Claymore Chapter 118

[Superb]

Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri

And the above is exactly why I don't want Clare to intervene in this fight. Everyone seems to think all problems will be solved by Clare's return, which annoys me far more then even Raftela's survival.

If Clare comes back, then so does Priscilla. Unless that situation somehow magically resolves itself, things are effectively in a deadlock with that situation. Even if Clare does somehow come out of it without Priscilla being a thread, she has to cross half the continent to come save everyone.

I love Clare, and do want her to appear again, but I just don't think her reappearance would be good for the story at this point. I find the story quite interesting with or without Clare.

I'd also like to note someone gave me negative rep me when I made a similar comment last thread. :P

Well I def won't give you negative rep

I respect your opinion, and I see exactly where you are coming from. Clare coming back WOULD make things hectic, because like you said Priscilla will be back too (most likely). I am so split right now, I want Clare back, but I don't want things to be rushed and make the story poor.

I really hope that something will happen that will continue the story on the mainland, at least for a bit. Because it needs to be seen now that it has been talked about, AND it means more Claymore

[claremore]

Originally Posted by Nixl

Worse than cat hands Dauf?

Anyway, explain what bothers you.

i hadnt gotten to read many other comments so sorry if i mention some stuff already mentioned. but every chapter there seems to be some rediculous explanations for what yoki can do. cassy should have attacked roxanne, since she now has her memories. and if not then she should have killed audrey because raftella really shouldnt have been there to help. why is she alive? did the organization people already forget about miria????

[Awakened]

Raftella survival can easily be explained. Yagi just failed to explain it.

We know that Scar-Face like to collect dead bodies. It could be that the ninjas were transporting her to his lab wile she was playing dead. Cutting off her head would have disfigured a perfectly fine specimen.

[Nixl]

Originally Posted by claremore

i hadnt gotten to read many other comments so sorry if i mention some stuff already mentioned. but every chapter there seems to be some rediculous explanations for what yoki can do. cassy should have attacked roxanne, since she now has her memories. and if not then she should have killed audrey because raftella really shouldnt have been there to help. why is she alive? did the organization people already forget about miria????

While I can understand some of your points I do disagree about Cassy. (1) Cassandra is brainwashed to some degree into eliminating the rebellion and (2) Cassandra was being attacked by Audrey and Rachel from the start. Right now she is finishing what she started, but I would not rule out Cassandra and Roxanne fighting just yet.

I do not think Raftela's near-death is similar to Miria's and I think that is in part due to Yagi moving the scenes too quickly for us to know what happened fully. We know she fell over, but that is just it. Raftela fell over after taking a few wounds. Remember back to the Witche's Maw arc where Claire finds that claymore from Jean's party completely mauled. Claymores can take a lot of damage, that we know, but what we are missing from Raftela's near-death is whether she got back up and ran or they ignored her body completely. We simply will not know and I'll agree that the events were a little choppy.
Then again, I think I would be more angered by Audrey and Rachel being able to defend against Cassandra any longer without some type of aid. Besides the remaining ghosts, Raftela is the only thing that could slow one of the resurrected 1s.

Consider in this chapter, rather than the heroines face up to the villain's challenge like in other shounen with determination they are getting their asses kicked. Audrey, Rachel and the others are decapitated and Raftela is the only thing keep them alive for the moment. Miria is not beating Hysteria with determination or technique, but rather just going berserk and awakening. The twins are...well just screwed. This chapter was not the main character's rising to the occasion and facing adversity as I thought they would. They are just losing, plain and simple.

[claremore]

Originally Posted by Awakened

Raftella survival can easily be explained. Yagi just failed to explain it.

We know that Scar-Face like to collect dead bodies. It could be that the ninjas were transporting her to his lab wile she was playing dead. Cutting off her head would have disfigured a perfectly fine specimen.

that's a reasonable explanation, but the chapter gave me the impression that they were being lazy or forgot that claymores have yoki.
will give it another read through and try to make the best of this. usually after reading some opinions then rereading the chap helps

[Nixl]

Originally Posted by claremore

that's a reasonable explanation, but the chapter gave me the impression that they were being lazy or forgot that claymores have yoki.

True, but consider the "who" part. Not all the Mibs are scientists. Some are just grunts. Not to say if makes perfect sense, but it looks like a lot of Mibs are kept in the dark.

[Fenrir_valindri]

I got the impression they were dragging her somewhere to finish disposing of her and Raki caught sight of it and saved her.

[rafael1932]

Originally Posted by Double_friedman

I love the story and I don't think Yagi is a bad writer. However, I have the impression he's been committing many mistakes lately. I understand the reason Raftela is helping everyone, I just don't see how she was able to survive after being killed in front of the scientist, who, btw, are supposed to be smart. That's pretty lame.

Miria and Hysteria's fight is definitely interesting. But also illogical (and we logic operates different in manga, but you know what I mean) and resembles to any cheap-made anime in which the main character gets a huge power-up just because she/he's determined. In Claymore, usually power-ups were explained beforehand (half-awakening, teresa's flesh, huge potential which was said BEFORE the actual battle, copying techniques), and now with this fight, (I'm exaggerating it) seems like Miria could have even beaten Rigaldo, give me a break! Her life was in danger, if it weren't for Claire, she would be dead, and now she's implying she might have done MUCH better to the point that she might have won, she's very egocentric! She's misdjudging again, like when she did with the org, with the twins, with Claire. Yagi is very consistent in that.

1 thing I don’t agree with you.

Miria have always thought that clare was much more stronger than her. This is actually the 1 thing she says when she is alone with her, like she should be the one leading.

By the way you can’t actually believe that the old miria would do something like going to the org alone like a retard when she is known for everyone as the best leader ever ( or that she fights better than the number 1 while in group). She is a leader during the 7 years, at pieta and in the spider ab

If she is a leader why she goes alone to the org ? see it is ridiculous. is like having 2 mirias. The rest I do agree, pretty cliché.

[Friday]

That was a quick release!!! was expecting Sunday at the most....

oh well,
Audrey almost snuff it , thanks to Raftela barely breathing but the juniors will heal her.
at least Miria manged to hit Hysteria once before she went the REAL awaken on her.

overall 8/10

[Kinematics]

Have completely avoided the 118 thread til I could read the chapter; and wow, almost 20 pages of nothing.. ah well, on to the show..

Initial impressions:

Raftela, alive. "We should have checked to make sure she was really dead!" Really??? \o.o/

Major idiot ball case, there. Saved Audrey, but felt lame.

She also seems to be using something more like Galatea's technique, rather than the technique she used on Miria. Hm.


Cassandra's technique: pretty much exactly like I would expect after last chapter. Destroying the opponent's mobility is a tactic that is so often ignored (especially in shonen manga), but it can be devastating if used properly. Somewhat disappointed that Audrey didn't die (Helen and Deneve were far more deserving of their own survival than Audrey was in that particular position), but that ties to Raftela. And things would have rapidly headed down grim-dark territory if not for that, so I can handwave it away for now, though I'll probably gripe about it later when I have more time to think.


Miria - kinda cool. Makes it clear that in 'normal' mode, she's still not at the level of the top #1s. Very sound reasoning for not wanting to use it before. This is much closer to the original Miria, who gives far greater weight to the risks involved in anything she does, rather than the bullheaded mulishness of Clare who's willing to risk anything, any time, or her own recklessness in attacking the organization solo. Also harkens back to the hesitancy and fear that Miria always exhibited when in clutch situations. Feels good to have the 'real' Miria back.


With some of the comments made, though, I'm wondering if people are reading the same chapter I am? Particularly in regards to Miria's precision in using the new awakened Phantom. My impression is that she loses precision in exchange for raw, unadultarated speed. Why are some people saying she somehow copied the Elegant Phantom? I didn't see that at all.

[Anima]

IMO, Miria has outlived her span in Claymore and Yagi is most likely going to kill her. She led the ghosts. Guided them. Went to destroy the org. Fulfilled her rule (so far?) The situation is very dire. Are we going to see a Piata 2 with Miria this time? I don't think so.

Why is Miria doomed? Well, she barely can keep up with the power-up (so to speak) and her opponent is not even taking her seriously (yet). Is Miria's potential very high so awakening would give her an advantage? Nothing indicates that.

Plus, we have 2 other #1 who are healthy and probably can be triggered to awaken since they are an "experiment". Not to mention the crazy copy cat Roxanne who has numerous signature moves of other warriors.

How is Yagi gonna fix the situation (not necessarily having the good guys win, mind you)?

Yagi, please, we need an event that reminds us how crazy and full of surprises Claymore can be.

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by Claymore!

(...) All Miria did was use her Phantom and Charged directly at Hysteria. Miria was probably just swinging her sword randomly too.

Her strikes don't look random to me. She did the same thing as Hysteria and by that I mean the result was the same. How can you call it random? It would be random if she would go back and forth 10 times, missed 5-9 times and finally hit Hysteria at some point. But we see she has 100% accuracy (at least for now). Why wasn't Hysteria hit earlier then? With their combined speeds (her and Miria's phantom move) she shouldn't have been able to dodge it either earlier if Miria rushed at her since their speeds were comparable. I'll answer that for you - because she had so much precision and Miria hadn't. So she could dodge Miria's swings or because Miria wasn't even trying to attack her and exchange a strike for a strike by swinging her sword in all directions. Which makes this move too convenient and strange no matter how you look at it. And I still can't believe how easily people bought the explanation "I didn't use this move when fighting Rigaldo because I didn't want to risk it", lol. As if she had more options than she has now... Some people agreed with me on this (*cough* haegar *cough*) and Yagi used one of the explanations I laughed at but now, seeing the chapter I see the same people "well, it's not that bad"... All they needed was a picture of Rigaldo, lol.

Originally Posted by carbontaxes

^finally someone who understood from the beginning that Mira is not garbage.

Who said she was garbage? I just have a problem with her precision. Yagi could have made her faster than Hysteria but struggling to hit her because of lack of precision but she has both precision and speed. The end results show it explicitly. Plus the fact she didn't use such move on Rigaldo makes it stupid. And the fact that she didn't use youki-version of her phantom on twins makes it also stupid since she was struggling with them. It was as if Miria knew that Raftela was there (even though we know it's not true). Yagi used to make very logical decisions and he didn't leave many plot holes (if anything he was ambiguous about some things) but lately he has been losing his touch and in Claymore standard/cheesy scenes appeared. At first the organization was shown as a group of cunning old men, knowing almost everything about what was going on on the island. And when we've learned they've managed to control it for 100 years it reaffirmed it. But now they're shown as retards who can't make even one competent and logical decision even 1 out of 10 times. That's not something I can easily accept.

@Solace
About why I think the Miria move was stupid I've explained several times already. About Raki, you're mistaken at least about me. I considered him as one of my favorite characters for the reasons as follow: http://forums.animesuki.com/showthre...20#post1087720
But when he grew up he became a typical shounen male hero saying the same cheesy lines which don't make sense. He stayed with monsters for 7 years and has really disturbing approach to Priscilla (if she snaps then "oh well"). And did one of the most retarded things I've seen in Claymore. Don't see how anyone might like him but there are different tastes I guess. To me such one-dimensional overpowered character (unless he's not human which I doubt and which is another blunder on Yagi's part) shouldn't be on screen at all. As a kid he was much more interesting and showed potential. But now when we finally see him he's saying the same things like "If you're gonna come, be aware that you're throwing away your life". OK, we get it and these ninja get it probably too since they've had their butts whipped by Raki once already (which is ridiculous if he's human but Claymore is standard shounen as it turns out and I have to deal with it). And yeah, I know these probably are not the same (although now in Claymore I don't know any more if I can expect logical things) ninjas but since he left them alive they must know what happened.

Originally Posted by Arlenis

I understand Miria's new phantom and how it can be pulled off. I just don't see how it can logically help her against her current adversary. BEcause Hysteria is not even at ten percent much less thirty or fifty.... So all she has to do no is use her yoki and out class Miria yet again. Does anyone else not get this? Sheesh.

QFT.

[Friday]

Originally Posted by Kinematics

She also seems to be using something more like Galatea's technique, rather than the technique she used on Miria. Hm.

hmmmm, a thought came to me.......
if Raftela can be healed by the younglings then she can use her technique on Cassandra and maybe she will remember who killed her.

Problem is can Raftela realise that Cassandra was a former No 1?

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by Kinematics

She also seems to be using something more like Galatea's technique, rather than the technique she used on Miria. Hm.

Not necessarily. We know she messes up senses so Cassandra might think she aims accurately when she doesn't. Heck, even with one eye closed you would have problems with precisely aiming with a pencil at a small point on paper even though with two eyes you would do it without problems. And Raftela's ability is much more annoying and advanced than covering one eye. BTW, that should mean that unless Rafaela and Neideene had really good youki sensing they would suck at fighting.

[Bikerider]

aww... isn't that nice of the trainees.. Poor injured #10 needs some healing and lots of love. The Trainees got so much love to give poor #10... So nice.

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by Falcor

It seems that many have forgotten how to suspend belief and just enjoy the story for all its glorious WTF moments.

Well, I've lost faith in Yagi when I gave him the benefit of the doubt with explaining why Miria was spared. His explanation was "we [Claymores] knew what we must do". And MiB's incompetence ruined it for me. I seriously doubt Yagi will use a different approach than Tite in Bleach, i.e. first an enemy has the advantage, then good guy has it (in Miria's case they're even although Miria can regenerate easily so...), then the bad guy has advantage again and lastly the good guy comes up with a superb technique or makes a brilliant move that finishes the fight. And I doubt she will awaken, that would put her in a bad light. After all she would be risking lives of Claymores she wanted to protect. Unless she would finally start to think with her brain not her heart (and then we go back to "why didn't she do it earlier").

Originally Posted by Tempest35

Quoted For Truth

What he said.

[Arlenis]

Gooral, I have a problem with her precision as well. But the jumping over the limit momentarily for a super phantom makes complete sense.
What does QTF mean?

[Tempest35]

Quoted For Truth

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri

Cassandra technique really is brutal, its quite methodic in first making sure the enemy can't move, then can't retaliate, before going in for the kill.

That principle is nothing new. As I've written here Clare liked to chop a hand before she made the final strike too. Zaki, one of the youma in the group she encountered (chapter 2), the "female" youma, voracious eater from Rabona (she cut his two hands even), Agatha... Maybe someone remembers other examples. Teresa also used this combo (and Priscilla too).

Originally Posted by Tempest35

Quoted For Truth

What he said.

[Arlenis]

and ...that means? *Lowers head in N00B shame*