Why is Eric such a jerk?

[project myu]

I just watched the first episode of Full Metal Alchemist and he just comes to some city and wants to steal the stone from the priest for his own selfish reasons? And what the heck is his problem, so what if other people believe in God, why's he gotta try to force his lack of faith on others? And even though the priest is a fraud, just like he said, it's a wealthy city now where everyone's happy..

[I_Know_Spoilers]

uh, his name is Ed Elric.

anyway, it's probably because he doesnt' want the citizens to be sucked into the proverbial black whole which is a false sense of security. did you just get started in the series?

[323Familia]

christians have been forcing their belief in god on others for hundreds of years. Sometimes it goes the other way, get over it. Don't worry about it so much and enjoy a great series.

[project myu]

I dunno, he wants the stone to restore himself and his brother.. Sounds more like he cares more about himself than the city people. As for the comment on Christians forcing their beliefs, two wrongs don't make a right.

[Gluttony]

Did you even notice what the false priest wants to do? He's going to abuse the stone much more than the Elrics. He plans to use the people's false faith and extort money from them, and use them as his own private army. Don't you think they're better off without it? Ed is bringing down a dictator.

[I_Know_Spoilers]

Originally Posted by 323Familia

christians have been forcing their belief in god on others for hundreds of years. Sometimes it goes the other way, get over it. Don't worry about it so much and enjoy a great series.

hey man, i'm a christian, and that kinda hurts. anyway, we're not forcing you to belive what we believe (unless you count those catholic guys from around the time spanish settlers came to North and Sout America and forced the natives to become catholic, that's a whole other story that i would be glad to inform you about, so pm me if you want more info.), that's just your opinion.

[project myu]

Originally Posted by Gluttony

Did you even notice what the false priest wants to do? He's going to abuse the stone much more than the Elrics. He plans to use the people's false faith and extort money from them, and use them as his own private army. Don't you think they're better off without it? Ed is bringing down a dictator.

Well, Ed deduced that the priest was going to become wealthy himself off of donations and whatnot, but really, at what expense? Not at the people's because they all becames successful along with the city. In hindsight, it's better that the priest was killed but there was no way that Ed would've known that he was some psycho who was going to create an army.

By the way, I'm a Christian, too (I'm a part of a fellowship at my school and attend church regularly on my own).

[I_Know_Spoilers]

whoot! another christian on this board. anway, it sux for the priest to get eaten. can you imagine what that would feel like? ugh.

[SlasherX]

He wanted to create an army of blind believers. What better way to die in battle than to believe you are fighting for someone who you believe can revive them. Religion is still a tool to mass believers for a purpose. (An opinion)

[haunterex]

Originally Posted by I_Know_Spoilers

hey man, i'm a christian, and that kinda hurts. anyway, we're not forcing you to belive what we believe (unless you count those catholic guys from around the time spanish settlers came to North and Sout America and forced the natives to become catholic, that's a whole other story that i would be glad to inform you about, so pm me if you want more info.), that's just your opinion.

no offense, but that's what organised religions, especially christianity and its sister counterpart, islam/muslim do. Your religion requires you to "spread the words" and "show the true way" to everyone because that's the "right" thing to do. And dont try to push the blame onto catholic, its just different branch of the same bs. It origins from the same bookers, but with differen readers interpreting it differently and claimed themselves to be correct.
Christianity nowaday, especially in america, is still the primary and dictative religion.
For christians, it's ok to incoropate, act and show their faith because of "freedom" and "righteous". But it's considered an attack or discrimination if an atheist/agnostic or people from other religions to oppose any christian views in society.

Originally Posted by project myu

I just watched the first episode of Full Metal Alchemist and he just comes to some city and wants to steal the stone from the priest for his own selfish reasons? And what the heck is his problem, so what if other people believe in God, why's he gotta try to force his lack of faith on others? And even though the priest is a fraud, just like he said, it's a wealthy city now where everyone's happy..

what the hell is his problem?? what the hell is wrong with your logic?
ed and al exposed the priest's scheme and his fake religion which were lying and cheating the people. The problem here isnt believing in god, but believing in a false god and a false religion. ( even though all religions could be fake).
you need to learn how to read buddy, everyone was happy under a big fat lie, and the priest is cashing out on these people's hopes and dreams.
Can you see a parallel image with real world's religion???


faith has no place in reality and science, just as fact and logic has no place in organized religion.

[Umbrae]

Originally Posted by haunterex

no offense, but that's what organised religions, especially christianity and its sister counterpart, islam/muslim do.

You forgot Mormon and a few other's as well. Buy yea thier are alot of religions based off the Jewish god (I consider it a jewish god as all the others are off shoots of it).

Organized religion = EVIL. Least that is my take on it.

[project myu]

Originally Posted by haunterex

no offense, but that's what organised religions, especially christianity and its sister counterpart, islam/muslim do. Your religion requires you to "spread the words" and "show the true way" to everyone because that's the "right" thing to do. And dont try to push the blame onto catholic, its just different branch of the same bs. It origins from the same bookers, but with differen readers interpreting it differently and claimed themselves to be correct.
Christianity nowaday, especially in america, is still the primary and dictative religion.
For christians, it's ok to incoropate, act and show their faith because of "freedom" and "righteous". But it's considered an attack or discrimination if an atheist/agnostic or people from other religions to oppose any christian views in society.

what the hell is his problem?? what the hell is wrong with your logic?
ed and al exposed the priest's scheme and his fake religion which were lying and cheating the people. The problem here isnt believing in god, but believing in a false god and a false religion. ( even though all religions could be fake).
you need to learn how to read buddy, everyone was happy under a big fat lie, and the priest is cashing out on these people's hopes and dreams.
Can you see a parallel image with real world's religion???

faith has no place in reality and science, just as fact and logic has no place in organized religion.

Yet more inane ramblings from a guy who seems to be angry at the world and religions in general.

I don't know why it is but all this time I've been on the Internet, a large proportion of anime fans just seem to be a bunch of God-hating elitists. From BBS to USENET to forums. I wonder why that is?

Spoiler:

Anyways, looks like I was right after all, considering the messed up state the city is now in. It's also kind of weird how Ed's attitude toward people dying seems to fluctuate for no real reason. He didn't seem too sad about the death of that psycho guy who was in love with the blue-rose girl but then suddenly he becomes deeply affected by a serial killer trapped in a suit of armor (#48) killing himself.

[I_Know_Spoilers]

faith has no place in reality and science, just as fact and logic has no place in organized religion.

really? and what do you believe in, my good sir?





on-topic= Ed can be a jerk. nuff said.

[Feral]

[ ]

Originally Posted by haunterex

no offense, but that's what organised religions, especially christianity and its sister counterpart, islam/muslim do. Your religion requires you to "spread the words" and "show the true way" to everyone because that's the "right" thing to do. And dont try to push the blame onto catholic, its just different branch of the same bs. It origins from the same bookers, but with differen readers interpreting it differently and claimed themselves to be correct.
Christianity nowaday, especially in america, is still the primary and dictative religion.
For christians, it's ok to incoropate, act and show their faith because of "freedom" and "righteous". But it's considered an attack or discrimination if an atheist/agnostic or people from other religions to oppose any christian views in society.

Holy crap, talk about generalisations. I'm a christian, and under the catholic church (although my beliefs aren't strictly along the dogma) and I find it offensive and a bit ignorant by the reckless use of the word 'christianity'. Please differentiate the uses of the words 'christianity', 'christians', and the 'church' in the future, theu're very different things.

Besides, in a strict sense, any people who act as you view christians aren't truely what they claim to be. What those you point out do contradict the teachings of Christ; Love your neighbour as yourself, love the sinner no matter what but hate only sin and what it results in, keep faith in God and teach others of the faith. There are some others that tie in with the last one I noted, that he rebuked the Sanhedrin for acting to the book and justifying themselves by the book but not taking the actual message intended to heart. Not to judge (If you've read the new testament, I'm sure you're familiar with the splinter-log in the eye part.)

Originally Posted by haunterex

faith has no place in reality and science, just as fact and logic has no place in organized religion.

Have to disagree with you there; faith doesn't only mean deism. For example, if you believe in science as the accurate truth, you must place trust in either quantum physics or general relativity. As for organised religion, I'll keep away from it because we're already deviating from the original topic, but I will say I like the idea of having a community, and spreading the faith so that people will be aware of it but I think of religion as a personal thing and not a mass produced product you select from list.

[/ ]

And yes, Ed may seem like a jerk but he was just trying (in his own seemingly harsh way) to get out what both religion and science try to spread and expose: the truth. But, seeing later episodes, so much for 'the truth shall set you free', eh?

[Hiruka00]

I don’t want to argue with anyone cuz I believe anyone can believe what they want. But I am also a Catholic, and I personally LOVE Fullmetal Alchemist.

I know Ed can be a jerk, but I think it has a lot to do with how he grew up. He did something very bad in his past, and he is trying to make up for it. It may seem selfish, but I guess anyone looking for the Philosophers stone wants it for there own selfish reasons. But I believe that Ed and Al's reason is just. They don’t want to try and bring there mother back anymore, and they aren’t looking for power or wealth. All they want is to regain what they lost... And they do it for each other, not for ones self.

I really hope the religious aspect of this show doesn’t scare off people, cuz it is a great series. Keep an open mind, I guess is all I can say...

[http://hiruka00.deviantart.com/

[haunterex]

Originally Posted by I_Know_Spoilers

really? and what do you believe in, my good sir?

If i have to claim i "believe" in something, it would be science.
i am an agnostic, i dont know if god exists or not, but i am certain it certainly isnt the gods described in organized religions such as christianity and islam. Why? Simply because the teachings and the "reasonings" of them are full of contradiction and fairy tales. It was written by people who thought the earth was flat, the eath was the center of the universe, that diseases and viruses are little devils sent by satans to hurt them.
The bible and its sisters are fill with faily tales and "events" simply proven almost improbable by modern science. A pair of animals on the ark to prepare for the flood? no god damn way would noah how to get to the poles to get penguins and polar bears; adam and eve were the first human? impossible, since that means their children would have to mate with their brothers and sisters like rabbits in order to popular the earth, and that's not even considering the genetic disorder.
God is the most powerful and loveful being in the world? then how can he create a defected angel named satan?
The bible worked for explaining life for the europeans living in the dark ages, but modern science replaces the need of false assumption and lies for explaining how the world works. It was called the dark age for a reason; church and politics were one, people were killed because priests claimed they were evil, women were burnt as witches because they were a bit different from the mass. Europe snapped out of that dark period of time because people started to question about their religions and think with REASON, instead of just believe and accept with FAITH.


Praying doesnt get you food to eat, praying doesnt give you the knowledge to erect a building or a bridge, praying to jesus doesnt get you the knowledge and formula for medicines. It's all the hard work of normal human being.

A religion and its gods are powerless and false because it requires people to believe to exist.
God didnt create us, we created god to fullfill our fear and desire of life.
We WANT to believe theres a better place waiting for us to go because we dont want to accept the fact that some of us might be wasting our life working for nothing.
but the fact is, religion only slows down human progress. Relying on god is just as useless and sitting on the floor and hope food will appear magically in front of you.
Civilization rise and grow with human unity and technogically progress. It falls and die when the ruling class and society are plagued with the destructive rules and lies of its religion and its fairy tale beliefs.

If you christians really want to retail your faith so bad, go to your church and stay there. I am sure your god will provide everything you need if you just pray hard enough. The rest of us reality based agnostic/atheist/non organized religious deists can work our asses off to ensure our future are within our own control, not some imaginary friends who seems to set rules and plans to destroy and trash the planet and dictate human nature and society.

Oh yeah, one last thing, christian-right fundies are the mirror image of the islamic/muslim extremists. Except the middle east groups are armed with RPG, and you christian fundies are armed with nukes. ( All weapons provided are thanks to science, not praying to jesus or allah. Pray only gives you a sore throat)

[haunterex]

Originally Posted by Feral

[ ]

Holy crap, talk about generalisations. I'm a christian, and under the catholic church (although my beliefs aren't strictly along the dogma) and I find it offensive and a bit ignorant by the reckless use of the word 'christianity'. Please differentiate the uses of the words 'christianity', 'christians', and the 'church' in the future, theu're very different things.

you are an individual who believe in an organized religion which in GENERAL carries that agenda. You might not directly or indirectly do those actions, but other of the same faith as your, in majority, and as a whole do, since it IS part of your religion teaching. So i have to say you arent a very good christian since you aren't really following your religion that well.
And how is christian,christianity, and church very different things?
chrisitianity is the general term for believers,christians, who worship christ/holyspirit/whatever, under the influence and direction of the church. They are very connected things, for one cannot exist without the others.

Originally Posted by Feral

Have to disagree with you there; faith doesn't only mean deism. For example, if you believe in science as the accurate truth, you must place trust in either quantum physics or general relativity. As for organised religion, I'll keep away from it because we're already deviating from the original topic, but I will say I like the idea of having a community, and spreading the faith so that people will be aware of it but I think of religion as a personal thing and not a mass produced product you select from list.

depends how you word it really, i will place my trust on the theory of quantum physics if the whole theory's foundation is strong and without errors. I would reject a theory if it has errors an plotholes in key parts of its theory.
Same thing for religion, if the religion has no contradiction and nothing to be discredited or countered by modern knowledge, then i might palce my trust on it.
However, if it's an religion which might have obivious false information in key parts of its structure, then i will piss on it and throw it out the windows.
To me, a lot of things in christianity simply cannot be true and happened if its happened on the same earth we are living in now. Since science seems to provide more understand and logic, and REPEATABLE results to justify its theories. I will place my trust on scientists who invest their life on researching and providing new knowledge and correct wrong past theories rather than listening to priests who tries to twist every sentences in the bible in order to keep up and defend its from the inevitable scientific progress, while molesting little boys. ( i am sure god knows and lets them molest those kid, i mean, which would the almighty allows those men to represent him in the moral world?)

I am gonna stop because i dont want this thread to explode into serious religious debate. And i aint skill enough to convince you your jesus and your bible are story books and lies, just as no way in hell are you able to convince me christianity are correct and its teaching are real and true. For i have experienced too much in life that make me reject religions, especially christianity and all religions resemble or relate to it for the rest of my time of earth, unless jesus christ shows up at my door step.

[kujoe]

Oh please. Don't turn this to another religion-themed debate.

As for why Ed acts like a "jerk"--I suggest you watch the rest of the series, and enjoy it. I'm a Catholic and this doesn't even bother me the slightest, primarily because Ed isn't really attacking faith per se, but the superstructure upon which the society of that city stands: a false hope, a form of complacency or in other words, a big fat lie. Now, that's a very valid atheistic or a Marxist view for some, but it's also very true. Actually, it's a realistic view on things.

Hiruka00 also makes a point by citing the significance of the previous experiences of the main characters. This is just a minor spoiler, but this episode actually takes place in the middle of the story--so you'll have a chance to see for yourself what they've actually been through as the other episodes roll by.

[jonli]

I think you should watch on before judging about Ed and Al's intentions.

They've already SEEN (as to see what you have to watch to know) something in the past and now that they see the priest creating a religion which is completely different from the truth they saw...well if I saw someone lying to another person and I know the truth I would stand up and say "hey stfu!"...that's what Ed is thinking.

Besides he's still a 15 year old...they're naive (i'm 16 so i'm not much better). You know this later on when higher officials in the military talks about how Ed's actions in the village (forgot name) didnt actualy help them.

I hope you keep on watching the series...because this is a technique the author is using to make you think THIS is what FMA is about but infact it ISNT...you have to watch on to know...that Ed and Al are both slowly accepting the cruelty of the world throughout the series.

Dont stop now

[project myu]

I actually just finished the show (well, I skimmed through a lot of the middle episodes). Here are my thoughts on it..

The whole reason I started to watch it is because I saw the dub of episode 8 on Cartoon Network and at the end, Edward talks about how if they don't have faith in each other (the two brothers), then they have nothing. I was really touched by this scene, but ironically enough, that's not even what he actually said in the Japanese version (according to the subtitles, what he really says is "I don't care if they call us angels or devils, blah blah blah"). O_o

Anyway, I thought the show started off really strong and was especially struck just by how sad it must be for Al. The middle started to get stagnant but the series finished up nicely, just not as strong, with the exception of a couple dumb characters.

By the way..

Spoiler:

When it was first revealed that Sloth is actually the failed attempt at resurrecting Ed and Al's mom, I first was shocked that somehow the series was able to fool me this whole time, even though they do look the same. Then I thought it was pretty retarded that Ed and Al didn't even notice all this time. Then I looked back at the previous episodes, and the clues WERE there and Ed and Al DID notice. That's always a sign of a good series, when things in previous episodes make perfect sense! Of course, there were some plot holes, but oh well.

One thing I didn't like, though, is how Edward suddenly begins to value human life so much, especially of the truly bad guys (serial killers, Greed, etc.). He didn't even blink a eye when Majhal died.

Good series, and I know the manga spans a bunch of volumes, but if the anime had been condensed to less episodes (like the typical 26) and the storyline had been more focused, I think it would've been a top 5 anime. The only opening/ending I liked is the first ending.

As for the anti-religion guy, like you admitted, you really don't have enough knowledge of the Bible or other religions to really refute anything. And how can you claim man created religion when the first known civilizations all believed in something? My theory is that in fact, men like you created lack of faith. People who are angry with the world or are too insecure and afraid to believe that they might not be in complete control of their own lives. Also, please don't say anything about having had to go through too many experiences.. EVERYONE has problems, and no matter what you've gone through, I'm willing to bet there are many more who have gone through worse and still have some sort of faith.