2010-06-24, 13:06 | Link #7942 | |
Aria Company
Join Date: Nov 2003
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2010-06-24, 13:29 | Link #7943 |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Renounce the napalm treaty and level the entire place. *sarcastic*
There isn't really much of a real solution to the Afghan problem other than to secure Kabul wholly, then leave. The whole place is in a mess.
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2010-06-24, 13:53 | Link #7944 |
Um-Shmum
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts
Age: 39
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1)if your enemy knows how you conduct yourself, conduct yourself differently (change troop locations all the time, and introduce newer weapons into the fight)
2)if you see an enemy using civilians as human shields, don't let that fact deter you from attacking them (if they see that it works, they will keep on doing it) 3)coordinate between your NATO allies to insure that EVERYONE is following the same lead, and not their own individual orders. 4)give more control to the soldier in the field, so that he doesn't have to wait for confirmation before attacking the enemy. 5)allow the soldiers to laser designate targets at their own discretion (they can see better then the guy at HQ) 6)stop allowing the use of lawfare against your troops by backing your troops up 100% on their decisions at all times, and only conducting investigations yourself 7)take over poppy fields and buy them up instead of letting the taliban do it (you can destory the poppy for all that it matters, just don't let taliban use it) 8)holy places are NOT fire proof, so make if perfecly clear that anyone firing from a church of a masque will be fired upon without a second thought) 9)if you suspect that a "civilian" is aiding the enemy during combat, fire at them even if they aren't armed (at the very least, to scare them away) 10)US and NATO bases and installations are classified areas, and anyone observing them is to be arrested and questioned. 11)there is NO SUCH THING AS AN ENEMY STRONGHOLD (at least not for more then a few minutes). if you know where they are, you attack immediately with full force. the enemy must NEVER be allowed a single nights rest. if your enemy has even a single place where they feel safe, then your doing it wrong. 12)understand that attempting to form democracy is much more complex in that part of the world afganistan is just a collection of tribes who all share a specific territory, so if you want your newly formed goverment to have control, you start with divide and conquer tactics (reward the allies, and crush the enemies of the new government) you won't have to do this for very long, since word gets around very fast that people who follow you get rewarded and people who oppose you get dead. the middle east is a place where the strong rules. show that YOU are the strong, and people would rather become your allies then your enemies. but most importantly, cancel any plans on leaving any time soon there is no such thing as a set DATE for a pull out. if your dealing with an enemy that simply needs to outlast you, then he can just wait until you leave, then make his move. the US should declare that they would ALWAYS maintain troops and bases in afghanistan, even AFTER the battle is over although it would be in a lesser capacity (like in saudi arabia) most of the work would be done by the afghan troops, but you'll always be there. if people think that your going to leave soon, and that the taliban will just take over again, then they aren't going to work with you or your local allies. if you want to win the war against the taliban and their ilk, you can't afford to have your presence seen as a temporary thing. if it is, then they just have to wait until you leave. if they know that you aren't GOING to leave, then they will have to choose between going to war with you (which is better for you, since you can mow them down) or to give up.
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Last edited by bladeofdarkness; 2010-06-24 at 14:06. |
2010-06-24, 15:39 | Link #7945 | |
Love Yourself
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Northeast USA
Age: 38
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There's a major flaw with this strategy for the United States in Afghanistan. It's the strategy that was used previously and it did not meet with good results. We are trying to win over the Afghan people. The methods you've described place an emphasis on killing the Taliban. Killing innocent civilians will have a number of negative effects: 1) The United States will be seen as a conqueror, rather than an ally. They already have a very unstable trust relationship with us. 2) Dead innocents incites feelings of hatred against the killer. Where do you think that the Taliban recruits from - people who are peace-loving and friendly to the United States? No, they're recruiting the people who feel that the US is evil for killing innocents. The threat of death will not deter these people from taking action against the US. 3) Retaliating over every little thing is ridiculous. A terrorist in every true term could fire a rocket from a mosque packed with innocents. If we followed your advice, the mosque and its innocent inhabitants would be burned, and the US would have a trust crisis on its hands. We would have been deliberately manipulated by the Taliban. Negative sentiments against the United States are good for them. I'd also add that in this regard, I wish that Israel would be a little bit less predictable in how it retaliates to attacks, and that it should show more restraint. 4) We cannot take and control areas with our own forces. What you said about the poppy fields has already been tried. We can't burn the fields, because that's there way of life. Our forces have tried paying farmers to do something else, but once the soldiers leave then the Taliban returns and forces the farmers to keep going. We're not trying to eliminate the Taliban. That's impossible without committing genocide (and we all know that would probably result in the creation of new "terrorist" organizations, that were all out to get the United States). We're trying to pacify Afghanistan. You don't do that purely with force.
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2010-06-24, 15:50 | Link #7946 |
Um-Shmum
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts
Age: 39
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i'm not saying kill anyone who looks suspicious.
i'm saying that one should make it clear that hiding behind civilians is a useless tactic, because it wont stop you. the people who WANT to see the US as a conquerer, will always see it as a conquerer the key is to make the people who ARE your allies, seem more powerful for their alliance with you. the choice should be "join the government" who is much more powerful or "help the taliban" who are less powerful the US should be the "power" part. the mistake in what you said is "paying them to do other things" don't try to change how they live don't try to burn the fields. BUY the poppy yourself. doesn't matter what you DO with it, so long as the taliban can't use it. pacifying Afghanistan means making the central government the actual RULING body in the country its not easy, but its doable you just have to sufficiently weaken the enemy, and sufficiently strengthen the government forces
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Last edited by bladeofdarkness; 2010-06-24 at 17:13. |
2010-06-24, 17:00 | Link #7947 | ||||
Love Yourself
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Northeast USA
Age: 38
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Please don't speak so disrespectfully of other cultures. That sort of disrespect is partly what fuels those opinions of people claiming that Israel wants to commit mass genocide against Arabs (among other such nonsense).
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Either way, it doesn't matter. Your focus - and the USA's old focus - was on defeating the Taliban by confronting the Taliban directly. The proper focus, which is what we're doing now, is to hack away at the Taliban (and other hostile forces) yet not give them the full focus. Our true focus is to let the Afghanistan people build a stable society, one in which the people are content enough not to become militants. That has always been our end-goal. If we can accomplish that, the Taliban and other militants will wither away because they will not be able to find people who want to join their cause. Quote:
While you're right that people who want to make the USA out as some sort of villain will do so regardless of what action is taken, there are plenty of people who have no opinion. We do not want to turn those people against us or make them suspicious of what we're doing there. Quote:
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Unlike Israel's situation, this is a war of choice. We claim that we were attacked and so we went over there, but the response was arguably overblown. They are not at our border, firing rockets onto our soil regularly. The situation is very different, and simply being there is costing the country a lot of money every day.
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2010-06-24, 17:13 | Link #7948 |
Um-Shmum
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts
Age: 39
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1st
i'm not talking as an israeli, i'm talking as a person who follows the news and i'm seeing mistakes being made that cost american lives for stupid reasons (believe it or not, we actually LIKE americans ) sorry for being offensive (it was meant to be a joke, i'll remove it) 2nd if the terrorist know that using THEIR OWN CIVILIANS as shields is a winning strategy, they will keep doing it. war criminals shouldn't be REWARDED for their crimes by letting it work. 3rd either burn the poppy AFTER you buy it, or convert it to morpheme just make sure the Taliban can't use them 4th your already THERE is pulling out an option at this point ? if not, then you need to rethink.
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2010-06-24, 19:46 | Link #7949 | |||||
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Apparently justice is not delivered as of today as a number of provinces in Afghanistan are still under oppression, corruption by both the Karzai government and the Taliban. Btw, you shouldn't just follow the news. Use some logic and critical thinking when reading them : newscasters, reporters and editors will do what it takes to make sure their news sell rather than informing people. Quote:
As much as we want to shoot them all and drop JDAMs, it isn't right for an innocent to die just because two sides are fighting. Keeping up just-enough pressure without going all out is the only thing they can do to limit collateral damage. Quote:
The problem is that poppies are the SOLE source of livelihood for the people there, you can't just take it away without offering an alternatives with equal returns. And growing poppy is much more profitable than wheat or anything else : there is a reason why it is called a cash crop. Quote:
The problems faced in Afghanistan are : 1. They have got zero natural resources. 2. Their economy functions by exporting raw material for illegal narcotics. 3. They have got two choices for leadership : the Taliban or Karzai, and neither of them are competent enough to rule the country or engage in PROPER foreign diplomacy. What US is doing is the bare minimal and the toughest : restructuring the economy. A source of income for that arid piece of desert is the main problem, nobody knows what that place can export LEGALLY in the first place to sustain itself. They can't run a service industry because their people aren't educated in the usage of modern technology (other than Warsaw Pact firearms, but that isn't considered high-end is it?), the Talidogs aren't helping by restricting education and bombing schools that teach and use modern tech, and there is insufficient money to put into the budget for education. The place isn't like Vietnam where there is agricultural opportunities to grow something other than opium : making it a potential hotspot for black industries to grow. Quote:
The response wasn't overblown, it is badly planned. The country is like a terrorist factory turning Afghanistan civilians and Muslims from around the world into radicalised killers as the ruling party is already a terrorist organisation in the first place. US went in, and had problems getting out because of bad postwar planning.
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Last edited by SaintessHeart; 2010-06-24 at 19:56. |
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2010-06-25, 03:10 | Link #7953 |
Le fou, c'est moi
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Las Vegas, NV, USA
Age: 34
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I love it how the armchair tough guys are advocating genocide like it's all shits and giggles.
Look, at least be decent and keep your megalomaniac fantasies safely in video games like I do. I'd prefer it if the USA doesn't take your* advice and make me a citizen of a nation directly responsible for mass war crimes, thankyouverymuch. *I'm not going to quote anyone here. Think for yourself about who you are and what you're suggesting. |
2010-06-25, 11:02 | Link #7954 | ||
Love Yourself
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Northeast USA
Age: 38
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No new news has been posted yet, so I'd like to make another response.
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From what I've read, the Taliban are still largely regarded as violent thugs who harm the people. The Americans are still regarded with suspicion (people are afraid that we're there to invade them and rule them). We ultimately need the local people's support to "win." That is more important than simply killing as many Taliban fighters as possible. We're just lucky that the Taliban have not taken the path of Hamas and Hezbollah, which have charitable arms and thus which can convince their respective populations that they're a good and just organization. Yes, it is an option. And as time passes, the public increasingly wants it to happen.
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2010-06-25, 11:04 | Link #7955 |
Takao Tsundere Cruiser
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Classified
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Enough with the politics and lets talk something else instead.
Bionic feet for amputee cat Hooray for the Cat. Swiss graffiti man faces Singapore caning Ahhh, canning. The last time i saw one was for that Malaysian woman who drank alcohol but was later pardoned. Sex tape charges for Indonesian star Nazril Irham What the? The frontman from the band Peterpan did porn? What does this sound familiar? Speaking of sex... Sex domain gets official approval Hello .xxx and goodbye to guys trying to hide evidence watching porn. lol
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2010-06-25, 11:17 | Link #7956 | |
On a sabbatical
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Wellington, NZ
Age: 43
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2010-06-25, 13:43 | Link #7957 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Last time is Michael Fay where US made a fuss. I am glad the Swiss didn't do anything and let us whip the cheese out of him.
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2010-06-25, 16:42 | Link #7959 | ||
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Now this is an interesting article : Salesmanship Lessons From Donald Trump Quote:
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2010-06-25, 19:43 | Link #7960 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal
Age: 44
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All McNuggets not created equal
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current affairs, discussion, international |
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