2008-07-17, 15:47 | Link #41 | |
Banned
Join Date: Aug 2006
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IMO, ROME seems too.. uh.. how should i put it... industrialized? (i am no master of the english language, as many know ;p). Topics and IRC = task management while keeping it .. uh.. "human", and somewhat interesting and fun. It's been well established that IRC is central to fansubbing, for it is the interaction and "chatting" (as well as trolling) that make it enjoyable, we may as well use something right on IRC for keeping track of tasks, rather than a whole separate thing like ROME. Ecxuse me if this makes little sense, i may possibly be high right now. |
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2008-07-17, 15:51 | Link #42 |
Give them the What For!
Fansubber
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Instead of Replacing IRC, why can't the app compliment it. For instance, most groups will have an staff IRC channel regardless. They usually have some sort of syntax for creating task in the topic. Why not have the app be ablie to change that IRC topic and for those that refuse to use it.
Also how about a bot that runs in the channel. You can push status updates to the bot. Which then updates the site. It can be done straight to through the site as well. You have to think about in the way of a fansubber. What do fansubbers need what do, they don't need. Generally everything that site deos can be handled through irc with notices and memoserves topics and general chats. The site should compliment that as a frontend to the irc room say for mobile or quick use. Also why not have a way for the leechers to get in on the game. Public Progress updates. Since you are running a centralized system why not make a way for leechers to follow groups or shows get updates on releases an rss feed for torrents etc, etc... Fansubbing is mostly community driven. The site the way its layed out leaves out most of that community aspect. It is a start though.
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2008-07-17, 16:41 | Link #43 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Ok, let me see it through the eyes of a fansuber. maybe you can help me:
1. How do you inform your members about a new task, like that he can time the new anime episode, if your members lives +8h apart from you? 2. How do you inform your members about changes, mistakes and missing sentences made in a translation, if your translato is offline? 3. Where do you post your translations for proofreading and how do you edit it? 4. What do you do if someone can't use irc? |
2008-07-17, 16:47 | Link #44 | |||
makes no files now
Join Date: May 2006
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You tell them they fail and don't fansub with them. Rocket science! Nyaa~
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2008-07-17, 16:53 | Link #45 | |
done
Fansubber
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Yokosuka, JP
Age: 43
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The fact is we have developed our systems through trial and error over many, many years. Pretty much all of us know how to set up a project chan topic to be extremely effective i.e. #Anime Topic: 01:QC Encode(Encoders name), 02:Timing(Timers name), 03:Raw(airing date) and so on. This app is suppose to be for whole group management. Anyone who is even ready for true group managing does not need their hand held like this. You should focus on adding to our systems not trying to replace them. Though this is just my opinion, I feel there is NO WAY your app can be better than our systems. Your app was developed maybe over 2 years or something, while just knowing a few names here you'd know quite a few of people here have over 6 years subbing experience. I figure those people, with that much time invested would know what they want for management by now. Reinventing the wheel is unnecessary, but adding rims is constructive. |
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2008-07-17, 16:55 | Link #46 | |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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2. useless 3. if it's plain text then it's useless, even a bulletin board is better 4. needs MSN Yeah, rocket science is pretty much useless. I understand that you've just coped with the way you are doing right now by forcing yourself on irc. I mean 6 years ago there weren't many good developed web based project management softwares on the web, so you're basically just saying that you've never used that kind of software before or that you don't see a real benefit in it. I can say the same about irc based task management. As soon as you add 10 different issues to the topic, it's quite a hassle to get any real information out of it. The only way to get your status is to wait for a member to be online. If, and that's the important difference in our premise, if a group member can't spend the whole time on your irc channel, the whole network and your scripts become pretty much useless. I'm not criticizing and say that it's bad to use irc. No, it's an important tool to stay in contact with each other. But there are more efficient and easier ways to assign new tasks. Last edited by silverado; 2008-07-17 at 17:07. |
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2008-07-17, 17:14 | Link #47 |
Give them the What For!
Fansubber
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1. How do you inform your members about a new task, like that he can time the new anime episode, if your members lives +8h apart from you?
I badger people to badger the member. Wake up at odd hours and badger then myself. (Memoservs, Gtalk, Cellphone if that has been given) Communication and a sense of responsibility is key to a great fansubber 2. How do you inform your members about changes, mistakes and missing sentences made in a translation, if your translato[r] is offline? I badger people to badger the member. Wake up at odd hours and badger then myself. (Memoservs, Gtalk, Cellphone if that has been given) Communication and a sense of responsibility is key to a great fansubber 3. Where do you post your translations for proofreading and how do you edit it? On the ftp, with a tag on the topic and a memoserv to the editor. Group editing is discouraged unless they are english majors (ego's run high) 4. What do you do if someone can't use irc? If they can't use irc. Are they really a fansubber... (email.. but really can't use irc)
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2008-07-17, 17:20 | Link #48 | |
makes no files now
Join Date: May 2006
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You know, the more you post, the more it is evident that you know very little about how a fansubbing group usually works. 1) Research 2) Do the work Not the other way round.
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2008-07-17, 17:26 | Link #49 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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I think the real problem here is how to explain that a wheel rolls better than a square. That specialized management software are sweeter than an instant messanger. That advanced web based text editors with roll back feature are more suitable for text editing then ftp clients, because this is exactly what you are doing.
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2008-07-17, 17:33 | Link #50 | |
Give them the What For!
Fansubber
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Look at TWITTER, yes you can use the site alone. But you can also be old fashioned and use the phone as usual. They work together. It makes no difference what you use. Just make the site simple and customizable and aimed directly at fansubbers (not scanslators they work differently)
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2008-07-17, 17:35 | Link #51 |
Seeker of Power
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I've never seen the elusive FTP client that also serves as a text editor. "Advanced web-based text editors with rollback features" might sound something like SVN, but... No, not really. As far as I know, most people edit in a plain text editor (Notepad++ or the like) or in Aegisub itself. These seem to be the standard practices.
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2008-07-17, 17:39 | Link #52 | |||||
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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2008-07-17, 17:51 | Link #54 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
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What we have works perfectly for our purposes. No one cares if a translation is 25% done or 75% done. It is an absolute waste of time to track progress in this way, because fansubbing tasks are already atomic. You cannot time a translated script until the translation is done. You cannot QC a release candidate until it has been encoded. You've created another typical CRM-style bloated app to fix something that isn't broken. IRC does everything. You can talk to your team members, leave messages, see what you have to do, and let everyone know when you've finished a task assigned to you. It's easy to see what team members are doing at a glance. What value does Rome add? |
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2008-07-17, 17:52 | Link #55 |
Give them the What For!
Fansubber
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Well I tried it out and I say... There are options that I don't need. And assumptions that I want to be done.
silverado I will look at your site and go through what I like and disklike. What I would expect as a fansubber and what not. I know its early and not all things have been implemented so I may be mention things that you may implement. This will take me a few hours maybe if I get at it right away.
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2008-07-17, 18:06 | Link #56 | |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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2008-07-17, 18:14 | Link #57 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
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show1ep1 @ TL, ep2 @ workraw? || show2ep1 @ RCQC (staff1), ep2 @ time (staff2), ep3 @ Tl/WR || show3ep1 @ TLC (staff3), show3ep2 @ TL (staff3) || show4ep1 @ raw It's quite clear (at least when you sub in the real show/staff names). If we work on 5 shows, we can have separate channels for each show (as another group I work in does). Perhaps there is room for other alternatives. However, when I'm done a QC, I don't want to upload a file, trigger events, send notifications, etc. I just want to upload a file and change a name in a topic. How can you make this process more streamlined? |
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2008-07-17, 18:27 | Link #58 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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When you close an issue in Rome all involved members will be automatically notified. You don't have to say "Hey, I'm done." They already know that you are done.
If you are a translator, your members will know where to find the text file (in the wiki). If you are a proofreader, your members can compare the current version with a previous version. New lines are highlighted green, deleted lines are in red. If you find mistakes, you can annotate the texts or edit it directly. You always see who did what. As manager you can create mile stones like "Bokurano Season 1". You can see the overall progress and plan whether you need to recruit new members or not. If a member is absent, he can create an "I'm Absent" issue or create a topic in the staff forum, all you need is one browser. How easier can this become? |
2008-07-17, 18:43 | Link #60 | |
Give them the What For!
Fansubber
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I'm a typesetter... I have a certain way I name files on my ftp. The ftp is very very structured. We follow a certain syntax. After I upload file I open my irc windows (which is always running) and update the topic all it is a /topic command. Your site introduces a few clicks and requires info that groups just assume. Can your sit e handle assumption. The IRC room is removed from any of the fansubbing material itself. Why should your site be any different. We put the TL in text files not in wikis thats not going to change. It all has to do with the Import feature of Aegisub which is made to handle text files. We don't group edit. So a wiki based editing is useless to us. One person edits at a time. Would being able to see changes done in a file be nice... yes. But thats could be done with a compare plugin into aegisub. Do we need milestones or due dates. No. WE go by the model its done when its done. (In a reasonable frame of time of course). Describing the task. Typeset Macross 02... Does that need describing. It's self explanatory. There are various things on the site that are not needed in for fansubing and all it is clutter and confusion. Streamline that site and find a way for it to complement the IRC. Cause we don't want to replace it.
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project management |
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