AnimeSuki Forums

atua · 2004-04-19, 05:13

I'm not sure if this is the right place for this thread, and beg the moderator(s)' forgiveness if it is not.

Anyway, I recently downloaded anime-fin's Marimite episode 1 to see if there were any significant changes in the art between the TV and DVD versions (anime-fin's raw was apparently from a dvd rip), since I know quite a few series such as Stellvia and ROD TV that had a number of redrawn or slightly altered scenes in the DVD version.

As I starting playing the episode however, it became increasingly obvious that the subtitles I was reading was ripped straight from the ASource-Lililicious version, albeit with some (very) minor changes. I'd say about 95% of the script was a word for word copy, with most of the differences coming from different spelling (British vs American) or just straightforward word substitutions (freshman instead of first year, academy instead of school).

I don't claim to be versed in the finer points of etiquette in the fansubbing community, but it does seem clear to me that to rip another group's translations WITHOUT CREDIT (or permission, i'm guessing) is the type of behaviour that should be strongly discouraged. I'm not sure if this group has done this sort of thing in the past, but I still remember the uproar when AJunkies did something similar.

So basically what I was wondering is whether anime-fin did in fact rip that script from the ASource-Lililicious, or was I just jumping to conclusions?

As for the art, I didn't notice any real changes in the episode. But having said that, since the first episode had the best artwork in the series, even if there were going to be redrawn scenes, it probably wouldn't be found in this episode. Did anyone else notice any art changes that I missed?

Göönk · 2004-04-19, 16:22

Ripping a DVD is already something that is prohibited...
Downloading a DVD rip is the kind of behavior that shall be prohibited

atua · 2004-04-19, 19:30

That's true enough. But if we're talking about legality, then I'm fairly sure that technically *all* fansubs are illegal, not just DVD rips.

Göönk · 2004-04-20, 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by atua

That's true enough. But if we're talking about legality, then I'm fairly sure that technically *all* fansubs are illegal, not just DVD rips.

yes it's true and yes I'm aware of that. DON'T DOWNLOAD !! IT'S BAD !!

I think it's not completely illegal when it's just airing on TV. Because, you could copy it on VHS (is it legal?) etc.. so, basically, once you publish it on TV, u know, you're loosing your copyright... but you have "TV quality" or "VHS quality" (now you can have DVD-R quality maybe, I don't know).

But ripping a DVD I think it's not the same. It's really stealing. It's like publishing a music title taken from a CD. Anyway. We are all aware it's bad but we can't resist.

Stealing the fansub is just a lazy act that shows lack or respect for the original fansub group. You had a good memory to see that. I don't remember the sub titles of ep. 1.

NoSanninWa · 2004-04-20, 02:22

I can't speak for the laws of all countries, but in the US when you tape something off of TV you are only allowed to keep it for your own private use. You may show the tape to a friend, but if you give the tape to your friend you are breaking the law. That seems to be just about as illegal.

atua · 2004-04-20, 07:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Göönk

Stealing the fansub is just a lazy act that shows lack or respect for the original fansub group.

I totally agree with this. It takes little extra time or effort to get permission and credit the group responsible for the script. I know that ASource-Lililicious put a lot of effort into Marimite and to see another group trying to pass off A-L's hard work as their own is rather insulting to both A-L and all the people who are fans of the show because of A-L's efforts.

BTW, I went and downloaded Anime-Keep's Marimite episode 1 yesterday (for comparison purposes), and it seems that Anime-Fin ripped some lines from them as well, though nowhere near the amount they stole from ASource-Lililicious.

Göönk · 2004-04-20, 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by atua

BTW, I went and downloaded Anime-Keep's Marimite episode 1 yesterday (for comparison purposes), and it seems that Anime-Fin ripped some lines from them as well, though nowhere near the amount they stole from ASource-Lililicious.

you know, sometimes translation is translation. And two translators may end with the same translation. But that's true that Japanese is very direct language and yo have to add words to make a grammaticaly GOOD sentence (by the way, is my sentence good? lol) so, it's strange that they end with the same sentences.

Suspicious !

kaiser_ · 2004-04-22, 04:10

Can you post some screenshots as to these sentences?

I'm just curious. It doesn't seem like they have any seeds for the DVDrip either.

atua · 2004-04-22, 11:01

I'd put in screenshots, but I feel it's mostly pointless because the amount of identical lines was just so high. Ignoring regional spelling differences (English vs American spelling, eg realise vs realize) that occured in a few sentences the only differences that I could see in the script from the first half of the first episode between the AS-L and A-F versions are:

ASource-Lililicious version vs Anime-fin version

I'm a first-year student, Fukuzawa Yumi vs I'm a freshman student, Peach-group, Fukuzawa Yumi.
So... vs Well then...
The Lillian Girls' School is a garden for maidens... vs The Lillian Girl's Academy is a garden for maidens... (The OP scene lines were taken from A-L's corrected version found in the later episodes)
You should tie your scarf in a proper knot vs You should make sure that your scarf is tied in a proper knot.
Ogasawara Sachiko-sama is the star of Lillian Girls' School vs Ogasawara Sachiko-sama is the star of Lillian Girl's Academy.
She beat out the second years vs She beat out the juniors.
A first-year student who deliberately walked by Sachiko-sama with her scarf undone... vs A freshman who deliberately walked by Sachiko-sama with her scarf undone...
Sachiko-sama is famous for hating slovenly dress vs Sachiko-sama is known to dislike improper dressing.
You know that I'm in the Photography Club vs You know that I'm in the photography club, right?
By the way, the title is "Training." vs By the way, the title is "Teaching Discipline.".
Even I think the leaders of the Yamayurikai are frightening vs Even to me the leaders of the Yamayurikai are frightening.
Shimako-san is Rosa Gigantea en bouton, so it's completely natural for her to be here vs Shimako-san is Rosa Gigantea en bouton, so it's natural that she would be here.
The Yamayurikai is what at normal schools is called the Student Council vs The Yamayurikai is what in normal schools is called the student council.
The official officers are Rosa Chinensis, Rosa Foetida and Rosa Gigantea, the three Roses vs The official lead members are Rosa Chinensis, Rosa Foetida and Rosa Gigantea, the three Roses.
No, this is fine vs No, I'm fine.
Rosa Foetida, if Sachiko has already decided, then this isn't the time to debate it vs Rosa Foetida, if Sachiko has already decided, then there is no more need to argue over it.
What? vs <Nothing added>

To give this some perspective, there were a total of 127 sentences in the first half of Episode 1. There are 17 changes listed above; the remainder of the lines are IDENTICAL. And as you can see for yourself, even the lines that have changed are mostly just "find and replace" changes, rather than a change in sentence structure, meaning or interpretation of the line.

kaiser_ · 2004-04-22, 23:50

wow.. thanks for the differences you listed there.

SCR512 · 2004-04-23, 02:51

hmm yay?.....

Dunno what to think, I'm honestly too tired to care as of now.. but I know the translators for our project are gonna drop bombs on Anime-fin... well if they care.. exams suck you dry =p Anyway, ya.. I would just stay away from their releases then if this is the case.... pretty disrespectful to do that with out our consent.. thankgod they cant steal out sfx/typeset signs, cause if that happend it would be HOCKEY >:/
God knows how long it took for me to time/style thoes evil lil signs.

2004-04-19, 05:13	Link #1
atua Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Sydney, Australia	Subtitles for [anime-fin] Marimite episode 1 ripped from ASource-Lililicious script? I'm not sure if this is the right place for this thread, and beg the moderator(s)' forgiveness if it is not. Anyway, I recently downloaded anime-fin's Marimite episode 1 to see if there were any significant changes in the art between the TV and DVD versions (anime-fin's raw was apparently from a dvd rip), since I know quite a few series such as Stellvia and ROD TV that had a number of redrawn or slightly altered scenes in the DVD version. As I starting playing the episode however, it became increasingly obvious that the subtitles I was reading was ripped straight from the ASource-Lililicious version, albeit with some (very) minor changes. I'd say about 95% of the script was a word for word copy, with most of the differences coming from different spelling (British vs American) or just straightforward word substitutions (freshman instead of first year, academy instead of school). I don't claim to be versed in the finer points of etiquette in the fansubbing community, but it does seem clear to me that to rip another group's translations WITHOUT CREDIT (or permission, i'm guessing) is the type of behaviour that should be strongly discouraged. I'm not sure if this group has done this sort of thing in the past, but I still remember the uproar when AJunkies did something similar. So basically what I was wondering is whether anime-fin did in fact rip that script from the ASource-Lililicious, or was I just jumping to conclusions? As for the art, I didn't notice any real changes in the episode. But having said that, since the first episode had the best artwork in the series, even if there were going to be redrawn scenes, it probably wouldn't be found in this episode. Did anyone else notice any art changes that I missed?

2004-04-20, 02:22	Link #5
NoSanninWa Weapon of Mass Discussion Fansubber Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: New York, USA	I can't speak for the laws of all countries, but in the US when you tape something off of TV you are only allowed to keep it for your own private use. You may show the tape to a friend, but if you give the tape to your friend you are breaking the law. That seems to be just about as illegal. __________________ There's not that fine a line between willing suspension of disbelief and something just being stupid.

2004-04-22, 11:01	Link #9
atua Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Sydney, Australia	I'd put in screenshots, but I feel it's mostly pointless because the amount of identical lines was just so high. Ignoring regional spelling differences (English vs American spelling, eg realise vs realize) that occured in a few sentences the only differences that I could see in the script from the first half of the first episode between the AS-L and A-F versions are: ASource-Lililicious version vs Anime-fin version I'm a first-year student, Fukuzawa Yumi vs I'm a freshman student, Peach-group, Fukuzawa Yumi. So... vs Well then... The Lillian Girls' School is a garden for maidens... vs The Lillian Girl's Academy is a garden for maidens... (The OP scene lines were taken from A-L's corrected version found in the later episodes) You should tie your scarf in a proper knot vs You should make sure that your scarf is tied in a proper knot. Ogasawara Sachiko-sama is the star of Lillian Girls' School vs Ogasawara Sachiko-sama is the star of Lillian Girl's Academy. She beat out the second years vs She beat out the juniors. A first-year student who deliberately walked by Sachiko-sama with her scarf undone... vs A freshman who deliberately walked by Sachiko-sama with her scarf undone... Sachiko-sama is famous for hating slovenly dress vs Sachiko-sama is known to dislike improper dressing. You know that I'm in the Photography Club vs You know that I'm in the photography club, right? By the way, the title is "Training." vs By the way, the title is "Teaching Discipline.". Even I think the leaders of the Yamayurikai are frightening vs Even to me the leaders of the Yamayurikai are frightening. Shimako-san is Rosa Gigantea en bouton, so it's completely natural for her to be here vs Shimako-san is Rosa Gigantea en bouton, so it's natural that she would be here. The Yamayurikai is what at normal schools is called the Student Council vs The Yamayurikai is what in normal schools is called the student council. The official officers are Rosa Chinensis, Rosa Foetida and Rosa Gigantea, the three Roses vs The official lead members are Rosa Chinensis, Rosa Foetida and Rosa Gigantea, the three Roses. No, this is fine vs No, I'm fine. Rosa Foetida, if Sachiko has already decided, then this isn't the time to debate it vs Rosa Foetida, if Sachiko has already decided, then there is no more need to argue over it. What? vs <Nothing added> To give this some perspective, there were a total of 127 sentences in the first half of Episode 1. There are 17 changes listed above; the remainder of the lines are IDENTICAL. And as you can see for yourself, even the lines that have changed are mostly just "find and replace" changes, rather than a change in sentence structure, meaning or interpretation of the line. Last edited by atua; 2004-04-22 at 11:26.

2004-04-22, 23:50	Link #10
kaiser_ Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003	wow.. thanks for the differences you listed there. Last edited by kaiser_; 2004-04-23 at 00:41.

2004-04-19, 16:22	Link #2
Göönk Macross fan Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: France	Ripping a DVD is already something that is prohibited... Downloading a DVD rip is the kind of behavior that shall be prohibited

2004-04-19, 19:30	Link #3
atua Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Sydney, Australia	That's true enough. But if we're talking about legality, then I'm fairly sure that technically all fansubs are illegal, not just DVD rips.

2004-04-22, 04:10	Link #8
kaiser_ Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003	Can you post some screenshots as to these sentences? I'm just curious. It doesn't seem like they have any seeds for the DVDrip either.

2004-04-23, 02:51	Link #11
SCR512 Ayu/Eclipse Semi-Slave Join Date: Nov 2003 Age: 41	hmm yay?..... Dunno what to think, I'm honestly too tired to care as of now.. but I know the translators for our project are gonna drop bombs on Anime-fin... well if they care.. exams suck you dry =p Anyway, ya.. I would just stay away from their releases then if this is the case.... pretty disrespectful to do that with out our consent.. thankgod they cant steal out sfx/typeset signs, cause if that happend it would be HOCKEY >:/ God knows how long it took for me to time/style thoes evil lil signs.