Relationships In The MSLN Series [SERIOUS DISCUSSION ONLY]

[Tempy]

Ambiguity generates the largest fanbase and as you've said, boosts sales. Should 7arcs actually make some sort of official announcement that cements a pairing, they'll lose fans, and thus, money. Regardless of what people say of which pairing is the truest, cutest, most "right," or similar rubbish, it only comes down to opinion and bias.

That said, my only addition to this is that shipwars and pushing a pair will only serve to alienate others, myself included. I used to be like NanoFate (this will come as a shock to some), but certain events have actually caused me to distance myself significantly from anything remotely NF to the point where I avoid it.

Anti-conversion, hoo yeah.

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon

I haet playing according to anyone's plan except my own.

Hmm...


Did some research.

Turns out 7arcs' CEO is

Spoiler for this guy:

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

OK, let's forget the characters for a moment... Any chance of the seiyuus getting into a yuri relationship with each other?

Thank you for reminding me of Mai Nakahara and Ai Shimizu in Strawberry Panic EDs

[Skyfall]

Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon

Shall I call Celestial Being?

You rang ?
(Sorry, couldn't resist)

Though on a more serious note, there is no reason to call anyone - things have improved quite considerably ever since the catastrophe known as the Grand Shipping Wars. Which makes me a relatively happy carnivorous bunny. Now, if only i could convince some other subforums to follow in said footsteps ...

[Sheba]

You meant those like the Clannad and the Shuffle subforums?

[MeisterBabylon]

Nanoha forums was just lucky to have a core group of well... disillusioned war vets who then turned vigilante?

[Skane]

Originally Posted by Sheba

You meant those like the Clannad and the Shuffle subforums?

Shipping wars in CLANNAD? Only if you consider rainbows and sunshine to be the harbingers of the Apocalypse. Nah... he meant the Macross Frontier sub-forum, where it degenerated into juvenile monkey-pooping each other. Much worse then here in the past, where at least the opposing sides attempt to be civilised in their responses (even if to the point of delusion at times).

Cheers.

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Skane

Shipping wars in CLANNAD? Only if you consider rainbows and sunshine to be the harbingers of the Apocalypse. Nah... he meant the Macross Frontier sub-forum, where it degenerated into juvenile monkey-pooping each other. Much worse then here in the past, where at least the opposing sides attempt to be civilised in their responses (even if to the point of delusion at times).

Cheers.

Tell me about it . It's in every thread there; Romance, Character Discussion, Movie, etc.

[Keroko]

This was getting a bit too much about the actual romance, and a bit less about fanfiction, so I took this here.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

The best of both worlds?
I LOL'd
Nanoha is more manlier than Yuuno. He lacks of the characteristics for a male lead. If you want to pair them successfully with a male you will have better luck with someone with the characteristics of Chrono or Vice.
Also, love doesn't work that way. If they're already in love with each other they won't need more people to be happy.

And what characteristics are we talking about here?

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Nice one there Kero-chan, you always says that same thing as if he's doing something more than the rest of their friends besides of teaching her some magic at the library, when has been said that all of them are looking after Vivio and Nanoha since she's busy at work and Fate working away.

Remember that in Japan no one will be as skeptical as you about our happy family's relationship, and instead of putting it in doubt like you, they will wonder who's the papa. And the answer is: Fate is the daddy, but Nanoha is still the seme xD



I hope the writer takes Nana-chan and Yukarin's suggestions for the next season, that would be a WIN. They should be the directors xD

It never ceases to amaze me that you chid me for 'reading too much' in Nanoha's blatant statement in M3 that Fate is taking more distance in Nanoha and Vivio's relationship, and yet you draw a non-canonical interview far out of context.

Double standards much?

Originally Posted by BPHaru

People not liking NanoFate? There is no way that's possible xD

Possible and happening more and more.

[BPHaru]

Originally Posted by Keroko

It never ceases to amaze me that you chid me for 'reading too much' in Nanoha's blatant statement in M3 that Fate is taking more distance in Nanoha and Vivio's relationship

Good one there, kero-chan!
They're not working in the same place now, but they are together as much as possible and talk everyday by video transmission as we have said numerous times ^^

Originally Posted by Keroko

Possible and happening more and more.

Denial much?

Cuídense y sigan sonriendo

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Good one there, kero-chan!
They're not working in the same place now, but they are together as much as possible and talk everyday by video transmission as we have said numerous times ^^

'staying in contact' does not equal love. I stay in contact with a good old friend of mine who works on the other side of the country these days, does that mean I love her?

Also, Yuuno stayed in contact with Nanoha during their time apart post-A's. Your logic decrees they're madly in love. Which is it?

And yet, we have Nanoha actually saying that Fate has been taking distance in the raising of Vivio. So far you have been, and still are, denying information directly from one of the horses mouths.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Denial much?

Quote taken, and thrown right back at you. Have you not read the recent posts in the FF thread? There are people who are tired of it, and I recall quite a few people in FAQ asking whether or not this series was a Yuri series, as they wouldn't want to watch it if it was Yuri.

Dislike for NanoFate is there Haru, you just don't want to see it.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

I wasn't saying that. A male lead if someone with which the audience is supposed to be willing to identify themselves, you can take their standard physical and physiological characteristics from any harem show.

Of course, you do realize that Yuuno's personality does exist among harem leads, right?

Originally Posted by BPHaru

At least according to the fans, Nanoha and Fate are a couple. That's what we know so I think it's better to suppose that they are in love with each other, not with external character.

Fans =/= canon. According to your logic, Naruto and Code Geass are two major Yaoi shows.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Fate is only working away since she's a enforcer at the Navy, she's still Fate-mama (well, now she's more like Fata-papa xD). The 7 Arc's offices being still in one piece is a proof of it xD

I do hope that was sarcasm, as I would doubt the 7Arcs offices would get even so much as a scratch. In fact, considering there was no rageing after M3, I think many people wouldn't mind an alternate pairing.

[BPHaru]

Originally Posted by Keroko

'staying in contact' does not equal love. I stay in contact with a good old friend of mine who works on the other side of the country these days, does that mean I love her?

No, but is the other way: you keep in contact with your other half when you're away. Anyway this doesn't proof nothing, but I'm just stating a fact in their life as a couple.

Originally Posted by Keroko

I do hope that was sarcasm, as I would doubt the 7Arcs offices would get even so much as a scratch. In fact, considering there was no rageing after M3, I think many people wouldn't mind an alternate pairing.

Besides of you, I don't see anyone else attacking the people who deeply appreciate the love between Nanoha and Fate with something like that.
I think the people there won't doubt the great strength of Nanoha and Fate's relationship for something like that, they have been together since 10 years and now they share a bond stronger than what you can see in many other couples from romance anime.

Originally Posted by Keroko

And yet, we have Nanoha actually saying that Fate has been taking distance in the raising of Vivio. So far you have been, and still are, denying information directly from one of the horses mouths.

I'm not denying it, but you're interpreting it as "OMG our relationship is finished!! we're not a couple anymore!!!! I'm not fate-mama for our little vivio!!11!", while it isn't nothing more than the portraying of the average situation of a standard family where the dad works away of home. Which happens very often, specially in countries like Japan.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Quote taken, and thrown right back at you. Have you not read the recent posts in the FF thread? There are people who are tired of it, and I recall quite a few people in FAQ asking whether or not this series was a Yuri series, as they wouldn't want to watch it if it was Yuri.

Dislike for NanoFate is there Haru, you just don't want to see it.

Are you extrapolating a 30-ish people community to the whole sample? The people here "tired" of it, like you, are basically the same people who has always been tired of it and that didn't watch this series for its great yuri component, but for the action, lolis, or other factors. Everyday there are more and more NanoFate fans, I can tell it because I know them personally, and principally because we have the statistics of www.nanofate.net , and numbers don't lie.

Cuídense y sigan sonriendo

[thedeath93]

Stop the shipwar please!
Haru-san, I know you love nanofate and I'm too, a crazy nanofate fan, but we don't know what 7arc have in their mind so I always prepare so it wouldn't hurt too much if nanofate won't happen. I always search for proof of nanofate to ease my mind, but then I still have doubt so I will be waiting for somethings from 7arc even if I know my heart might be broken and I think you guys should wait too.
Ps: I mean no ofense so please don't throw anything at me!

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by BPHaru

The best of both worlds?
I LOL'd
Nanoha is more manlier than Yuuno. He lacks of the characteristics for a male lead. If you want to pair them successfully with a male you will have better luck with someone with the characteristics of Chrono or Vice.
Also, love doesn't work that way. If they're already in love with each other they won't need more people to be happy.

"Characteristics of a male lead" is a very, very general statement since there have been oh-so many different lead males throughout the history of anime and other media:

Kenshiro (Hokuto no Ken) - Determined, physically fit, big muscles, stoic, and can make people's head EXPLODE with his hands

Keitaro (Love Hina) - Below-average study, not physically fit (though durable), clumsy, and lacks charisma

Amuro (Mobile Suit Gundam) - Stubborn, technologically gifted, becomes excellent MS pilot ace, and is a NewType

Shinji (Evangelion) - Socially withdrawn, lacks backbone, physically unfit, and rarely stands up for himself

Edward (Fullmetal Alchemist) - Lacks physical stature, temper, gifted alchemist, determined in his goal, and sarcastic

And this list can go on and on about the variety of male leads.

Originally Posted by Keroko

It never ceases to amaze me that you chid me for 'reading too much' in Nanoha's blatant statement in M3 that Fate is taking more distance in Nanoha and Vivio's relationship, and yet you draw a non-canonical interview far out of context.

Double standards much?

I remember that being stated on one of those...

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Good one there, kero-chan!
They're not working in the same place now, but they are together as much as possible and talk everyday by video transmission as we have said numerous times ^^

And I log onto mIRC almost everyday to talk with people and I'm almost always on Ventrilo with my guild each night where we chat about day to day things. Am I in a relationship with each member of my guild and the communities I keep up with on mIRC? I think not.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Quote taken, and thrown right back at you. Have you not read the recent posts in the FF thread? There are people who are tired of it, and I recall quite a few people in FAQ asking whether or not this series was a Yuri series, as they wouldn't want to watch it if it was Yuri.

Dislike for NanoFate is there Haru, you just don't want to see it.

Humans are human and no two are alike. Tastes will vary from person to person and those differences need to be respected otherwise conflicts can arise. Being different is what makes us human. Without being different we wouldn't be where we are in our evolution.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Of course, you do realize that Yuuno's personality does exist among harem leads, right?

I think he's a stronger lead than Shinji and some harem leads

Originally Posted by BPHaru

No, but is the other way: you keep in contact with your other half when you're away. Anyway this doesn't proof nothing, but I'm just stating a fact in their life as a couple.

Keeping in contact is hot a sign of love, but just a sign of being human. Desiring contact with someone familiar when one is away to unfamiliar places is not uncommon. Children call their parents and friends when they head out of state for college at times because they are home sick and desire to connect with what they know and grew up with. Soliders write letters and (if able) IM family as well as friends when they are deployed to theaters of conflict to keep in touch. Keeping in touch with a familiar face isn't much of a sign of love.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Besides of you, I don't see anyone else attacking the people who deeply appreciate the love between Nanoha and Fate with something like that.

And yet you give negative remarks to those who do not support NanoFate or write non-Nanofate fics...

Originally Posted by BPHaru

I think the people there won't doubt the great strength of Nanoha and Fate's relationship for something like that, they have been together since 10 years and now they share a bond stronger than what you can see in many other couples from romance anime.

Key words there are 'I think.' Therefore this is just your opinion. Good friends are hard to come by. Just because you know someone for a long time does not mean anything other than you have close ties with them. Yes, long-ties can lead to relationships. The key word there is 'can.' It doesn't have to happen. People can stay just friends and still be happy.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

I'm not denying it, but you're interpreting it as "OMG our relationship is finished!! we're not a couple anymore!!!! I'm not fate-mama for our little vivio!!11!", while it isn't nothing more than the portraying of the average situation of a standard family where the dad works away of home. Which happens very often, specially in countries like Japan.

Not being a couple anymore implies that they were a couple in the first place. There really is no canonical evidence that they are, in fact, a couple or were a couple at any point other than really good friends with a deep trust in each other.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Are you extrapolating a 30-ish people community to the whole sample? The people here "tired" of it, like you, are basically the same people who has always been tired of it and that didn't watch this series for its great yuri component, but for the action, lolis, or other factors. Everyday there are more and more NanoFate fans, I can tell it because I know them personally, and principally because we have the statistics of www.nanofate.net , and numbers don't lie.

This is just comparing one site to another site. The amount of demographics that it covers is slim if at all. A fansite devoted to one particular pairing will of course get a lot of hits from those who like the pairing, but where is the other comparison data? Comparing a specific site to a very general site that covers everything like AS is not a good example. If you want to prove something of this nature you need to pull data from other fansites that support different pairings. And by other I mean at least a half-dozen or so to get a good collection of data. To say that this one POST about people who don't care for this pairing is null because this one WEBSITE has many hits is like comparing the population of a solar system to a galaxy.

[BPHaru]

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

Not being a couple anymore implies that they were a couple in the first place. There really is no canonical evidence that they are, in fact, a couple or were a couple at any point other than really good friends with a deep trust in each other.

Yeah, that's open, things may lead to think that they are living as an already married couple, and then we wonder about if they are in fact already married or if they will start the season 4 with an epic NanoFate wedding, because there is nothing denying either of the options, but then again, there is nothing to confirm it either even if the scenario it's mostly implying that.

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

This is just comparing one site to another site. The amount of demographics that it covers is slim if at all. A fansite devoted to one particular pairing will of course get a lot of hits from those who like the pairing, but where is the other comparison data? Comparing a specific site to a very general site that covers everything like AS is not a good example. If you want to prove something of this nature you need to pull data from other fansites that support different pairings. And by other I mean at least a half-dozen or so to get a good collection of data. To say that this one POST about people who don't care for this pairing is null because this one WEBSITE has many hits is like comparing the population of a solar system to a galaxy.

I'm sorry if I didn't explain myself very well, but I didn't want to make a contras about fans who care about yuri v/s Nanoha fans in general, I just mentioned our statistics with intention of giving the presence of evidence that the NanoFate community is still growing, and that in an average the people is not "getting tired" of it. Especially, the Spanish community is growing very fast.

Cuídense y sigan sonriendo

[Jimmy C]

Tell me Haru, is yours the only community that matters? Because, the way you say it really sounds like it is.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by BPHaru

No, but is the other way: you keep in contact with your other half when you're away. Anyway this doesn't proof nothing, but I'm just stating a fact in their life as a couple.

Wait, what? How does that make sense?

Seriously, why don't you take a step back and explain to me why 'keeping in contact' equals love?

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Besides of you, I don't see anyone else attacking the people who deeply appreciate the love between Nanoha and Fate with something like that.

Please, by all means show me where I have attacked the people who deeply appreciate the love between Nanoha and Fate. All I have been doing is debate the canonicity of an unconfirmed pairing, and no matter how you twist or turn that, that does not mean I attack the fans of said pairing.

You, on the other hand, have actively called people who wrote things that were not NanoFate 'cruel' and 'horrible' That, my dear Haru, is attacking.

Please don't try to pin your crimes on me.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

I think the people there won't doubt the great strength of Nanoha and Fate's relationship for something like that,

Nobody is. Whether or not that relationship is love is what is being questioned.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

they have been together since 10 years and now they share a bond stronger than what you can see in many other couples from romance anime.

And yet I can say the same for Nanoha and Yuuno.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

I'm not denying it, but you're interpreting it as "OMG our relationship is finished!! we're not a couple anymore!!!! I'm not fate-mama for our little vivio!!11!", while it isn't nothing more than the portraying of the average situation of a standard family where the dad works away of home. Which happens very often, specially in countries like Japan.

No, I interpret it as 'see? Their relationship was not that serious after all'

The reasoning behind that is two-fold: One is the description of Nanoha as the 'proper parent' this means that Fate is not a proper parent, at least not in the literal meaning of the word. Now we come to the second part: What did Fate call herself again?

That's right, a godmother.

Now, putting these two together, and we come with a very clear picture: Fate was not raising Vivio together with Nanoha as a happy couple, but Fate was helping Nanoha raise Vivio.

Your response to the M3 on the other hand, is to deny it ever happened. You can't do that Haru, something did happen. Nanoha agreed with the analysis that Fate is keeping more distance -on an emotional level- from Vivio, in order for Vivio to get used to the idea that Nanoha is her real mother.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

Are you extrapolating a 30-ish people community to the whole sample? The people here "tired" of it, like you, are basically the same people who has always been tired of it and that didn't watch this series for its great yuri component, but for the action, lolis, or other factors. Everyday there are more and more NanoFate fans, I can tell it because I know them personally, and principally because we have the statistics of www.nanofate.net , and numbers don't lie.

Ah, but your site doesn't count the people who don't like NanoFate, does it?

Regardless, this changes nothing. You said it was 'impossible' for people not to like NanoFate. I proved you wrong.

[BPHaru]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Seriously, why don't you take a step back and explain to me why 'keeping in contact' equals love?

I'm sorry if i didn't explain myself well, I only meant that it wasn't the way you implied: keeping in contact => love, but the other way: love => keeping in contact. But I also said that it doesn't proof nothing, because it's an implication, not an equality.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Please, by all means show me where I have attacked the people who deeply appreciate the love between Nanoha and Fate.

I'm sorry if that wasn't your intention.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Now, putting these two together, and we come with a very clear picture: Fate was not raising Vivio together with Nanoha as a happy couple, but Fate was helping Nanoha raise Vivio.

That's your opinion and you're free to think that because this is a open scenario and you have some arguments. Anyway I think most people thinks the other way, at least for what I see daily in the web, but it's not as it matters.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Your response to the M3 on the other hand, is to deny it ever happened. You can't do that Haru, something did happen. Nanoha agreed with the analysis that Fate is keeping more distance -on an emotional level- from Vivio, in order for Vivio to get used to the idea that Nanoha is her real mother.

The Vivio-Fate relationship was debated a few pages ago in this thread IIRC, and I recall you giving the same interpretation about this, but I'll stick with mine since nothing has changed since then in terms of official information.

Originally Posted by Keroko

You said it was 'impossible' for people not to like NanoFate. I proved you wrong.

Yes, if you take it in the literal sense, you're right. So, I'm sorry.

Take care and keep smiling

[Kyral]

Originally Posted by BPHaru

The Vivio-Fate relationship was debated a few pages ago in this thread IIRC, and I recall you giving the same interpretation about this, but I'll stick with mine since nothing has changed since then in terms of official information.

I'm confused now... wasn't M3 official information?

[BPHaru]

Originally Posted by Kyral

I'm confused now... wasn't M3 official information?

Yes, I think that conversation started just because of that.

Take care and keep smiling