AnimeSuki Forums

Soji · 2012-02-05, 11:17

^That's what I fear .We see this with teruyama clone .
I don't what Seto go through this.

Homura7 · 2012-02-05, 12:05

Soji, when you say the real Kafka, you mean that the one facing now Seth isn't that Kafka? I'm kinda confused, but come to think of it, Eve's stockings suddenly appeared on her.

So it's very possible the real Kafka was transferred to the present time as well and is currently wandering around somewhere.

And I don't think Seth is gonna die. Think about it, the spear was produced by Arclight, if Seth is killed they will make a clone out of her, a falsification. But even if her memories aren't modified, a clone is a clone, she won't be the real Seth.

And I think too that she has no stigmata, unless you want those two bastards to bring Arclight her head.

Soji · 2012-02-05, 12:10

Adan I think you mean erapath he is the one that said about Kafka clone and real. What I mean was I don't what that Seto go through the same thing a Teruyama. We see that Teruyama is still the same but the clone not. I mean we see how he act toward Blade e co.

Homura7 · 2012-02-05, 12:23

^Yeah, I know that. And this is what I think:

-That Seth won't be killed.

-That she has no stigmata, which will further avoid her possible death.

The issue of Kafka can be explained through Blade's memories.

Ishiyama's power not only serves to travel back to other times through someone's memories, it also trasnfers the data of any alteration that was made there.

For example there's Eve's stockings, or Yamada's arm.

So the Kafka issue can be explained in the following way: There's 2 Kafka now.

-Because it has been already a long time since then, Simeon most likely already had his clone ready even before all the incident with Blade's memories happened.

-Whereas the one Yamada met there was most likely brought back to the place where he was killed by Blade but with no recollection of his death since he presumably should have changed the future, his future.

It's kinda complex, but this is what I believe it happened. Saten took a blood sample of Kafka and left the corpse there, then they made the clone, then the whole incident with Blade's memories happened, and then the Kafka from there was brought to the present time in the same place where the other Kafka's corpse was left behind.

Ishiyama's fragment is yet to be fully explored, hence why we can hardly make a detailed review of how his fragment works actually.

ShadowsAsgard · 2012-02-05, 13:36

One thing I like about recent events is that they're showing that Kandatta String isn't nearly as useless as it first appeared. In the beginning Kafka died like a punk and whenever Blade used Tempest Thread as an attack it usually turned out to be useless, but the current battle proves that it's actually a very versatile power if you use it properly.

Soji · 2012-02-05, 13:42

Adan@Gotta point there.
ShadowsAsgard@ You're right. That just show that Blade don't use kandatta string at they full potetial>_> What shame.

yuzen003 · 2012-02-05, 14:45

Isn't this version of Kafka is powered up with Eden's seed which seems to improve the users control as well as grant regeneration. Kafka's also got a more favorable matchup here, Saten or Aruka probably would have a much easier time then Solva because of the nature of their attacks.

I'm not saying Blade made the best use of Kandatta String, but this fight might not be the best way to judge how well Blade was using the ability since Eden seed strengthened clone Teruyama was also getting more out of his ability then Blade did.

Homura7 · 2012-02-05, 15:09

No fragment is useless if you use it properly.

Why I have such feeling that the real Kafka will soon make his appearance and deal with the fake one...

As for Uten, since he's a stigmata holder, most likely he will retire once things get though.

Because let's be honest, even with her enhanced Graviton, Seth can't win this by herself. Her chance is pretty slim with Solva out.

Soji · 2012-02-05, 15:20

^ Yeah .So if the real Kafka do like he said to Yamada . Then the thing will be really interesting.
And why I still have this felling that yamada will use Uten sper on himself or someone will use that on him>_>

yuzen003 · 2012-02-05, 16:22

I want to know if Cruz is even a normal human anymore. Unless Setsuna is all talk she hit him with an attack that should have killed him by spinning his head all the way around twice, and given she has punched through a person's abdomen she does have the ability to inflict a lot of force with Speed. We know he hasn't undergone any special training that would have given him superhuman durability so I'm assuming the pill unlocked Needless powers or he was always Needless and it was just suppressed.

Soji · 2012-02-05, 16:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by yuzen003

I want to know if Cruz is even a normal human anymore. Unless Setsuna is all talk she hit him with an attack that should have killed him by spinning his head all the way around twice, and given she has punched through a person's abdomen she does have the ability to inflict a lot of force with Speed. We know he hasn't undergone any special training that would have given him superhuman durability so I'm assuming the pill unlocked Needless powers or he was always Needless and it was just suppressed.

Sestuna would never lie about this,wich mean we can take what she said from true. About Yamada I don't think that the pill have nothing to do with this...It's probabilly something from the pfzero and what eve do to him to brig him back to life. If you think about it the change have begin from that point onward.

surerman · 2012-02-05, 17:03

mm..
1.Kafka killed by Blade while chasing Cruz, inside Blade's head, Memory Kafka created
2.Kafka's remain, preserved by Saten
3.Cruz entering Blade memory via Ishiyama Fragment Incident along with Saten
4.Blade's Doppelganger heal Cruz fracture hand (in reality this power just become dormant, since not enough brain cell that control them present/already in Eve, but this time, Cruz is inside his Body, so the power work on him)
5.Memory Kafka meet Cruz, Blade, and Saten in Town and then Overlord's Stronghold
6.Blade create a costume using his Doppelganger for Cruz (in reality he create Eve's sock from the sheet Eve use that time)
6.Memory Kafka hold off the chasers for Cruz, Blade and Saten, promise to change future (his own death)
7.Clone Kafka appear in the City

so there's actually 3 Kafka, The real Kafka (killed), Memory Kafka (inside Blade's Head) and Clone Kafka

if Clone Kafka know about his promise to Cruz in Blade's Memory World, it's must be Saten doing, since he also present at that time.

yuzen003 · 2012-02-05, 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soji

Sestuna would never lie about this,wich mean we can take what she said from true. About Yamada I don't think that the pill have nothing to do with this...It's probabilly something from the pfzero and what eve do to him to brig him back to life. If you think about it the change have begin from that point onward.

Quite possible, but post PF Zero he still seemed fairly normal such as having trouble holding on to Eve in the underground city and being stuck after falling off Disk's testament, post pill Cruz is jumping around between collapsing building dragging people to safety and climbing sheer metal walls. Maybe he always could do this stuff and just never was motivated enough but he seems to have greater physical abilities now.

Soji · 2012-02-05, 17:31

^You forget that he pull up Eve with is harm still hurt?
She bigger than him.

Spoiler for scene:

And dont forget this as well.

Spoiler for scene:

Both of this are after pfzero and what Eve do to bring him back.

yuzen003 · 2012-02-05, 18:48

Hmmm, I forgot how big a fall that was and he left a impact crater to punctuate it. He basically fell from what looks to be the equivilant of at least 15 story building and only suffered some slight bruising. Seeing it again, it's pretty clear he's had superhuman durability since PZ Zero, maybe Setsuna just didn't know he was already more then human last time they met.

Soji · 2012-02-05, 18:58

yuzen003@ No.I think she does realize something..it's just that Cruz is become even more strong.
Look here.

Spoiler for scene:

And that's why I'm curios to know what will happen if uten'spear will be use on Cruz .

Homura7 · 2012-02-05, 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by surerman

so there's actually 3 Kafka, The real Kafka (killed), Memory Kafka (inside Blade's Head) and Clone Kafka

Wrong, because the Kafka from Blade's memories = the real Kafka. You heard him: "The future will change... no, I'll change the future!"

So there's 2 Kafka, the real one and the clone. It should be noted that the clone has been around for some time, way before the incident with Blade's memories happened.

Soji · 2012-02-05, 19:23

The intersting thing here is. We finally will discover what AnN is, Mio say about the angel and they are in a Simeon lab . This is the perfect time for AnN to show up again ,born or being set free.

surerman · 2012-02-06, 03:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adan

Wrong, because the Kafka from Blade's memories = the real Kafka. You heard him: "The future will change... no, I'll change the future!"

So there's 2 Kafka, the real one and the clone. It should be noted that the clone has been around for some time, way before the incident with Blade's memories happened.

so the one killed by Blade is the the clone?

Simeon never make a clone before the real one dies. Uten confirm this while he confront the Misfit Gang in the City, that his memory is only till after Eve beat him.
the scientist Cruz meet also say the same about memory of one inside body with exact copy of DNA

Important note:

Memory Kafka never come out from Blade's memory world

Even tough Blade in reality around that young age haven't met Kafka, in his Memory World, there's one

Saten even mentioned that Memory World been messed up because Blade action destroying Ishiyama's Gate, thus make all person Blade ever met till that incident appear at the same time

one of messed up order example is Storm existence, and his Overlords reign that supposedly already destroyed (according to Saten conversation with Cruz)

edited:
oh! maybe by Kafka's Clone around you mean another member of the Flea Team? the one with eyes that can see through solid object? He sure dressed in similar manner as Kafka
The Flea Team is Simeon Scout specialist, There's 3 of Flea Team member. the only Female is the one with Ears like Elf that very sensitive.

Homura7 · 2012-02-06, 07:55

^No, I mean this:

-Kafka gets killed by Blade, Simeon retrieves a blood sample and make a clone.

-The incident with Blade's memories happens, Kafka changes his fate by listening to Cruz's advice.

-Kafka is brought back through the alterations made in the memories while his clone is already wandering around the City.

In short, before the whole thing with Blade's memories took place, the fake Kafka was already created, and after modifying some things inside that world made with memories, the real Kafka should have been brought back to life too, because that warning should have allowed him avoid his impending death.

So there should be 2 Kafka, the real one and the fake. Time will prove whether I'm right or not in my thoughts.

2012-02-05, 17:03	Link #7852
surerman Banned Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Killers Special Mobile Prison	mm.. 1.Kafka killed by Blade while chasing Cruz, inside Blade's head, Memory Kafka created 2.Kafka's remain, preserved by Saten 3.Cruz entering Blade memory via Ishiyama Fragment Incident along with Saten 4.Blade's Doppelganger heal Cruz fracture hand (in reality this power just become dormant, since not enough brain cell that control them present/already in Eve, but this time, Cruz is inside his Body, so the power work on him) 5.Memory Kafka meet Cruz, Blade, and Saten in Town and then Overlord's Stronghold 6.Blade create a costume using his Doppelganger for Cruz (in reality he create Eve's sock from the sheet Eve use that time) 6.Memory Kafka hold off the chasers for Cruz, Blade and Saten, promise to change future (his own death) 7.Clone Kafka appear in the City so there's actually 3 Kafka, The real Kafka (killed), Memory Kafka (inside Blade's Head) and Clone Kafka if Clone Kafka know about his promise to Cruz in Blade's Memory World, it's must be Saten doing, since he also present at that time. Last edited by surerman; 2012-02-05 at 17:22.

2012-02-05, 11:17	Link #7841
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	^That's what I fear .We see this with teruyama clone . I don't what Seto go through this.

2012-02-05, 12:05	Link #7842
Homura7 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009	Soji, when you say the real Kafka, you mean that the one facing now Seth isn't that Kafka? I'm kinda confused, but come to think of it, Eve's stockings suddenly appeared on her. So it's very possible the real Kafka was transferred to the present time as well and is currently wandering around somewhere. And I don't think Seth is gonna die. Think about it, the spear was produced by Arclight, if Seth is killed they will make a clone out of her, a falsification. But even if her memories aren't modified, a clone is a clone, she won't be the real Seth. And I think too that she has no stigmata, unless you want those two bastards to bring Arclight her head.

2012-02-05, 12:10	Link #7843
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	Adan I think you mean erapath he is the one that said about Kafka clone and real. What I mean was I don't what that Seto go through the same thing a Teruyama. We see that Teruyama is still the same but the clone not. I mean we see how he act toward Blade e co.

2012-02-05, 12:23	Link #7844
Homura7 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009	^Yeah, I know that. And this is what I think: -That Seth won't be killed. -That she has no stigmata, which will further avoid her possible death. The issue of Kafka can be explained through Blade's memories. Ishiyama's power not only serves to travel back to other times through someone's memories, it also trasnfers the data of any alteration that was made there. For example there's Eve's stockings, or Yamada's arm. So the Kafka issue can be explained in the following way: There's 2 Kafka now. -Because it has been already a long time since then, Simeon most likely already had his clone ready even before all the incident with Blade's memories happened. -Whereas the one Yamada met there was most likely brought back to the place where he was killed by Blade but with no recollection of his death since he presumably should have changed the future, his future. It's kinda complex, but this is what I believe it happened. Saten took a blood sample of Kafka and left the corpse there, then they made the clone, then the whole incident with Blade's memories happened, and then the Kafka from there was brought to the present time in the same place where the other Kafka's corpse was left behind. Ishiyama's fragment is yet to be fully explored, hence why we can hardly make a detailed review of how his fragment works actually.

2012-02-05, 13:36	Link #7845
ShadowsAsgard Member Join Date: Jan 2012	One thing I like about recent events is that they're showing that Kandatta String isn't nearly as useless as it first appeared. In the beginning Kafka died like a punk and whenever Blade used Tempest Thread as an attack it usually turned out to be useless, but the current battle proves that it's actually a very versatile power if you use it properly.

2012-02-05, 13:42	Link #7846
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	Adan@Gotta point there. ShadowsAsgard@ You're right. That just show that Blade don't use kandatta string at they full potetial>_> What shame.

2012-02-05, 14:45	Link #7847
yuzen003 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: USA	Isn't this version of Kafka is powered up with Eden's seed which seems to improve the users control as well as grant regeneration. Kafka's also got a more favorable matchup here, Saten or Aruka probably would have a much easier time then Solva because of the nature of their attacks. I'm not saying Blade made the best use of Kandatta String, but this fight might not be the best way to judge how well Blade was using the ability since Eden seed strengthened clone Teruyama was also getting more out of his ability then Blade did.

2012-02-05, 15:09	Link #7848
Homura7 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009	No fragment is useless if you use it properly. Why I have such feeling that the real Kafka will soon make his appearance and deal with the fake one... As for Uten, since he's a stigmata holder, most likely he will retire once things get though. Because let's be honest, even with her enhanced Graviton, Seth can't win this by herself. Her chance is pretty slim with Solva out.

2012-02-05, 15:20	Link #7849
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	^ Yeah .So if the real Kafka do like he said to Yamada . Then the thing will be really interesting. And why I still have this felling that yamada will use Uten sper on himself or someone will use that on him>_>

2012-02-05, 16:22	Link #7850
yuzen003 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: USA	I want to know if Cruz is even a normal human anymore. Unless Setsuna is all talk she hit him with an attack that should have killed him by spinning his head all the way around twice, and given she has punched through a person's abdomen she does have the ability to inflict a lot of force with Speed. We know he hasn't undergone any special training that would have given him superhuman durability so I'm assuming the pill unlocked Needless powers or he was always Needless and it was just suppressed.

2012-02-05, 17:31	Link #7854
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	^You forget that he pull up Eve with is harm still hurt? She bigger than him. Spoiler for scene: And dont forget this as well. Spoiler for scene: Both of this are after pfzero and what Eve do to bring him back.

2012-02-05, 18:48	Link #7855
yuzen003 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: USA	Hmmm, I forgot how big a fall that was and he left a impact crater to punctuate it. He basically fell from what looks to be the equivilant of at least 15 story building and only suffered some slight bruising. Seeing it again, it's pretty clear he's had superhuman durability since PZ Zero, maybe Setsuna just didn't know he was already more then human last time they met.

2012-02-05, 18:58	Link #7856
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	yuzen003@ No.I think she does realize something..it's just that Cruz is become even more strong. Look here. Spoiler for scene: And that's why I'm curios to know what will happen if uten'spear will be use on Cruz .

2012-02-05, 19:23	Link #7858
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	The intersting thing here is. We finally will discover what AnN is, Mio say about the angel and they are in a Simeon lab . This is the perfect time for AnN to show up again ,born or being set free.

2012-02-06, 07:55	Link #7860
Homura7 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009	^No, I mean this: -Kafka gets killed by Blade, Simeon retrieves a blood sample and make a clone. -The incident with Blade's memories happens, Kafka changes his fate by listening to Cruz's advice. -Kafka is brought back through the alterations made in the memories while his clone is already wandering around the City. In short, before the whole thing with Blade's memories took place, the fake Kafka was already created, and after modifying some things inside that world made with memories, the real Kafka should have been brought back to life too, because that warning should have allowed him avoid his impending death. So there should be 2 Kafka, the real one and the fake. Time will prove whether I'm right or not in my thoughts.