|
View Poll Results: Guilty Crown - Episode 16 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 23 | 23.47% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 24 | 24.49% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 17 | 17.35% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 9 | 9.18% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 3 | 3.06% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 6 | 6.12% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 3 | 3.06% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 1 | 1.02% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 5 | 5.10% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 7 | 7.14% | |
Voters: 98. You may not vote on this poll |
|
Thread Tools |
2012-02-10, 12:02 | Link #121 |
Hu Tao
Join Date: Oct 2006
|
Isn't that void weapon supposedly will dissolve once the owner let go of it? In that case, why is the girl's void still on the ground and got crushed by the pillar? I pretty sure that she let go of it accidentally...or the weapon takes certain amount of time to dissolved?
Same goes to the void boomerang (pretty silly weapon). It should be disappeared once Shu threw it. Another thing is the title of this episode, the English word wrote "Tyranny", but the kanji obviously meant "kingdom". |
2012-02-10, 12:07 | Link #122 |
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
Graphic Designer
Moderator Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Belgium, Brussels
Age: 37
|
The title is just a not-so-uncommon way for Japanese to use 2 titles at once. For example, last week Episode Japanese title was 告白 (Confession) while English was Sacrifice. All of the episode titles were like this.
__________________
|
2012-02-10, 12:18 | Link #123 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Moscow, RU
Age: 35
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
2012-02-10, 12:21 | Link #124 | |
The Chaotic Dreamer
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: In a cruel yet beautiful world
Age: 32
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
2012-02-10, 12:25 | Link #125 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
|
Quote:
I like this evil Shu, although you can't expect him to win against a well-trained soldier despite of the Void (except if that soldier is fodder) And that Void was was A? I still think Souta's Void deserves more than F-rank since it was quite useful in a couple of occasions I watched the preview and it looks like the president wasn't killed by Inori (maybe Tsugumi made a double? Somebody stopped Inori?)
__________________
|
|
2012-02-10, 12:34 | Link #127 |
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
Graphic Designer
Moderator Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Belgium, Brussels
Age: 37
|
There is a glaring difference between a greeting bow, and "that" bow. In japan, the angle determines how much you show deference to the other party. And frankly, in this case, it isn't anything close to a student council president, it is a complete different category (which is why Argo was pissed off already). And no, people don't go as far as -leaving the way free for you- in such fashion either, unless you are using few animes exaggerating this motion.
__________________
|
2012-02-10, 12:53 | Link #128 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NYC
|
Terrible writing. Hare's death in the episode before was so contrived and out of place (girlfriend in refrigerator syndrome....very badly done at that). And Shu's transformation is incredibly forced. I'll keep watching for amusement value, but the writer's really need to step it up and redeem themselves.
__________________
|
2012-02-10, 13:00 | Link #129 | ||||||||||
Senior Member
Author
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I'm going to be frank here. Some people on this thread are being awfully idealistic, and this is coming from someone who has defended idealism a lot in the past and sees some worth in it. Let's say you have 100 people. They all have different skills and abilities. Some are clearly smarter than others. Some are clearly stronger than others. Some are proven to be more useful than others, at least given the current situation. You're stranded on a deserted island. You have a very scarce amount of resources available to you. On that deserted island is a lot of dangerous animals that can kill you. You absolutely need to keep your strongest people alive to fight them off, and it's good to keep your smartest people alive in order to try to outwit the animals (and also to organize things like shelter construction, create some semblance of rule of law, etc...) You do not have enough resources available to you to keep all 100 people in good health and well-nourished. You want your key people to remain in good health and well-nourished (you obviously want your top animal-hunters to be in the best shape possible for fighting off animals). What do you do? Being strictly egalitarian in such extenuating circumstances is the wrong thing to do, at least at a pragmatic level. You wouldn't want to let anybody simply die, if it can be helped at all, but it would frankly be foolhardy to not show at least some degree of preferential treatment to your key people. It would of course be different if you could keep all 100 people in good health and well-nourished, but as is... The scenario I outlined above is pretty similar to what Shu and friends are facing: Just replace "deserted island" with "quarantined Tokyo", "dangerous animals" with "GHQ", and "animal-hunters" with "fighters". Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Plus, it could be a case that they need to have their top Offensive-style Void users go on raiding missions for more vaccines, thus leaving behind a skeleton force at the school HQ. In fact, Argo probably walked in on just such a raid mission near the very beginning of the episode.
__________________
Last edited by Triple_R; 2012-02-10 at 13:11. |
||||||||||
2012-02-10, 13:25 | Link #130 | ||||||||
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
Graphic Designer
Moderator Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Belgium, Brussels
Age: 37
|
Quote:
You may think it was appropriately done, but I disagree in such matter: it was a flipping a switch. Shu changing to this extent is plausible, but the execution of it was pretty poor, especially the way how he is completely passive. A passive attitude wouldn't lead to such drastic change unless after several inner turmoil and resolve. However, he is extremely passive as he is following the flow suggested by Yahiro and the other goons. That's the only way I see that: Hare's death hit him like a truck, but instead of going through different stages of bereaving, they catapulted to the last stage of it: emptiness/anger. Quote:
Classifying people on a "numerical value" in such circumstance is a very poor judgment. Quote:
To add the insult to the injury, they didn't have anything to confirm the actual reliability of the device, since they didn't design it: the fact Inori is over 2000 doesn't mean the device will give an appropriate value to Ayase, etc. I would have no problem if Shu and friends found that at Gai's personal cache or raided a GHQ research facility without being a "look, it is a freebie, take it!" item. But here, the circumstances regarding the device are utterly fishy no matter how you look at it. Quote:
I would have largely accepted if they evaluated voids -themselves- by putting them in category (attack, defense, support, etc), thus allowing them to appreciate correctly the usefulness of the void and thus having a proper hierarchy. Numerical value doesn't mean jack if the circumstances and the metric value are not in favor to this scale. In a way, it is like comparing assault rifles and Bazooka on destructive powers without factoring ammunition, weight, space etc. That's why "not equalitarian in such circumstances" doesn't work for me here. If it was in general, I would agree, but the circumstances are really something I can't give credits for. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Knowing Yahiro, he probably endoctrined everyone to make Shu their king. Therefore, leaving the king in such defenseless fashion is beyond an oversight: plain stupidity or scripter oversight altogether. The fact one of the thug sticking with Arisa should mean that someone higher ranked would be close to Shu (that guy is, "for some reason", part of Shu closest goons), since the later is a higher priority no matter how we look at it. Hell, even these 2 girls from "secret service" would do the trick sort of, yet well... Shu was basically on his own, and the slightest mistake would be a terrible game over.
__________________
|
||||||||
2012-02-10, 13:57 | Link #131 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
|
I am really hating how much of a manipulative prick Yahiro is turning out to be. $20 says Shu will eventually kill him for betrayal or something like that (I'd find the irony delicious if Shu killed Yahiro with his own Void).
Spoiler for Arisa:
Spoiler for WTF?!:
|
2012-02-10, 14:20 | Link #132 |
Loves the Experience
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Earth...hopefully
|
By the way, I didn't mention this because I'm trying to like the series, but why is "void breaks and you die" a big deal? It's not like those things are fragile and you'd have better luck killing a person than breaking a void, so why keep it a big secret? It's just a simple precaution when using them.
__________________
|
2012-02-10, 14:40 | Link #133 |
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
|
Incidently why did her void remain so that it could be broken when we usually see voids disappear when they fall out of your hands?
Also the episode confirmed that either Shu or the person he's drawing the void out of needs to have some eye contact so how the hell did Shu pull that quick draw stunt two episodes back?
__________________
|
2012-02-10, 14:47 | Link #134 | |||||||||||||
Senior Member
Author
|
Quote:
Quote:
But as you reflect on whatever the catalyst of the emotional breakdown is, major changes in attitude and personality can set in depending on what you determine to be the root cause(s) of your problems. This is why I was glad for the time-skip. I can believe certain personality changes setting in for Shu during the time-skip. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
People keep talking about these protagonists and their changes as though they're living normal everyday lives. They're not. They're in one of the worst situations imaginable. It's actually a bit surprising that more of them haven't broken down and panicked entirely. Exceptionally desperate times create exceptionally desperate people and often desperate measures. Quote:
My core point here was simply that some degree of prioritization amongst the voids (and hence, implicitly, amongst the students) makes sense given the circumstances. For example, keeping Inori alive should be one of the highest priorities right after keeping Shu alive. Really, that's how this thing should have broken down. Not with an intricate categorization system (though I can kind of see why they went for that), but with the recognition that a few key people need to be kept alive no matter what, and that some of them call the shots (i.e. you don't leave the school HQ without their go-ahead). After those key people, it would probably be best to have there be egalitarianism. People probably have an easier time being in a very broad 90% below the top 10% then being categorized in the bottom 10% with 90% placed above them. Quote:
Quote:
In any event, as you say, Souta ultimately must be held accountable for his silly sortie. I don't fault Shu at all there. To me, it makes sense that Shu would favor Yahiro's position over Souta's position after Souta played such an obvious role in getting Hare killed. Is it perfectly logical of Shu? No. But I don't expect perfect logic from him, or from most fictional characters for that matter. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
In Shu's mind, Hare is the kindest person he ever knew. And what happened to her, arguably due to her kindness? She got killed, that's what. I don't agree with a man discarding "kindness" over that, but people have become very jaded over much less. Quote:
And that's pretty much what Shu is relative to the other students - He's the Head Honcho of the entire organization. It's not like they're outright worshiping him. They're just paying him the sort of respect that a Salaryman would be expected to pay his top superior (i.e. the Head Honcho of the company). Quote:
__________________
Last edited by Triple_R; 2012-02-10 at 15:06. |
|||||||||||||
2012-02-10, 15:41 | Link #136 | |
Banned
|
Quote:
I agree though, that's kind of been the best reason to continue watching it, seeing what completely random direction it'll take the characters and plot in next and how quickly it shifts direction yet again. I expect the scenario to shift gears, the characters to switch sides, personalities and philosophies, and the plot to switch focus completely at least a couple more times before all is said and done. |
|
2012-02-10, 16:02 | Link #137 |
Senior Member
|
Shu's mother say that Shu can't forgive them for what they are doing.
Then i can think that "new" Gai is a sort of controlled zombie, that suddently attack Shu....and probably Shu was forced to kill his old friend (Triton). Another walk down to the insanity for Shu. @Shu (XD) If you want to pick a fight with a trained Soldier.....use Inori's Void XD
__________________
|
2012-02-10, 16:16 | Link #138 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2011
|
Slight disagreement on Shuu's psychology (or at least what the writers are likely thinking, if not quite executing with their writing). Shuu reads to me as having been, at core, afraid of actually being disliked by other people -- and too lame to dream of being widely-liked, it seems -- which is why he was an asocial loner at the start: it let him stay in a kind of limbo, neither widely liked nor widely disliked.
Hare's death traumatized Shuu, but more importantly it made him aware that his dream of not being hated was dead, dead, dead: he's the leader in a crap situation and he's almost certainly going to be disliked no matter what he does. Go easy on everyone? Things will turn out badly and he'll be hated. Go hard on everyone? They'll hate him too, even if he does lead some of them safely out of Tokyo. So he's adopted a fatalistic "everyone will hate me no matter what I do" attitude, which is why he's so blasé and largely lets Yahiro run things. If the writers were a bit more on top of it they'd tie their own threads together more consistently, but I'm pretty sure that's the picture of Shuu the writers are trying (unsuccessfully) to paint. FWIW if you think back to the funeral parlor days Shuu's recurring issue with Gai and the rest of the parlor was pretty much always about the love and respect the funeral parlor staffers had for Gai, despite how much of a manipulative jerk he was. I don't think Shuu was ever explicitly jealous of anything else about Gai (except maybe closeness with Inori); I don't recall any any of Gai's looks, style, planning abilities, fighting skills, manly swagger, etc....just what Shuu saw as an inexplicable popularity. That said, like I mentioned earlier I think the story would've gone better if Shuu'd been portrayed as a popular, well-liked guy on campus (or at worst a Yagami Light "everyone likes and respects me, I'm just too busy to socialize much"). His relationships with his "friends" like Souta are things we've seen built up over the course of the series and still seem quite shallow, which deflates the dramatic effectiveness of moves like Shuu's letting Souta figure out his own escape. But, in particular, if the writers knew they were going to go all lord of the flies eventually, a Shuu who started out as a popular guy would make the way school life's turned out easier to swallow; as-is the void regime is just a bridge too far for suspension of disbelief (the idea is ok, the speed and thoroughness of its implementation not so much), but if Shuu was already "that guy" it's a lot easier to make it work. And as a nit: I think they would've added a lot of verisimilitude if they'd shown the on-campus living arrangements in more detail. Not sure if there's some taboo here about this, but some kind of dormitory set-up with different densities for different ranks (S-class: 2-to-a-room?, F-rank, rooftop tent city? A-rank, 8-man dorms?) would add a lot of color and take not too long to work into an episode. |
2012-02-10, 16:18 | Link #139 |
黒猫のタンゴ
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: 幻想郷
Age: 36
|
Inori should be renamed Instant Plot-Device, because she seems to just do whatever the hell the plot calls for her to do. She apparently is now Shu’s C.C. (though she obviously isn’t as cool) and is going to do whatever she can to help him with his plan of world domination or whatever. Also can someone explain to me what’s the deal with the Schuhrer’s mom? Or any of the character?! Their interactions and motifs just don’t make any kind of sense… And suddenly GAI O SENGEN:
__________________
Last edited by Qpax; 2012-02-10 at 16:50. |
2012-02-10, 17:37 | Link #140 |
real men love pink
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Ohio
|
yeah the shows been on a steady decline since ep 12. Characters how no rhyme or reason, its just all chaos. Inori is like slowly changing into yandere mana.
and now with a resurrected gai, its like really..... Well only 6 eps left hopefully they can get this back to being decent
__________________
|
|
|