Attack on Titan - Episode 23 Discussion / Poll

[monir]

Spoiler Alert: Annie is the female titan!

[Mad Pierrot]

Man, that laugh Annie... Not only she killed Marcoh, Levi's mates but lots of other people. Damn...

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

I know people say Shingeki has no moe, but how can you look at Little Blonde Riding Hood and say that?

It's a trap!

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by Actuarially Sound

The question it prompted for me, was why did we see Annie saving Jean in the first place? Furthermore, why did she seem so apologetic towards a dead soldier (Not sure if it was Marco or someone that was stuck in a Titan hairball)? She sure didn't value human life very much when she was trying to capture Eren. Even during the latest episode, AFTER she had already learned Eren was a Titan, and AFTER personally killing at the very least 10+ recon soldiers outside the walls, she goes and defends Marlow from those senior Military officers.

I'm sure this will probably get better explained in later episodes, but for now it just boggles my mind a bit.

Annie's inconsistent behavior gets brought up within the episode itself, namely as to why she spared Armin. Or why she might (potentially) have saved the lives of some of her comrades during the battle of Trost.


I think it's important to remember that degrees of separation plays heavily on how willing somebody is to kill in many cases. Killing somebody you don't know is different than killing someone who you bonded with as a comrade in arms through three years of training. And smashing little insect like figures from on high is allot easier than having to stand right over the remains of dead people killed by similar means.



Think about how WW2 bomber crew could devastate entire cities and kill hundreds of thousands of people but not feel too shook up about it. Compare that to a random infantryman being haunted for life for killing that one young enemy soldier at close range. And I don't think bomber crew are inherently more sociopathic than Infantry soldiers.

[kitten320]

Originally Posted by Preciize

In the beginning when it showed her father talk, does it mean it's not uncommon for titans to take human form? Or was she a human who went through some kind of transformation?

Well Eren is a human with ability to change, she must be the same then.

[Snow White]

Originally Posted by amaterasu4

Man, that laugh Annie...Not only she killed Marcoh, Levi's mates but lots of other people. Damn...

>Not only she killed Marcoh
But she didn't. She only took Marco's 3DMD, but didn't kill him.

[Preciize]

Originally Posted by kitten320

Well Eren is a human with ability to change, she must be the same then.

Yeah, I guess my question is why was she hunting Eren. If she is a human, why is she helping the titans?

[monir]

Originally Posted by Preciize

Yeah, I guess my question is why was she hunting Eren. If she is a human, why is she helping the titans?

That would be one of the most intriguing mystery right now, wouldn't it? She is got a lot of blood on her hand.

This episode was almost perfect. I forgot to breathe. Production I. G got some seriously talented people working on this show that's for certain.

[Veviticus]

Maybe the humans are the bad guys here. Titans could be a product of humanity's experimentations from the past. I'll go with what someone said on these forums, and that is to complete the titan mating ritual

[Roger Rambo]

We got to see some of the Military Police close up finally. They seem like a rather dysfunctional organization.


They're mainly an internal security force with no real internal security threats to deal with, whose enlistee core consists of the most promising recruits in terms of their ability to kill Titan's (who deliberately ignored training for fighting against humans, since that ranking didn't matter)...only they immediately let those potential skills go to waste by being used as errand boys for the senior MP's who spend most of their times faffing about, even going so far as to fence military supplies on the black market in broad daylight.

Maintaining thousands of soldiers who are effectively useless against Titan's would be bad enough. But it's especially sad that it looks like they aren't even capable of upholding their theoretical mission of dealing with major internal security threats should they actually arrive. How well do you think these MP's would fare against full scale rioting by the citizens? Or an attempted military revolt by the other parts of the military. The Recon Corps could probably take on 2-3 times their numbers in MP's in a fair fight...and the Recon nutjobs hardly seem the types to fight fair.

Does explain why the MP's seem so nervous about Eren as a security threat (or his existence inspiring a security threat). A paper Mache tiger must make sure to extinguish all near bye flames before they burn too hot.



TLDR?

[Flolan]

Originally Posted by monir

Spoiler Alert: Annie is the female titan!

The cat is finally let out of the bag!

[Actuarially Sound]

Originally Posted by Roger Rambo

I think it's important to remember that degrees of separation plays heavily on how willing somebody is to kill in many cases. Killing somebody you don't know is different than killing someone who you bonded with as a comrade in arms through three years of training. And smashing little insect like figures from on high is allot easier than having to stand right over the remains of dead people killed by similar means.

Think about how WW2 bomber crew could devastate entire cities and kill hundreds of thousands of people but not feel too shook up about it. Compare that to a random infantryman being haunted for life for killing that one young enemy soldier at close range. And I don't think bomber crew are inherently more sociopathic than Infantry soldiers.

While I agree with your overall point, Annie did in fact kill Gunther while she was in human form. Furthermore, she consciously spared and attempted to take human lives of those she trained with (compare Armin with Mikasa). And at this point it was Annie who used Marcoh's gear to kill Sawney and Bean.

It's clear to me that Annie in human form and in Titan form has a clear goal in mind. And despite having personal morals, she will break all her personal rules to accomplish her main goal whether in human or titan form.

[Snow White]

Originally Posted by Actuarially Sound

While I agree with your overall point, Annie did in fact kill Gunther while she was in human form. Furthermore, she consciously spared and attempted to take human lives of those she trained with (compare Armin with Mikasa). And at this point it was Annie who used Marcoh's gear to kill Sawney and Bean.

It's clear to me that Annie in human form and in Titan form has a clear goal in mind. And despite having personal morals, she will break all her personal rules to accomplish her main goal whether in human or titan form.

When did Annie intend to kill Mikasa? She was just running away when Mikasa trying to kill her.

If you mean that time when Mikasa was saved by Levi, I don't think Annie knew it was Mikasa who tried to cut the nape of her neck. She was still blinded, after all.

[monir]

On the topic of Military Police, several people commented in previous threads that how some of the best people from the academy went to become MP, so even if Recon Corps loses a lot of personnel, MP still should be able to tackle onslaughts from Titans if it comes down to it. That topic stemmed from the amount of Recon Corps killed in the hands of FT, how it weakens humanity so much more at the irreplaceable casualties sustained.

This episode puts huge question mark to that assessment. Skill is one thing but without honing ones skill, it becomes dull. So even if these MP's were on top of their recruiting class during their academy years, they shouldn't have a shred of chance if they engage the Titans when the occasion calls for it once in a blue moon. Recon Corp, on the other hand, seeks out and engages the Titans on a fairly regular basis. The combat experience alone puts any surviving Recon Corps soldier shoulders above any of the Military Police that never fought a Titan. So I have my doubts the MP will be effective as much as Recon Corp when it comes to fighting Titans. Humanity goes bye bye as soon as Recon Corp is dismantled. This episode makes a very strong case that the MPs aren't going to save the day.

Originally Posted by Flolan

The cat is finally let out of the bag!

http://i42.tinypic.com/2drxqur.jpg

More like the cat is in the bag.. hahahahahaha...

I'm just glad as a moderator that this "secret" is finally out.

[Actuarially Sound]

Originally Posted by Snow White

When did Annie intend to kill Mikasa? She was just running away when Mikasa trying to kill her.

If you mean that time when Mikasa was saved by Levi, I don't think Annie knew it was Mikasa who tried to cut the nape of her neck. She was still blinded, after all.

I'd say throughout much of Mikasa's chase, Annie tried swatting and grabbing at Mikasa. Certainly not enough by itself, but added with the scene of when Mikasa had injured the female titan enough to lose its footing, Mikasa tried cutting the nape of female titan's neck, only to have her sword shattered. Mikasa maneuvered herself to a nearby tree and wondered why the sword wouldn't cut through, internally apologized to Erin for not immediately getting him, and then dodged a full on female titan punch that surely would've killed her by crushing her into the tree.

That, and the part by Levi. But the tree punch was the one that stuck out the most to me.

[Preciize]

Originally Posted by monir

That would be one of the most intriguing mystery right now, wouldn't it? She is got a lot of blood on her hand.

This episode was almost perfect. I forgot to breathe. Production I. G got some seriously talented people working on this show that's for certain.

Yeah, love how this series raises so many intriguing questions and mysteries ^^

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Roger Rambo

No, she didn't want to go into the tunnel because a tunnel is the most vulnerable place a titan shifter can be. If she transforms underground, she essentially buries herself alive, pinning her in place just like when the Recon Corps had her harpooned. They'd be able to blast and dig her out at their leisure. Escape would be impossible. She could kill a few of her attackers by transforming like that...but the Recon corps is prepared to take casualties to bring her down anyway, and Annie probably doesn't want to get herself killed or captured.

You got it wrong on the details. Annie can't transform underground.

Titans move during daylight. Hanji experimented on Sawny and Bean discovering that they become more lethargic without solar energy.

Eren participated in an experiment if he can transform without sunlight under a well.

What happened is that his regeneration won't work and he can't transform.

So yes underground is where Annie is most vulnerable. As she is rendered plain normal.

[Haigon]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

You got it wrong on the details. Annie can't transform underground.

Titans move during daylight. Hanji experimented on Sawny and Bean discovering that they become more lethargic without solar energy.

Eren participated in an experiment if he can transform without sunlight under a well.

What happened is that his regeneration won't work and he can't transform.

So yes underground is where Annie is most vulnerable. As she is rendered plain normal.

?

Eren didn't transformed in the well because lack of resolve.

[Randrak42]

Why did Annie try to kill Mikasa when she obviously avoided killing her friends at all cost before? Simple, Mikasa was an actual threat...none of the other members of her training squad were as much of a threat as Mikasa, she seemed to easily deal with their attacks and still not harm them. With Mikasa it was different, not only was Annie exhausted after fighting Eren but Mikasa was strong and aiming for the kill...it was kill or be killed and Annie had no choice but to protect herself how she could. If Mikasa had stopped the attack then I'm sure Annie would not have bothered with her any longer.

[takai]

Not bad episode. But nothing special either. At least nothing was lingered on too long.

Overall an average episode.

[NoemiChan]

Darn, Annie. Hoped they've stripped her while in human form...