Sword Art Online - Episode 22 Discussion / Poll

[Tsundere Louise]

The episode was good and... poor Suguha. Guess Kirigaya never thought of her more than a sibling...

[Insane]

Originally Posted by joshuafaramir

And speaking of harems... what about that guy from Clannad eh?? That guy was as bad as Kirito... We all know who he was gonna end up with but the story keeps on throwing girls at him even when the newer girls where a lot better.

Badass MC or not, harem is harem after all. It's all for the sake of those damned japanese otakus. They won't be satified until tons of girls swarming the MC even though they clearly know that not all of the girls will be chosen by him in the end.

sarcasm aside. I wonder why Kirito didn't just grab one of the dome guardian's sword and went back to his dual wielding style which virtually would give him much more advantage in extra-cornered situation (i was facepalmed when he parried one of the guardian's sword by his bare hand, if only said hand had wielded another sword instead......)

[Millenia]

I was so waiting for this episode, to know what way they would find the truth about each other. Kyaa~

Go Suguha!


Now to rewatch it!

[Sumeragi]

Originally Posted by joshuafaramir

And speaking of harems... what about that guy from Clannad eh?? That guy was as bad as Kirito... We all know who he was gonna end up with but the story keeps on throwing girls at him even when the newer girls where a lot better.

Depends. You could choose the route in the original visual novel, so using the anime as the standard is slightly problematic.

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by joshuafaramir

And speaking of harems... what about that guy from Clannad eh?? That guy was as bad as Kirito... We all know who he was gonna end up with but the story keeps on throwing girls at him even when the newer girls where a lot better.

Originally Posted by Insane

Badass MC or not, harem is harem after all. It's all for the sake of those damned japanese otakus. They won't be satified until tons of girls swarming the MC even though they clearly know that not all of the girls will be chosen by him in the end.

You do realize you're criticizing an Anime that is an adaptation of a visual novel with multiple story routes that you can choose from right?

[Kanon]

That was just horrible. It was already bad enough to break Sugu's heart, they didn't have to crush it into tiny little pieces. Having her fall for Kirito was ridiculous and pointlessly cruel if you ask me. There's no way I can take that kind of contrived drama seriously. It's just too much. The whole situation ended up being hilarious instead. The moment Sugu confessed and realized Kirito was her brother... MY SIDES

Sure, this was a foregone conclusion since the start, but that doesn't make the writing any less terrible. Not even in fanfiction can you find something that bad.

As for the good:

- Yuki Kajiura's soundtrack was wonderful as always.
- Ayana Taketatsu's performance was absolutely stellar. She's kind of wasted here.

[Raviel]

Originally Posted by orpheus2

Uh, Kirito. There is a reason it takes an army of players to beat the Grand Quest. Then again, he was consumed by emotion at the time.

Poor Sugu...

Overall, it was quite enjoyable.

*looks at end card*

If/when Kirito manages to get a raid party going for the Grand Quest I fully expect if to go something like this:

Sylph Leader (I forgot her name XD): Alright guys this dungeon has given us problems before, does anyone need anything from the boss?

Leafa/Lyfa: I think Kirito-kun needs to save his girlfriend

Sylph Leader: *sigh* Alright Lou do a quick number number crunch and see how we hold

Lou: Hmmmm, based on our last few runs I'd say we have a 34% chance of clearing the quest this time. What's the plan?

Slyph Leader: Warriors go in and draw while--

Kirito: Ok guys lets do this..........ASUNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Everyone Else: Oh my god he just ran in, SAVE HIM

Sylph Leader: STICK TO THE PLAN GUYS

Lou: Too late I'm dead

Leafa/Lyfa: Kirito-kun you idiot

Kirito: At least I have my waifu

[Oroboro]

Hmm... I think ultimately, Suguha was too caught up in her own fantasy. She IS a 15 year old girl after all, and during the two years Kazuto is in SAO, the idea of a forbidden romance slowly worms its way through her head, and becomes an unchecked fantasy that she invested too much in until it was too late.


Anyway, I was thinking. I wonder if it would be possible to chop up the scenes from ALO, only giving us the scenes from Suguha's / Lyfa's perspective, and have it still make sense. I guess maybe if you showed it to an outsider like that, a bit of basic exposition on the SAO incident as she knows it.

By casting her as the main character and removing any knowledge about Kirito, we have the story of a 15 year old girl interested in a taboo romance, but who eventually falls the badass and mysterious stranger with a dark and hidden past. (Which, in case anyone forgot, that second part is the plot to every romance novel ever written.)

Edit: That probably is the crux of Suguha's problems really, that she thinks she's the main character of a different kind of story.. =P

[blakstealth]

@Raviel: Leeroy Jenkins, much? lol

[Raviel]

Originally Posted by blakstealth

@Raviel: Leeroy Jenkins, much? lol

That IS what Kirito did during the episode minus causing the entire raid group to wipe

[Fawx9]

Well glad that that's been dealt with.

Anyone else think it would have been better for Sugu to just play a sister who matured over 2 years and is more worried about him/concerned about who he is now than what we got?

IMO her character could have grown that way instead of being a drama bus.

[larethian]

ALO is the worst arc to me in the entire SAO series. But, with regards to the anime which I finally caught up after weeks, I actually liked the flashbacks and BGM placement this episode!

[ellessarr]

Originally Posted by Sumeragi

Depends. You could choose the route in the original visual novel, so using the anime as the standard is slightly problematic.

Spoiler for Comparison to Clannad:

second half of the game(after story) is totally about the main girl, and like i told if the author wished he could have done a good drama without using "romance" as a hook, family problems he had before the game could appear without make her fall for him

[Dauerlutscher]

Spoiler for Comparison to Clannad:

The Relationship with Nagisa and what happened to her had a big impact on Tomoya and made him who he was at the end.
Besides after that thing happened with Nagisa, romance played not so much of a big part, but the family aspect.

In the end, Tomoya and Kirito have nothing in comon except that they hade/have a harem. Comparing them is absurd and is of topic.

[Miraluka]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Spoiler for Comparison to Clannad:

The Relationship with Nagisa and what happened to her had a big impact on Tomoya and made him who he was at the end.
Besides after that thing happened with Nagisa, romance played not so much of a big part, but the family aspect.

In the end, Tomoya and Kirito have nothing in comon except that they hade/have a harem. Comparing them is absurd and is of topic.

Spoiler for Comparison to Clannad:

The comparsion comes from the "set in a stone relationship" while they keep addinng more girls which only makes pointless drama out of those girls =__=;

[Dauerlutscher]

Well, in most "harem"stories it's clear who is going to end up with whom anyway and they still don't wast 10 episodes or more on pointless and forced romance just for dramas sake.
In the case of this story, it's just the extreme focus for so long on a girl that had never a chance in the first place what is so annyyoing. It's just a huge waste of time. It was clear that this thing with her would not go anywhere and istead on fousing on things that are more important, Kiritos and Auna character developmet, we got nothing but 10 episodes on a pointless thing.

[Sumeragi]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

istead on fousing on things that are more important, Kiritos and Auna character developmet, we got nothing but 10 episodes on a pointless thing.

Wait, you thought that was the point of this arc? You must have missed the memo.

[Bahamut]

...if Kirito was just going to rush in anyways...
...that should have been the first thing that happens when he entered this game...

...enter game...
...meet Leafa...
...gets to Alne...
...hears Asuna...
...rushes to Yggdrasil...
...attempt fails...
...then start everything else...

...but i guess if that happened the heart break scene wouldn't work (not like it matters)...
...its Suguha's story so i guess it has to be this way?

...fight scene was good though...showed his determination...even though it was kinda late in-game...

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by Sumeragi

Wait, you thought that was the point of this arc? You must have missed the memo.

The memo about what? That i should be prepared of a huge waste of time?

I hoped that we would get the necessary character development to the main characters, but we didn't get it. The time that was wasted could have ben used to make the characters and the story deeper. What we got instead was 10 episodes of pointless and forced drama and characters that are still flat.
Take this forced romance thing away and absolutely nothing would have ben lost. Kirito would still be the same "omnipotent" guy, Asuna would be still trapped and still be forced to marry, and the villain would still be that idiotic guy that he is.
So tell me. What was the point on focusing on Suguhas little problem for so long besides to have drama for dramas sake and to make the audience feel pity for her in an extremely blatant way?

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

In the case of this story, it's just the extreme focus for so long on a girl that had never a chance in the first place what is so annyyoing. It's just a huge waste of time. It was clear that this thing with her would not go anywhere and istead on fousing on things that are more important, Kiritos and Auna character developmet, we got nothing but 10 episodes on a pointless thing.

There's a lot more to the theme and message of SAO than just "Kirito and Asuna's story". It's not a shounen action show that's all about watching the protagonist power-up so he can face his next villain (although there is an element of that). Suguha's story offers its own commentary and perspective on the link between games and reality and how your feelings are the bridge between the two. It's a complement to the perspectives of both Kirito and Asuna, whose current situation is developing the same themes. Even though her romance was doomed from the start, the issues explored and the perspective shown is directly connected to the show's theme.

As I said before, Kirito and Asuna's story isn't auto-magically more important or more related to the theme just because they're the main characters. From a strictly pragmatic point of view, there's nothing to be gained from Asuna being captured since we know for sure that she will be reunited with Kirito in the end. So their little story arc of being separated and reunited is not magically more important than Suguha's because of who they are. It's also not pointless just because the destination is known, because that's no different in either plot thread. All three characters are important because their respective stories all revolve around the same theme and message, and that's why the three perspectives will come together in the arc's denouement.

I'm not saying you have to like it, but I think it's extremely relevant to the story they're telling... just not to the story you would rather they tell instead.