2012-02-13, 17:34 | Link #801 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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This is a battle of wills. In my opinion, if people don't have the will and the patience, they wouldn't pass this test. To make a person give up, you must beat him in his own game, or find a common ground and then deal that blow that'll make the opponent lose the edge and give up. I think Gon wanting a "fair" match is not much far from the purpose of this test. This is not a simple one-on-one hand combat.
Hanzo, I think, was really hasty here. He went to view Gon as a kid and went to torture him, thinking that just like any ordinary kid, he'll just give up in fear of getting hurt. But Gon is not ordinary. I think his confrontation with Hisoka prior is one example. Even that play with Netero comes to mind. Gon already has unbelievable guts and is stubborn (and crazy even). Hanzou has to play another game to make Gon give up. Hanzou played the torture/fear game, and he lost, not just because of Gon, but also his inability to know the opponent better. Gon already faced death couple of times in the past, this is no exception. Gon asking for a a fair game points on what Hanzou has failed to do. Last edited by kakakka; 2012-02-13 at 17:51. |
2012-02-13, 17:36 | Link #802 |
Seishu's Ace
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Kobe, Japan
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I don't think it is that simple, and I don't think you're giving him enough credit. I do believe his desire to have a "fair fight" with Hanzo was genuine (though that wouldn't really have been fair to Hanzo) but he also knew at the most basic level he didn't have to physically defeat Hanzo - he just had to make him surrender.
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2012-02-13, 17:45 | Link #803 | ||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Even if Gon didn't surrender, Leorio or Kurapika would have intervened, and Hanzo would have won. Quote:
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But so did Hanzo. It's hard to say he was truly outsmarted. It's not like Hanzo has to beat Gon. |
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2012-02-13, 19:11 | Link #804 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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What's the point of not giving up if you can't do anything after that? I hate giving up myself, heck, I have torn my knee ligament 3-4 times now and I still keep training for this last 7-8 years of constant injuries! My family, coach and doctors told me to stop long time ago and yet I'm still opposing their decision! However, if I tear it again I will most likely stop because if this continues, I might become disabled and that's 100% not the future I want! But after I have my last surgery I will put everything into rehabilitation, strengthening the muscles and training so in case I tear it again, I won't have any regrets in the future. The person should know the limits and think about future more too, not just present.
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2012-02-13, 19:31 | Link #805 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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2012-02-13, 23:49 | Link #806 | |
Radical Dreamer
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Washington DC
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2012-02-14, 00:57 | Link #807 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
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in this exam of wills if you don't figure out a way to make your opponent surrender then you lost, even if you're stronger, sure hanzo could have break more bones but at that point hanzo knew even if he do that the situation wouldn't change and he wouldn't win... so why keep torturing your opponent if you know you are gonna lost anyway? what makes hanzo give up was gon's determination so I think gon's winning was fair enough |
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2012-02-14, 02:31 | Link #808 | ||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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2012-02-14, 03:16 | Link #809 |
Seishu's Ace
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Kobe, Japan
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Your argument is based on the assumption that Gon, under enough pain, would eventually give up. I don't think Hanzo was "unwilling to do what it takes" - I think he simply believed Gon would lose consciousness or die before surrendering. Thus, there was no way for Hanzo to win.
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2012-02-14, 03:48 | Link #810 |
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The town where Copernicus was born.
Age: 38
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@Guardian Enzo
You've failed to notice the other thing Anh_Minh was talking about, i.e. that Leorio and Kurapica would intervene if Hanzo did (or tried to do) any more damage. Hanzo knew about it because he saw how Leorio reacted and also saw that he was warned by the judges. Anyway, I agree with Anh_Minh on this. Although it wasn't only that Hanzo was being nice, he also knew that his next opponent won't be anyone in his league either and that he would have 4 more chances (he saw the chart) and since he wasn't a sadist it would be an overkill to torture Gon any further just to receive a reward he would get anyway (but a moment later). |
2012-02-14, 04:01 | Link #811 |
Seishu's Ace
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Kobe, Japan
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I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that Leorio and Kurapika were going to step in. Kurpika went red-eyed at the idea that Hanzo was going to cut Gon's legs off, but that was always a bluff and once Gon called it, I think the two of them realized that whatever happened, Gon wouldn't want them to interfere.
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2012-02-14, 05:10 | Link #813 | |
Adeptus Animus
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Gon didn't have a clever psychological plan, he just wouldn't give up, regardless of Hanzo's threats. Even if he had cut of his legs, Gon still wouldn't have given up. That's just who he is. A stubborn little juggernaut who will continue on once he sets his mind to something, regardless of the danger to himself. |
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2012-02-14, 08:26 | Link #815 | |
Beautiful fighter.
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: England, UK
Age: 37
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2012-02-14, 12:38 | Link #816 | |
User of the "Fast Draw"
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I find the whole interfering policy kind of odd though. If you jump in then the guy you help fails. Which means if you wanted to pass just get involved in the match of someone who you don't mind seeing fail . Of course probably would adapt the rule depending on the relationship between competitors, but would be funny if it was a standard rule.
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Anything is possible, but I just don't see any reason to believe they wouldn't have gotten involved if Hanzo had continued with the method of systematically beating Gon senseless.
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2012-02-14, 13:37 | Link #817 |
Kamen Rider Muppeteer
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Unknown
Age: 39
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I thought it was clearly established that Gon is an idiot. And not the comical kind. Why are people surprised by this? I don't think anyone would disagree that Gon was lucky enough that his opponent had the common sense to both realise that continuing to pressure him would be pointless, and that killing him and re-taking the exam next year was unnecessary.
In fact, the only character who did not have this common sense was Killua... Which reminds me, this is the point in the story where it takes its "First turn towards a darker story". |
2012-02-14, 13:57 | Link #818 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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While I agree Hanzo could have continued, I find a bit hard to believe that he "chose not to continue". Hhhmmm, how do I explain this...
I do think Hanzou did things that hurt Gon alot, and that could lead to Leorio and Kurapica interfering. But after that kick from Gon, I think that made some impact on Hanzo and also, as we saw, to the watchers around. Hanzo is a guy who sometimes gets lost in the moment (monkey impersonation, the manga's sushi test, getting fooled by Killua) and I think when he decided to go for threatening Gon's life, he became sucked into Gon's tide/flow. He became embarrassed and impatient. It's not that he decided not to continue torturing Gon, but he failed to realize (or lost it somewhere...) the implications/results if he continued at that moment. That's my take. Last edited by kakakka; 2012-02-14 at 14:07. |
2012-02-14, 14:04 | Link #819 | |
Amor Fati
Join Date: Oct 2011
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action, shounen |
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