Shin Sekai Yori - Episode 14 Discussion / Poll

[felix]

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

I still don't see what danger Maria and Mamoru would pose to the village or its inhabitants since they'll be nowhere near them. They could probably be able to live out the rest of their lives in peace just the two of them.

The villages are secret as far as I am aware; and their security requires they remain such. If anyone with power from the outside world ever comes they would be defenseless (because of the whole can't kill humans pact). The outsider on the other hand would be completely free to do as he pleases. As the previous episodes show the cats only seem to be effective against people who've been hypnotized and even then it has its limits.

[Dark Wing]

Even if there were a chance of other humans living beyond the lands controled by the village I'd imagine Maria and Mamoru would be smart enough not to advertise where they came from.

So again why can't they just be left alone? If you ask me the only thing that will put the village in any real danger is if they keep hunting Maria and Mamoru forcing them to defend themselves.

[Arkeus]

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

So again why can't they just be left alone? If you ask me the only thing that will put the village in any real danger is if they keep hunting Maria and Mamoru forcing them to defend themselves.

If you think about it a bit more, about what they are in general, it's easy to see where the danger lies, but this risk going into spoiler territory.

[felix]

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

Even if there were a chance of other humans living beyond the lands controled by the village I'd imagine Maria and Mamoru would be smart enough not to advertise where they came from.

So again why can't they just be left alone? If you ask me the only thing that will put the village in any real danger is if they keep hunting Maria and Mamoru forcing them to defend themselves.

The village leaders would imagine otherwise.

For what it's worth, all that's needed is one psychopath and a little blood and either of them would spill their entire life.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Taking all of the above into consideration, I wonder if this entire situation was a carefully concocted trap designed to ensnare Saki, and lead her into taking actions that the Education Committee could use as pretext for having Saki disposed of. In other words, Mamoru wasn't the true target - Saki was. They hoped to make Saki break more rules by throwing Mamoru's life in danger. And then they'd use that rule-breaking as justification for executing Saki.

I don't know about that. One of the woman on the board was genuinely shocked when Tomiko announced she had been grooming Saki to become their new leader. Somebody as wise as Tomiko probably kept her true expectations for Saki's future a secret, precisely to avoid that kind of ploy.

It seems more likely to me that the education committee has been growing more and more paranoid after the incident with Shun, and decided to get rid of group 1 (which they were aware was special) starting with the weakest link, Mamoru. He was the true target and they failed to kill him. After learning Saki and the others went after him, they probably intended to use this opportunity to get rid of them all and kill four birds with one stone, but I don't think they were targeting Saki in particular.

Choosing to dispose of Mamoru was a big mistake, and I think it will come back to bite them in the ass later on. Saki's foreboding words about Maria still linger in my mind.

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

I still don't see what danger Maria and Mamoru would pose to the village or its inhabitants since they'll be nowhere near them. They could probably be able to live out the rest of their lives in peace just the two of them.

It's not that easy for two kids to live all alone in the wilderness, especially when they come from such a sheltered society. The environment of the current world seem very hostile too. Anything could happen to them, and the possibility that one of them turns into a fiend is not negligible (imagine if Mamoru got killed, how would Maria react?). And that's how their society works: they dispose of kids the moment they show the slightest hint of straying off the path. They can't make an exception of Maria and Mamoru. It simply goes against their principles. The rules say nobody goes outside of the holy barrier, so they have to bring them back no matter what.

[pinoscotto]

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

Even if there were a chance of other humans living beyond the lands controled by the village I'd imagine Maria and Mamoru would be smart enough not to advertise where they came from.

So again why can't they just be left alone? If you ask me the only thing that will put the village in any real danger is if they keep hunting Maria and Mamoru forcing them to defend themselves.

i don't know if the 2 of them can be troblesome, but if the elders let them live outside the village they should do the same to whoever wants to run away

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Kanon

It seems more likely to me that the education committee has been growing more and more paranoid after the incident with Shun, and decided to get rid of group 1 (which they were aware was special) starting with the weakest link, Mamoru. He was the true target and they failed to kill him. After learning Saki and the others went after him, they probably intended to use this opportunity to get rid of them all and kill four birds with one stone, but I don't think they were targeting Saki in particular.

There's no reason for them to get rid of Group 1, though? They're simply paranoid, like Tomiko said. When your job involves watching people closely for any sign of danger it's only a matter of time until you start becoming paranoid. The problem, as Tomiko explained earlier, is Mamoru having reached a critical point where he is potentially dangerous both to his friends and to society in general. And as it turned out they were right: he couldn't control his power which lashed out subconsciously as Mamoru panicked. Except, as Tomiko says, it wasn't a very well-thought-out decision to eliminate him, since in a way he was pushed to the breaking point by the Committee itself, and perhaps he would've worked out his issues if they had given him some time. But on the other hand, as it turned out he can't control his power - who wants to take responsibility for a person like that?

And as for why Mamoru and Maria are dangerous, I think Tomiko made it pretty clear? They have to account for every single person. You can't exactly have them running around unchecked. Plus one of them is already unstable and at risk of becoming an akki or gouma; and both are able to resist mindwipe. To make it worse, they're a boy and a girl: they can produce offsprings that would be raised outside society with its rules and ways to help people control their power.

[Grey]

Limitless energy, dangerous like nuclear weapons, and unaging, eh? It's like they really are little gods.

Man, that early episode's line about Maria still hangs over everything like a sword waiting to drop.

[Dark Wing]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

they're a boy and a girl: they can produce offsprings that would be raised outside society with its rules and ways to help people control their power.

I'm going to have to withdraw my stance on this debate at this point since I can't find anyway to counter this statement. Now that I think about it this is probably what Tomiko ment when she told Saki about not being able to fully grasp the danger both Maria and Mamoru posed.

[Master_Yoma]

Wait she 267 so is she the Highlander

[Dark Wing]

Originally Posted by Master_Yoma

Wait she 267 so is she the Highlander

As fare as I know she just found a way to slow down the aging process but can still be killed other means...and yes decapitation is one of them.

[Grey]

So the hypnosis on Group 1 is weaker than on everyone else? I wonder if that means Maria and Mamoru will find it easier to eventually harm humans.

But what a surprise to find out the entire group was an experiment. Doesn't look like the experiment is working out too well so far. The "we can kill anyone under 17" policy doesn't sound like it would work too well with that experiment. I'd expect more Fiends and Karma Demons in that group compared to a totally uncontrolled population.

I mean, talk about stress. "We'll mind control you...but only a little bit! Just enough to make you realize there are strange and dangerous secrets about the village." Genius.

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

I'm going to have to withdraw my stance on this debate at this point since I can't find anyway to counter this statement. Now that I think about it this is probably what Tomiko ment when she told Saki about not being able to fully grasp the danger both Maria and Mamoru posed.

It also explains the Education Board woman's distress when she said it wasn't just a boy that went missing but a girl too. That flew totally over my head the first time I watched the episode. These characters are thinking farther ahead than I am.

[Dark Wing]

Originally Posted by Grey

It also explains the Education Board woman's distress when she said it wasn't just a boy that went missing but a girl too. That flew totally over my head the first time I watched the episode. These characters are thinking farther ahead than I am.

Thats how you can tell it's a well written story!

[CJ_Walker]

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

Turns out Tomiko is pretty much immortal and if the hit Tomiko gave Saki is any to go buy she may unlock the secret herself one day. However what makes this whole thing odd why is shes seeking a new replacement if she can keep on living forever?
?

Because she's tired and wants to die>>>> "I'm the only one left"<<<<<

Anyway, now I know why she's so damn calm, she's seen enough and lived enough to have that extreme sense of calm no matter what.

Also it seems we have another danger: loose humans without the extreme brainwashing all the other humans have. . .

that explains a lot of things, especially why "Kid x" who took shuns place couldn't really remember that he wasn't a part of the group like the group did.

I enjoyed this episode, shit actually happened. this and in combination with the last two eps I marathoned made it great.

I think once the anime is over, I'll need to marathon it again, it's probably gonna be one of those "big picture" type shows.

[NoemiChan]

Episode 14

Hohoho...

Doing "it" on the outside in the snow... Where are Satoru and Mamoru during "that" time.... God.

Anyway, I question whether "grandma" is really Saturo's "grandma"... 267? WTF?

The anime is way far from being Sci-fi. It's complete fantasy..

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by Grey

Limitless energy, dangerous like nuclear weapons, and unaging, eh? It's like they really are little gods.

No...it's because no one can kill them coz everyone's emasculated thanks to the death feedback.

They are killable, seen them taken down by poison and blade before remember? Godlike they are not.

The real threat at present comes from the death feedback more than anything else.

Back in the modern era, it's easy to see how the main threat then would be the unpredictablity of the relatively new phenomenon of insane PK users

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Grey

So the hypnosis on Group 1 is weaker than on everyone else? I wonder if that means Maria and Mamoru will find it easier to eventually harm humans.

That's a different thing - their non-aggression check and death feedback prevents them from harming people, or at least, harming people consciously. (The problem was Mamoru lashing out subconsciously...)

Originally Posted by Grey

But what a surprise to find out the entire group was an experiment. Doesn't look like the experiment is working out too well so far. The "we can kill anyone under 17" policy doesn't sound like it would work too well with that experiment. I'd expect more Fiends and Karma Demons in that group compared to a totally uncontrolled population.

I mean, talk about stress. "We'll mind control you...but only a little bit! Just enough to make you realize there are strange and dangerous secrets about the village." Genius.

Which is why Tomiko said she was also responsible... But then, it was an experiment that had to be done (and perhaps had been done before). They mind-control people in order to make them docile and safe (and happy), but they also need people to lead and protect them. In the novel she also adds that it's important to have "trickster" like people who introduce variation and help making society evolve with the times (as rigidness is self-defeating in the long run). Obviously this also makes Group 1 more dangerous, but from Tomiko's POV that was a risk she had to take.

(Also, I wonder why nobody so far commented on how cleverly Tomiko manipulates Saki... for better or for worse. She gained Saki's trust and she just talked her into locating Maria and Mamoru and bringing them back to where they're in danger. =Well, they're in danger everywhere, but anyway.) Oh, she promised to protect them, but how far can we trust her on that? For all Saki knows, she would bring the two back, they would be executed, Saki and Satoru would get mindwiped, and by the time they realized something was amiss, like they did with Shun, it would be too late and they wouldn't fully remember anyway. Either that, or they would be left alive but mindwiped very, very thoroughly...)

[Cosmic Eagle]

That isn't really her being smart but Saki being trusting

[BBOvenGuy]

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

I question whether "grandma" is really Saturo's "grandma"... 267? WTF?

Japan is one of many cultures where family terms like "grandma," "aunt," "uncle," etc. are used for people who aren't literal biological relatives.

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by BBOvenGuy

Japan is one of many cultures where family terms like "grandma," "aunt," "uncle," etc. are used for people who aren't literal biological relatives.

They are biological relatives, though. She's his great-great-great-etc. grandma.