Rasengan: Most useful Jutsu?

[hokagenaruto3]

That's not what I'm saying.
I know you have no controll over chakra that isn't linked to your body.
But what I mean is:
1.He makes the rasengan
2. He let's it explode without touching anything with it (at will).
3. The tornado bursts forward destroying a lot in it's path. That's what I think is possible.

You letterally have controll over the bomb/tornado in your palm. He could choose to maintain the strong rotation and keep it compact, or release it.
one for melee, the other for long(er) range.

[Dauthi]

Originally Posted by hokagenaruto3

That's not what I'm saying.
I know you have no controll over chakra that isn't linked to your body.
But what I mean is:
1.He makes the rasengan
2. He let's it explode without touching anything with it (at will).
3. The tornado bursts forward destroying a lot in it's path. That's what I think is possible.

You letterally have controll over the bomb/tornado in your palm. He could choose to maintain the strong rotation and keep it compact, or release it.
one for melee, the other for long(er) range.

Thats what i was saying. Its hard to say how accurate it would be, seing as how its like a cyclone, and moving in a lot of different directions. Also like others said its hard to say how far it would go. And like i said it takes too long and too much chakra to do minimal damage, if it does hit.

For example Temari can do basically the same thing, except with a lot less chakra, and a LOT less time.

[sheen]

Originally Posted by Dauthi

Well while it is useful, its only use really is to evade an attack. Based on versatility, ild say Kage Bushin is better, as Naruto has shown us countless times. Even the third manipulated it to seal 3 people instead of 1.

True that it is only a defensive technique. But at the same time, Kage Bushin can be countered if the opponent creates the same amount of Bushin. Example being Kakashi and Zabuza and also Naruto and Ebisu. In some cases, Kage Bushin will only serve to waste Chakra if you don't get near enough to the enemy to do damage; but Kawarimi will serve its purpose if you have the time to execute it before an attack hits you.

But anyways, like it was said in another thread: any technique that is able to do more damage to the enemy than it does the user, is a good technique.

Originally Posted by hokagenaruto3

That's not what I'm saying.
I know you have no controll over chakra that isn't linked to your body.
But what I mean is:
1.He makes the rasengan
2. He let's it explode without touching anything with it (at will).
3. The tornado bursts forward destroying a lot in it's path. That's what I think is possible.

You letterally have controll over the bomb/tornado in your palm. He could choose to maintain the strong rotation and keep it compact, or release it.
one for melee, the other for long(er) range.

1. He makes the Rasengan
2. He let's it expode without touching anything with it (at will).
3. The tornado bursts in all directions, not necessary forward.

What I envision, once the Rasenga is released (the moment he loses control of it), is that: the chakra that is being compressed will unravel in all different directions before it can be thrown to a safe distance away from user.

The stronger that it is rotating and the more compact that it is, the more that it will repel once you lose control of it. Like a sphere of outward springs.

[Dauthi]

Originally Posted by sheen

True that it is only a defensive technique. But at the same time, Kage Bushin can be countered if the opponent creates the same amount of Bushin. Example being Kakashi and Zabuza and also Naruto and Ebisu. In some cases, Kage Bushin will only serve to waste Chakra if you don't get near enough to the enemy to do damage; but Kawarimi will serve its purpose if you have the time to execute it before an attack hits you.

But anyways, like it was said in another thread: any technique that is able to do more damage to the enemy than it does the user, is a good technique.

No my point is its more versatile. You realize without kage bushin Naruto wouldnt have been able to even use Rasengan? Or that he would have died in the stomach of that snake. Think of all the time Naruto used it not as brute force, but with other uses/tactics, it couldnt have been countered with just more bushins from the opponent.Without it the 3rd couldnt have defeated Oro. It has more uses than just muliplying and attacking, by far. Compared to Kawirimi, which while useful, has only one purpose and use.

[Gaara_]

I think Rasengan is a crappy Jutsu, along with Chidori. Sure they are both very powerful and destructive Jutsu's, but that's where their usefulness ends. A jutsu like Kage Bunshin or a well done Genjutsu is way way way more useful, there's a hell of alot more to bieng a ninja than just fighting. And go Kawarimi, that is one hell of a useful Jutsu.

[Azrael]

Fighting > All. Otherwise Orochimaru wouldnt be such a threat to the Konoha.

[sheen]

Originally Posted by Dauthi

No my point is its more versatile. You realize without kage bushin Naruto wouldnt have been able to even use Rasengan? Or that he would have died in the stomach of that snake. Think of all the time Naruto used it not as brute force, but with other uses/tactics, it couldnt have been countered with just more bushins from the opponent.Without it the 3rd couldnt have defeated Oro. It has more uses than just muliplying and attacking, by far. Compared to Kawirimi, which while useful, has only one purpose and use.

Is it? How many people can use the Rasengan? And those who can does not need Kage Bushin. Naruto could have used Kawirimi in place of himself and he wouldn't have been eaten by the snake in the first place. You can come up with something creative with any jutsu. Kakashi had use the replacement technique against Naruto and Kage Bushin was used against him; Sakura had use Kawirimi to fool the opponent in the forest of death. My point being, how versatile the jutsu is based not on the jutsu, but the on user.

[hunterx]

seriously.. you watched 95 episodes of naruto and you came to the conclusion that the rasengan is the most useful jutsu?

[Dauthi]

Originally Posted by sheen

Is it? How many people can use the Rasengan? And those who can does not need Kage Bushin. Naruto could have used Kawirimi in place of himself and he wouldn't have been eaten by the snake in the first place. You can come up with something creative with any jutsu. Kakashi had use the replacement technique against Naruto and Kage Bushin was used against him; Sakura had use Kawirimi to fool the opponent in the forest of death. My point being, how versatile the jutsu is based not on the jutsu, but the on user.

Not really, because every case youve used is the same thing, he replaced himself to avoid an attack.

1. Naruto uses it to trick Kiba, by combining it with another jutsu to make it look like his dog. Same with the forest of death, he combines it fooling his attackers. He does the same when he turns into one of those giant shurikens to defeat Zabuza.

2. He uses it to deplete his chakra when Jiraiya wants him use it up to summon.

3. He uses it to be able to actually use Rasengan, an ultra high class ability, without kage bushin he couldnt use this ability for a good while.

4.

Spoiler:

He uses a Kage bushin to propel him towards Sasuke

5. The third uses it to seal 3 souls instead of one before he dies.

6. Naruto frees himself from a snakes stomach by multiplying.

7. He uses it combined with Lees attack, to make Naruto Rendan.

The list pretty much goes on, its very versitile. Heres your list.

1. He switches himself to avoid an attack.

2. Uhh he switches himself to avoid an attack..

etc.

Kawarimi relies a lot on speed, or surprise, while Kage Bushin is just a technique that can be used, and only needs time to perform the seals. Its hardly versitile, however im not saying it is a good technique. Personally if i were to pick a technique ild want one thats offensive as well as defensive, like Kage Bushin.

[Azrael]

Originally Posted by hunterx

seriously.. you watched 95 episodes of naruto and you came to the conclusion that the rasengan is the most useful jutsu?

Hmmm.. lemme see, if its a technique that took a hokage years to master and the only other person who knows how to do it is a Sannin... then yes.

[sheen]

Originally Posted by Dauthi

Not really, because every case youve used is the same thing, he replaced himself to avoid an attack.

1. Naruto uses it to trick Kiba, by combining it with another jutsu to make it look like his dog. Same with the forest of death, he combines it fooling his attackers. He does the same when he turns into one of those giant shurikens to defeat Zabuza.

2. He uses it to deplete his chakra when Jiraiya wants him use it up to summon.

3. He uses it to be able to actually use Rasengan, an ultra high class ability, without kage bushin he couldnt use this ability for a good while.

4.

Spoiler:

He uses a Kage bushin to propel him towards Sasuke

5. The third uses it to seal 3 souls instead of one before he dies.

6. Naruto frees himself from a snakes stomach by multiplying.

7. He uses it combined with Lees attack, to make Naruto Rendan.

The list pretty much goes on, its very versitile. Heres your list.

1. He switches himself to avoid an attack.

2. Uhh he switches himself to avoid an attack..

etc.

Kawarimi relies a lot on speed, or surprise, while Kage Bushin is just a technique that can be used, and only needs time to perform the seals. Its hardly versitile, however im not saying it is a good technique. Personally if i were to pick a technique ild want one thats offensive as well as defensive, like Kage Bushin.

All the example in which you have listed has nothing to do with the techique, it's the user.

1. It was used in combination with Henge. Those victories cannot be won with Kage Bushin alone.
2. There are also other jutsu to deplete one's Chakra. Sasuke can pull out two Chidori and bam, chakra's gone; it's also more time efficient, no?
3. Given another user, Kage Bushin would not be necessary.
6. Again, using Kawarimi, he would not be in the stomach to begin with.
7. Sasuke did it without Kage Bushin.

4./5. Given, I couldn't think of anything but a battle can presents all sorts of possibilties.

There are cases in which Kage Bushin was useless. Kakashi and Jiraiya has each presented an occassion where it is.

A technique is just a techinque. I was never arguing that Kawarimi was more useful than Kage Bushin. Versatility still depends on the user, but of course, Kage Bushin provides all the advantages of having extra bodies. But so does every other technique and the advantages will be different.

Naruto is a special case. Before the Rasengan, Kage Bushin was his signature move. Give him something other than Kage Bushin in the series and I'm sure he would have made use of it like he did with Kage Bushin. He also has an boundless supply of Chakra and crazy stamina. Would any other ninja be able to constantly call up so many Bushin in a battle? It can even be argued that it's wasteful for another user.

For example, I would say summoning is pretty versatile.
1./4./7. Pull out Gamabunta and the fight is over with the genins.
2. Depletes Naruto's chakra quite well.
5. Sandaime's summon did help, did he not? Kakashi's dog sealed his victory with Zabuza.
6. Giant piping frog in the stomach, anyone?

[kakash1]

i hate the rasengan. it sounded so cool. i hate it. they ruined it. it doesnt look very devastating.. wow jiraiya drilled half a tree with it amazing.. tsunade can do that with a punch.. w/e i doubt jira was using his full strength or even 1/10000000000th of his strength to show naruto. i still hate the rasengan

[gvozden]

For those who don't appretiate rasengan, please get some of the powerballs (to match color neon blue). If you can get over 12k rpm than you can complain how week rasengan is.

[Dauthi]

Originally Posted by sheen

All the example in which you have listed has nothing to do with the techique, it's the user.

1. It was used in combination with Henge. Those victories cannot be won with Kage Bushin alone.
2. There are also other jutsu to deplete one's Chakra. Sasuke can pull out two Chidori and bam, chakra's gone; it's also more time efficient, no?
3. Given another user, Kage Bushin would not be necessary.
6. Again, using Kawarimi, he would not be in the stomach to begin with.
7. Sasuke did it without Kage Bushin.

4./5. Given, I couldn't think of anything but a battle can presents all sorts of possibilties.

There are cases in which Kage Bushin was useless. Kakashi and Jiraiya has each presented an occassion where it is.

A technique is just a techinque. I was never arguing that Kawarimi was more useful than Kage Bushin. Versatility still depends on the user, but of course, Kage Bushin provides all the advantages of having extra bodies. But so does every other technique and the advantages will be different.

Naruto is a special case. Before the Rasengan, Kage Bushin was his signature move. Give him something other than Kage Bushin in the series and I'm sure he would have made use of it like he did with Kage Bushin. He also has an boundless supply of Chakra and crazy stamina. Would any other ninja be able to constantly call up so many Bushin in a battle? It can even be argued that it's wasteful for another user.

For example, I would say summoning is pretty versatile.
1./4./7. Pull out Gamabunta and the fight is over with the genins.
2. Depletes Naruto's chakra quite well.
5. Sandaime's summon did help, did he not? Kakashi's dog sealed his victory with Zabuza.
6. Giant piping frog in the stomach, anyone?

Dude Kawarimi cant even be coupled with techniques, it only has one use, to evade, we have never seen it used for anything else but this, or even coupled with any other technique.

Kage Bushin IS more versatile, while a stupid person couldnt take advantage of the versatility, a smart person has 0 versatility with Kawarimi....

Yes its great to avoid the attack, im not arguing that, but it by no means means its versatile in any way. Versatile means its used for multiple purposes, as Kage Bushin is in all those examples i give, and plenty more for any occasion.

Versatility doesnt mean its strong, it means it has more uses. Some moves are only meant to do one thing. Kage Bushin isnt made to do one thing, its made to assist other abilities.

[sheen]

Originally Posted by Dauthi

Dude Kawarimi cant even be coupled with techniques, it only has one use, to evade, we have never seen it used for anything else but this, or even coupled with any other technique.

Kage Bushin IS more versatile, while a stupid person couldnt take advantage of the versatility, a smart person has 0 versatility with Kawarimi....

Yes its great to avoid the attack, im not arguing that, but it by no means means its versatile in any way. Versatile means its used for multiple purposes, as Kage Bushin is in all those examples i give, and plenty more for any occasion.

Versatility doesnt mean its strong, it means it has more uses. Some moves are only meant to do one thing. Kage Bushin isnt made to do one thing, its made to assist other abilities.

First of all, from the very first post, I was talking about its usefulness, not its versatility. Second of all, where did you pick up the fact that I was saying Kawarimi was more versatile than Kage Bushin?

You're not understanding what I'm trying to say. The versatility of Kage Bushin all sprout from the main concept of the jutsu: to create an extra body. All the possibilities of its uses come from that extra being. The same main concept of Kawarimi of replacing oneself with something or even someone else. Possibilities come from the replacement. Of course Kage Bushin have more uses if it were up to the replicate since the product of Kawarimi is often inanimate. But that doesn't change the purpose (ie: the use) of the very jutsu itself, which to create an extra body, nothing more. The aftermath depends on the user.

[Stone_Cult]

Most useful Jitsu by far has to be "Harem no Jitsu"... even the 3rd Hokage admitted it probably would have worked even on him. I don't think Naruto would ever have a chance of landing Rasengan on him

[hokagenaruto3]

I already said that the title of my thread was shit.
I know rasengan isn't the most usefull jutsu, but I wanted to discuss if it could be released into one direction, which it was against Kabuto.

If we sum it up, the conclusion is to do both.
First drill it inside your opponent's stomach and when it's halfway, you release it and the opponent is ripped to pieces while he's being blown backwards by the ball of chakra (which was shown in both the manga and anime).

My theory is that it can be released without hitting something with it.

P.S. Hunterx I read the manga and i countlessly admitted that the title of this thread is shit. please discuss on what my theory is.

[Ben]

Not really, he just hit him and that sent him backwards i suppose...

[UnCauzi]

Originally Posted by hokagenaruto3

I already said that the title of my thread was shit.
I know rasengan isn't the most usefull jutsu, but I wanted to discuss if it could be released into one direction, which it was against Kabuto.

If we sum it up, the conclusion is to do both.
First drill it inside your opponent's stomach and when it's halfway, you release it and the opponent is ripped to pieces while he's being blown backwards by the ball of chakra (which was shown in both the manga and anime).

My theory is that it can be released without hitting something with it.

P.S. Hunterx I read the manga and i countlessly admitted that the title of this thread is shit. please discuss on what my theory is.

From what I gathered from the manga, unless you continue to concentrate it the Rasengan explodes forward like a grenade with only one exit point. Concentrated it drills, but maintaining it's concentrated form gets more difficult once you HIT an object.

Eh that's my theory anyway.


Btw Kwarimi can be coupled with other techniques, if I remember correctly you can replace yourself with just about anything. Didn't Kakashi replace himself with Naruto at one point? This means you can replace yourself with explosive notes, poison bombs, Itachi (just kidding) or whatever you can think of.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by hokagenaruto3

Ohhm my Tanri...
I need someone like Hunter to approve/dismiss my theory...
Where is Hunter when you need him???

Sorry it may seem that I live here but i do have a social life

For your point, I mostly agree with Dauthi, I do think that you can use the Rasengan as a tornado of chakra before you would be at close contact to make an opponent fly away but the damage wouldn't be important, if you look at Kabuto when he took the hit, the only damaged part of his body was the part where the Rasengan precisely touched.

I think it would be a too huge cost of chakra for a too little result even if indeed with Naruto's crazy amount of chakra there could be a situation where it would be usefull.

For the point between Dauthi and Sheen, I think it's obvious that the Kage Bunshin is way more usefull than the Kawarami, the Kage Bunshin doesn't only create a clone of a body which is already extremely usefull, especially when you see that a ninja like the 3rd could keep the clones 'alive' even after they were stabbed several times.
It can create object, the 3rd created a crazy amount of shuriken with it.

Ninjas aren't always fighter, the possiblities are endless.
It could create clone of money, of weapon, recreate a stolen document or a scroll maybe without even opening it, etc.