(L) Simoun

[Matrim]

But Morinas also appeared to know pretty much nothing about the Simouns at first (unless this ignorance was a trick to get Waporif's attention ).

[Kaoru Chujo]

Originally Posted by Guppy

...if anyone's going to make her Sagitta sick, it's Aeru. Aeru's usually paired with fairly steady types (Neviril, Limone, Yun), so perhaps it doesn't normally show as much....

As far as I can tell, Aaeru is, with Neviril and Limone, the best auriga of all. That's more or less what Guraghief told the officials, isn't it? When Neviril took off with Morinas as sagitta (in ep 15, I think), you could see some wavering like when Morinas flew with Aaeru. But I don't think Morinas is inexperienced, so the colors might be right. Lol. Sorry, I just had to defend my favorite, Aaeru.

But Matrim makes a good point. I think I recall that Morinas had only flown simile before. I'm not sure.

Spoiler for speculation about simoun, based on ep19:

That idea that the simoun could be everywhere and nowhere makes me wonder if they can make spatial or temporal jumps, moving suddenly from one location to another. Learning how to do that would be the only way now that the Kyuukoku simoun could regain their technological superiority over Reikoku/Shoukoku.

As for whether Kyuukoku is down to only an under-strength Chor Tempest, I think there must still be simoun on Arcus Niger. The reason we only see Vyuura and her partner may be that they are the only, or among the few, from the other Arcus Prima choirs who have not gone to the Spring.

EDIT: I've upated the hashihime "Simoun Secret Cast" pages with episodes 16-18 (there were no bit parts in 15).

[Seska]

Sure, if the Country only have 1 Corps now, they will be overruned for sure...

They must have more Ships like Arcus Prima, we now from a Arcus Black version. And they all can hold 3-4 Corps onboard. Perhaps more pilots, but limit Simouns on board.

they surely guard the boarders of the country, and even for the old Messia they must give a reason. They surely have more. But the Series focus only on "Seikou" Best Corps they have around from (the director only knows) 30 Corps they have in duty. And dont forget the ground forces of them...

Mfg,
Seska

[Kaoru Chujo]

New commercial for the game:
www2.ranobe.com/test/src/up11254.zip

The titles talk about beauty and sorrow and drawing beautiful battle scenes in the air, and say it is a new story, with a new character who holds the key. Aaeru's voice basically just gives the name of the game, which is Simoun, Ibara Sensou, Fuuin no Ri Maajon. This I think means "Simoun, Battle of the Other Roses (a homonym for 'thorns'), Ri Maajon of the Seal (not the animal, and a homonym for 'elegance')."

And I just discovered that Morinaga Rika's site (she plays Mamiina) has more on it than I thought. The links are in the loops of the butterfly's path. She has a strange beauty, can do classical ballet, is 26 years old, works for the preeminent agency I'm Enterprise (as do Saitou Chiwa, Nakahara Mai, Rie Kugimiya, Ueda Kana and Takahashi Mikako) and is tiny: 149cm, 37kg (just under 4'11", 82lb).

And this pic of posters gives us "Neviril" and "Aer" as semi-official transcriptions. Fine by me.

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo

I've upated the hashihime "Simoun Secret Cast" pages with episodes 16-18 (there were no bit parts in 15).

I really hope that "Temple Guardian" and "Chor Rubor Member A" at least get real names before the series is over; we've seen them frequently enough, and "Member A" looks like she might become one of Chor Tempest's new recruits....

[jtrog]

I have not looked ahead that far, I still love the originality of this series.

When they grow, in spurts like if in real life, their faces should change as should even hair styles and dress should change.

Kudos to Simoun writers for orginality of the series.

[Guppy]

Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo

As far as I can tell, Aaeru is, with Neviril and Limone, the best auriga of all. That's more or less what Guraghief told the officials, isn't it? When Neviril took off with Morinas as sagitta (in ep 15, I think), you could see some wavering like when Morinas flew with Aaeru. But I don't think Morinas is inexperienced, so the colors might be right. Lol. Sorry, I just had to defend my favorite, Aaeru.

Hey, that wasn't a slam on Aeru - she clearly is the most naturally talented Auriga in the Chor, and as a combat aviator she's head and shoulders above any of the others. But she's also the wildest flier and, IMO, one of the least likely to naturally pay attention to the comfort of her backseater. (Maybe that's why I've come to think that Yun makes a better pair for her than the emotionally fragile Neviril.)

Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo

But Matrim makes a good point. I think I recall that Morinas had only flown simile before. I'm not sure.

It does look like that's the case, since Wapourif had to explain things like needing a pair to fly a Simoun. That would also account for her being better as an Auriga than a Sagitta.

[Matrim]

Spoiler for Rimone's natural talent:

I think Rimone was more naturally talented than even Aaeru or at least had (or has if she is not dead) the potential to become better than Aaeru when reaching Aaeru's current age.

[Guppy]

Originally Posted by Matrim

Spoiler for Rimone's natural talent:

I think Rimone was more naturally talented than even Aaeru or at least had (or has if she is not dead) the potential to become better than Aaeru when reaching Aaeru's current age.

Spoiler:

It seems to me that Aeru isn't the best in terms of pure skill or technique - Neviril outclasses her there, and I'd agree that Limone is close if not better. But I think Aeru's flying has an inspiration that the other two generally lack.

[Matrim]

Well, yes. If anything cannot be achieved in any other way except through sheer determination, Aaeru immediately comes to mind as the one to do it. I wouldn't bet on neither Nevirl nor Rimone if they have to fight against Aaeru in one on one duel (assuming Similes can be used for duels, of course), despite the former's experience and the latter's natural flying ability. Neviril can inpire the rest with wise words in the right moment very well but Aaeru can lead and inspire just with the force of her personality.
But I am not sure that Neviril outclasses Aaeru in terms of pure technicue, what makes you think so?

[Kaoru Chujo]

We haven't seen that much of Neviril as an auriga, but she is the Sibylla Aurea and the chor's Regina, so I kind of assumed she was magic. Although maybe it's her father's position that got her there. Don't know.

Aaeru has demonstrated her magic with that amazing performance in the simile, and then in the Maaju Pool with Paraietta. After that, it's hard to judge except by what others say. But the pure shining force of Aaeru's personality (and Niino Michi's voice) are something special. I agree with the idea that Limone is/was something special. The child genius. And sorry I misinterpreted what you wrote, Guppy. I thought afterward that I might have. Aaeru might be the flamboyant race-driver in the crew.

[Matrim]

Well, that's what I was trying to say (or rarther should have said) - we can't really make a comparison backed with that much proof except what other characters think of Neviril and Aaeru's abilities. And it's kind of difficult to distinguish between them when in both cases the techinque seems to border on perfection.

Anyway, it's possible that her father's influence had to do with Neviril initially being proclaimed Regina but since no one (as far as I remember) has complained she doesn't deserve this position because there are more skillful Sybillae than her in the Choir, I'd say that even if that had been the case , since then she has more than proved her merit.

[Guppy]

You're right, there isn't an abundance of direct evidence, but it always seemed to me that - if you exclude the chaos and stress of combat situations - Neviril is the sort who you could depend on to show up and do a perfect Ri Maajon every time. Limone struck me as being fairly similar in that respect. Both have refined their skills to the brink of perfection and can execute any move in the book (which is what I think constitutes good technique).

On the other hand, Aeru's flying is superb, but I think she's the sort of person for whom "refinement" and "perfection" have no real meaning - she puts in practice time, sure, but what really makes her special is an ability to throw the book out the window and make amazing things happen with sheer talent and force of will.

And, yeah, in battle I don't think any of the others come close to Aeru's combination of flying ability and combat senses. I seriously doubt if Aeru would have gotten nailed by the Plumbum Simouns as easily as Neviril - I've read more than once that excellent technique can actually work against you in such situations, because it makes you too predictable to others skilled in the same profession.

[Yaya-chan]

As they say let's pray for the repose of Mamiina's soul.
Mamiina video

[Yui from Okinawa]

Spoiler:

Totally, Ri-Maajion by Simoun is match for the inferior speed and mobillity airplanes.

In #16, Argentum twin-engine fighter break and evacuate All Ri-maajion which traceed by Dominura & Rimone
On the other hand, V-simoun easily evade Simoun's Shark Ri-Maajion at ep19.

I think Neviril has wrong tactics judgement at the Recon to Argentum Air-Career even if she has not military affair pilot but Sybilla.

Floe said we can find Argentum career, go back, not Neviril insist that they seek V-simoun on board enemy's career.

If Neviril return to Messis according to Floe's advice at #19, the tragedy of Mamiina's death has never occured.

I fear at the prediction of the episode 23 (Simuracrum surrender to Plumbum & Argentum), Simulacrum governer easy to give up to hand over Sibylla Aurea's body.

May be Floe go to the spring, I hope all Choir Tempest Sybylla go to new world, not to execute A war crime judge at the military tribunalby by the Plumbum and Argentum held

[Guppy]

Originally Posted by Yui from Okinawa

Spoiler:

Floe said we can find Argentum career, go back, not Neviril insist that they seek V-simoun on board enemy's career.

If Neviril return to Messis according to Floe's advice at #19, the tragedy of Mamiina's death has never occured.

Spoiler:

The thing that puzzles me about their constant attempts to find the enemy carrier is... what exactly do they intend to do about it once it's found?

In episode 19, Chor Tempest had finally located the carrier, and even with the loss of one Simoun they still had five battleworthy craft on hand. The biggest airborne threat, the Plumbum Simouns, had fled and the deck had been strafed clear of enemy troops. The Messis had even arrived in support.

So why exactly did they withdraw? What was the point of locating the enemy, and taking casualties in the process, if they weren't even going to try attacking when their entire force (minus Neviril and Mamiina's Simoun) was assembled? From past experience, they should be well aware that the carrier would move locations before reinforcements could be called in.

I mean, we're all well aware by now that Simulacrum is utterly incompetent at waging war, but this seems a bit too much.

[Kaoru Chujo]

Originally Posted by Yaya-chan

As they say, let's pray for the repose of Mamiina's soul.
Mamiina video

Thank you! That was wonderful.

[Matrim]

Originally Posted by Guppy

Spoiler:

The thing that puzzles me about their constant attempts to find the enemy carrier is... what exactly do they intend to do about it once it's found?

In episode 19, Chor Tempest had finally located the carrier, and even with the loss of one Simoun they still had five battleworthy craft on hand. The biggest airborne threat, the Plumbum Simouns, had fled and the deck had been strafed clear of enemy troops. The Messis had even arrived in support.

So why exactly did they withdraw? What was the point of locating the enemy, and taking casualties in the process, if they weren't even going to try attacking when their entire force (minus Neviril and Mamiina's Simoun) was assembled? From past experience, they should be well aware that the carrier would move locations before reinforcements could be called in.

I mean, we're all well aware by now that Simulacrum is utterly incompetent at waging war, but this seems a bit too much.

Spoiler:

If there is one thing that gets on my nerves in Simoun is the patchiness of the plot and the way certain storylines get abandoned for a time only to be picked up later seemingly out of the blue. As you say it seems normal to expect an all out attack on the base but I suspect there was not enough time in this episode and for some reason it was decided it would be better to postpone this event if it ever actually happens. I think we all expected more explorations of the Ruins immediately after episode 17 and this didn't happen or to see more about the relationship between the ground forces and the Sybillae after episode 11 and this didn't happen either.
As far as emotional impact episode 19 was great, the plot though left a lot to be desired, alas.

On the other hand, Aeru's flying is superb, but I think she's the sort of person for whom "refinement" and "perfection" have no real meaning - she puts in practice time, sure, but what really makes her special is an ability to throw the book out the window and make amazing things happen with sheer talent and force of will.

I am curious which of them came up with the idea to use the troop containers to destroy a few tanks in episode 11, I think it wasn't shown. If it was Neviril maybe she can think outside the box, too but I think it must have been Aaeru. Neviril remonds me of a professional boxer who even in a street fight would use only her fists because the routine and experience, while Aaeru would use punches, kicks, teeth...basically every trick in the book and would rather end up in a hospital than admit defeat.

[oneplusme]

Originally Posted by Guppy

Spoiler:

In episode 19, Chor Tempest had finally located the carrier
(...)
So why exactly did they withdraw? What was the point of locating the enemy, and taking casualties in the process, if they weren't even going to try attacking when their entire force (minus Neviril and Mamiina's Simoun) was assembled?

Spoiler:

Well, we've seen in the past that Chor Tempest doesn't exactly perform Ri Maajons very well without Neviril in the lead, and with her out of action as well as everyone else being decidedly unsettled (to say the least), they might well not have been a terribly effective combat force at that point...

That not to imply that the Simulacrans were being any less incompetent than usual at warfare, mind.

[Kaoru Chujo]

Originally Posted by Matrim

If there is one thing that gets on my nerves in Simoun is the patchiness of the plot and the way certain storylines get abandoned for a time only to be picked up later seemingly out of the blue....

I actually disagree with this part of what you wrote. I think this pattern is intentional and effective. It keeps us moving forward. If they solved every problem as it came up, the feeling would be more static and simple, and not as wonderfully deep and dynamic as it is. I do agree that the tactics are often hard to make sense of, but there is enough sense in them to not break my willing suspension of disbelief.

Spoiler for ep19:

The mistake in this ep was Neviril's decision not to return to base. Her choices were three: attack, scout, or return undiscovered. Scouting would produce one of two results: no simoun and attack, or simoun and retreat under fire. Her gamble failed, and the fire was too great. But she was following orders to attack if possible. It just wasn't possible, because of the Plumbum V-simoun.