Dungeon Defense

[Xacual]

The best part about the chapter was that there was absolutely no gain or loss in affection from Elizabeth despite how well the two of them connected.

[Breimn]

I liked the half world cliche too with both sides acting as both hero and maou side.

[Nvis]

They saw each other naked, at least.

Seeing this chapter, conquering Paimon will be a breeze compared to Elizabeth.

Still I admit, Dantelion x Elizabeth best couple, IMO. The sinister, heartless couple.

[Ophis]

I find Barbatos and Elizabeth to be equally awesome characters. I like Elizabeth a bit more though, since she has bigger boobies.

I would love if Barbatos were to be the big-breasted loli type.

[mors86]

I went back and read the first chapter again.

In spite of that, if you were to look even slightly to the side you would learn how wrong that feeling was. From goblins to orcs and to finally ogres, these bulky monsters were guarding the man without leaving even a single gap. These monsters could slaughter the five thousand humans gathered here immediately if the man so ordered them to.

Have we seen these nonhuman demons in his army before? Except for the centaur cavalry and dwarf captains, I don't think they've been mentioned... my mental image till now with Dantalian's subordinates were mainly like human-looking demons with some others thrown in, but it feels more of them might be demihumans than I thought and the author smply doesn't remark on it, treating them as people.

[Breimn]

Goblins were mentioned as we know goblin children follow them(remember the stone game witches started), tough it is not said if there are any in the army or not.

[Breimn]

New ch is out!

[Sizaki]

I guess that Paimon will have the spotlight in the next volume. As she's on the cover.

Edit: Oh and yeah, that speech was good~

[Mechatrill]

Damn... That speech...

That plan...

Viva La Revolucion. Someone invent the Guillotine, because it's going up in every town square.

Traditionally, before the advent and widespread usage of gunpowder weaponry, peasant rebellions did still happen, only to get brutally put down. This is because the Nobility tends to have a monopoly on force due to the fact that they're the ones with the time and resources to train for years to fight and amass higher quality equipment. Those advantages would generally allow a group of noble knights rip though many times their numbers in peasants, who certainly lack anywhere near the same combat experience, discipline, and equipment.

Until the great equalizer known as firearms came around and made all those years of training moot in the face of a hail of bullets. At which point, well, the French Revolution is just the most famous example...

The thing is, I don't see a peasant revolt doing any better in the Dungeon Defense world. At least, not in normal circumstances anyways.

Thus enter Dantalian, and the newest Demon Invasion. Plus, since the opening declaration of war speech was about the Revolution, coming from Farnese, the perception will arise that the Demon Army, or at least Dantalian's Army, isn't there to invade Humanity, but rather to support the peasantry in their revolution. Suddenly, the peasant revolt has what is in effect a mercenary army that's the equal of the Nobility's joined to their cause, making it much more likely to succeed despite the original force disparity.

Even it it doesn't, well, it would have served Dantalian enough in that it would heavily divide and weaken the Human forces, which would make it far easier for Dantalian to win this war. Plus, success of failure, it would provide an extremely potent foundation for him to build on to win the hearts and minds of the conquered populous, which is one of his long term goals anyways.


On a side note, this may very well also completely neutralize the Hero as a threat, if not co-opt him outright. Dantalion just made the whole war a war between the peasantry and nobility, with the Human/Demon war a mere aside. If the Hero were to get involved in the war, then he, as a peasant, is more likely to join on the peasantry's, and by extension, Dantalian's side.

[mors86]

Dantalian just invented Communism. XD

[Craxuan]

Haven't read such a moving story in a while. This is seriously amazing.

And Volume 4 is coming out soon!

[wuhugm]

.........Laughable

This novel has never been successful in depicting "Demons" vs Humans since it felt like Humans vs Humans since the beginning

And now it's totally making it Humans vs Humans... What?

Dungeons... Demons... These components went completely out of the picture

This novel is great but fuck the fantasy element, just make Dantalian a lowly feudal lord and it will turn the same way

[ungururuh]

Originally Posted by mors86

Dantalian just invented Communism. XD

No, and it is laughable that you would first say "communism" where the ideology is totally opposed to what he is saying. What Datalian is advocating for is individual people sovereignty and one protects his sovereignty with weapons and arms.

Politics....it's always so confusing for many people.


@wuhugm

Yep, it's a shame that there aren't more fantasy elements incorporated in the narrative. I mean, we know they are there, or they exist but they are just mentioned from time to time and never properly used in the novel plot.

But still, the last chapter made me curious to see where exactly Dantalian is intending to go.


Btw, the closest ideology to what Dantalian's speech is eluding is "anarchy", but in order for it to be a true anarchy then he also has to give up his right to rule, and I don't think that would ever happen to soon, you know, considering his desire for power. Wonder if the author understands this concepts? or if he just so happens to write the speech like that.

[gn_X00]

the speech was a bit confusing at first... kinda come out of nowhere

but after you know the context and reread it again, damn.. that's one hack of a speech to destroy your enemy lol

and the black vs white go allegory is great

[rantaid]

nice speech, recommendation to enhance the feeling, listen to Verdi's Dies Irae (or Wagner, whichever you know is good... maybe Tanhausser or what?) while reading... you will unknowingly get turned on.

btw... actually, Dantalian's tactic although marvelous there is one single great flaw. whether the people is superstitious. He is a Demon, alright.... but ... did he or even Farnesse had Mandate of Heaven to justify their action? revolution (people revolt) and unconventional warfare is indeed the most troublesome battlefield. hence it is important for any invading army to win hearts and mind of common people. even better if they can justify their action as righteous act of God or Divine being. it wouldn't be funny if any event might coincidently made his situation unfavorable.

"To defeat an enemy, you must know them. Not simply their battle tactics, but their history, philosophy , art ." - Grand Admiral Thrawn.

also, you know whose speech was even better than Farnesse (Dantalian)? that is correct. Eric Cartman.

[wuhugm]

All right! Let's revolt against the nobles despite fucking demons are at our doors!

It's gonna be fine! The demons will not attack us when we are fighting each other!

We're supposedly pissing ourselves by only seeing those demons appearance, but it doesn't matter, KILL ALL NOBLES! LET'S FORGET THE FUCKING DEMONS!

The demons barely described as demons anyway so they are basically humans from another country~

You know what, let's change Humans Alliance & Demons Alliance into Axis & Allies and nothing's gonna fucking change!

Btw witches got magic by selling souls to Demon Lords, right?
Wouldn't they become that specific Demon Lord's servants? Why they being mercenaries and shit?

So Human Mages got magic by doing what?
Their skill set is the same...

@ungururuh

Oh yeah~

[mors86]

Originally Posted by ungururuh

No, and it is laughable that you would first say "communism" where the ideology is totally opposed to what he is saying. What Datalian is advocating for is individual people sovereignty and one protects his sovereignty with weapons and arms.

Politics....it's always so confusing for many people.

I was making a pun with 'class strife'. Have fun with your pedantics.

The means he's preaching is something close to insurrectionary anarchism if I really had to make up an ideology out of propaganda (not to mention the monologue but we aren't taking that into account), but for casual readers that hardly matters.

Did you have a sense of self-satisfaction? Well congrats to you.

[Breimn]

Witches have magic before they sold their sould. They got immortality from selling their souls. The younger you are as witch the more you are respected since it means you are talented enough to have a maou take your soul when you were young.
So maybe witches are simply humans who sold their soul?

[ungururuh]

Originally Posted by mors86

I was making a pun with 'class strife'. Have fun with your pedantics.

The means he's preaching is something close to insurrectionary anarchism if I really had to make up an ideology out of propaganda (not to mention the monologue but we aren't taking that into account), but for casual readers that hardly matters.

Did you have a sense of self-satisfaction? Well congrats to you.

I don't see why exactly I am being labeled "pedantic".


@wuhugm

"You know what, let's change Humans Alliance & Demons Alliance into Axis & Allies and nothing's gonna fucking change!"

Yep

[mors86]

Re-reading the chapter:

While joyously accepting the definition of my life to kill and be killed with that man, I closed my eyes.

So for people like them it's basically marriage! 'Cause they're bound to other 'till Death do us part'.

Well. Except for the fact that they'll be trying to get to the 'parting' bit rather... proactively.

@wuhugm

Don't worry about the Dungeon in the name - it comes from the game being called Dungeon Attack which is from Hero POV, so the novel from the opposite POV is called Dungeon Defense. Don't expect Dungeons to play a big part in the story lol.

About the fantasy bit - it's just the genre man. Spice and Wolf could've been written without Horo being a wolf. Maou Maouyuu Yuusha could've been written between two races instead of having demons and magic. It's just a way of establishing the book into a specific genre so that the audience automatically gets some familiarity. It's not something that has to have meaning.

Sure this could've been written in a non-fantasy setting, but then it wouldn't've been much of a reincarnation webnovel and probably wouldn't've gotten picked up for LNs. Authors have to compromise like that all the time. Or are you going to rant about every fanservice scene and harem tropes in every LN as well? :P