Learning Japanese

[nikorai]

mendokusaさん

説明ありがとうございます。
全部分かりました。
でも、日本語で話したほうがいいのではないでしょうか。どう思いますか？

just a little there are different meaning of same kanji in japan and china.

その通りですね。時々、言語によって漢字の意味が違います。たとえば、中国語で「手紙」という漢字は「トイ レットペーパー」の意味があります。また、「馬上」という言葉は日本語で「直ぐ」ということを意味します。 （馬が速く走れますから。）

Don't work too hard.

はい、そうします。でも、練習が少ないから、日本語をすぐ忘れちゃいます。

[Miko Miko]

Is this correct?

Eng: Are you lying to me?
Jap: 私に嘘をついていますか?
Rom: watashi ni uso wo tsuite imasu ka?

Just want to know if the Japanese and Romanization are correct. I can't read kanji so I wouldn't know and I am not familiar with ALL the hiragana yet.

[sonotme_9FedriqSama]

Originally Posted by mendokusa

this change easy to understand it.
勝手に人の家に上がりこんでいるんじゃないよ
this "こん" isn't "来るkuru",becouse "来る"should change "来て（kite）"then.
so,this "こん" is "込むkomu",and "込む"should change "込みで(komide)"then.
but "込みで" is not easy to speak.
”上がりこみで”→（撥音便hatsuonnbinn）"上がりこんで"

"～でいるんじゃないよ”→”～でるんじゃないよ”→”でんじゃないよ”
when someone already have entered.

勝手に人ん家上がってんじゃねーよ。
when someone is entering just now.

”ないよ”→”ねーよ”

So the ko is not of 来: to came but of 込: to crowd
and the こんでん is short for こんでいるん

But the meaning of the sentence as I gave earlier... does it change or will it remain as it is?

And this changes in speech are the short versions...
"～でいるんじゃないよ”→”～でるんじゃないよ”→ ”でんじゃないよ” → when already entered

and

"上がって"んじゃね agatte part will be there when event is happening (so the sentence will be come "don't just enter into somebody's home without permission) lol...doen't sound different in english now does it...?

I hope I got that right?

And what about that konaide sentence is that verbally correct?
勝手に人の家上がって"こないで". [Event happening since agatte part is there]

I mean with what you just explained it look wrong...

can you tell me more about what is this "撥音便 (hatsuonnbinn）" i'm not that familiar with it

Arigatou Mendokusa-san

[sonotme_9FedriqSama]

Originally Posted by Miko Miko

Is this correct?

Eng: Are you lying to me?
Jap: 私に嘘をついていますか?
Rom: watashi ni uso wo tsuite imasu ka?

Just want to know if the Japanese and Romanization are correct. I can't read kanji so I wouldn't know and I am not familiar with ALL the hiragana yet.

looks correct to me...but then again I am basic learner

sound more like
"are you telling me a lie?"

watashini uso wo tsuiteimasu ka?

Also i guess

私に嘘吐いてんのか？
watashi ni usotsuitennoka?
[Edit: so as mendokusa san said を part gets curt of in informal]

will be informal I guess...

Expert on Japnese please clear our doubts....

[Miko Miko]

Originally Posted by Miko Miko

Is this correct?

Eng: Are you lying to me?
Jap: 私に嘘をついていますか?
Rom: watashi ni uso wo tsuite imasu ka?

Just want to know if the Japanese and Romanization are correct. I can't read kanji so I wouldn't know and I am not familiar with ALL the hiragana yet.

Anyone going to reply yet?

Sorry no patience. *hits self on head*

[nikorai]

Miko Miko

Anyone going to reply yet?

Sorry no patience. *hits self on head*

sonotme_9FedriqSama-san has replied to you above.
The sentence about lying looks perfect to me from the grammar point of view. But then again, I'm not an expert. mendokusaさん is.
By the way, learning kana takes 2 days (as it was in case with me) but everything else takes years to learn even a basic idea about, let alone use it in speech freely.

[Bou]

Eng: Are you lying to me?
Jap: 私に嘘をついていますか?
Rom: watashi ni uso wo tsuite imasu ka?

I am not 100% good at Japanese but I do believe that translates exactly.
I am intermediate if i not good enough i am sorry Miko Miko

sound more like
"are you telling me a lie?"
watashini uso wo tsuiteimasu ka?

Its basically the same, only the words are altered a little.
are you telling me a lie? = watashi ni uso wo iteiru?
are you lying to me? = watashi ni uso wo tsuite imasu ka?
Pretty much the same. Not much of different sentence structure.




btw I am still revising but how many kanji are there? Was it 2000?

[sonotme_9FedriqSama]

I suck at kanji....since I started learning japanese by myself and am still doing it...I just randomly look at words...I can identify basic kanjis, like kita: come, nani: what, jibun: myself...but most mangas have hiragana written beside them so...i can just interpret the meaning of the sentence by looking kanji's of word in dictionary...and if i come across the same kanji once or twice I am able to remember it and what it means...so basically i am not learning kanji specifically...I pick up as I go...slowly

this is a website wihich give kanji learning by grade...try llearning according to it...

Spoiler:

http://www.jref.com/language/grade_breakdown_kanji_gakunenbetsu.shtml

[nikorai]

sonotme_9FedriqSama
These kanji look familiar to me. Does that mean I'm as good as a Japanese middle schooler?
Actually, I don't specifically learn kanji either. Once it was time when I used a textbook for the beginners. There were lists of words in each unit but also a list of kanji. There were around 20-30 new kanji in each unit listed separately. And about 40 units in total in 2 volumes of the textbook.
Now I'm using a textbook for intermediate level. In each unit there are 50-100 new words with kanji and reading and you just memorize the words. And since I don't practice kanji I can't really write them. Except for the easy ones. Last year I switched completely to using my PC but that's very bad for writing skills even if it's much more convenient.

I'm translating articles from G's magazine at the moment. If I bump into new words I first try to guess on-yomi. if nothing helps I have to use IME handwriting tool　（ 漢字を知らなかったら、手書きツールを使うしかない。）

mendokusaさん
I'm not sure if it's appropriate to ask. I've been translating iDOLM@STER bonus DVD from Xbox 360 game. I did all the script (typed Japanese) but there are many points where I didn't make out words　(難しいところに赤で印を付きました）. I have the video, too(ビデオもアップロードしました）. The script is 70 pages long. 日本語のスクリプトは７０ページの長さです。間違いだらけです。　ちょっと見てもらえませんか 。

[mendokusa]

Eng: Are you lying to me?
Jap: 私に嘘をついていますか?
Rom: watashi ni uso wo tsuite imasu ka?

can translate some patterns
あなたは私に嘘usoを吐tsuいていますか？
あなたは私を欺azamuいていますか?
あなたは私をだましていますか？
these's same meaning.
私に嘘吐tsuいてんのか
when angry or informal.


I'm sorry to other people.
have no time now,I will come here this night.

[lixuelai]

嘘 used in the polite form sounds wierd lol.

[Raiga]

This is more of a random observation than anything else, but I was taking a stab at song lyrics just now and let me say 凸凹 is officially the coolest Kanji compound I've ever seen.

[DeathTofu]

im a frustrated japanese ^^


i want to learn some ^^

[mendokusa]

私に嘘をついていますか？

addition,
私 read watashi and watakushi.

(1)勝手に人ん家に上がりこんでんじゃないよ。
(2)勝手に人ん家に上がってんじゃないよ。

when someone entered my room,I say (1)or(2).
when someone will be entering from my house's door,I say (2).
(1) enter deeper than (2).

込koむ･･･into,include

家に上がる･･･stand on house's fooler

when the sentence is used,just enter into somebody's home without permission.
but the sentence don't include the meaning of "without permission".


上がって来koないで is right.

音便onnbinn
change about verb
4 kind of onnbinn
イ音便・・・・・・・・・巻maきて（巻く）→巻いて
無音便mu・・・・・・・・話hanaして（話す）→話して
撥音便hatsu・・・・・・踏huみて（踏む）→踏んで
促音便soku・・・・・・・打uつて（打つ）→打って
hatsu is んnn
soku is っxtsu

First
verb of onnbinn change ～anai
巻かない、話さない、踏まない、打たない
Next
what is one letter before "anai"?
k or g →～いてor～いで
s→～して
m→～んで
t→～って

exception
行iく→行いて→行って

[mendokusa]

"are you telling me a lie?"

just translate,
あなたは私に嘘を言っていますか？

that sentence can use in japan.
but Normally japanese use
あなたは私に嘘をついていますか？


you say "I'm male",and you tell me lie.
あなたは「私は男です」と言って、嘘をつく。

like the sentence,often used with "say".
あなたは「私は男です」と言って、嘘を言う。
not easy to understand it.


to nikorai
If I can help you,do that.

A bit I play iDOLM@STER with PSP.


to Raiga
Can you read that?
(1)凸凹
(2)凹凸

[nikorai]

mendokusaさん

If I can help you,do that.

A bit I play iDOLM@STER with PSP.

Are you going to help me for real? That would be awesome. Thank you very much.
Speaking of im@s, I thought to get a Japanese xbox 360 (order by post) but still can't find a suitable moment to do that.


The video
http://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/7fe7no
And the script for it (it was very difficult for me to type. It’s 70 pages long)
http://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/rihwm2

Anime video:
http://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/unkyx1

Also I have the script for the anime -
http://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/fboavu

There was one line that I didn’t understand. I repeatedly listened to it for 8 hours straight but it left me puzzled.
13.44
This is all I could manage to get:
「苦労をかけないでよね」

The resulting subtitles should look like this (with very nice karaoke effects):
http://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/bg7lpz

[lixuelai]

Originally Posted by Raiga

This is more of a random observation than anything else, but I was taking a stab at song lyrics just now and let me say 凸凹 is officially the coolest Kanji compound I've ever seen.

They mean exactly what you would think they mean too. It is the same in Chinese as well.

[Raiga]

Originally Posted by lixuelai

They mean exactly what you would think they mean too. It is the same in Chinese as well.

Yah I remember them from Chinese, only I forget how to pronounce the second one *heads to unihan to check* oh yeah wa1 or ao1. I never properly learned how to write the weird shaped ones. :\ But fun examples of characters looking just like what they mean, and they look so funny next to each other. XD

@mendokusa: I knew how they were read written as 凸凹 (from the song) but looking it up again I didn't notice the second reading, and it looks like written as 凹凸 there's only one reading. Well, I know them all now. Dekoboko is still my favorite though. It sounds... cute. Dekoboko. Dekoboko.

Hm, looks like the modern Chinese tu sound came into Japanese as とつ... both in this case with 凸 (which is tu1 in Chinese) and 突然 (which is tu1ran2 in Chinese). I'll file that away in my memory of common Chinese/Japanese sound parallels.

[sonotme_9FedriqSama]

Originally Posted by mendokusa

(1)勝手に人ん家に上がりこんでんじゃないよ。
(2)勝手に人ん家に上がってんじゃないよ。

when someone entered my room,I say (1)or(2).
when someone will be entering from my house's door,I say (2).
(1) enter deeper than (2).

込koむ･･･into,include

家に上がる･･･stand on house's fooler

when the sentence is used,just enter into somebody's home without permission.
but the sentence don't include the meaning of "without permission".


上がって来koないで is right.

音便onnbinn
change about verb
4 kind of onnbinn
イ音便・・・・・・・・・巻maきて（巻く）→巻いて
無音便mu・・・・・・・・話hanaして（話す）→話して
撥音便hatsu・・・・・・踏huみて（踏む）→踏んで
促音便soku・・・・・・・打uつて（打つ）→打って
hatsu is んnn
soku is っxtsu

First
verb of onnbinn change ～anai
巻かない、話さない、踏まない、打たない
Next
what is one letter before "anai"?
k or g →～いてor～いで
s→～して
m→～んで
t→～って

exception
行iく→行いて→行って

Komapsumida mendokusa-san...

So basically when the person has already steped inside the house (1) is the likely way to say... (2) while on door enterence...I think I got that...

I really didn't know about these "change about verb"....but I was able to understand the verbal sentences properly...its when reading I'm getting like

有り難う once again mendokusa-san ~
(ok how should I say that in jap: hutatabiarigatou 再び有り難う ???... am I right?)

when the sentence is used,just enter into somebody's home without permission.
but the sentence don't include the meaning of "without permission".....so it'll be...

"don't just enter into somebody's home as you please"

Any special reason that 行く doesn't changes...is it because it can be confused with 生(i)き???

Originally Posted by lixuelai

They mean exactly what you would think they mean too. It is the same in Chinese as well.

....dekoboko, outotsu?...what are they said in chinese?

[nikorai]

sonotme_9FedriqSama

(ok how should I say that in jap: hutatabiarigatou 再び有り難う ???... am I right?)

Yes, that works perfectly.
Or you can say あらためて、[説明]ありがとうございます。

Indeed, I didn't know about the whole 音便 thing. In my textbook, the verb change was explained using a table. It was basically said that 'japanese verbs are like that. Learn the pattern". But there was nothing about the phonetic change and terminology (i/mu/hatsu/soku). Maybe I should start reading about grammar in Japanese after all. Because it looks like I miss a lot of things here.