Penguin Drum - General Discussion

[Slick_rick]

Originally Posted by Kagayaki

Well, lizards lay more eggs or something after they have sex. So these lizards still have sex for the hormonal stimulus, even though their eggs don't need to be fertilized.

I'm not quite sure what you were asking here, but does that answer your question?



Oh, well I was just skimming through the thread, and I saw your last post, and I remembered the example from a biology class. I just thought people in this discussion might think it was interesting. I'm not out to get you or anything, trust me

I agree that the example I gave probably doesn't change how we should interpret the themes of the show. I'm not even sure how you guys got onto this topic anyways, so I won't respond re:homosexuality or lizards in this thread to avoid being off topic.

When you say stuff like "that should kill the idea", which I don't think it does, there is definitely some implied hostility there towards my idea at the least. Even if I give you this which I assume they still bear eggs even when they don't have sex, it still not incorporated 99.999% for other creatures survival strategies. It's very interesting though thanks for sharing.

Like I said if we take the transformation scene to be some Freudian reproduction/evolutionary symbolism that somehow removes inhibitions and taboo like incest we'd also have to then realize that it would probably be against homosexuality for its own purposes.

I personally don't even believe that scene to be sexual but it I followed that logic its generally lead my mind to reach that conclusion which may or may not even come to pass or be relevant.

[ZODDGUTS]

I'm sure it's already been pointed out:

Spoiler for Images:

[Ziziphus]

Spoiler for Seizon senryaku~:

[risingstar3110]

So i have just started to watch Utena recently. And while the art/animation style is not really resemble so far. I really love the kind of random humour in Ikuhara works... (the penguins here, the running loose horse bull kangaroo there)

Will also expect Mawaru Penguin Drum to dedicate at least a whole episode for comedy sometime in the future

[Shiroth]

Originall Hoshino Lily designs from the starting guide book.

Spoiler:

I love Lily's art. <3

[Forsaken_Infinity]

I love it too :3

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by Slick_rick

When you say stuff like "that should kill the idea", which I don't think it does, there is definitely some implied hostility there towards my idea at the least. Even if I give you this which I assume they still bear eggs even when they don't have sex, it still not incorporated 99.999% for other creatures survival strategies. It's very interesting though thanks for sharing.

First, survival strategy is not only about reproduction. Anything animals do to unsure their species' survival is a survival strategy. For instance, migratory birds' migrations are a survival strategy.

And of course, forming homosexual couples to raise orphaned offspring is a survival strategy too. Anything, and everything that may increase their possibilities of survival.

Of course, if only two individuals (say, male and female) from a given species remain, then no doubt it won't matter whether they are closely related or homosexuals or whatever; their instincts will still have them mate in order to survive.

But I don't see how homosexuality might be relevant in the series' context, since we're talking about Himari and Kanba, and neither seem homosexual to me. The point here is that they're related.

[Arabesque]

I think then we need to figure out what is the survival strategy is meant to survive from, to decided whether or not this was about reproduction or otherwise. Birds migrate to survive from the cold, animals form couples for their orphans to insure the next generation lives on, mate with their siblings to not go extinct etc. but these actions are taken according to the situation present to them.

So, what is this survival strategy meant to do. What are they trying to survive from? Prolonging Himari's life? Saving the penguins?

Originally Posted by BluWacky

Spoiler:

The note about the sibling's relationship to Ringo on that chart is "promising lead on the Penguin Drum". It doesn't say she's looking for it, or that she's "in the lead" - it says that she IS a lead, she's a clue.

Ah I see, I misinterpreted that section of the chart then. My mistake.

[Suzuku]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

But I don't see how homosexuality might be relevant in the series' context, since we're talking about Himari and Kanba, and neither seem homosexual to me. The point here is that they're related.

Homosexuality is counterproductive to survival because same-sexes can't breed. So, homos in this series would basically be the antagonists working to thwart The Princess of Crystal's survival strategy. Sure is social commentary.

Originally Posted by Arabesque

I think then we need to figure out what is the survival strategy is meant to survive from, to decided whether or not this was about reproduction or otherwise. Birds migrate to survive from the cold, animals form couples for their orphans to insure the next generation lives on, mate with their siblings to not go extinct etc. but these actions are taken according to the situation present to them.

So, what is this survival strategy meant to do. What are they trying to survive from? Prolonging Himari's life? Saving the penguins?

A lot of people seem to think it has something do with sexual reproduction, due to the symbolim used in the transformation scene. Seems pretty plausible too, given the guy who is behind this is a complete lunatic.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Suzuku

Homosexuality is counterproductive to survival because same-sexes can't breed. So, homos in this series would basically be the antagonists working to thwart The Princess of Crystal's survival strategy. Sure is social commentary.

Hold on...
What made you think The Princess of Crystal is the HEROINE?

For you to think "homos" are antagonists means you think the Princess is the Protagonist. Yet we see plenty of signs that the Princess is far from friendly. She is downright repulsive.

Is there any reason you think Princess of Crystal is actually not the enemy? I mean, she is a parasitic hat!

The brothers might have made a deal with the princess to save their sister, but it was obviously not done because the princess want to be nice. She wants them to do something for her in return, and there is no reason why the task would be pleasant. I have long learned to be weary of cute girls in anime as potential future enemies/last bosses.

[Suzuku]

Okay, I never meant that the Princess was a protagonist, I just wanted to make it clear how homos could fit in the context of the story.

[Dist]

Originally Posted by Slick_rick

Director of Sailor Moon and Revolutionary Girl Utena...

Even so.. if the demographic of this series is not shoujo, why draw it like one? Well, I don't know what the demographic is but I could have liked it if the characters weren't like they are. Well I might still watch it but can't say I like what I see.

+ I'll never understand why shoujo must look like what it does. What do girls appreciate in girl looking males <.<

[ars89]

No idea what i just watched, but i loved it. The penguins are great. Quite a roller coaster of emotions. I got lost in the ending though. So when she initiated the survival strategy she took something out of one of her brothers. Also did Kanba kiss her at the end?

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Dist

Even so.. if the demographic of this series is not shoujo, why draw it like one? Well, I don't know what the demographic is but I could have liked it if the characters weren't like they are. Well I might still watch it but can't say I like what I see.

+ I'll never understand why shoujo must look like what it does. What do girls appreciate in girl looking males <.<

You might as well ask why anime characters look like anime characters.

Anyway, Western cultures excessively enhance masculine features for male characters. Japan doesn't much care for macho stuff. In fact, big muscular brutes is popularly associated with homosexual men in Japanese stereotypes. In other words, "only real men wear pink".

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by Suzuku

Homosexuality is counterproductive to survival because same-sexes can't breed.

But whose survival are we talking about? We don't even know that yet, so we can't really be sure whether homosexuality even plays a role here. Besides, if the Princess is revealed to be the actual antagonist, then the series ultimate message could quite possible be against survival strategy and not in favor of it.

Anyway, let's wait and see.

Originally Posted by Arabesque

So, what is this survival strategy meant to do. What are they trying to survive from? Prolonging Himari's life? Saving the penguins?

Exactly! This is the most important piece of info we need right now!!

[Suzuku]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

But whose survival are we talking about? We don't even know that yet, so we can't really be sure whether homosexuality even plays a role here.

Thus why it's called speculation.

[TJR]

Originally Posted by Dist

Even so.. if the demographic of this series is not shoujo, why draw it like one? Well, I don't know what the demographic is but I could have liked it if the characters weren't like they are. Well I might still watch it but can't say I like what I see.

+ I'll never understand why shoujo must look like what it does. What do girls appreciate in girl looking males <.<

The producers have a fujoshi audience in mind (so yes, the artistic depictions and mannerisms of the brothers are meant to convey homoerotic overtones, although I expect extremes to be avoided). With late night nows, they generally tailor content toward a particular niche one way or another.

Anyway, Brain's Base has the fujoshi market down pat, so their involvement in the project makes sense.

[Shiroth]

It has happened.

Mawaru Penguindrum Cushion Offered in Japan in October

I am going to do everything in my power to own the cushion and those pins.

[Suzuku]

Holy fuck just take all of my money.

[Kirarakim]

Originally Posted by Shiroth

It has happened.

Mawaru Penguindrum Cushion Offered in Japan in October

I am going to do everything in my power to own the cushion and those pins.

ACK why do cool things always come out when I don't have money!