Mai-Hime or Mai-Otome, Which do you like more?

[Dulcetiar]

Both equally ! >_<
I love all mai-series.

[Terrestrial Dream]

Hime by a mile, I loved Hime with it's plot twist. I also loved when they were taking back the school from Searrs, and I loved so many of it's character. Now Otome was just bad, the plot was really dull and boring (only thing that was somewhat interesting was who as the real heir to the Windbloom). Character were annoying as hell and the ending was just pure crap.

[X10A_Freedom]

Both HiME and Otome suffered from gaping plot holes.

However, I found HiME to have better character development and bonding, music and of course the protagonist!

[Woodchips]

For me there is no contest: Mai-HiME wins hands down.

While Mai-HiME would still probably not rank in my top 10 list, Otome would unfortunately be sitting somewhere around that other abomination of a 'sequel' Kyoshiro to towa no sora (the Kannazuki no Miko and Steel angel Kurumi alternate-universe spinoff).

Why, you may ask, does Otome rank so abysmally?

1. The new generation characters are one-dimensional, stereotypical and lack the sort of charisma needed to carry the story. Arika fails miserably as a lead, which makes it very difficult to care about her issues which makes trudging through the series very difficult indeed. Add to that her character is the most annoying lead I have come across since Kuu (again see Kyoshiro). Her only redeeming feature: her head turning into an ant's when called Arinko-chan.

2. Fanservice, fanservice, fanservice. Now I'm not one of those people who thinks that any flash of flesh is gratuitous, but there is a limit to my tolerance, particularly when there is absolutely no reason for it. If you have a good scene where it makes sense to have a character in a compromising position, and it helps move along the story or develop characters then I'm all for it. But the majority of fanservice found in Otome seems purely designed to cater to the tastes of pre-pubescent boys. We will not even speak about the farce that was the first 10minutes of the 3rd OVA.

3. Plot holes galore. I concede that Mai-HiME had it's fair share of plot holes, but there were far less, and were of far less significance compared to the ones found in Mai-Otome. At least I understood what was going on in HiME, were Otome frequently left things unexplained or just stopped a thread in the middle of it's telling.

4. Mangling previously established characters from HiME. They turned Tate into a paedophile for crying out loud. I am pretty open minded, and I can assure you now that the 10 year age difference doesn't bother me, it's more the fact that he is a 30ish year old man, and both Nina and Arika are (at the most 15). Add to that fact he is the foster father of one and a sponsor to the other, which puts him in a huge position of trust for both girls. You can spout 'they are in love' and 'it's an anime so the same rules don't apply' all you want at me but it will not change the fact that it makes me cringe. And what the hell happened to Natsuki? The bad-arse is no more. The only redeeming character to be upgraded in Otome was Nao - at least she was interesting.

I really cannot emphasise how disappointed I was with Otome, and I'm sure that I'll get more than a few people who disagree, probably vocally, about what I've said - although considering the results I may be pleasantly surprised.

[mdauben]

Originally Posted by Woodchips

Arika fails miserably as a lead, which makes it very difficult to care about her issues which makes trudging through the series very difficult indeed.

I guess this must be a matter of personal opinion. I found Arika's quest for her Mother much more emotional and complelling (and less sterotypcial) than Mai's quest for... a boy friend?

2. Fanservice, fanservice, fanservice.

Now, this one is definely a mater of personal taste. While I would not argue that there was a fair amount of fan service in the anime, I didn't find it excessive, or to the point of detracting from the plot. (Of course, that was not the case in the OVA, where I agree it did detract from the story)

3. Plot holes galore. I concede that Mai-HiME had it's fair share of plot holes, but there were far less, and were of far less significance compared to the ones found in Mai-Otome.

Care to expand on this? I admit I did not notice any major plot holes in Otome, myself, so I am not quite sure what you mean.

4. Mangling previously established characters from HiME.

I guess I can kind of understand how this would bother some fans, but it just seems such a non-issue to me. It's a totally differnt series, and the characters (despite any similarity in names or appearance) are not the same characters. There is a lot of discussion in the Zero no Tsukaima forum about how some of the characters are portrayed in a radically different way in season two than they were in season one. That I think it a valid complain becuase they are supposed to be the same characters. In the case of HiME/Otome, not so much since they are different characters.

I actually thought it was kind of clever twist, that the "rebel" from HiME was now part of the "establishment" in Otome.

They turned Tate into a paedophile for crying out loud.

Well, technically he would not be a pedophile, since (in Japan) both Arika and Nina would have been over the age of consent. Even ignoring that technicality, I think its not fair to label him as pedo. The attraction with Nina was entirely one-sided. She was intersted in him as more than a father figure, while he repeatedly rejected that sort of relationship. I admit there is no arguing that he was attracted to Arika, but I thought much of that was carry over from his adolescent crush on Arika's Mother. Plus, in the end he did not follow through with anything, even when Arika was ready and willing.

In the end, I actually found that whole Nina/Sergey/Arika "triangle" from Otome much more intersting that the corespoding Mia/Tate/Shiho one in HiME.

I really cannot emphasise how disappointed I was with Otome

In the end, its up to you if you enjoy the series or not. I can disagree with some of your statemetns, but if you didn't like it then I can't really argue with that.

[solarknight123]

Originally Posted by mdauben

I guess this must be a matter of personal opinion. I found Arika's quest for her Mother much more emotional and complelling (and less sterotypcial) than Mai's quest for... a boy friend?

Well I disagree with this. Mai's quest was dealing with her (already difficult) normal life while dealing with all the "hime" buisness and her powers. Personally I saw it as much more intresting than when arika was trying to find out who her momther was. Plus I find it weird that she didn't seem the least bit curious who her father might be.

[Woodchips]

Originally Posted by mdauben

I guess this must be a matter of personal opinion.

Firstly, thank you for responding to my post in a mature fashion, it is a breath of fresh air.

Originally Posted by mdauben

Care to expand on this? I admit I did not notice any major plot holes in Otome, myself, so I am not quite sure what you mean.

- The initial big kerfuffle about the identity of the princess quickly became a non-entity.
- What is the Harmonium and why does it bring about the end of the world?
- Why is only Midori able to summon her Child?
- Why does a giant Fumi start going crazy and blowing crap up?
- Why does the star randomly change from red to blue with no explanation?

As you can see my questions are more to do with the motives and reasons behind some oddities I found with the series. I don't know whether I was just half-asleep at the time, but it seemed that they didn't explain things particularly well in the anime. And I'm a big stickler for wanting to know 'why' characters are doing something, I'm not happy just to blindly accept without having an adequate motive to support it.

Originally Posted by mdauben

I guess I can kind of understand how this would bother some fans, but it just seems such a non-issue to me. It's a totally differnt series, and the characters (despite any similarity in names or appearance) are not the same characters.

But that's just the thing - it's not a 'completely different' series. If it was, we wouldn't have the old cast included in it. By including the old cast, there is an expectation that we are getting much the same characters as we had in the original, I don't mind tweaks, but they've made a few very drastic changes in pre-established characters.

Originally Posted by mdauben

Well, technically he would not be a pedophile, since (in Japan) both Arika and Nina would have been over the age of consent. Even ignoring that technicality, I think its not fair to label him as pedo. The attraction with Nina was entirely one-sided. She was intersted in him as more than a father figure, while he repeatedly rejected that sort of relationship. I admit there is no arguing that he was attracted to Arika, but I thought much of that was carry over from his adolescent crush on Arika's Mother. Plus, in the end he did not follow through with anything, even when Arika was ready and willing.

Age of consent does not always equal judicial indemnity, but I am not well versed enough in Japanese law to tell you verbatim any additional restrictions on sexual activity for minors (Under 18 or 20 in Japan). I am aware that their age of consent is 13, but there are usually special restrictions placed on older partners who are bound by 'duty of care' (Teacher/guardian). In Australia we are informed that the age of consent is 16, but if you look closely you will see that you are able to engage in sexual activities with a 10 year old if you are within 2 years of the younger partner's age. If you look even more closely you will see that the age of consent is raised to 18 if one of the partners has a duty of care to the younger partner.
That was off-topic, but needed a bit of clarification. Legalities aside, 30 year old + 15 year old = unsavoury in my book.

And I beg to differ, as Sergey himself admits that he is attracted to Arika regardless of who her mother is. From the horses mouth, or so to speak.

Originally Posted by mdauben

In the end, its up to you if you enjoy the series or not. I can disagree with some of your statemetns, but if you didn't like it then I can't really argue with that.

I think we may just have to agree to disagree, but it was nice to have a bit of a friendly debate about it eh?

[mdauben]

Originally Posted by Woodchips

- The initial big kerfuffle about the identity of the princess quickly became a non-entity.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this?

Spoiler for Princess:

There is doubt that Mashiro is the real princess at the beginning of the series. For a while it seems that Arika might be the missing princess, but in the end it turns out it was Nina. None of that ever becomes common knowledge, though (I'm not even sure if Arika realized it?), so when she returns and (with Arika's help) overthrows Nagi she is accepted back as the Queen of Windbloom.

I admit it's kind of convoluted and improbable, but it does not appear to be a "hole" to me in that it all makes sence in the context of the story.

- What is the Harmonium and why does it bring about the end of the world?

It's an old "doomsday" weapon from the Dragon War (or was it the War of the Twelve Kings?), that was burried under the castle years and years ago when the war ended and forgotten.

- Why is only Midori able to summon her Child?

Actually, didn't we see another one of the Aswad (Lumen?) summon his "child" to kill Arika and Sergey (a big fish looking thing that smashed the boat)? We also see several other Aswad riding their "childs" along with Midori when they fly off to attack Cardair.

EDIT: Yes, in fact here is a picure of Lumen's "child"

- Why does a giant Fumi start going crazy and blowing crap up?
- Why does the star randomly change from red to blue with no explanation?

Those are definely holes, but they are all in Zwei (which I will freely admit is riddled with plot holes), and I was referring to the original Mai Otome story, however.

But that's just the thing - it's not a 'completely different' series. If it was, we wouldn't have the old cast included in it. By including the old cast, there is an expectation that we are getting much the same characters as we had in the original, I don't mind tweaks, but they've made a few very drastic changes in pre-established characters.

Even if we assume that HiME and Otome actually take place in the same "universe" (which I don't think is at all certain), Otome has to take place hundreds of years later, so they are different characters. I enjoyed how they played some of the Otome characters against type from the HiME characters (like Natsuke), while others were quite similar (like Shizuru). If you wanted them to be the same characters in a different setting, then you will obviously be disappointed.

That was off-topic, but needed a bit of clarification. Legalities aside, 30 year old + 15 year old = unsavoury in my book.

I was just pointing out that, in the context of Japanese culture, the situation was not automatically wrong or illegal. Certaily, if he accepted Nina's advances, as her foster father that would have been "wrong" no matter what the relative ages, but he did reject her (and indeed, never even seemed tempted by her). Arika was a slightly different case, in that although he was secretly helping to fund her schooling, he was not really her guardian or parent figure in any way.

And I beg to differ, as Sergey himself admits that he is attracted to Arika regardless of who her mother is. From the horses mouth, or so to speak.

Maybe, or maybe he just said that? He definetly first noticed her becuase he recognized the GEM that used to belong to Rena, and there were a lot of flashbacks to establish that he did have some kind of crush on Arika's mother.

In any case the fact remains that even when Arika came on to him (after he rescued her from that gang), he walked away. That I think is the key point. He was certainly attracted to her, wheter it was from his feelings for her mother, for Arika herself, or something of both, but in the end he did not follow through. I believe being attracted to a young girl is not pedophilia unless you follow through, especially a phycially mature girl (really young girls may be a different matter). I'm sure most adult men with normal sex drives would find a teen age girl like Arika physically attractive but that does not mean they are going to try and hook up with her.

I think we may just have to agree to disagree, but it was nice to have a bit of a friendly debate about it eh?

True! It's always nice to actually talk about differing opinions, rather than just dismissing the other person as "wrong".

[Fear-less+heart]

I would say that I like both equally, because both had elments that one another did not have. In Mai-Hime is was heavy on the drama, but I will have to say that in Mai-Otome I like the characters more. And for some reason the drama had more of a impact on me then Mai-Hime. Probaly because I like the characters more in Mai-Otome, also I like Arika more than Mai, because Mai was just normal to me, but Arika was more outspoken and hyper than Mai, which give her more character then Mai. But Mai-Hime drama was better in terms of, things will happean that will suprise and shock you, so it is the best of two worlds I guess.

[Fweakin]

Originally Posted by Fear-less+heart

I would say that I like both equally, because both had elments that one another did not have. In Mai-Hime is was heavy on the drama, but I will have to say that in Mai-Otome I like the characters more. And for some reason the drama had more of a impact on me then Mai-Hime. Probaly because I like the characters more in Mai-Otome, also I like Arika more than Mai, because Mai was just normal to me, but Arika was more outspoken and hyper than Mai, which give her more character then Mai. But Mai-Hime drama was better in terms of, things will happean that will suprise and shock you, so it is the best of two worlds I guess.

I'm batting for Mai-Hime, which to me wins by leaps and bounds. I, like others, was frustrated by the lead characters in Otome, as I found them to be dull and their stories weren't interesting to me at all. I especially HATED the Otome OVA's due to their gaping plot holes and ridiculous amounts of gratuitous fanservice.

The main gripe I had with the characters is that Arika was an excessively genki, naive do-gooder, which to me has been done to death. Plus every time her seiyuu uttered a line I wanted to scratch my ears off. Every line ended with an extended whine. I much preferred Mai, because to me she was more real - none of this "I will save the world" nonsense.

I also disliked how they made Natsuki so.....redundant. I didn't mind that they made her part of the establishment, but she seemed to have quite a bit of screen time but get absolutely nothing achieved. She was best in Otome when partnered with Nao.

Mai-Hime FTW.

[solarknight123]

Originally Posted by Fweakin

I'm batting for Mai-Hime, which to me wins by leaps and bounds. I, like others, was frustrated by the lead characters in Otome, as I found them to be dull and their stories weren't interesting to me at all. I especially HATED the Otome OVA's due to their gaping plot holes and ridiculous amounts of gratuitous fanservice.

The main gripe I had with the characters is that Arika was an excessively genki, naive do-gooder, which to me has been done to death. Plus every time her seiyuu uttered a line I wanted to scratch my ears off. Every line ended with an extended whine. I much preferred Mai, because to me she was more real - none of this "I will save the world" nonsense.

I also disliked how they made Natsuki so.....redundant. I didn't mind that they made her part of the establishment, but she seemed to have quite a bit of screen time but get absolutely nothing achieved. She was best in Otome when partnered with Nao.

Mai-Hime FTW.

Yeah, I agree with you there, btw i've been meaning to know what does FTW mean? sorry just curious. lol

[Woodchips]

Originally Posted by solarknight123

Yeah, I agree with you there, btw i've been meaning to know what does FTW mean? sorry just curious. lol

::Puts on her smartarse hat:: FTW = For the win. Just another pointless abbreviation for you to have in your arsenal.

[Westlo]

Apart from the animation/music (Hime had the best song but overall I prefered Otomes score) and a few characters Mai-Hime was superior in every aspect.

[solarknight123]

Originally Posted by Woodchips

::Puts on her smartarse hat:: FTW = For the win. Just another pointless abbreviation for you to have in your arsenal.

Thanks alot for that

[Fear-less+heart]

That is the reason why I said that Mai-Hime drama was better, because it was better in terms of, things will happean that will suprise and shock you in the stories. And I have to say that I like Mai-Hime music better than Mai-Otome, because the only music I like from Mai-Otome was, when Aoi fell off that cliff and they was playing some background music that fit very well with the part.

[Laura25]

I liked Hime but I wished that the ending was better...and Tate was not as centric.... but maybe that last part was just something I imagined. I liked Otome better because the reincarnation of Tate was so much more hate able.. >.> Seriously... Okay...so, not... Ah, because I liked Arika and Mashiro and of course the distinguished coupley feeling Nat/Shiz gave, I voted Otome. Plus, Haruka was great! I loved how she was portrayed in Otome =]

[Alyssa Searrs]

I viewed the trailer for my-otome, a decided to watch it. But instead of picking up otome, i picked up Hime, and ever since then otome had no chance. Hime has just a great source of struggle, character development and it was the first thing i have watched that had made me cry. (And that’s rear for me to cry).

After watching Hime i tried to watch otome, and even though i enjoyed seeing all my favourite characters appear again, it just didn’t feel right.

[Guernsey]

Forgive me if I interrupted anything but I really enjoy the Mai series and I just want to post something here. I first watched Mai Hime last year (the dub version), Mai Otome (a few months ago) and Mai Otome Zwei (a few days ago) but among all of these I seem to like Mai Hime in terms of story, drama and characters but for some reason or another I cannot seem to forget Mai Otome since it has been more prominent in my mind. I like Mai Hime because the unpredictability of the story, how it leaves on the edge of your seat wanting more and how it always seems to leave you in suspense but Mai Otome is something I would have most likely enjoyed even more if the story wasn't so convolouted. There were just so many things that Mai Otome could have done even better for example the anime and manga could do without all the fanservice and they could have at least made some newer characters rather than just rehash the old ones at reasonable numbers so that they don't jam pack a ton of characters in the story. Also, Mai Otome could have been a little longer (I would say about 51 episodes) in terms of show length and it could've used more main characters besides Arika herself. I enjoy both series but ultimately if I were to make a choice, I would choose Mai Hime because there are so many things that it did right that Mai Otome could have done better or without (like Sergay Wong to be honest whose voice seiyuu was little annoying at times yet his english seems a little tolerable). The same could be said about the Mai Hime and Mai Otome manga that stories are often rushed in the latter and that to be honest there was way too much fanservice that this fan can handle!

OOT: You may or may not flame me for saying this but Shizuru voice sound great in both the dub and the Japanese version of both animes.

[solarknight123]

Originally Posted by Guernsey

Forgive me if I interrupted anything but I really enjoy the Mai series and I just want to post something here. I first watched Mai Hime last year (the dub version), Mai Otome (a few months ago) and Mai Otome Zwei (a few days ago) but among all of these I seem to like Mai Hime in terms of story, drama and characters but for some reason or another I cannot seem to forget Mai Otome since it has been more prominent in my mind. I like Mai Hime because the unpredictability of the story, how it leaves on the edge of your seat wanting more and how it always seems to leave you in suspense but Mai Otome is something I would have most likely enjoyed even more if the story wasn't so convolouted. There were just so many things that Mai Otome could have done even better for example the anime and manga could do without all the fanservice and they could have at least made some newer characters rather than just rehash the old ones at reasonable numbers so that they don't jam pack a ton of characters in the story. Also, Mai Otome could have been a little longer (I would say about 51 episodes) in terms of show length and it could've used more main characters besides Arika herself. I enjoy both series but ultimately if I were to make a choice, I would choose Mai Hime because there are so many things that it did right that Mai Otome could have done better or without (like Sergay Wong to be honest whose voice seiyuu was little annoying at times yet his english seems a little tolerable). The same could be said about the Mai Hime and Mai Otome manga that stories are often rushed in the latter and that to be honest there was way too much fanservice that this fan can handle!

OOT: You may or may not flame me for saying this but Shizuru voice sound great in both the dub and the Japanese version of both animes.

Few people like you and I both agree on shizuru's dubbed voice. I actually liked this whole "souther bell" thing she had going on in the dubbed

[KitsuneNineTails]

Originally Posted by Alyssa Searrs

I viewed the trailer for my-otome, a decided to watch it. But instead of picking up otome, i picked up Hime, and ever since then otome had no chance. Hime has just a great source of struggle, character development and it was the first thing i have watched that had made me cry. (And that’s rear for me to cry).

Ep 25 (next to last) of Mai-HiME has to be one of the most powerful episodes of any anime I've watched. You have Natsuki telling Mai goodbye ("I'm glad I met you") and then dying with Shizuru after accepting her feelings, then you have Mikoto bawling into her ramen when she thinks of how much she misses Mai (hard to keep a dry eye here, imho). Then Mai's farewell to Chie and Aoi, then finally Mai's resolve to finish it all ("Of all the HiME I've seen, Mai, you were the best...."). Good stuff.

I haven't seen Otome yet. I want to, but I'm armed with quite a few grains of salt based on the feedback from here and other places, so I'm not expecting it to be nearly as moving as HiME. Of course, when I read the title as "My Princess", I REALLY didn't expect Mai-HiME to be much of anything either, and it sure as hell surprised me, so ya never know...

Oh, and after Generator Gawl, I can't stand to listen to English dubs anymore, so I can't say much about Shizuru's Southern Belle accent...

Ciao!