Learning Japanese

[Tranhieu]

Originally Posted by SlendermanHD

Yes i have the chukyu one and two, both with their grammatical notes in english.

Mind dropping me a PM if link posting is not allowed? I'm working on the Integrated Approach and would like to see other text books of the same level as well.

[Yu Ominae]

Same with me too. I need to hit the books soon.

[SlendermanHD]

http://studyjapanesenet.blogspot.com/

You guys can find the books and a lot of material right here, hope this can help you with your studys.

There is also this this one that could help you with some reading materials and other stuff:

https://chokochoko.wordpress.com/

[SlendermanHD]

Originally Posted by Tranhieu

Mind dropping me a PM if link posting is not allowed? I'm working on the Integrated Approach and would like to see other text books of the same level as well.

the MnN chukyu 1 and 2 are all of the grammar you need after the shokyus. but if you are asking for other books of the same level that can help you prepare for the jplt aswell i will say kanzen master N3 then N2 maybe.

[Yu Ominae]

Got something strange a while ago. Got a call from a company (Recruiting company) that headhunted me for a Japanese language position. I told them via phone that I got my certification in N5, which may not work.

I was told that some native Japanese speaker will assess and see if it's fine. Salary is 25K pesos in Manila or 562 American dollars. I'm not sure if it's a good idea. I mean, this'll be my first job if I decide to accept the offer.

[SlendermanHD]

Originally Posted by Yu Ominae

Got something strange a while ago. Got a call from a company (Recruiting company) that headhunted me for a Japanese language position. I told them via phone that I got my certification in N5, which may not work.

I was told that some native Japanese speaker will assess and see if it's fine. Salary is 25K pesos in Manila or 562 American dollars. I'm not sure if it's a good idea. I mean, this'll be my first job if I decide to accept the offer.

Thats really weird that a company is interested in a N5, for me taking the N5 is just to see if you did a good start at the basics of japanese grammar, but if you think you can do the job and need the money then why not, it sounds like a cool opportunity.

[Yu Ominae]

I need to make the decision later on. I'll need to ask what kind of benefits are attached (eg - fund further Japaanese studies, etc.)

[AmeNoJaku]

N5? Even with N2 it will take a lot of time to able to work in japanese, and that is only if you have a technical job.

[Yu Ominae]

True. Which is why I found it weird. Even my old man found it weird.

UPDATE: Did the assessment with a native speaker. I was told that my range was at N4-N5 level. One of the things they check is whether if I give off a native-like accent when I speak Japanese and that a native Japanese can tell that I'm a foreigner.

[endarion88]

can someone help me with this little bit please?

(まさかちょっとした悪戯心のために命を懸けるハメになるとは)

i undertsnad the first part as something like "did not expect to risk my life for a petty prank" but i dont really get the ハメになるとは ...by it self i think is something like "when it comes to screwing" but i can't make the sense with the rest of the sentence

anyone can help please?

[SlendermanHD]

Originally Posted by endarion88

can someone help me with this little bit please?

(まさかちょっとした悪戯心のために命を懸けるハメになるとは)

i undertsnad the first part as something like "did not expect to risk my life for a petty prank" but i dont really get the ハメになるとは ...by it self i think is something like "when it comes to screwing" but i can't make the sense with the rest of the sentence

anyone can help please?

There is no past in that sentence, is a conditional expression, is like dont expect me to risk my life for a petty prank when it comes to screw someone ( i dont have the context so i assume that in fact it is a person).the conditional is the ninaruto. Im on my ipad sorry for the romaji lol.

[endarion88]

Originally Posted by SlendermanHD

There is no past in that sentence, is a conditional expression, is like dont expect me to risk my life for a petty prank when it comes to screw someone ( i dont have the context so i assume that in fact it is a person).the conditional is the ninaruto. Im on my ipad sorry for the romaji lol.

thanks for the answer, he was indeed screwing with someone but he just thought this he didn't say it

[erneiz_hyde]

Originally Posted by SlendermanHD

There is no past in that sentence, is a conditional expression, is like dont expect me to risk my life for a petty prank when it comes to screw someone ( i dont have the context so i assume that in fact it is a person).the conditional is the ninaruto. Im on my ipad sorry for the romaji lol.

Umm...no, that's not what the sentence means. Your example is more "sonna itazura no tame ni inochi wo kakeru to omou na". This person did a prank, but it unexpectedly turned to a life risking situation. endarion88 were already correct on that front.

"xxx hame ni naru" is an expression that points to a result of an action or condition. "chottoshita itazuragokoro no tame ni" is the clause/premise/condition/whatever the correct term, and "inochi wo kakeru" is the result of it.

[Avatar of Dreams]

Originally Posted by SlendermanHD

There is no past in that sentence, is a conditional expression, is like dont expect me to risk my life for a petty prank when it comes to screw someone ( i dont have the context so i assume that in fact it is a person).the conditional is the ninaruto. Im on my ipad sorry for the romaji lol.

There is no past tense in the sentence that is spoken but that's because the speaker drops the final verb. This is common in Japanese when the listener can infer the missing verb. Give the nature of this case the ending verb is almost certainly 思わなかった, which is indeed past tense.
See here for usage.

Anyways endarion88, when you translate ハメになるとは to "when it comes to screwing", I am getting the impression you are confusing ハメ with the dirtier slang meaning of ハメる. The ハメ here is actually 羽目, which just means 'bad situation'. So when you have the expression 'verb'+ハメになる, it just means the situation has gotten to a bad point where 'verb' happens. If you understand the expression 'verb'+ことになる, it's very similar except with a negative context.

So the sentence literally translates to "I did not expect the situation to become one where I would risk my life for a petty prank". However, as is the case with most literal translations, this is terrible English. In fact your translation "I did not expect to risk my life for a petty prank" is perfectly fine and is the one I would use if I were translating for English speakers.

[endarion88]

Originally Posted by Avatar of Dreams

There is no past tense in the sentence that is spoken but that's because the speaker drops the final verb. This is common in Japanese when the listener can infer the missing verb. Give the nature of this case the ending verb is almost certainly 思わなかった, which is indeed past tense.
See here for usage.

Anyways endarion88, when you translate ハメになるとは to "when it comes to screwing", I am getting the impression you are confusing ハメ with the dirtier slang meaning of ハメる. The ハメ here is actually 羽目, which just means 'bad situation'. So when you have the expression 'verb'+ハメになる, it just means the situation has gotten to a bad point where 'verb' happens. If you understand the expression 'verb'+ことになる, it's very similar except with a negative context.

So the sentence literally translates to "I did not expect the situation to become one where I would risk my life for a petty prank". However, as is the case with most literal translations, this is terrible English. In fact your translation "I did not expect to risk my life for a petty prank" is perfectly fine and is the one I would use if I were translating for English speakers.

oh thanks a lot for the explination! in fact that ハメ i had no idea what it meant so i went with what the dictionary told me...and since it was written in kana and not kanji well..you know how it goes..also i was confused in a double way by that とは at the end so instead of the normal になる meaning i went with the になると meaning "when it comes to" ..and it still confuse me a bit guess i still have a long way to go

i wanted to try to translate a few pages but i guess maibe i'm still not good enought

[SlendermanHD]

Originally Posted by Avatar of Dreams

There is no past tense in the sentence that is spoken but that's because the speaker drops the final verb. This is common in Japanese when the listener can infer the missing verb. Give the nature of this case the ending verb is almost certainly 思わなかった, which is indeed past tense.
See here for usage.

Anyways endarion88, when you translate ハメになるとは to "when it comes to screwing", I am getting the impression you are confusing ハメ with the dirtier slang meaning of ハメる. The ハメ here is actually 羽目, which just means 'bad situation'. So when you have the expression 'verb'+ハメになる, it just means the situation has gotten to a bad point where 'verb' happens. If you understand the expression 'verb'+ことになる, it's very similar except with a negative context.

So the sentence literally translates to "I did not expect the situation to become one where I would risk my life for a petty prank". However, as is the case with most literal translations, this is terrible English. In fact your translation "I did not expect to risk my life for a petty prank" is perfectly fine and is the one I would use if I were translating for English speakers.

Yeah it was my mistake, it was the first time for me seeing that expression and sometimes without context japanese can turn into an ambiguous language at least for me im not that advanced. Ty very much i learned something new.

[Asuras]

So, as my Junior year at a university comes to a close, I'll be leaving behind my single year of Japanese courses. Due to my major combination, I don't have any room to continue taking the next levels any time during my next two semesters, which is unfortunate because I wanted to keep up a steady pace of learning Japanese. I don't want to lose all the knowledge I have like I did with French in High School.

I asked my professor what I could do to continue Japanese at my own pace outside of a classroom, and she replied with an honestly unsatisfactory answer, in my opinion. She told me it would be, "incredibly difficult" to learn Japanese without the help of an instructor and that I would be better off purchasing the next book level and coming back to her for questions when I had them, which I knew was quite wrong given how many people I've seen who go through self-tutoring.

So I ask you guys instead, what can I do to continue learning on my own? I've taken a year of Japanese (two semesters, 101/102 level), and am familiar with at least 160 kanji, grammar points including: future/present tense, past, te forms, informal, explanatory, etc (a lot more but I of course won't name them all), and enough words that I could feasibly survive in a Japanese setting without being utterly clueless.

I just want to know what my next step could possibly be. I have yet to learn keigo, and based on how many times I asked my professor, "How to say X," (X being a grammar point we had yet to learn), I've also got a lot more grammar to learn as well. I'm well aware the best way to learn words and kanji is to simply come across them, find their translation, and then memorize it. I'm more interested in how to learn more about grammar.

[SlendermanHD]

Originally Posted by Asuras

So, as my Junior year at a university comes to a close, I'll be leaving behind my single year of Japanese courses. Due to my major combination, I don't have any room to continue taking the next levels any time during my next two semesters, which is unfortunate because I wanted to keep up a steady pace of learning Japanese. I don't want to lose all the knowledge I have like I did with French in High School.

I asked my professor what I could do to continue Japanese at my own pace outside of a classroom, and she replied with an honestly unsatisfactory answer, in my opinion. She told me it would be, "incredibly difficult" to learn Japanese without the help of an instructor and that I would be better off purchasing the next book level and coming back to her for questions when I had them, which I knew was quite wrong given how many people I've seen who go through self-tutoring.

So I ask you guys instead, what can I do to continue learning on my own? I've taken a year of Japanese (two semesters, 101/102 level), and am familiar with at least 160 kanji, grammar points including: future/present tense, past, te forms, informal, explanatory, etc (a lot more but I of course won't name them all), and enough words that I could feasibly survive in a Japanese setting without being utterly clueless.

I just want to know what my next step could possibly be. I have yet to learn keigo, and based on how many times I asked my professor, "How to say X," (X being a grammar point we had yet to learn), I've also got a lot more grammar to learn as well. I'm well aware the best way to learn words and kanji is to simply come across them, find their translation, and then memorize it. I'm more interested in how to learn more about grammar.

Of course everything is easier with a tutor or a teacher, japanese is not the exception, but it doesnt mean that you can not learn the language by yourself. You can donwload the shokyus and chukyus i left the link in this same thread. Look out for the grammar you dont know on the shokyus, the final lessons in the shokyu 2 are keigo. Thats for grammar, then about kanji well there are a lot of apps books flashcards choose the best suited for you. The best way to learn its to read. By reading you will pick up the vocabulary and practice your own grammar.

And i mi wa? Is a nice app for dictionary and kanji.

Make the japanese a daily study at least for 2 hours a day if you dont have a lot of time like me, it took me like 5 months to be at the n4 level. You can look at kira sensei hes a spanish teacher currently living in japan teaching them the spanish language, he took the N1 in just 2 years and he studied all by himself, its a proof that indeed is possible to learn the language without a teacher.

[Honoakari]

Originally Posted by Asuras

- snip -

For grammar, check out Tae Kim's Japanese Grammar Guide.

In my previous post I described how I learned Japanese. Perhaps it can be of help.

For any questions regarding Japanese, Japanese Language Stack Exchange is a very good place to ask.

Internalizing grammar is important, but don't forget to improve your vocabulary as well. Actually, if you can handle basic grammar, then I'd say it's time to learn kanji properly (and get used to the grammar as you read/listen Japanese). 160 is a very small number - you pretty much won't be able to read anything.

Kanji are usually learned by following the jouyou order. Unfortunately, there are two major problems with this method:

- you'll get to learn some important kanji late, because they're placed towards the end of the list (among some less important ones);
- despite the recent additions, the list still lacks many important kanji. These include 嬉, 嘘, 頷, 呟, 晒, 叶, 溢, 賑, 辿, 睨, 覗, 纏, 庇, 騙, 罠, 歪, 捌 and more...

A better alternative would be to use frequency lists. The last link on this page for example lists kanji by how frequently they appear in novels. You can find several of these lists on Google.

For learning kanji you'll need a good dictionary, for this I recommend jisho.org. It comes in both a modern version and a classic one (I prefer classic).

There are also browser-integrated dictionaries, such as Rikaichan and Perapera (I'm using the latter), which are very, very useful when reading things online.

Hopefully, my post is comprehensive enough. If you have any other questions/requirements regarding online self-study of Japanese, don't hesitate to ask.

[Yu Ominae]

Got that callback I talked about a few posts ago regarding a Japanese language position as an interpreter despite my N5 credentials.

I told my folks and they hesitated, partially due to that and the potential of seeing a scar on my head due to surgery on it a few months ago with my hair short.

I plan to confront them and insist on getting a shot at this.