Hanasaku Iroha - Episode 25 Discussion / Poll

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by hoarfrost

The relationship of a service provider to a customer is not one way and that is another one of my problems with Sui's dogmatic idea that it is. For all her pontificating about how you must address every flight and fancy of the regulars regardless of cost, it certainly doesn't seem to be helping the inn maintain itself financially.

I don't know about that.

In real life, there's a restaurant I go to fairly regularly, maybe once every month or two. I've been going there regularly for years now, and all the workers there know who I am the moment I walk into the restaurant.

Once I go into this restaurant, my "every flight and fancy" is almost immediately catered to. If I say "I'll have the usual", they know exactly what I mean (and my usual will come with extra sour cream and salsa because they know I splurge on that ). If I'm there with a crowd, the waiter or waitress will bring out a large pitcher of Diet Pepsi even if I don't ask for one, because they know that's what everybody in my family and immediate circle of friends likes to drink during mealtimes.

I've at times considered stop going to this restaurant because it can be a bit pricey. But the level of service (and quality of food of course) keeps me coming back.

I really don't think that Sui is wrong for keeping a record of all of her regular customers, and tailoring everything to suit their distinct personalities. That sort of service is attractive to a lot of people, including myself, and it can offer a real competitive advantage. "Dogmatic idea" or not, maybe its the right idea.


Also, we don't know why, exactly, the Inn has been struggling financially. It may simply be a lot of newer, larger competitors recently opening up drawing customers away from them. If so, Sui's "special touch" might be the only thing keeping the place going at all, as in many areas, it just can't compete with the larger Inns and Hotels.


So I frankly think, based partly on real life personal experience, that you're selling some of Sui's ideas short, and possibly jumping a bit to conclusions. There's nothing necessarily wrong with sentimentality. Many people have sentimental feelings for certain things, and a wise commercial enterprise can take advantage of that.


By the way, the restaurant I somewhat regularly go to has been going strong for years, and in an area where two major restaurants recently closed due to lack of business. Again, there's something to be said for holding to an ideal approach to customer satisfaction.

[serenade_beta]

That BGM... at the end...

Anyways, it finally ends next week. I wonder if it will be good enough to make up for everything else.
ﾑﾘﾀﾞﾅ(・×・)

[Utsuro no Hako]

Originally Posted by hoarfrost

Customer satisfaction seemed pretty fine from where I was watching. We don't see anyone get particularly upset at a buffet breakfast and it solves a one time problem so the idea that it would leave regulars with a lingering negative opinion of the inn is unfounded. The relationship of a service provider to a customer is not one way and that is another one of my problems with Sui's dogmatic idea that it is. For all her pontificating about how you must address every flight and fancy of the regulars regardless of cost, it certainly doesn't seem to be helping the inn maintain itself financially. To that end it is an ideal that is not sustainable. If you look at it from that direction, Sui is as also not suited to running the inn, just that she'd last quite a bit longer than Enishi.

Clearly Sui's way of dong things is old fashioned and out of place in the modern world. But unfortunately Enishi's solution would turn the place into a Howard Johnson's -- and a badly run one at that, since, as we saw in this episode, his management creates problems that he needs someone else to solve.

The reason so many people think Satsuki should take over is that when she visited last time, she gave Sui several concrete suggestions of how to improve the inn without abandoning the things that everyone loves about it. She has the forward-thinking outlook that Sui lacks and the sensibility that Enishi doesn't have.

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Eh. Morale was still high. Everyone was motivated to "save the inn". Even if that motivation took them to strange places.

When you have fights breaking out amongst the staff, morale is in trouble. Just compare the way everyone was acting in this episode to the well-oiled machine we saw in both the OPs.

[vansonbee]

^ Not only that, but there just not another alternative choice for heir, other than Satsuki.

[Master Chibi]

I guess I'm alone in loving the obvious change in music in this episode.

It was oddly fitting.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by hoarfrost

I group these together because these are the only true faults of Enishi in this situation. He wasn't in a position to refuse help, but that could have happened differently than than it did. But that's more of a problem with Okada and her view of the opposite gender. He overbooked, but the other workers share responsibility for reasons I will elucidate on below.

The workers may have egged him on, but his job as manager was still to not let that happen.

That's pretty much how I interpret "stop fighting and get back to work".

The problem isn't him asking them to stop fighting. The problem is him crying like a six years old walking into his parents arguing. The problem is that he didn't provide concrete directives to focus on beyond "stop fighting".

Customer satisfaction seemed pretty fine from where I was watching.

That's because you didn't think through the implications of Ren and Tomoe's argument.

We don't see anyone get particularly upset at a buffet breakfast and it solves a one time problem so the idea that it would leave regulars with a lingering negative opinion of the inn is unfounded.

Remember that old couple? The old man is too polite to come right out and say it, but it's obvious he preferred having meals brought to his room. And it was not long after we got a reminder that Kisuiso's strength was its relaxing atmosphere. If you take that away, what's left?

Right, spite is a poor motivation. However I take issue with the implication that one cannot be competent for less than ideal reasons, and ideal reasons will strengthen ones competance. It isn't necessarily true and I suspect that it is only employed to make Sui/Ohana/Nako look good at Enishi's expense.

Satsuki's competent while being a complete pragmatist.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Remember that old couple? The old man is too polite to come right out and say it, but it's obvious he preferred having meals brought to his room. And it was not long after we got a reminder that Kisuiso's strength was its relaxing atmosphere. If you take that away, what's left?

Exactly. Kissuiso's strength comes its relaxing atmosphere and the special attention the staff gives to the customers. They make it a priority to get to know them and their tastes, as well as to complete any requests they may have. As Triple_R already demonstrated, this does make a difference. It feels very pleasant not to be treated like a faceless customer, and it can be a strong incentive to come back. This is precisely what Satsuki's latest review highlighted IIRC.

Enishi's methods are removing the extra quality of the service and are essentially turning Kissuiso into a normal inn. This is not what these people came here for, and I seriously doubt any of them are going to come back. Why go to Kissuiso instead of a bigger, more modern and possibly cheaper inn like Yunosagi if the service is the same?

[Tempester]

Originally Posted by Master Chibi

I guess I'm alone in loving the obvious change in music in this episode.

It was oddly fitting.

Don't worry; you're not. I loved that choral music at the end coupled with a lingering shot of gorgeous scenery. It really gave the impression of relief after hard, intense work that I'm sure the characters felt.

[Guardian Enzo]

Every time that old couple has come to the inn before, the rooms were probably between 60-90% empty (in fact, there have been several "So and so is the only guest registered" moments during the course of the series). That might be nice for them to have a large ryokan all to themselves, but it's not good for business. If you have the biggest local festival of the year and the biggest review in the inn's history at the same time, isn't it natural that a few temporary concessions would have to be made during the few days the place was 100% booked? If that old couple can't accept that, they're the ones with a problem.

There's a definite sort of fantasy world that characters in HanaIro live in, but I'm never sure whether the POV of the show itself shares it and I'm not sure it is, either. Life isn't a perfect black and white experience, and you can't run an inn exactly the same way you do when it's 10% full when it's 100% full. If you continue to draw a huge increase in guests, you hire more staff and try and get as close as possible to the old way. What's happening at the moment is a sort of perfect storm and it's silly to expect everything to operate exactly as normal.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

Every time that old couple has come to the inn before, the rooms were probably between 60-90% empty (in fact, there have been several "So and so is the only guest registered" moments during the course of the series). That might be nice for them to have a large ryokan all to themselves, but it's not good for business. If you have the biggest local festival of the year and the biggest review in the inn's history at the same time, isn't it natural that a few temporary concessions would have to be made during the few days the place was 100% booked? If that old couple can't accept that, they're the ones with a problem.

There's a definite sort of fantasy world that characters in HanaIro live in, but I'm never sure whether the POV of the show itself shares it and I'm not sure it is, either. Life isn't a perfect black and white experience, and you can't run an inn exactly the same way you do when it's 10% full when it's 100% full. If you continue to draw a huge increase in guests, you hire more staff and try and get as close as possible to the old way. What's happening at the moment is a sort of perfect storm and it's silly to expect everything to operate exactly as normal.

Well, I'm not saying the buffet was a bad idea. I'm saying it's not an unmitigatedly good one. It comes with a cost, that has to be acknowledged.

Ideally, they should probably have hired temps for the rush season.

[Tempester]

Humor highlight of the episode: Minko shouting 'balut' and the subsequent reply from Tooru and Ren-san. I burst out giggling when that happened.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Tempester

Humor highlight of the episode: Minko shouting 'balut' and the subsequent reply from Tooru and Ren-san. I burst out giggling when that happened.

I found that funny myself, lol.

Anh_Minh is right about how the ideal solution would have been hiring temp workers, but that would have resolved the conflict a bit too easily, so I can see why the anime narrative didn't go that route.


The buffet idea I thought was, on the whole, a decent idea given the circumstances. There was a bit of a trade-off there: One elderly couple didn't like it, but another customer was wowed by the quality of the buffet food (because the cooks were taking a first-class approach to it, which isn't always the case with buffet food). Here again, though, temp workers could have solved the bad side of the trade-off (i.e. a "If you'd prefer to not eat at the buffet and rather be served in your room, just make that request to the front desk" sort of deal, and the temp workers could handle this).

I have to admit that I would have been darkly amused if a big sumo wrestler had been using the Inn at the time, saw the buffet, and said "Time to chow down!"

[Utsuro no Hako]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

The buffet idea I thought was, on the whole, a decent idea given the circumstances. There was a bit of a trade-off there: One elderly couple didn't like it, but another customer was wowed by the quality of the buffet food (because the cooks were taking a first-class approach to it, which isn't always the case with buffet food).

But wasn't that high quality what caused the fight between Ren and Tomoe? The kitchen couldn't keep up while maintaining their normal standards. (Let's face it, buffets get by by sacrificing quality.)

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Utsuro no Hako

But wasn't that high quality what caused the fight between Ren and Tomoe? The kitchen couldn't keep up while maintaining their normal standards. (Let's face it, buffets get by by sacrificing quality.)

We don't know if it was the quality per se. It could have been the quantity, and it could have been Ren underperforming because of the pressure getting to him - he has a history of that.

[frubam]

I probably was the only one who thought Ko would show up and decide to help out at the inn, esp since when they were showing Satsuki going to/arriving, it seemed like they were intentionally showing her talking/arriving in such a way as if it was to hide someone behind/next to her.

I take this to mean that, in the end, Ko is a more important aspect to Ohana than Kissuiso is. The fact that they saved it for last means it's the big finale; the defining point for Ohana's future. I mean, even though she pointed out that how everyone was thinking in terms of "beating Okami" was wrong, she wasn't really a critical factor in all of this compared to other drama-filled arcs. She didn't feel like the same girl who took a train all the way to Tokyo to hunt down a cook to come back and save Kissuiso.

[TheGeekHuntress]

Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo

Unfortunately a fairly second-rate episode. But one scene made up for everything: Okami-san with her daughter and granddaughter walking down the hall as waitresses together. Almost got tears in my eyes.

This. Saved the episode for me.

[HandofFate]

Decent episode, but annoyed at how everyone was acting, especially giving Ohana the cold shoulder for helping the bonburi festival like they're suppose to.

It definitely showed a decrease in service overall. No idea why Enishi overbooked the place like that when he knows the inn can't handle that many customers normally.

Was also annoyed in the one scene when Tomoe sprains her ankle, and Enishi immediately thinks to ask the union for help.

So he attempts to screws the union over during the movie deal (even though it turned out to be a scam), and refuses to help the union set up the town festival (that the inn is also a big part of, all of their customers are thanks to the local festival there),

then when they have a small problem, its the first thing he looks to, to want help. If I was the union, I would have told him "too bad"

It was all worth it to see Satsuki in service uniform. :3

[DragoZERO]

It was an enjoyable episode. Enishi really is pathetic though... poor guy.

Now then... let's resolve things with Kou and say farewell to this lovely series that, even though was not what we expected, was still enjoyable.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by HandofFate

Decent episode, but annoyed at how everyone was acting, especially giving Ohana the cold shoulder for helping the bonburi festival like they're suppose to.

It definitely showed a decrease in service overall. No idea why Enishi overbooked the place like that when he knows the inn can't handle that many customers normally.

Because he doesn't know? It's never happened in his lifetime?

He worked on the principle of "if we have the room, we accept them". He didn't figure out until too late that his staffing isn't made for something like that.

Was also annoyed in the one scene when Tomoe sprains her ankle, and Enishi immediately thinks to ask the union for help.

That's technically what they're here for.

So he attempts to screws the union over during the movie deal (even though it turned out to be a scam),

He didn't attempt to screw them over. He just refused to share what was supposed to be his baby. Heck, IIRC, they attempted to share in the benefits without taking on the risks.

and refuses to help the union set up the town festival (that the inn is also a big part of, all of their customers are thanks to the local festival there),

Yeah, as I've been saying since ep24, it wasn't smart. But understandable, considering how stretched they are.

[HandofFate]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Because he doesn't know? It's never happened in his lifetime?

He worked on the principle of "if we have the room, we accept them". He didn't figure out until too late that his staffing isn't made for something like that.

His fault. He's been the "Young Master" for 10+ years, and he didn't figure out his staff of 8 people couldn't handle that many?

This isn't the town's first bonburi festival, and not the first time they had more than 2 customers. We seen them stressed with like only 4-5 rooms of customers.

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

That's technically what they're here for

He didn't attempt to screw them over. He just refused to share what was supposed to be his baby. Heck, IIRC, they attempted to share in the benefits without taking on the risks.


Yeah, as I've been saying since ep24, it wasn't smart. But understandable, considering how stretched they are.

Yea, the Union is there to help, but he's treating it as a Take All, Give None attitude with the union.

All we seen is Enishi giving the finger to the union. Just saying I wouldn't be surprised if the union gave him the finger back next time he asks for help.

The only reason they're still included is because Sui keeps going and apologizing for him.

And the Union were willing to take on risk in the movie deal, they were all gonna pitch in for the production budget, but Enishi said "yea, we're actually going to take on the entire budget, so we don't need you" and tried to hog all the benefits for himself. And in the end, it almost straight out bankrupted the place.

All the other hotels are also busy with above-average customers, and they were all able to send someone to help preparations.