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DanielSong39 · 2020-08-27, 05:00

I enjoyed the series at the start and it wasn't just because of Yatori/Ikta dynamic.
As I said before, what turned me off was the Empire and Chamille. Basically the enemies are after Chamille's life at every turn and treats her as the Big Bad. She proves over and over again that she is indeed the Big Bad and the enemies' actions are justified.
At the end, our two heroes die and the Big Bad wins. We're supposed to believe that this is a good thing.
I'm sorry but I feel how I feel and not how the author wants me to feel.

Zefyris · 2020-08-29, 01:45

...?
Chamille is the most selfless and benevolent character in the series. Compared to her, Icta and Yatori are bad persons (and they're definitely not bad persons on average).

Even Icta recognises that. That was even one of his reason to die in stead of Chamille and he said it right to her face. Something like "you see , no matter how much I 'd try I could never do what you're doing. You're a better person than me, so that's why you should be the one to live and guide the Empire on the path of a better future, not me".

there's no "two heroes". Yatori didn't have a more important role in the novel than the other 6, and definitely less of a hero than Icta and Chamille. Heck I could argue that even certain characters introduced later like Milvaquié are more important than Yatori on the long run.

zoldec · 2021-01-25, 06:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanielSong39

I enjoyed the series at the start and it wasn't just because of Yatori/Ikta dynamic.
As I said before, what turned me off was the Empire and Chamille. Basically the enemies are after Chamille's life at every turn and treats her as the Big Bad. She proves over and over again that she is indeed the Big Bad and the enemies' actions are justified.
At the end, our two heroes die and the Big Bad wins. We're supposed to believe that this is a good thing.
I'm sorry but I feel how I feel and not how the author wants me to feel.

Not all stories are about just plain good vs bad just like how overlord showed a perspective different from you normal view. So u said chamille was a bad person what did she do? Can u site some examples that does not have a valid political reason for the said action? Remember we are watching an anime about empire building and those spirits not a story about a hero like kids show.

Zefyris · 2021-02-17, 04:04

Chamille has never been a bad person so clearly he's not making any sense.
No matter how you look at it, she's someone who keeps sacrificing herself for the sake of others, for the sake of her country. Every death she cannot avoid she feels responsible for it and hate herself for it, even if she's not responsible, simply because she considers that since she's of the same blood as the emperor, she's just as much responsible as him for what happens.
It has always been clear on that point that she was both self hating and selfless, as well as the most benevolent character in the story.

So as I wrote it above, "Chamille is the big bad", that doesn't make any sense at all.

tuckersister · 2021-07-31, 13:56

Who saved Ikta from his stupor after Yatori's death in vol 9?

Also, what's haro's summary between vol 9-14. There isn't too much on any wiki site.

How did Ikta find out about the "other" Haro?

Zefyris · 2021-08-08, 07:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by tuckersister

Who saved Ikta from his stupor after Yatori's death in vol 9?

Also, what's haro's summary between vol 9-14. There isn't too much on any wiki site.

How did Ikta find out about the "other" Haro?

AFAIK skythewood has finished translating the 14 volumes now. If that's the case, you don't need any summary, just read it and make your own opinion.

WingedAccelerator · 2021-08-10, 07:34

Whenever this thead is bumped, 95-99% chance it's another round about Yatori's death. Not sure if I should admire the tenacity or just shake my head, but it's kind of comical from my perspective.

Zefyris · 2021-10-05, 08:10

To be fair, most peoples have merely read that spoiler and barely more. That's why most comments are about this, and why most comments on what happens later in this story are negative in this thread. Of course it would be negative when you only know the beginning, a death in the middle; and maybe another death near the end of the story , and barely anything around or in between.

SidVicious · 2022-07-11, 11:09

I'm almost at the end of volume 14.
That was a rough ride.

2020-08-29, 01:45	Link #662
Zefyris 図書館狼 Join Date: Jul 2013	...? Chamille is the most selfless and benevolent character in the series. Compared to her, Icta and Yatori are bad persons (and they're definitely not bad persons on average). Even Icta recognises that. That was even one of his reason to die in stead of Chamille and he said it right to her face. Something like "you see , no matter how much I 'd try I could never do what you're doing. You're a better person than me, so that's why you should be the one to live and guide the Empire on the path of a better future, not me". there's no "two heroes". Yatori didn't have a more important role in the novel than the other 6, and definitely less of a hero than Icta and Chamille. Heck I could argue that even certain characters introduced later like Milvaquié are more important than Yatori on the long run. __________________

2021-02-17, 04:04	Link #664
Zefyris 図書館狼 Join Date: Jul 2013	Chamille has never been a bad person so clearly he's not making any sense. No matter how you look at it, she's someone who keeps sacrificing herself for the sake of others, for the sake of her country. Every death she cannot avoid she feels responsible for it and hate herself for it, even if she's not responsible, simply because she considers that since she's of the same blood as the emperor, she's just as much responsible as him for what happens. It has always been clear on that point that she was both self hating and selfless, as well as the most benevolent character in the story. So as I wrote it above, "Chamille is the big bad", that doesn't make any sense at all. __________________ Last edited by Zefyris; 2021-03-01 at 09:32.

2021-07-31, 13:56	Link #665
tuckersister Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2013	Who saved Ikta from his stupor after Yatori's death in vol 9? Also, what's haro's summary between vol 9-14. There isn't too much on any wiki site. How did Ikta find out about the "other" Haro? Last edited by tuckersister; 2021-07-31 at 19:15.

2021-10-05, 08:10	Link #668
Zefyris 図書館狼 Join Date: Jul 2013	To be fair, most peoples have merely read that spoiler and barely more. That's why most comments are about this, and why most comments on what happens later in this story are negative in this thread. Of course it would be negative when you only know the beginning, a death in the middle; and maybe another death near the end of the story , and barely anything around or in between. __________________

2022-07-11, 11:09	Link #669
SidVicious Anime addict Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: São Paulo/Brazil Age: 46	I'm almost at the end of volume 14. That was a rough ride. __________________ MyAnimeList AniList

2020-08-27, 05:00	Link #661
DanielSong39 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	I enjoyed the series at the start and it wasn't just because of Yatori/Ikta dynamic. As I said before, what turned me off was the Empire and Chamille. Basically the enemies are after Chamille's life at every turn and treats her as the Big Bad. She proves over and over again that she is indeed the Big Bad and the enemies' actions are justified. At the end, our two heroes die and the Big Bad wins. We're supposed to believe that this is a good thing. I'm sorry but I feel how I feel and not how the author wants me to feel.

2021-08-10, 07:34	Link #667
WingedAccelerator Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2014	Whenever this thead is bumped, 95-99% chance it's another round about Yatori's death. Not sure if I should admire the tenacity or just shake my head, but it's kind of comical from my perspective.