2009-04-30, 00:18 | Link #1241 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Quote:
Hell, Kiritsugu did baaaaad things too, and Shirou worshipped the man. |
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2009-04-30, 00:24 | Link #1242 | |
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Quote:
I know there are many who like these kinds of stories, but for me it was a letdown. After revealing Sakura to be Rider's true master, I was cheering and expecting to be fighting alongside Rider and Sakura. The disappointment that came when I realized this was not the case was rather large. |
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2009-04-30, 00:56 | Link #1243 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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2009-04-30, 01:12 | Link #1244 |
Onee!
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Auckland, NZ
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you could just argue that not every route plot point works. or more precisely works well.
sakura's character design is good and different from the others: twisted childhood, abusive family, dark secrets but the way events played themselves out it's very hard to cheer for her. instead of an uplifting redemption story we're treated to the slippery slide into ultimate darkness where so many people get hurt because of one person's selfishness (i personally was outraged at Sakura's corruption of Saber after still feeling the fuzziness from Fate). personally the fact that the only way to resolve the situation required the sacrifice of Iriya (my favourite chara <3) or Shirou (me) really didn't help. and Kiritsugu wasn't a *bad* guy as such, he still had the best intentions with the safety of the ones he loved as his motivation. not sakura; her actions were for herself.
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2009-04-30, 01:33 | Link #1245 |
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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I'm not saying they should, however the option they chose for this route is one I did not like, hence why I found the Heavens Feel route to be boring and Sakura an uninteresting heroine.
Like I said, I like my heroines to be heroines. Not damsels. I've seen enough damsels in TV, anime and manga to last me quite a while. |
2009-04-30, 01:34 | Link #1246 |
Heaven's Nightmare
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Why should you care?
Age: 35
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Ultimate darkness FTW! no seriuosly, I'm all for it I admit I missed the epic fights, that's why I prefer UBW probably. However I must say I was recomforted to read a sad story for a change, lately most mangas/animes I see lack that bit of darkness HF offered me. Personally, I love twisted characters with even more twisted stories and really f***ing twisted developments, it makes everything very interesting. I'm won't try to justify Sakura, HF reminds me of Elfen Lied, anime that still keeps the number one of my favourites. That said, I think I don't need to explain why I like HF
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2009-04-30, 02:34 | Link #1247 |
Onee!
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Auckland, NZ
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i get it. you're just eeevil -_-
Well i get what you're saying, that a straight "guy-meets-girl-cue-kickass" story isn't as appealing as a story which contorts more than an asian gymnast but still i find the actions taken in HF to be inexcusable. sakura is not a damsel, those girls are nice enough to sit tight for a hero to come rescue them. sakura instead gets up and rushes headlong into damnation with her increasingly erratic acts, all the while still expecting someone to come "save" her. the story of HF is fine, i didn't like most of the developements but no one is dissing HF. just.. sakura. oh wait keroko is dissing HF :P nvm.
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2009-04-30, 09:08 | Link #1250 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Quote:
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2009-04-30, 10:51 | Link #1253 |
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Is she? "I don't care how many people die, as long as I get senpai" puts her on the same level as Gilgamesh, Caster and Zouken, not lower. However, her willingness to inflict near fatal wounds on the person she loves in order to keep him with her puts her a step above. Not even Caster would willingly inflict wounds on her love.
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2009-04-30, 11:52 | Link #1254 |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Good point. However, she still isn't as bad as Zoken.
She never let her grandson rape her adopted granddaughter. Repeatedly. Non-stop. (Despite this, I still think that's better than imposing your definition of justice on the world by killing a fuckton of people using asshole tactics, then calling yourself a superhero.) Fact is, there's a lot of moral ambiguity in the Nasuverse, and there are very few characters that are truly good and pure and just. Saber is one of them. |
2009-04-30, 14:22 | Link #1255 |
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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No, she raped her own sister. Non-stop. And unlike Zoken, Sakura was not going to give Rin any respite. Sakura got breaks, Rin did not. She's not as bad as Zouken, she's worse. Zouken at least tortured Sakura for a purpose, Sakura torturing Rin was just revenge and spite.
(yes, I'm being rather defensive on this, because Sakura turning evil was one of the few things I liked about Heavens Feel. ) And I didn't think Kiritsugu called himself a superhero... didn't he always become sad when Shirou called him that? Agreed on the third bit though. |
2009-04-30, 17:53 | Link #1256 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Quote:
Also, to further your point, "revenge" would imply that Rin had done something to Sakura necessitating revenge. She really didn't. Sakura was mostly being jealous. (Also, doesn't she only rape Rin in a bad end?) |
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2009-04-30, 19:56 | Link #1257 | |
Heaven's Nightmare
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Why should you care?
Age: 35
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Quote:
In the end Sakura is responsible for her actions, yes, but her circumstances are being ignored I think. Please, she's been raped and tortured ever since she was a little child (probably seven or eight) with or without breaks, and she was literally abondened by her real family, probably knowing that the "transforming" methods were going to be harsh. I think she had plenty of reasons to be angry. Ok, she ended killing hundreds of people who had nothing to do with her and my argument falls there. But still, it's not like she just became a killing machine with no reason. |
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2009-04-30, 21:34 | Link #1258 | |
Melancholic Swim Captain
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pennyslvania
Age: 33
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Quote:
Anybody want to explain this? My guess was on Caster turning Shirou into a living wand of projection because she mentioned wanting to do something like this in other parts of the route.
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2009-04-30, 23:51 | Link #1259 | |
Onee!
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Auckland, NZ
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Quote:
did this happen in the game? the only scenario i can remember which comes close to this is when Saber/Shirou decide to go assault the temple, shirou gets warped out and painfully killed but even this is far from your scene. where did the tank come from? <_<;; sounds awfully like NGE.. sure it wasn't a doujin/fanfic or something?
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Tags |
fate/stay night, visual novel |
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