Higurashi (1st season) Character Discussion / Poll

[MarthX]

Originally Posted by Shiosai

I wonder why Mion turns out so masculine and Shion so feminine. Identical twins are super interesting.

Mion has a reputation to uphold.

[yakuri-moe]

Mion doesn't literally say "call me ojisan", but she's always refering to herself like that so it feels like she's asking for it XD

[FatPianoBoy]

+1 for Shion
And don't fault her for going on a rampage. How would you feel if you thought your Yakuza family (who had all but excommunicated you) was responsible for the disappearance and possible murder of your beloved?
Exactly.

Spoiler for Meakashi-hen TIPS:

We're going by the names everyone calls them and not their birth names, correct? As anyone who's read the TIPS knows, Shion's name is actually 'Mion,' but was changed when the guys doing the little doodle on the back got the twins switched and put it on the younger twin.

[sagematt]

Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy

And don't fault her for going on a rampage. How would you feel if you thought your Yakuza family (who had all but excommunicated you) was responsible for the disappearance and possible murder of your beloved?

No, I wouldn't go on a killing rampage.

Something that's been bothering me is that everyone is thinking that Shion has to be forgiven because she loved Satoshi and the Sonozaki messed up with him and his family big time. If the reason for forgiving her is that, then you guys are totally wrong. I would never forgive someone for going on a killing rampage because the guy she has a silly crush on probably got killed. That's... wrong.

Now, why is it that we forgive Shion's sin?
It's because she wasn't herself when she did all that horrible stuff. She was under the influence of something, and that something is what made her go batshit insane. It's the same something that caused K1 to murder Rena and Mion in Onikakushi, and the same something that had Rena almost blowing up the school and killing everyone on Tsumihoroboshi. They just weren't themselves, they went crazy and couldn't help it. That's why we should forgive them.

Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy

Spoiler for Meakashi-hen TIPS:

We're going by the names everyone calls them and not their birth names, correct? As anyone who's read the TIPS knows, Shion's name is actually 'Mion,' but was changed when the guys doing the little doodle on the back got the twins switched and put it on the younger twin.

Spoiler for Obligatory convention we should all agree on:

Did you ever see Animesuki's Gosanke ever mentioning that before? Like, calling "the real Shion" as Shion and "the real Mion" as Mion? (on the context of a normal conversation, I mean)

Of course not, because it would be TOO CONFUSING.

The one we first knew as Mion, we should call her Mion. And viceversa. Or else it would be TOO DAMN CONFUSING

[FatPianoBoy]

Actually, that's what's I've always been saying. I guess I just put it wrong in that last post
The thing that ticks me off the most is that when Shion starts dragging people off to her butcher shop, she's evil. When Rena starts chopping people up, she gets moe points. FPB senses a double-standard

[sagematt]

Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy

The thing that ticks me off the most is that when Shion starts dragging people off to her butcher shop, she's evil. When Rena starts chopping people up, she gets moe points. FPB senses a double-standard

By my standards, there is no double-standard there. It's totally fair

[MarthX]

Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy

Actually, that's what's I've always been saying. I guess I just put it wrong in that last post
The thing that ticks me off the most is that when Shion starts dragging people off to her butcher shop, she's evil. When Rena starts chopping people up, she gets moe points. FPB senses a double-standard

Shion killed innocent people, Rena did not. She tried to at the end but never did.

[Matrim]

That double standard annoys me too. Maybe we need to arrange a deadmatch between crazy Rena and berserk-mode Shion to settle the score.

Shion killed innocent people, Rena did not.

Well, I doubt you think Rena would have hesitated to follow Shion's example had she gotten a chance to get close to those she thought were the masterminds behind the conspiracy. Moreover, taking innocent people as hostages is probably even more despicable than going on some misguided crusade because at least in Shion's case she thought the victims were guilty of something. So excuse me for thinking the crimes of Rena are excused by some fans because of her cuteness and moe-like behaviour and noth much else.

[DrakeNavarone]

It's because Shion did all those things for a really stupid reason (revenge for some crush that probably didn't like her back?), while Rena was defending Hinamizawa from alien parasites... She was saving the world, man!! (okay, a little sarcasm there...)

But honestly, Shion's cheap. One shot with the stun gun, and she drags you back to her torture chamber where she does what she wants with you while you're being tied back. At least Rena gave her opponents a fighting chance...

[Supergrunch]

Originally Posted by Matrim

Well, I doubt you think Rena would have hesitated to follow Shion's example had she gotten a chance to get close to those she thought were the masterminds behind the conspiracy. Moreover, taking innocent people as hostages is probably even more despicable than going on some misguided crusade because at least in Shion's case she thought the victims were guilty of something. So excuse me for thinking the crimes of Rena are excused by some fans because of her cuteness and moe-like behaviour and noth much else.

What the hell had Satoko done to make her guilty, other than crying?

[Matrim]

What the hell had Satoko done to make her guilty, other than crying?

It's not about what she had done, it's about what Shion thought she had done (being a burden on her brother and so on). It's not as if the rest of her victims were guiltier than Satoko, why single her out? I don't claim Shion was right to kill them, not at all. I just think Rena was just as ruthless, if not more.

At least Rena gave her opponents a fighting chance...

I think Teppei's ghost might disagree with that.

[Supergrunch]

Originally Posted by Matrim

It's not as if the rest of her victims were guiltier than Satoko, why single her out?

Well, Mion made Shion pull out her nails, Oryou looked like she was in charge of everthing, Kimiyoshi likewise, and Rika was going to inject her...

[MarthX]

Originally Posted by Supergrunch

Well, Mion made Shion pull out her nails, Oryou looked like she was in charge of everthing, Kimiyoshi likewise, and Rika was going to inject her...

She already planned to kill Rika before she did anything.

[Supergrunch]

Originally Posted by MarthX

She already planned to kill Rika before she did anything.

Meh, but Rika isn't as innocent...

[Matrim]

In Shion's crazy mind being a burden on Satoshi was probably just as bad or even worse offence than what the rest did, so I don't really see your point. Objectively none of the victims seemed to be guilty, and subjectively to Shion they were all guilty, so I just don't think we have to single out Satoko, except for the way she died compared with the rest.

[BakaOnna]

The thing with Shion is, her problem wasn't developed as much as Rena's problem, even though Meakashi hen was 6 episodes. It just seemed really... awkward Shion sees Satoshi, he pets her on the head and disappears, then Shion believes everyone tried to seperate them, and goes off on her killing spree. And he said, what, 2 lines to her in total and he even confused her with Mion the whole time until the end.

It's like, um, you met this guy for 2 secs and you barely talked to him. Then you suddenly start killing everyone because you think your family killed him?

And besides, we're already told that Rena had psychological problems since Onikakushi hen. Shion's was just, wham, I'm gonna kill you now because you killed someone I fell in love with after saying 2 lines to him.

I'm sure it was more developed in the actual game, but based on what happened and how her situation was rather rushed in the anime, that's what I feel towards her.

[MrZombie]

I have to agree. My friend and I simply did not get Shion's motivation at all. Her she is, here she meets Satoshi, here he says a few lines to here, here he disappears and finally she snaps and kills everyone because of it.

I simply can't see her reasoning for this and don't give me the "she's insane" excuse. Once she kills Sakoto she shows that she didn't do it for Satoshi.

[Keiichi no Hibi]

Originally Posted by MarthX

She already planned to kill Rika before she did anything.

Did she? From what I got out of it, she told Rika about Keiichi and like, expected Rika to off Keiichi or something crazy like that. I dunno I'll have to rewatch it.

If we're talking the actual scene where she killed Rika, though, from what I got, Rika showed up out of nowhere as far as Shion was concerned, and it did seem like Shion really was just going to get Rika the soy sauce before Rika instigated the fight.

Looking at that, even if she planned to kill Rika later on, in that instance it started out as self denfense on Shion's part.

Originally Posted by BakaOnna

It's like, um, you met this guy for 2 secs and you barely talked to him. Then you suddenly start killing everyone because you think your family killed him?

Well it WAS more than two seconds. Sure she got a crush on him right when they met, but then she called him, she helped him out with the bear, and yeah. Not much more though I suppose

Spoiler for Keiichi and Shion comparison type thingamajig?:

And while we're on the topic of comparison, since that seems to be a "to do" thing, why not compare her to Keiichi in his two "lol killer loli" chapters? (I am aware this might be pointless but I'll go ahead and do it anyway ) It's obvious Shion was being affected by something and painfully obvious Keiichi was, and he beat Rena and Mion to death. Did Rena and Mion do anything wrong? No, but that didn't stop Keiichi, because he believed they did/were going to. Yes, Keiichi thought they were trying to kill him whereas Shion wanted her warped revenge, but I think there's a point in there... somewhere. Maybe.

And then there's in the other arc. True, Keiichi was a lot closer to Satoko than Shion was to Satoshi, and yes Teppei deserved it whereas most of Shion's victims didn't, but it's still murder no matter how you look at it.

And uh, since this is probably one of the worse Shion-defenses (why she needs a defense when practically EVERYONE turns into a psycho killer at some point, I do not know) out there, I'll stop now

But anyway, yeah Rena had psycological problems before with her "I was cursed by Oyashiro-sama" bit and her parent's divorce. What about Shion? From what I can see, the majority of her family hates/really dislikes her, she got shipped off to a place she obvious hated being in, got seperated from his sister and they were obviously close before she got shipped off to that school, if their conversation when reunitied on the phone was any hint; and well, all of that stuff.

Under a spoiler for length

Spoiler:

Now, ignoring this, let's assume both Rena and Shion were affected by whatever it was (and HEY here's a theory. Maybe whatever makes everyone go nuts is on the books Takano gives out to people).

-Shion then finds out her family and some other people knocked off someone she cares about (let's not argue whethor or not she should be allowed to like someone after only a short meeting, that won't change the fact she likes him a hell of a lot even when she's not being affected by whatever)

-Rena finds out that there are alien invader parasites being produced by the Sonozakis.

-Shion then proceeds to kill/torture everyone she believes is guilty of Satoshi's disappearance/suffering/suffering that lead to his disappearance and slowly gets more and more mad as she goes along.

-Rena holds a school hostage full of innocent people who she is only using to get what she wants, which is the investiagtion of the so called Sonozaki Conspiracy.

Yes, Rena had a "just cause" behind her but she STILL planned on killing everyone in the school if Keiichi and the rest had not intervened. Shion didn't kill anyone who was innocent, as far as her mind could see.

And whether or not you can't see the motives for Shion's actions is sort of irrelevant as SHION was the one doing them, so it'd probably be better to look from her perspective and all that junk.

So... yeah. There's my two cents

[MrZombie]

It's not so much that she's not allowed to have a crush on someone she just met. She goes from having a crush on him to full on obsession in 2.5 seconds.

Once again her logic falls apart. She likes Satsoshi and when she hears that it's because of his sister that he's falling apart, she decides it's a good idea to beat the hell out of his sister to teach her a lesson. I wonder why I can't believe this was a good idea?

[Chibi_Faerie]

Originally Posted by Keiichi no Hibi

Spoiler for Keiichi and Shion comparison type thingamajig?:

And while we're on the topic of comparison, since that seems to be a "to do" thing, why not compare her to Keiichi in his two "lol killer loli" chapters? (I am aware this might be pointless but I'll go ahead and do it anyway ) It's obvious Shion was being affected by something and painfully obvious Keiichi was, and he beat Rena and Mion to death. Did Rena and Mion do anything wrong? No, but that didn't stop Keiichi, because he believed they did/were going to. Yes, Keiichi thought they were trying to kill him whereas Shion wanted her warped revenge, but I think there's a point in there... somewhere. Maybe.

And then there's in the other arc. True, Keiichi was a lot closer to Satoko than Shion was to Satoshi, and yes Teppei deserved it whereas most of Shion's victims didn't, but it's still murder no matter how you look at it.

And uh, since this is probably one of the worse Shion-defenses (why she needs a defense when practically EVERYONE turns into a psycho killer at some point, I do not know) out there, I'll stop now

I've been thinking on one part of something you mentioned in there that made me wonder.

Spoiler:

in refference to everyone turning into a psycho killer, Mion has never lost it and killed anyone remember, in none of the arcs infact she seems like the most stable one of the bunch. Unless she has really taken part in murders and such for the Sonozaki family as the heir (which are possible but can't remember if it was ever mentioned. Rewatching the series to figure this and stuff out), but it's never been said as far as I know. Since we know it was Shion in Wantanagashi there are times when Mion has seemed a little off to Keiichi and Shion when they were losing it but It was more than likely paranoia I think from what we've seen so far. So unless suddenly a secret is revealed and Mion is like the missing murderer from the dismemberment case she doesn't seem to have gone psycho and killed anyone O.o though we know thanks to her family she has had to do things like what happened with Shion's nails. But even then she decided to share the same fate as her twin.

Thinking of it like that sorta bumps Mion up on my list a little.

And yeah I know that lacked major grammer and spelling but I'm too miffed and lazy to bother with that sort of thing at the moment. Sue me :P I'll pay you in chocolate chip cookies *nods*