Subtitled VS. The English dubbed debate

[Blaat]

Harry Potter is considered a children's movie.

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by Blaat

Also I'm curious to know why is it harder to read subtitles on television than on a computer screen?

That's not the issue; it's because most people do one or more other things while watching television. (Trust me on this; I've actually conducted research studies on this subject. Most of our survey respondents were doing at least one other thing while watching, and at least a quarter were engaged in what we called a "distracting" activity like reading or playing with their kids. When asked to rate their level of attention to the show they were watching, only 15-20% of respondents reported giving a show "all" their attention.)

Suppose you're trying to prepare dinner and watch a show at the same time. That's possible with dubbing, where you can listen to the spoken dialogue while you go to the kitchen to check the stove and still keep up with the story. I find it annoying while watching a subtitled anime to have to pause every time I have to leave the room. Oh, and most people reported leaving the room at least once during a show; many reported leaving multiple times.

[totoum]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

And I think one reason why some people prefer dubs is because the vast majority (if not all) of the visual entertainment they absorb does not have subtitles

That's if you're in an english speaking country!More and more french people over the last decade have been watching fansub versions of US TV shows.Though regular TV still generally offers the viewers dual audio.

As Blaat and hyl have mentioned it,I've been to the netherlands a few times and the amount of subbed material on TV was a big surprise to me,I appreciated it because even though I don't speak dutch I could still watch a few english speaking shows because of it.

[Westlo]

Originally Posted by Lord of Fire

IMO, the fact that a lot of people prefer dubs is a sign that they keep clinging to their childhood, back to a time where they weren't fully capable of reading (subtitles) yet and had to rely on their ears to understand what was going on. I think it's pure laziness and unwillingness to move past these childhood memories that they don't give subs the credits they deserve.

I haven't watch an anime dubbed since I saw Spirited Away in cinemas... but that's just a load of crap.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

And I think one reason why some people prefer dubs is because the vast majority (if not all) of the visual entertainment they absorb does not have subtitles, so they're just not used to subtitles.

This would make much more sense than that other thing I've quoted in this post, heck the only reason I was "okay" with watching fansubbed anime was because I was used to reading subtitles from watching Jackie Chan and Jet Li movies. Obviously not as dialogue intensive as most anime but it was something that got me used to it, helps that I'm also a fast reader, so it never felt like I was missing something while reading subs.

[Kirarakim]

The Baccano dub is an interesting one because that is a fan favorite, but that is one I personally prefer in Japanese.

My main issue with it is there are a lot of fake gangster accents, and as someone who watches and enjoys classic gangster films the accents don't sound authentic to me at all. Just a personal thing though.

Edit: Putting aside issues of visual impairment (which is a real issue for some people who prefer dubs). For most people who have issues with subs just need practice. I never feel like I am missing anything when reading subtitles. However for other people it's harder to read fast and watch what is going on at the same time. However once you get used to it it becomes easier.

And I also enjoyed foreign film before I became an anime fan so switching from dubs to subs was really no decision at all for me (I still always watch the dub as an alternative though)

[Vexx]

American audiences (in general) aren't "subtitle trained" like the rest of the world - that's a considerable issue (of course, they're also significantly mono-lingual ... another issue).

The issue with anime dubs to some extent comes down to:
1) I'm Disney, I can spend a gazillion dollars finding the best voice talent on the planet to export my Pixar films in dozens of languages.
2) I'm Razor's Edge of Bankruptcy R1 anime distributor. I have $20 to spend on my voice talent for English dubs.

You get what you budget for. Once in a while you do good, but mostly its painful to the ears.

OTOH... with the available fonts for DVD tech (sketchy/horrible), people who have certain visual problems (like my wife who is nearsighted in one eye and farsighted in the other) have a lot of difficulty with those subtitles. (She does much better with well-chosen fonts available through fansubbing tools).

So, it isn't really a black'n'white issue. In the last few years, I've encountered a few dubs that didn't make me cringe (either due to the writing or the voicing).

Seiji's research findings that people are doing other things while "watching tv" makes me scratch my head. Why are they watching the tv in the first place? That might work for entertainment that doesn't actually require attention (what are we saying there about American tv? ) but it just means they aren't *really* watching the story if they're otherwised engaged and the story has any depth (humans actually do not multi-task anywhere near the skill level they delude themselves as being able to).

Anecdotal example: my wife often knits while "watching tv"... but when she is, she has on something that requires little brain power. Its either just a talent show, something shes's already seen, or a half-listened-to documentary. Its not unusual to hear her say, "what just happened" (to which I reply "I don't know, I'm not watching it."). Drama shows (or complex comedy) she pays full attention to (not knitting).

So fans of anime "half-watch" anime while they're doing something else? I suppose that might explain some of the zany clueless postings that seem to indicate the person didn't actually *watch* the episode they're complaining about?

[Kirarakim]

Vexx I don't think it's fair to say its only American audiences who aren't subtitles trained, it really depends on the country and there are many countries that dub most of their foreign products.

In fact the US is not even at the forefront of this since most live action foreign films are subbed. Although the market for these products are a niche. I think art house theaters and Criterion don't do so badly.

This wiki article covers it pretty well

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subtitl..._and_lectoring
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subtitl..._as_a_practice
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubbing...r_own_language

Also animation is more commonly dubbed than live action across the board.

Kind of surprised they said Japan subs most things (maybe that is true) but from my research it seems they also dub a lot of stuff. A lot of seiyuu we are familiar with in anime also dub live action films and TV shows.

[Liddo-kun]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Seiji's research findings that people are doing other things while "watching tv" makes me scratch my head. Why are they watching the tv in the first place? That might work for entertainment that doesn't actually require attention (what are we saying there about American tv? ) but it just means they aren't *really* watching the story if they're otherwised engaged and the story has any depth (humans actually do not multi-task anywhere near the skill level they delude themselves as being able to).

Anecdotal example: my wife often knits while "watching tv"... but when she is, she has on something that requires little brain power. Its either just a talent show, something shes's already seen, or a half-listened-to documentary. Its not unusual to hear her say, "what just happened" (to which I reply "I don't know, I'm not watching it."). Drama shows (or complex comedy) she pays full attention to (not knitting).

So fans of anime "half-watch" anime while they're doing something else? I suppose that might explain some of the zany clueless postings that seem to indicate the person didn't actually *watch* the episode they're complaining about?

I've met such a person who probably also qualifies as an example. She's a woman in her 30's and pregnant. Her habit of leaving a dvd movie on and then do something else.. it's hard for me to describe it in words.. I stopped lending her any dvd after I discovered her "lifestyle". Because it feels insulting when we talk and she asks me things she "didn't understand" about the movie - by the gods , she didn't understand the movie because she watched it like a blind man almost 50% of the duration (audio only), because she's arranging things in a drawer away from the dvd. Multi tasking..

To others who also multitask. The kind of multi-tasking of the person I'm referring to might be different from the kind of multi tasking that you do. If this post offends you, then I apologize in advance.

[CrowKenobi]

I'm locking this thread since the "debate" has ended and off-topic, belittling insult throwing has taken over. If anyone can give a well reasoned statement to the staff why this thread should be reopened, we'll consider it.