Umineko FanFiction Discussion

[GoldenLand]

Originally Posted by Cheerful Orange

I'm sorry, but is there any way you could rephrase this? I'm not quite following.

Ah, yes. That was probably a bit too train-of-thought. I'll explain.

Spoiler:

One popular thing that I've seen people arguing on the forums here is that there's no actual need in Umineko's storyline for Yasu to genuinely be Lion, the baby that Natsuhi threw off the cliff, and that she could just be a random orphan Genji arranged for after the baby's death.

Given the way that Redaction is treating Lion, with no obvious Beatrice and the Summoner (somebody nobody on Rokkenjima seems to know) there and working on Lion's behalf, I was thinking it would be interesting to look at the turn of events on the assumption that Ushiromiya Lion somehow survived but wasn't living on the island, and was interfering with the events at the family conference in 1986 using the Summoner as his agent.

I'm curious about whether that interpretation could explain some of the servants' behaviour earlier in Redaction, and whether it could provide a good enough reason for an apparent "outsider" to be meddling with the family. Of course, this is only a theory. I just think it would be entertaining to test it out.

(An alternative view, I suppose, is that it's all a plot of the servants, or that there is an outsider meddling in the conference for their own purposes, but it's not Lion.)

[Cheerful Orange]

Originally Posted by GoldenLand

Spoiler:

One popular thing that I've seen people arguing on the forums here is that there's no actual need in Umineko's storyline for Yasu to genuinely be Lion, the baby that Natsuhi threw off the cliff, and that she could just be a random orphan Genji arranged for after the baby's death.

Given the way that Redaction is treating Lion, with no obvious Beatrice and the Summoner (somebody nobody on Rokkenjima seems to know) there and working on Lion's behalf, I was thinking it would be interesting to look at the turn of events on the assumption that Ushiromiya Lion somehow survived but wasn't living on the island, and was interfering with the events at the family conference in 1986 using the Summoner as his agent.

I'm curious about whether that interpretation could explain some of the servants' behaviour earlier in Redaction, and whether it could provide a good enough reason for an apparent "outsider" to be meddling with the family. Of course, this is only a theory. I just think it would be entertaining to test it out.

(An alternative view, I suppose, is that it's all a plot of the servants, or that there is an outsider meddling in the conference for their own purposes, but it's not Lion.)

Spoiler:

That's definitely a solid theory. Stress is throwing off my brain today, so let me make sure I've got it straight now: theoretically, in this game, both Yasu and Lion exist; Yasu being what amounts to an orphan replacement, and Lion being... well, Lion. Yasu still existed on the island (hence Shannon's death, and Kanon's... well, whatever's going on with Kanon), whereas Lion left, and has hired the Summoner to take care of business on Rokkenjima.

The only thing that may need to been noted is Kinzo's will. Presuming it to be legitimate, at some point in the timeline Lion would have to have met Kinzo, and been acknowledged as Kinzo's child. This isn't really a big problem- really this could have happened at any point prior to Kinzo's death (either on-island or off-island), probably a few years earlier.

Now, let's actually run with this and see where it takes us. Presuming the above and the Summoner to be the culprit's avatar, I'd say that the Jeroboam=Summoner theory you outlined works quite well.

The thought comes to mind that Jeroboam could even be Lion's adoptive brother, explaining the sister-brother scenes. But I see too many problems with that for it to really be workable.

[Renall]

Redaction of the Golden Witch - Part 5

The narrative spirals out of control, seemingly on the whim of its eccentric Reader. But even as forces outside the story appear poised to destroy it, forces within fight to reassert control. Witches and humans alike take their future into their own hands to seek a resolution that makes sense. What makes sense to one may not make sense to the others, however... the bloodshed will not end at the guesthouse.

In the meta-world, Battler struggles to navigate multiple truths. If Andromalius's influences poison the story, is there any hope that they can be endured, or does this once-discredited Forgery deserve to die a slow, painful death? Will Battler's curiosity die with it, strangled by a demon's refusals? He's not known to give up easily... and with nothing to lose in this tale, Andromalius may yet regret toying with the Endless Sorcerer.

A lingering demise will not suffice for Walter Absalom. The mask of the editor as a patient academic begins to slip as injustices mount. He seeks to name the witch and battle her face-to-face. Can you name her first... and are you as confident as he is that you can successfully confront her?

The next playlist, in six parts.

Oh and obviously this will not be the final part (of the "main story;" there were always going to be Tea Party-esque segments to follow). Part 5 is now Parts 5 and 6. 6 is definitely the end though.

[Golden Bug-Hunter]

Halfway through part 5. I'm definitely feeling my lack of 80s pop culture knowledge. I can sometimes tell that a song is being referenced, but I know I'm missing a lot of subtext...

[Renall]

Originally Posted by Golden Bug-Hunter

Halfway through part 5. I'm definitely feeling my lack of 80s pop culture knowledge. I can sometimes tell that a song is being referenced, but I know I'm missing a lot of subtext...

I don't think any of it is necessary. Some of it is just for fun (one or two are just real groaner jokes if you catch them), and as I said only certain characters do it. Most scenes have little to none of that... I say, but then one of the editors catches the most blatant one in a scene that otherwise didn't really have any.

[Golden Bug-Hunter]

So, maybe it's just me, but....

Spoiler for Part 5 of Redaction:

It seems really suspicious that Jessica was so adamant about not waking Natsuhi up. I mean, they know there's something dangerous happening. They already saw a body from Shannon. The adults have been away all night and left in unnerving circumstances. They know she's not in a secure place.

But ohmygosh, she might have a HEADACHE or be CRANKY so let's leave her in this incredibly exposed and vulnerable position where she could be murdered at any moment??? And everyone else just rolls with it?! I guess noone loves Natsuhi, lol

Wanting to stay in the room initially was pretty reasonable, though out-voted and I would probably disagree with her too. The glare at going for the envelope for the sake of her dad's privacy is pretty sound too, so I wasn't too suspicious at those. But not even gently waking her up to make sure she's alive? I mean... the hell?!

After that, what else can I say except Jessica is an accomplice and trying to keep Battler from investigating too successfully?

[AuraTwilight]

Spoiler for Part 5:

I spoke with this to Renall myself during proof-reading. It's not very significant in-universe; and he admits it was one of the clumsier parts of the narrative. The reason Natsuhi isn't checked up on much is to create ambiguity on her situation, and uh... Let's just say Jessica isn't what should be suspicious about that situation. But is there anything ELSE weird?

[Renall]

Spoiler for Part 5:

I was beating myself up over this for a while, but then I realized that Ryukishi has people not hearing gunfire in the same building or dragging corpses around and constructing elaborate closed rooms with no concern for being caught. Meanwhile I'm trying to account for the fact that folks do actually get wet in the rain and not all being total idiots.

I'm owed one narrative stretch.

[Golden Bug-Hunter]

Spoiler:

Aw, I thought I was being observant, not a nitpicker. When a blatant clue is presented it's down right rude not to acknowledge it. I thought you were throwing us a bone, lol.

I mean, let's face it, everything about the situation is suspicious. That's to be expected in a murder mystery, right? Leaving aside Jessica's bizarre insistence on not waking Natsuhi up, there's the fact that they left Natsuhi resting alone in her own room to begin with. Why set her aside as a seperate target instead of having her shack up with the kids? There's strength in numbers there. And why was she so incredibly 'tired' anyway?

It makes me think of a scenario like Natsuhi was already dead when Krauss told Jessica she was resting in her room or maybe Natsuhi is somewhere else and they did the old 'pillows under sheets' trick. That fake Natsuhi in her room is bait for the other adults to attack.

So, it seems like the adults are half-working together but not completely. They have some sort of honor duel or something going on to settle things. They cooperated in lying to the kids about an assassin hunting them all, but really they're all out there murdering the hell out of each other because reasons.

So, from the crime scene investigation, here's what I've got in my head so far.

Rudolph and possibly someone else met with Krauss in the second floor room. He/they blitzed Krauss and took him by surprise. Rudolph got cut by the glass shards throwing Krauss out through the window.

Afterwards, Rudolph (and his partner) go downstairs. Rudolph wants a drink 'cause hey, he just killed a guy. But there was another enemy. Possibly out the window on the other side. Rudolph gets taken out. Probably with the first shot due to either surprise or treachery. The assailant or partner starts to try to burn the body but either gives up or gets distracted by something and runs off.

That Virgillia/Summoner duel was weird and confusing. I feel like there is some actual 'witch duel' game that I never saw the rules for, and they are describing a turn by turn account of it. Possibly using chess pieces to play a game other than chess since Virgillia remarked on the move having nothing to do with chess? Three rooks were used in the summoner's defense, so Virgillia couldn't use two rooks to place the shoulder towers on the board? I'm trying to remember if there was a game like that mentioned at WitchCon in part 3. Been a while since I watched that part.

In other news, I'm reassessing my interpretation of the part 3 narration. I wonder if perhaps Jeroboam is a woman. It explains the part where they room together better. It also makes the puppy-dog / friend zoning at the end of that story more sensible. I may have gotten so hung up on thinking of Andromalius as a manifestation of the author that I missed the forest for the trees.

[GoldenLand]

*rolls up sleeves*

Spoiler for Well...:

The story is pointing very very heavily towards Jeroboam as the culprit, but I think there's still a possibility of it being Cass, so I'll examine that too.

I think things hinge a bit on which parts of the story are reliable. I will assume that the portion by "Walter Absalom" is more or less totally reliable and is not something that someone (the culprit?) is writing themselves to try to stir up interest in their crimes. Which means that "a group of college students from California and Tokyo traveled to Rokkenjima" in 1996, and those students' dead bodies were recovered later.

The details are "sketchy" and Walter does not mention the names of those who went there...but it would be very strange if those names were not known, especially given that Walter was able to acquire medical reports about the dead bodies. Walter also hasn't said anything about the names in the forgery not matching those of the people who went to Rokkenjima, if the 1996 portions did indeed appear in the forgery that he read.

Now, what about the 1996 portions narrated by Jeroboam? If those are correct, then an adult travelled with the students, and it appears from Walter's narrative that an adult's body wasn't found. It's odd that he hasn't mentioned this, but perhaps he was planning this as a dramatic moment of "Aha! This was my key to finding the culprit" later on.

Possibilities:

There was an adult there
- Walter just didn't mention it or possess the details about it, but there was an adult with the group, who was killed.
- There was an adult there, and they escaped and lived. They probably killed the others and wrote the forgery. This adult was either Jeroboam or Cass.

There was no adult there
- Jeroboam was there, but was not an adult.
- Cass killed the others, escaped the island, and wrote Jeroboam into the forgery.

Potential killers:
Jeroboam
Cass (full name: Cassandra Villareal)

Alternatively: a single person who is represented in the forgery text by both Jeroboam and Cass. (For example, with Cass representing them as a young and foolish Rokkenjima fan who might yet be redeemed, and Jeroboam representing them as a mature person who finds that distasteful and wants to redeem her.)

Cass:
- Cassandra Villareal.
- Nearly 6 foot
- Went to UCLA
- Short dark hair
- Speaks good Japanese but with a dreadful American accent
- Appears to have a living father

Jeroboam:
- Unknown name
- About 5'5"
- Smokes cigarettes
- When first meeting Cass, he's wearing a suit and tennis shoes, Cass gives him a plastic butterfly pin and says they can pretend he's Rudolf.
- Used to go to UCLA
- Cass says that if Jeroboam would quit smoking and allow her to help, he could pull off being in his twenties again.
- When talking to Ootsuki, uses the fake name "Max Edison".
- Speaks fluent Japanese, in the Kansai dialect.
- had a strict mother whom he hates and went to live with at some point, and a father with a record collection who is now dead.
- Goes by his first name with friends, and by his middle name professionally. The middle name is unusual and sounds like something in a Western.
- When talking to a policeman, uses the fake name "Billy Shears".
- Interested to some extent in money and number tricks.
- Thinks the witch stuff is the fun stuff, but that the whole Rokkenjima fanbase stuff is ghoulish.
- Wants to think that Cass is redeemable - "I'd like to believe there's hope for people like you". "I had a lot of hope for you".
- Seems to have plans. "Tomorrow we'll be going to Nijima, and if all goes well...But it's not going well, is it? She hasn't learned a damn thing."
- basically has all the attitudes that Walter might well think the culprit has.

Golden Bug-Hunter's idea that perhaps Jeroboam is a woman is a plausible one. Based on the fake names Jeroboam gave in the story, and the way Cass tried to pass him off as a Rudolf cosplayer (although a woman in a suit could do that too at a pinch), the one in the forgery is evidently intended to be a man, but some things such as Jeroboam and Cass sharing a room, Karl not seeming to see him as a romantic threat, and some of the dialogue patterns could indicate that in reality Jeroboam was a woman. Those aren't particularly strong hints, though. The strongest one is Jeroboam's lack of a name and characteristics in common with the Summoner.

The Summoner
- Smokes cigarettes
- Her ID is her own from when she was younger
- Is 25 years old (but is not really 25. "Was I [25]? I guess I was." and has clearly gone back in time to visit the Rokkenjima incident.
- Cynical
- Is from California
- Definitely does not want to be called Beatrice
- Cannot have her name spoken out loud, because of reasons
- Her name is one which would seem exotic to Kanon if not for his time with the Ushiromiyas, who have names like it. About the name, she "never really felt like a princess".
- Self-taught witch
- Was projecting during Natsuhi's dream sequence, where scenes with Lion/Beato/Shannon were seen, along with scenes of a girl who is probably Richards.
- May be a girl called Richards whose father committed suicide
- May be a girl who went to live with a strict woman whom she hated but not as much as her father. The woman gave her a new name and said she was a bastard.
- May be a girl who was told by someone in an office that her mother was still alive
- May be the person in the office above who told her that
- May have lived in a home where a man with a gun killed a woman
- Has a card which puzzles Kanon and is just her "ba-" card. (Bank card? An error from being written post-1996?)
- Has what must be the plastic pin that Cass gave Jeroboam, "snapped in half at one of the wings". It reminds her of "dumb shit".

However, the Summoner's comment about her name is probably the biggest hint that the Summoner could be Cass or representing Cass in whole or in part. Cassandra = could be a reference to the Trojan princess Cassandra from mythology. And Cassandra's surname, Villareal, could well be a reference to the Spanish city Villarreal /Vilareal, the name of which means "royal town".

The name "Richard", which might be the Summoner's surname, could also have a hint in it. Wikipedia sayeth: "The first or given name Richard derives from German, French, and English "ric" (ruler, leader, king) and "hard" (strong, brave, court), therefore it means "powerful leader" as well as "King's Court"." That seems like a weaker connection in meaning, and not one that the Summoner would be likely to point out, but it could still count. And of course, the Summoner's real first name could be something else entirely that simply hasn't been mentioned at all.

I still think that Andromalius is representing the terrible truuuuuth, which is too harsh for Heaven, dissolves magical creatures with its blood, and gives humans nasty guilt trips. Although I'm not quite as sure as I was before.

The obvious theory is: Jeroboam is the culprit. He went to Rokkenjima and murdered the others, then escaped and became a witch who wrote a forgery and continued to take various actions against the Witch Hunters. At least in part, the Summoner represents him in the 1986 story.

Jeroboam is either Richards or somebody who knew Richards well. Richards' father committed suicide and perhaps also murder, and she was given trouble at school for it. She was sent to live with a relative who was probably her mother. This is why Jeroboam hates the people who play around with the Rokkenjima incident, which Jeroboam empathises with. Jeroboam is represented in the 1986 storyline by the Summoner.

There's a match in probably age, cigarette use, music interests, and some general behaviour.

Because of the scene in the office and the fact the Summoner's role in the story is to represent somebody, I'm hesitant to rule out that the Summoner/Jeroboam could be somebody other than the girl in the part 5 flashbacks. However, it appears likely that he (maybe she) really is that girl who is probably called Richards. It would explain Jeroboam's intense reactions. We know that, in some order, Jeroboam's father died and he went to live with his strict mother. He may also have had a sibling; if so, perhaps they were the unnamed siblings from certain scenes? Or heck, this is still an Umineko forgery, so perhaps one of them was the other's imaginary friend.

Jeroboam hoped that the 1996 group would understand the gravity of the situation if they went to Rokkenjima, or rather, he hoped they would realise before they got there. It was their last chance to realise what he hoped they would. They didn't, and he murdered them and left the island, writing a forgery and becoming a witch. In this forgery, he as the Summoner went back in time to 1986.

Jeroboam talked extensively in the chat room about theoretically getting away with murder, and wanted to make a point about how "It's real people. What if someday somebody says this sort of shit about you?" all of which could be taken as a threat.

However, certain points remain.
- If the characters are more mixed up than thought, the culprit could still be Cass.
- Cass' name still seems to suit the Summoner's "princess" remark better
- Richards may have been given a new name, which we cannot be certain belongs to Jeroboam rather than Cass.
- The forgery may not actually be a confession as Walter has assumed; the forgery writer and person who has tried to stop the Witch Hunters may not have been the true culprit.
- The above patterns don't take account of the possibility that contrary to Walter's expectations, the 1986 and 1996 incidents could be linked.

And I'm tired now, so that's all I'll write before I turn fully incoherent.

[Renall]

Originally Posted by Golden Bug-Hunter

Spoiler:

That Virgillia/Summoner duel was weird and confusing. I feel like there is some actual 'witch duel' game that I never saw the rules for, and they are describing a turn by turn account of it. Possibly using chess pieces to play a game other than chess since Virgillia remarked on the move having nothing to do with chess? Three rooks were used in the summoner's defense, so Virgillia couldn't use two rooks to place the shoulder towers on the board? I'm trying to remember if there was a game like that mentioned at WitchCon in part 3. Been a while since I watched that part.

Spoiler for Regarding the Witch Duel:

You're closer than you realize, but you're getting too complicated. It is in a certain sense a turn by turn (or close enough) account of something. However, as she states, it's not chess.

Remember that this scene is a deliberate parody of the one in Banquet.

Regarding the name situation...

Spoiler for Jeroboam Identity Stuff:

The surname is a freebie. I will say that "Jeroboam's" full name is guessable from only the information provided up to Part 5. Note that I say guessable, not provable; I can see there being unanticipated answers. But there is a correct one.

Spoiler for Gender Speculation:

There's one final point of detail in Part 3 you may have missed that should settle the question of Jeroboam's gender outright. The ones GBH mentioned are circumstantial, but there's one that might be outright confirmation. Can you find it?

Oh and...

Spoiler for The Second Card:

Someone in this thread may already know what the second card is referring to and not even realize it.

[Renall]

Redaction of the Golden Witch - Extra TIP

It's not easy being seventy-second. But for Andromalius, the things that trouble him most are not questions of the present, but the distant (and somewhat more recent) past. A being of contradictory thoughts and seemingly contradictory actions, he does his best to sort out who he is and what he really ought to be doing. It is difficult to love when everything you do comes through a lens of hatred and pain. Yet he feels as if he is driven to try.

As a participant in a seemingly heartless tale, how can he explain his conduct? Who is he and why has he come to the garden of the Endless Witch? How can he claim that his roiling blood allows him to know love at all?

It's a hard thing to justify to himself, let alone others. But he'll certainly talk for those willing to listen. Whether you trust anything a demon says is your business.

This is an extra and not meant to be part of the main story. It's strictly here for thematic reinforcement, flavor, and character development. I do not recommend scouring it for clues, as that wasn't the intent behind it. It does provide one really blatant answer, but that answer has only been slightly less blatant within the main tale and so it isn't especially needed. Long-time followers might remember chunks of this chapter existing in the original draft.

[witchfan]

Started reading Part 1 of Redaction. It's quite entertaining.

[battle22]

Total Seacat Island news.
I have re-released EP1-4.
New features include : Fixed Grammar, New font, Episode select screen, Tips and half of EP5.
For those who don't know what it is, here is the summery:

Meta Tv proudly presents: Total Seacat Island.
One of the most insane game boards in the Fragment sea by your hosts, Furfur and Zepar.
A series of comical, dramatic, ridiculous and unexpected challenges for the cast of Umineko to participate in.
See what happens when the 07th Expansion’s characters you have come to know and love
are divided into two teams and clash over the title of Umineko’s best character!
And by the end of each episode, one character has to leave the island forever!
Who will stay, and who will go? And who will be declared the best character ever written?
Find out, only on Total Secat Island!

-------------------
The link is on my signiture.

[Renall]

Redaction of the Golden Witch - Part 6

At long last, the 1986 narrative closes, but not without some bumps in the road along the way. The Fragment raises difficult questions not only for Battler, but for his erratic Reader, who seems to believe that Battler has an answer for him. Andromalius is intellectually manipulative, but he seems less adept at emotional appeals, and Battler is well aware of that.

But do any of those questions matter? Walter Absalom, fresh from unmasking his witch, is far too preoccupied with explaining away any lingering details. Perhaps viewing the Forgery was a waste of time after all; he has taken care of all the necessary research, and anyone who has written that many words must know what he's talking about.

Still, why take his word alone? In 1996, investigators arrive on the cursed island to survey a new incident... although not without obstacles of their own to deal with. What can be learned from this event? What is the appropriate response to it? What serves justice more: the mystery or the truth? Review the details for yourself and decide.

The "final" playlist, in six parts. Naturally, this is the end of the story only in the sense that the pre-Tea Party bits are the end of any Umineko story.

In addition, I've prepared a "questions" video as I said I would, basically serving as a guide to thinking about things while I slack off work diligently on the Tea Parties. You can find that here, or linked via annotation from the last part of Part 6. Don't view it before finishing Part 6.

[Jaden]

I'm so impressed by Redaction and really curious about it now. There's just a lot to it...will need some time and probably a lot of help to figure things out.

And about the questions video...holy shit, should we really be questioning all of those things? Okay then.

Spoiler for a train of thought:

Walter gives a biography of who he believes is the culprit, or witch, or the author. This makes abudantly clear the identities of the boy and girl in the story's seemingly random flashbacks. They'd be David Martin (supposedly the author) and his older sister. I have some ideas about her name, but I won't go there yet.

Now are those flashbacks in the actual forgery? For now I'm gonna say NO, because they are from the perspective of the girl, and we hear her thoughts. In that case, upon reading the forgery and connecting it to the real people in 1996, you'd assume the girl to be the author. Yet Walter says it's the boy. I think the girl being the author is feasible though.

Anyway, one of the questions to think about is, who is it that's actually speaking through Walter Absalom? In the very beginning it's already established that it's not the person's real name. Actually Absalom seemed like a strange name, so I googled it and oh crap, that's another can of worms opened. I've never actually read the Bible so maybe this stuff was obvious to everyone but came as a complete suprise to me. Let me explain anyways:

Absalom is the third son of the king David (first name of the supposed author). Jeroboam is one who conspires against David and eventually becomes king. The same naming sense doesn't necessarily mean that Walter=Jeroboam. Maybe the person speaking through Walter simply caught on the symbolism and just picked a thematic pseudonym.

Also noteworthy is the story behind the biblical Absalom: He avenges the rape of her sister after two years by sending his servants to murder the culprit. The sister's name is Tamar, who is the only known daughter of David. Meaning an unusual name that belongs to a princess...the summoner's name?

[Renall]

I will tell you that...

Spoiler for Name Speculation:

...it's not that complicated. I am totally aware of the symbolism (though Walter might not be) but it wasn't meant to be word-for-word, name-for-name. The thing to take from Walter's bit is that there is a particular sort of attitude that might have been held by David Martin's father. Look at his name and think about the kind of upbringing Steven Martin may have had. From this, what kind of name might his sister also have?

The things we know about the summoner's name:

• She says she's never really felt like a princess. And as people have caught on, yes that's a hint. However, people are overcomplicating it, because...
• Kanon says it would seem exotic if the Ushiromiya family didn't have names just like it. Remember, Kanon is Japanese; a name like "Jessica" is exotic to him, but it paradoxically becomes mundane because he actually knows a Jessica. In other words, her name is fairly normal for an American, or at least no more unusual than "George" or "Rudolf." A name like "Cassandra" or "Tamar," while both the names of princesses, might seem a little exotic.
• In the dream sequence, people call her "Richards" and "Beu."

Richards is obviously a surname.

The other mention of a name comes in Part 3:

• Cass mentions that Jeroboam's middle name is "something you'd see in an Old West movie." Cass mostly knows Jeroboam on a first name basis, and has only just noticed this is unusual.

So from this one could conclude that Jeroboam has a mundane first name and an unusual (or at least antiquated) middle name.

And finally there's Walter's analysis:

• David's full name is David Joseph Martin.
• David had an older sister whose name Walter couldn't find.
• Walter explicitly checked for birth records under both of David's parents' names in the counties where his sister would have likely been born and didn't find anything.

Spoiler for FAIRLY BIG SPOILERS:

I'm sort of obviously tipping my hand here that these names all relate to one another, and from that the conclusion is a little bit obvious.

As far as who Walter is goes, well, just bear in mind I don't expect a mountain of biographical details about him. Just more "what kind of person is he?" and "why does he want to expose this truth?"

[Jaden]

Spoiler for name speculation:

Ah yes, I remembered incorrectly what Kanon was saying about the summoner's name. So it's a mundane western name that most likely belongs to some princess, and could possibly be shortened to "Beu" (though nicknames often arise form unexpected things). Right now I'm thinking of a Disney princess.

I did catch on to that David's sister has no birth record in her family, so she could be adopted. In that case, even if her her foster father had a religious naming convention, it might not apply to her.

Oh, and is "Joseph" really considered antiquated? I'm from a scandinavian country myself so I don't really know. I think it's probably a name of waning popularity, but I still considered Joseph pretty normal. But that would mean Jeroboam couldn't be David Joseph Martin, so I must've been wrong.

My initial hunch was that Walter is more involved in the story than he's letting in, because the only way he could have figured out the author is through the summoner's character and especially her name. I thought Walter might be someone related to the sister, though not Jeroboam (that'd be 2meta4me) But now that Renall's saying it's acceptable to treat Walter as his own man, I'm a little bit put off, but also somewhat relieved.

[Renall]

I don't mind tossing around some info on the name stuff mainly because it'd be nice to get people actually using the character's name at some point. It was just meant to be a little puzzler, but the significance of the name itself is not that important... except that it will finally put me on the same page as naming the person as everyone else.

Originally Posted by Jaden

Spoiler for name speculation:

Ah yes, I remembered incorrectly what Kanon was saying about the summoner's name. So it's a mundane western name that most likely belongs to some princess, and could possibly be shortened to "Beu" (though nicknames often arise form unexpected things). Right now I'm thinking of a Disney princess.

I did catch on to that David's sister has no birth record in her family, so she could be adopted. In that case, even if her her foster father had a religious naming convention, it might not apply to her.

Spoiler:

Try not to think of names of princesses. Had it been a mythological or historical reference I would've been more specific. You're on the right track otherwise.

Steven Martin is the biological father of both of his children. It might be instructive to take a look at the dream again. Anything that Natsuhi doesn't remember must've come from somebody else, as she concludes.

Originally Posted by Jaden

Spoiler for Common Names:

Oh, and is "Joseph" really considered antiquated? I'm from a scandinavian country myself so I don't really know. I think it's probably a name of waning popularity, but I still considered Joseph pretty normal. But that would mean Jeroboam couldn't be David Joseph Martin, so I must've been wrong.

Spoiler:

Joseph is not considered antiquated in America and certainly not in the 1990s. Neither is David. They are, in fact, suspiciously commonplace.

[Jaden]

Well, that dream sequence confused the hell out of me. I'm thinking to re-read everything, armed with the knowledge bombs that have just been dropped.