few screws loose.

[Matrim]

Takano did it. No one that creepy could be innocent. I almost threw my fork (I was eating a burrito) when she popped up at the library
Heck, she still startled me the second time I watched it. Scary woman, she is.

Wow, I thought I was the only one who got scared of Takano not once but a few times. I have been saying it before but I will reiterate - Takano's seiyuu's doing such a masterful job. She just sounds as if she knows every damned secret in the world and the more gruesome they are, the more happy she gets.

Interesting point: Oryou and Mion were talking about Takano and Tomitake going into the shrine, but we didn't hear anything about Shion and K1. Doesn't mean they don't know, but they may not.

Well, Oryou did mention some young guy but since Oryou is so old we can't say whether she meant K1 or Tomitake. Anyway, in Watanagashi-hen on the next day (or maybe a bit later?) the whole village population seemed to know about the four of them breaking in.

Also, Oryou talked about them angering Oyashiro-sama. I found this really odd. Why would she speak about Oyashiro-sama like that in private if it was just a scapegoat? There's no reason for her to fool Mion, since Mion would likely know whether it was real or not. Hmm...

Well, even if the Sonozakis are behind the murders that does not necessarily mean Oryou does not believe that what she does would please Oyashiro-sama. Furthermore, maybe they are just used of saying that as some sort of euphemism for the murders that they commit and use it even in private. And Mion doesn't seem to know everything - for instance she seems to be kept in the dark about Satoshi's fate.

Come to think of it, the sudden encounter between the twins in the end of the episode might not be as decisive as I first thought. We had a cliffhanger in the end of episode three of Onikakushi-hen but the really dramatic events were not in the begining of the fourth episode. And the chilling cliffhanger in Tatarigoroshi with Takano asking K1 whether he buried the body well (I get goosebumps just thinknig of that scene) was followed by a rather cryptic Takano behavious afterwards. And it seems we will have three (or at laeast two) more Meakashi episodes, if one of the sisters imprison the latter now what's going to fill those episodes, I wonder?

Mion is Definitly NOT bad...

I wouldn't be that certain in that. We still don't know which of the twins is going to snap and go mad (or at least kill a few people while not being mad). Shion now looks a bit too obvious a choice which makes me hodl my judgement for the tiem being.

[Alu]

Originally Posted by Matrim

I wouldn't be that certain in that. We still don't know which of the twins is going to snap and go mad (or at least kill a few people while not being mad)

Its indeed too obvious now that is Shion who will do the switch.., we even saw her dragging Mion after having used the shock thingy (forgot its name^^) in the begining of the first episode of Meakashi-hen.

Plus.. all the pieces of the puzzle are set and its up to Shion to make everything fall into place (in what relates to Watanagashi-hen).., this beeing said.. I am absolutly positive that she will be the one to do the switch and pass on as Mion as we saw in the last episodes of Watanagashi-hen.

I had suspected such ever since that arc ended.., I mean.. the hints alone that she gives where already a Huge lead...; as when she speaks with Keiichi as she is leading him down the old dungeon.., she often menciones "now I see why Mion liked you", etc.

Anyway.., you will see for yourself on the next episode.., but may oyashiro-sama's curse strike me down where I stand if I am rong in this

*tap*

*tap**tap**tap**tap**tap**tap**tap**tap*

[Matrim]

Well, when Watanagashi-hen ended I was convinced that Shion was the bad twin, now when everything seems to point to her I am oddly less convinced. Answer arc or not, I am still expecting major plot twists.

[FatPianoBoy]

Originally Posted by Matrim

Well, when Watanagashi-hen ended I was convinced that Shion was the bad twin, now when everything seems to point to her I am oddly less convinced. Answer arc or not, I am still expecting major plot twists.

I don't think either of them was a "bad twin." I think something happened and one of them just snapped; like when Shion strangled Mion, but on a much deeper level.

[Darklightz]

Wow,this epsiode answers so many question while creating more much mystery.

I'm starting to lean towards the hallucinating gas theory.After all,by the time Keichii comes to Hinamizawa everyone is already quite insane,as he slowly becomes crazy too.

Mion...I just can't figure her out.One second she'd begging Obaba to let Shion alone and taking the ritual of distinction herself for it,the next she's discussing what most likely is Oyashira's punishment.Maybe personality discorders are genetic in the Sonozaki family?

Also I'd give a lot to tap into Hinamizwa's information network.Everytime someone does something,a completely unrelated character already knows about it.

I'm also getting curious to what it is Takano and Tomitake really want.If they know the gory story of torture why are they going so far as breaking the law to investigate?Are they secret agents trying to unfold the mysterious murder series?

[FatPianoBoy]

Originally Posted by Darklightz

I'm starting to lean towards the hallucinating gas theory.After all,by the time Keichii comes to Hinamizawa everyone is already quite insane,as he slowly becomes crazy too.

I'm beginning to open to it as well, but I still think that even that's a bit too easy.

Mion...I just can't figure her out.One second she'd begging Obaba to let Shion alone and taking the ritual of distinction herself for it,the next she's discussing what most likely is Oyashira's punishment.Maybe personality discorders are genetic in the Sonozaki family?

Mion is torn in half. She has to act responsibly as the heir of the Sonozaki house whilst still being Shion's sister. These last two episodes really hit home just how hard that must be, especially considering the view of Shion's existence according to family tradition.

Also I'd give a tap into Hinamizwa's information network.Everytime someone does something,a completely unrelated character already knows about it.

I know what you mean
Although in my mind, that means that they're not as unrelated as they seem

I'm also getting curious to what it is Takano and Tomitake really want.If they know the gory story of why are they going so far as breaking the law to investigate?Are they secret agents trying to unfold the mysterious series?

That's close to what I'm thinking, but I think their true purpose goes way beyond the killings. I've pointed out several times that Tomitake doesn't strike me as the photography type, and Takano seems to know way too much about everything in general (how many people know what's really in the storehouse?) to simply be curious about the town.

[Matrim]

Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy

I don't think either of them was a "bad twin." I think something happened and one of them just snapped; like when Shion strangled Mion, but on a much deeper level.

Well, saying "evil" or "bad" is simply the shorter way of putting it, so I am using it.
Tomitake is quite obviously not a simple photographer. I think that Akasaka's lie that he had come to the village to take great photographs of the scenery was a hint for that. Rika even said that he was Tomitake number 2. Come to think of it that means Tomitake has visited Hinamizawa even before the murders started. Or maybe this was Rika seeing the future again?

[Eleutheria]

Originally Posted by Sushi-Y

Spoiler:

That, and it's unfortunately they completely removed Keiichi's KOOL marble reality from the anime. ^^;

I finally understand what you mean by this after more than half a year. It's a damn pity the game didn't allow me to 回想する...