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Old 2015-10-05, 08:36   Link #481
Triple_R
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Well, if y'all have seen the first episode of Gundam IBO, it seems Okada and her pal already passed the first hurdle of making a Gundam series . There's a lot of hot-blooded macho-ness here for an Okada show.
I just watched the first episode of the new Gundam series, and yeah, this is definitely accurate. In fact, the hod-blooded macho-ness is probably the biggest strength of the first episode, which is amazing.


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Let's hope the writing & direction will keep on improving.
Agreed. Thankfully, it's off to a pretty good start.
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Old 2015-10-08, 19:57   Link #482
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Rejoice everyone! (or not)

We'll have another series written by Mari Okada called Kiznaiver

This time with studio Trigger

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Old 2015-11-23, 03:51   Link #483
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Guess what, people? We have actual harem in Okada’s Gundam. And by “harem” I mean real harem that’s taken seriously with one Casanova with plenty of wives and kids, not a bunch of highschool girls having a crush on one lame boy. You can also call it polygamy or polygyny.

Frankly, this is the first time polygyny being applied to one of the alpha male “good guys” in Gundam series where he treated his wives well and respects them, and the (badass) wives themselves love him back and being very friendly with each other (to the point of taking care of other wives’ babies). Usually, this kind of “gimmick” is only applied to antagonist characters which usually fit the “rich old fat bastard”-stereotype (I remember Gundam ZZ has such an antagonist which is practically an evil version of Hugh Hefner ).

So yeah, I just want to post this interesting turns of events here which is part of Okada’s writing for the latest Gundam series. And thanks to that, some female (and few males) reviewers and audiences have a bit of a mixed feelings on the episode when a polygamy/polygyny is portrayed as a good and working family unit (although the characters who practice it are pretty special cases themselves).
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Old 2015-11-23, 04:41   Link #484
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Knowing Okada, it's probably still some subliminal man hating message she is trying to portray.

It's just not possible.
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Old 2015-11-23, 06:40   Link #485
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That reminds me of Mushoku Tensei. I should check this Okada's Gundam, then.
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Old 2015-11-26, 16:32   Link #486
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I moved 35 posts to the Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread. Don't discuss the show's plot, character, and details here just because she's the author. If it's a discussion about the show, do it in a thread about the show.

If other people start these sorts of off-topic tangents then 1) report it, and 2) don't continue it.
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Old 2016-05-22, 09:18   Link #487
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Not entirely sure if this is the best idea, but oh well, let's find out.

Over the last two weeks, I've been translating Okada Mari's Bandai Creator's Selection interview, which was posted online on March 25 of this year. In the first half, she talks about working with Director Nagai Tatsuyuki on Gundam: IBO. And in the second half, she talks about her heroes, her MO, and the two series she's working on this season.

I'm not sure how many people are still interested in finding out exactly what Okada and other screenwriters do--to be honest, I don't think it's possible to find out from just one interview, no matter how comprehensive the Bandai Creator's Selection ones are. But here's another glimpse, at least.
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Old 2016-05-22, 09:28   Link #488
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Originally Posted by karice67 View Post
I'm not sure how many people are still interested in finding out exactly what Okada and other screenwriters do--to be honest, I don't think it's possible to find out from just one interview, no matter how comprehensive the Bandai Creator's Selection ones are. But here's another glimpse, at least.
Thanks, Karice!! I really appreciate it, especially the parts where she talked about IBO (being a Gundam fan that I am).
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Old 2016-05-26, 22:26   Link #489
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Originally Posted by karice67 View Post
Not entirely sure if this is the best idea, but oh well, let's find out.
It was definitely a good idea. I skipped ahead to the 2nd half, as I was most interested in hearing what Okada had to say on shows she's working on which are currently airing. And I found reading that, as well as some of her other comments, very informative and even somewhat fascinating. One thing nobody can take away from Okada is that she does great interviews. Extremely candid and detailed and often poetic in how she frames things. Thanks a lot for sharing this interview with us, Karice!

Reading what she had to say on Kiznaiver and Mayoiga sheds a lot of light on both shows. It might not soothe the critics of either or both shows, but it definitely goes a long way to explaining why they're the way they are.

In the case of Mayoiga, this interview definitely makes it sound like the Director is tightly and very thoroughly controlling the show. So Mayoiga's Director should probably get the lion's share of the credit/blame for how well/poorly this show does.


What Okada had to say about Kawamori was probably the most interesting section of Part 2 of this interview. I wasn't entirely happy with Aquarion EVOL, but it was a very fun ride with lots of charm and vibrancy. And I'm thoroughly enjoying Macross Delta right now. Kawamori really does seem to be a creative genius, at least in some ways.
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Old 2016-05-27, 03:18   Link #490
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Yeah, thanks for sharing, Karice. I also was mostly interested in the second part. I read the first one to see if there was something about who or how they dealt with the characters, since apart from their set up I didn't feel Okada's hand at all, but couldn't conclude much. Apart a little chuckle about the Ohana part, that implies it doesn't seem Okada's fault either.

About Kiznaiver and Mayoiga my personal impression matched more or less with what I read. Sure Mayoiga seems to suffer of an overload of info to be handled in such a short time on a very large cast of characters. and it's reflecting on the show I think. Sure I generally didn't feel Okada hand here either. And apparently it's true.
Instead I see hers in Kiznaiver, that I'm enjoying quite a bit so far, and coincidentally she is writing all the scripts.

I hoped to see some bit of info or her thoughts about my favorite shows but I got the impression she tried to stay away form commenting on her major or recent titles.


ps. I guess there's a typo about Angel Tales's year, that is 2001 not 1991.
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Old 2016-05-27, 07:57   Link #491
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
One thing nobody can take away from Okada is that she does great interviews. Extremely candid and detailed and often poetic in how she frames things.
That is something I've noticed, actually. After reading and listening to a few different creators, I’ve started to see differences in how they talk about their work. They use different words and phrases, different analogies etc, and that gives the reader a glimpse into their personality (well, through the person who wrote the interview out, and I don’t know how much editing he/she has done). To me, Okada talks about herself and her work in a really colourful way, so much so that I can see why other creators value her skills as a screenwriter.

That said, I can't say that everything in my translations is 'from her', so-to-speak. There are a few translators who’ve said something along the lines of ‘when you read a translation, 95% of the time, you’re reading me’. Whilst the percentage probably isn’t as high, that applies to creator interviews too. I do try to capture the impression they give me in a way that makes sense in English, but that does involve changing/adapting some of what they say. And I can’t definitely say that I’ve always interpreted a particular personality accurately…


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In the case of Mayoiga, this interview definitely makes it sound like the Director is tightly and very thoroughly controlling the show. So Mayoiga's Director should probably get the lion's share of the credit/blame for how well/poorly this show does.
Mizushima is definitely the one holding the reins here, yes, though I do wonder how it’s turning out. I’ve actually dropped Mayoiga, but there are a few things I’ve read/seen that make me wonder if I should pick it up again, to see how it all plays out…


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What Okada had to say about Kawamori was probably the most interesting section of Part 2 of this interview. I wasn't entirely happy with Aquarion EVOL, but it was a very fun ride with lots of charm and vibrancy. And I'm thoroughly enjoying Macross Delta right now. Kawamori really does seem to be a creative genius, at least in some ways.
That one section was actually the reason I ended up translating the second half as well. In fact, the Bandai Creator’s interview that came out two days ago is actually Delta’s director, Yasuda Kenji, and he has a similar read on Kawamori.

Admittedly, I’ve been brushing up on Macross by reading interviews and listening to all of Macrossworld’s SpeakerPodcast, so it didn’t surprise me at all. ^^


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About Kiznaiver and Mayoiga my personal impression matched more or less with what I read. Sure Mayoiga seems to suffer of an overload of info to be handled in such a short time on a very large cast of characters. and it's reflecting on the show I think. Sure I generally didn't feel Okada hand here either. And apparently it's true. Instead I see hers in Kiznaiver, that I'm enjoying quite a bit so far, and coincidentally she is writing all the scripts.
(And @Triple_R as well) I’m also not entire sure what people mean when they say “Okada’s hand” or similar things. I’ve tried asking before elsewhere, but no one seems to want to answer, so perhaps I can take this chance to ask again. What do you all associate with Okada? And if it’s something general like “emasculation of male characters,” can you note a few examples from the shows she’s worked on?

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I hoped to see some bit of info or her thoughts about my favorite shows but I got the impression she tried to stay away form commenting on her major or recent titles.

ps. I guess there's a typo about Angel Tales's year, that is 2001 not 1991.
That’s probably because she’s done many interviews about them, and has had less of a chance to talk about her earlier works because so few current fans know about them. I’m glad she chose to mention Kawamori, though. That’s was a real gem ^^

And thanks for that. That was actually from the original interview (>_>), though I should have noticed since I did link the wikipedia page.

In any case, you're both very welcome. Glad you find it useful.
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Last edited by karice67; 2016-06-01 at 00:53.
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Old 2016-05-28, 15:22   Link #492
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(And @Triple_R as well) I’m also not entire sure what people mean when they say “Okada’s hand” or similar things. I’ve tried asking before elsewhere, but no one seems to want to answer, so perhaps I can take this chance to ask again. What do you all associate with Okada? And if it’s something general like “emasculation of male characters,” can you note a few examples from the shows she’s worked on?
In the end I think is something very subjective and people kinda like to address this or that about her depending on their personal taste or distaste. I also didn't watch all her works and some I've dropped, so yeah. In any case in this same thread I wrote this:
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My opinion about her writing is that we should separate what she write to what she is asked to write as also what amuses her to write to what she love writing. Not really an easy task. But the fact that she is still so valued should be telling a bit to discern that differences.
Basically I'm under the impression that there's things that amuse her to write and others that she put passion in it. This latter is what I consider her "hand". more specifically I find that she can be extremely sensible depicting subtle character to character dynamics or in giving certain depth to her characters, in rounding them. And it's something that has to do with details than background stories, storyline or the likes. And that's what I feel as being her hand.

While people instead tend to accuse her to be overdramatic and unsubtle. And here's where my divide came from.
She can be overdramatic and unsubtle or vice-versa depends on what she is asked to write. And the former is what amuses her and for this reason she can go overboard easily. And whatever it is true or not I don't find this kind of writing particularly defining.
Instead her ability in being subtle and expanding her characters through details is where I think she is more passionate and where I think I can feel it (her hand).

Of course is just my feeling, strongly related on my tastes. But then I read this piece of your translation the other day that in some ways seems to match with it:
Quote:
He was a director who placed a lot of importance on the space “between the lines.” At that time, I was a writer who always left many things unsaid—stuff “between the lines,” so-to-speak. The points I liked and focused on were not really looked upon favourably by the industry, and I was going through a sense of crisis, wondering if my way of thinking was just wrong. That’s when I met Director Amino, and he helped me realise that it’s okay to place value on that. Of course, it’s not enough by itself.
Her writing between the lines is part of what I feel being her distinctive trait (or where it comes from) while her filling these spaces where she is not exactly passionate with, and apparently is what she had to "learn" to write in opposition to what was natural to her. (I defined it as amused, and it's fun since it also fits with her colorful way of talking).
Basically here she implied a similar distinction of mine. (Of course it could be meaningless, still this surely reinforced this impression I have of her writing no matter what ).

This piece seems to imply another part of my take, the most obvious, when she said her way of writing didn't match with the industry and so she had to adjust to fit. This kinda goes along with the idea of her "being asked to write" this or that more than being, say, some personal quirks she wants to put into her stories.
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Old 2016-05-30, 19:23   Link #493
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Thanks for that, Arya. I really appreciate how you've elaborated on what you said in that earlier post.


I am still hoping that other people will reply, though, because I'm mostly on a 'fact-finding' mission at the moment. I've seen a lot of people commenting (mostly negatively) about Okada's work over the last few years, but usually with just vague references to what they mean, so I'm just trying to clarify what everyone's saying.

Well, except when it comes to adaptations, where it's clear that some people blame her for ruining them. And there, what I've read so far implies that she wasn't the one making the key decisions in those cases, not even for Black Butler/Kuroshitsuji, where she was apparently given quite a loose rein with Claude and Alois's characters...
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Old 2016-05-31, 22:34   Link #494
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(And @Triple_R as well) I’m also not entire sure what people mean when they say “Okada’s hand” or similar things. I’ve tried asking before elsewhere, but no one seems to want to answer, so perhaps I can take this chance to ask again. What do you all associate with Okada? And if it’s something general like “emasculation of male characters,” can you note a few examples from the shows she’s worked on?
I think I see what Arya means by not feeling Okada's hand in Mayoiga. Mayoiga has some light romantic subtext, but it's very mild for an Okada-wrote work with good gender balance among the full cast. The male and female leads in particular don't feel much like Okada-style characters. That's not an insult or a compliment, just an observation.

Here are some things that some anime viewers tend to associate with Mari Okada:

1. Heavy duty romance drama
2. Theatrical melodrama in general
3. Strong female leads
4. Weak or emasculated male characters

I've come to the conclusion that the 4th one on this list has been exaggerated, and is overly based on one lone show - Hanasaku Iroha. I also think the 4th one on this list is due to a mutual bleed-over between Okada's reputation and PA Works' reputation in general. Between True Tears and HSI, Okada was a leading figure in PAW's early days, and I think this resulted in an unusual case of a particular anime writer being associated with a particular anime studio in the minds of some anime fans.

Now PAW's male leads often do leave a lot to be desired. But then, most PAW shows are not wrote by Okada. And, ironically, I would consider True Tears' Shinichiro to be one of PAW's stronger male leads, and Okada wrote True Tears. So, again, I really do think HSI looms a bit larger than it probably should in the minds of some anime fans when it comes to evaluating Okada as a writer.


Now, the first three on this list - I think Okada has mostly earned her reputation there, but it's obviously not all bad ("strong female leads" is certainly something Okada can take pride in). So we're left with heavy duty romance drama and theatrical melodrama (and it should be noted that even these aren't necessarily negative, they're just negative for some viewers).

For Heavy Duty Romance Drama - There's True Tears, Aquarion EVOL, and Anohana to some extent. If we were to boil it down further, Okada does seem to have a certain attachment to major female characters that endure unrequited love. True Tears and Aquarion EVOL deals pretty heavily with this, and so does the very recent Okada-wrote movie The Anthem of the Heart. "Major female character endures a lot of unrequited love" has shown up enough in Okada's works that it really does seem to be something she has a strong personal interest in. My suspicion is that it likely reflects her own personal life, but I'm not sure how much I want to delve into that suspicion.

For Theatrical Melodrama - All of the anime listed for "Heavy Duty Romance Drama" count here as well. Anohana has characters crying in literally every episode. Black Rock Shooter's TV series has some of the most ridiculously psychotic characters I've ever seen in anime. WIXOSS' antagonists are like a more refined (and hence fun!) version of what BRS TV has.


I think that sums things up decently well. I'm certainly open to changing my mind on Okada, and I think her current reputation is probably harsher than it deserves to be. Her strengths as a writer currently isn't getting as much attention as they deserve, in my view.
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Old 2016-06-01, 01:17   Link #495
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Thanks, Triple_R. That big picture summary and the examples you've provide do help me understand a little more what the discussion has been about.

(Though of course, I'd be more than happy to see more of the other posters who were active here in the past chip in with their own thoughts. So please do, if you're still around!)

Admittedly, I've only seen one of the works you've named (AnoHana), and have seen only about one third of the series that she done series composition for... I am planning to watch Anthem of the Heart and NagiAsu, though... ). That's probably one of the reasons I find it difficult to follow any Okada discussion unless people give specific and detailed examples.

I'm working on a post about Okada's involvement in some of those controversial works. I was thinking of starting with 'spin-off' type original works (True Tears, Black Butler, Aquarion, Gundam, even the Kenshin: New Kyoto Arc), but based on what you've pointed out, perhaps something specifically on what she's done with P.A.Works might be useful...
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Old 2016-06-01, 23:22   Link #496
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One small thought is that I wonder if there is a difference between someone's "style" and what becomes their "calling card". For example, a number of interviews have mentioned that True Tears was a work that caused Okada to be noticed as a writer, and it had a certain style. She commented herself that a lot of the plot decisions in that show were influenced by the director and the other writers, but nevertheless it became a sort of "calling card". So when she's called upon by other production committees, particularly for other original work, they may say "I really liked what you did in True Tears; give me more like that". Obviously there's some of herself in everything she does, but it could be not so different than an actor who gets "typecast" into a certain role. But it may be worth considering the possible difference between "the sorts of works she often writes" and "the style of writing" (which may have more to do with the way she writes dialog, the way she develops characters, and so on).

Just a thought anyway. Personally, I've always thought the attention she got as a writer was always a bit out of balance (and, in the case of some people, a bit unhealthy), but romantic drama/melodrama tend to attract a fairly passionate niche audience, and in those circles, some of her works are the most famous and well-regarded (if sometimes controversial).
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Old 2016-06-02, 02:17   Link #497
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Thanks for that. I'll refrain from commenting here at present because I'm trying to get an overview of what posters in this thread have talked about in the past, rather than trying to change the way that anyone thinks about Okada and her past projects.

I did come across something on AKB0048 that I'm a bit curious about though. On pages 4-5, people started referring to complaints by staff working on the show about Okada's work/attitude. I haven't seen the show, and a brief google search didn't net me anything, so could someone please tell me what that was about?
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Old 2016-06-03, 07:57   Link #498
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For Heavy Duty Romance Drama - There's True Tears, Aquarion EVOL, and Anohana to some extent. If we were to boil it down further, Okada does seem to have a certain attachment to major female characters that endure unrequited love. True Tears and Aquarion EVOL deals pretty heavily with this, and so does the very recent Okada-wrote movie The Anthem of the Heart. "Major female character endures a lot of unrequited love" has shown up enough in Okada's works that it really does seem to be something she has a strong personal interest in. My suspicion is that it likely reflects her own personal life, but I'm not sure how much I want to delve into that suspicion.

For Theatrical Melodrama - All of the anime listed for "Heavy Duty Romance Drama" count here as well. Anohana has characters crying in literally every episode. Black Rock Shooter's TV series has some of the most ridiculously psychotic characters I've ever seen in anime. WIXOSS' antagonists are like a more refined (and hence fun!) version of what BRS TV has.
I'll add Nagi no Asukara to the list, more than Aquarion EVOL (that admittedly failed on me, and probably not just me, about the character developments, and it's not just about Zess). This one I consider a sort of intersection/join between True Tears and Anohana, having romance drama, melodrama but also a fair amount of subtlety depends on what you decide to focus on. And also speaking of males, they are all quite well portrayed, starting from the MC, with his highs and lows, to Tsumugu to even, say, Akari's husband. Granted they all have their on flaws, but it is as it should be.

Instead I'm quite curious about Kizanvier since it seems to be a sort of experimentation (yeah, yeah, it feels a bit redundant if you know what the show is about) since it's taking an odd route, so I'd be interested into what she may have to say about this show in the future. It's like she is trying to blend the two approaches I was speaking earlier into one.
And well, for unrequited love, I can say that, at least so far, it is a checked box into the Kizavier settings list.
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Old 2016-06-03, 08:19   Link #499
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I'll add Nagi no Asukara to the list, more than Aquarion EVOL (that admittedly failed on me, and probably not just me, about the character developments, and it's not just about Zess). This one I consider a sort of intersection/join between True Tears and Anohana, having romance drama, melodrama but also a fair amount of subtlety depends on what you decide to focus on. And also speaking of males, they are all quite well portrayed, starting from the MC, with his highs and lows, to Tsumugu to even, say, Akari's husband. Granted they all have their on flaws, but it is as it should be.
Good points on Nagi no Asukara. I somehow forgot to include that show in my last post on this thread. NnA is definitely a strong example of Okada's tendency towards heavy romance drama and theatrical melodrama.

However, like you said, NnA is also a strong counterargument against the idea that Okada's male characters are weak or emasculated. Hikari is brash, fiery, confident, and aggressive - A very masculine character. Kaname and Tsumugu are smooth and surefooted. Akari's husband is likeable and tends to handle things pretty well, from what I can recall. Yes, they all have flaws, but they all have good screen-presence and good moments and don't come across as weak. I'd honestly say that NnA's male characters are stronger than its female characters.
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Old 2016-06-13, 21:27   Link #500
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Thanks Karice to translating all of this.

Quote:
But then he told me that he “wanted something like Hanasaku Iroha (2011), which had me wondering what in the world he meant. So I went back to look at the protagonist from that show, Ohana—she’s someone who really goes all out to give her best, and that just brings her a lot of painful experiences, right (chuckles).
I laughed. Basically it was like for IBO as I suggested. That's so direct. Female character? Like Ohana obviously.

O: What kind of female character do you want?
S: Someone like Ohana
O: What kind of male characaters do you want?
S: I think you should start from scratch. Hey weren't you involved with FSN?

Kudelia though seems to have gone a different route, though I suppose we also have idealism shattered much like in someone else's "OH YOU HAZ IDEALS LOL" work. Though Okada is pretty adept at this. Not a bad idea, though I really have had to start on IBO again. She seems pretty good when it comes to Gundam female protagonists which usually I find pretty weak. Maybe I just haven't watched enough Gundam, but it just seems like all the interesting female characters are evil? (Well, Cecily and Audrey were decent...)
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It doesn't sound like my love is getting to you.
I will not lose anymore; I will not give up.
More passion than hope, much deeper than despair.... Love!

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Guild Wars 2 SN: ArchonWing.9480
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