Gundam Seed/Seed Destiny General Discussion Thread

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

I'm currently thinking on why everyone made a big deal out of Lunamaria missing Djibril's shuttle in an episode of GSD.

Here's why I think you can't blame her for that:

• She was already established as a poor shot in Phase 7
• Char missed Jamitov's shuttle in episode 36 of ZG; it was also bigger than Djibril's shuttle
• Djibril's shuttle was equipped w/ a Mass Driver (making it faster), while Jamitov's shuttle was a regular one

Was Luna more of a melee-type pilot in the series?

No, she wasn't. At any rate, they already established that there was atmospheric interference with her targeting for shooting at the shuttle. They just didn't do a good job animating it, and made a better show of it in the special editions. Why are you digging up the past like that?

[Washu-Chan]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

No, she wasn't. At any rate, they already established that there was atmospheric interference with her targeting for shooting at the shuttle.

I forgot to mention that.

Why are you digging up the past like that?

It seems that everyone likes to make reference to that, that even some of the games that feature her intentionally made her a bad shot. OTOH, they did boost her melee capabilities.

And if the rumors are true (Fukuda being very demanding on Maaya Sakamoto)...

[Hagoshod]

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

Here it is. See it and weep:

http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...postcount=6240

For a mobile fujoshi, she doesn't look very mobile.

[Washu-Chan]

Here's an interesting read that I found in the Easymodo archives about the endings in Final Plus and SE4:

Gilbert might have died, but he won the argument. Kira became a full time soldier and Lacus became the leader of a nation. Neither wanted their new job, they are only doing it because that's what they are good at. So Destiny won over Freedom of choice.

As I said earlier, Destiny "Won" in a metaphorical sense.

This is likely unintentional, but because Kira and Lacus were too good at what they do, Sunrise forced them to become what they don't want to be in the end of Destiny. I am sure Fukuda didn't plan any of it, but it is kind of sad to see that one's genetic ability did dictate the future of two people against their will,

Sources: http://archive.easymodo.net/m/thread/5977043#p5978844

and

http://archive.easymodo.net/m/thread/5977043#p5977489

In short, although Kira and Co. won the war, "Destiny" triumphed over "Freedom".

[monster]

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

Here's an interesting read that I found in the Easymodo archives about the endings in Final Plus and SE4:





Sources: http://archive.easymodo.net/m/thread/5977043#p5978844

and

http://archive.easymodo.net/m/thread/5977043#p5977489

In short, although Kira and Co. won the war, "Destiny" triumphed over "Freedom".

Neither Kira nor Lacus has any problem with people doing something that they are good at doing. What they oppose is society making that choice for everyone. So it's not about getting what they wanted. It's about being able to decide their own future. Kira and Lacus might've wanted to stay at the orphanage. But if they became a soldier and an influential person, respectively, at least they were still the ones to make that decision regardless of the reason. Neither of them were forced at what they do simply because of their DNA.

[Washu-Chan]

But does that mean that, in terms of theme, Durandal was "right" all along?

Based on what I've read, Kira didn't want to fight anymore, but he was forced to after Lacus's assassination attempt. I don't know what was Lacus's intentions, but I think that she, too was forced into action.

[monster]

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

But does that mean that, in terms of theme, Durandal was "right" all along?

Based on what I've read, Kira didn't want to fight anymore, but he was forced to after Lacus's assassination attempt. I don't know what was Lacus's intentions, but I think that she, too was forced into action.

No, because that has nothing to do with the Destiny* Plan.

[Washu-Chan]

Originally Posted by monster

No, because that has nothing to do with the Destiny* Plan.

I'm saying that theme-wise, "Destiny" won over "Freedom".

Isn't one of the themes in GSD is "Destiny" vs. "Freedom"?

[rakusukira]

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

Here's an interesting read that I found in the Easymodo archives about the endings in Final Plus and SE4:





Sources: http://archive.easymodo.net/m/thread/5977043#p5978844

and

http://archive.easymodo.net/m/thread/5977043#p5977489

In short, although Kira and Co. won the war, "Destiny" triumphed over "Freedom".

well, kira did say that he was prepared to fight.. the gift of Freedom has it's consequences. That's what Durandal wanted to erase: consequence. People either had the choice to stop war or range war because of the gift of Freedom.. But human nature desires freedom and without, it wouldn't be a human life.

It's true that Kira and Lacus may not want to get involved in any military or political matter, it's their choice. But the power that they both have places them in a higher seat of responsibility.. here we are given another meaning to the word "Freedom" .. a familiar meaning called "Responsibility" ..

They were simply making use and being responsible for the power that they both have..

and I've heard this quote many times in the SEED series: "You have the power, make good use of it.." (not the exact words but it has the same sense )

[monster]

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

I'm saying that theme-wise, "Destiny" won over "Freedom".

Isn't one of the themes in GSD is "Destiny" vs. "Freedom"?

But not in the way you're thinking. Like I said, at the end of the day, Kira and Lacus still chose what they will do and who they will be. So they still have their freedom. Keep in mind that the destiny in Destiny Plan is not about an actual destiny. If there was an actual destiny, the plan would be redundant and pointless.

[Aquaman OS]

Kira and Lacus's main problem was Durandal. Not his plan.

It was that lied and manipulated his way into power by making a Lacus copy to do nothing but parrot his greatness, while trying to having the real Lacus killed prempitively so she couldn't expose him, while doctoring media footage to make himself look good. And then after annoucing his plan he was going to enforce it via death ray.

That was their problem.

[wingdarkness]

^Gil did what he had to do because a 15 year old idiot (technically a traitor) led a revolution last series then moved into a loveshack with her orphan cabbage patch children to play house with the uber pilot and the ubersuit that she illegally gave him...With such an unpredictable threat, as a politician Gil made his decision...If a damn Coordinator drop squad (Still technically never linked to Gil^^) could have hit the side of a barn with a missile then Lacus could have been killed thus insuring that everyone on Earth and the Plants would have been given a chance to go to the universal Job Fair called the "Destiny Plan"...

How cool would it have been to be assigned GOUF-builder?

Instead Gil is dead and people are still jobless in that tuff economy...Thanx Orb Faction ...

[monster]

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

With such an unpredictable threat, as a politician Gil made his decision

If Durandal thinks that Lacus staying with Kira is a threat, then he's a fool. And that would only confirm that Durandal knows his Destiny Plan isn't as benevolent as he makes it appear to be.

[rakusukira]

Originally Posted by monster

If Durandal thinks that Lacus staying with Kira is a threat, then he's a fool. And that would only confirm that Durandal knows his Destiny Plan isn't as benevolent as he makes it appear to be.

true. Lions don't bite unless provoked.

but I think Durandal meant that Kira and Lacus should not be together because they are a force to be reckoned with. Lacus' political prowess and influence; and Kira's death defying skills in battles.

However Kira is an untamed horse who is currently under the care of our precious White Queen. That is the weak spot between Lacus and Kira. They cannot function without the other. If Lacus were to die, Kira would have no one to follow and thus this will make Kira be easily manipulated and used and Durandal will be the one to use him in whatsoever purposes he has in mind. He would use Kira and make him become what he was TRULY meant to be: a killing machine. Lacus defies that plan simply by being Lacus and an important person in Kira's life. Lacus cannot be a powerful person without a right hand killing machine beside her to make everyone fear her power and influence.. so yeah, she needs Kira.

That's why he said that it must have been fate that Kira and Lacus met.

[monster]

Originally Posted by rakusukira

but I think Durandal meant that Kira and Lacus should not be together because they are a force to be reckoned with. Lacus' political prowess and influence; and Kira's death defying skills in battles.

But not if they spend most of their times with kids.

However Kira is an untamed horse who is currently under the care of our precious White Queen. That is the weak spot between Lacus and Kira. They cannot function without the other. If Lacus were to die, Kira would have no one to follow and thus this will make Kira be easily manipulated and used and Durandal will be the one to use him in whatsoever purposes he has in mind. He would use Kira and make him become what he was TRULY meant to be: a killing machine. Lacus defies that plan simply by being Lacus and an important person in Kira's life. Lacus cannot be a powerful person without a right hand killing machine beside her to make everyone fear her power and influence.. so yeah, she needs Kira.

That's a lot of work for one person. Durandal really has no need to use Kira.

[aeriolewinters]

If Lacus were to die....

Ask Rau for Details, he's the last guy who felt Kira's wrath.

And I'd disagree on Kira being manipulated if Lacus were to bite it; Durandal can only manipulate him indirectly,and that's quite a bigger risk than manipulating Shinn and Rey because even then, Kira's still a wildcard.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by aeriolewinters

Ask Rau for Details, he's the last guy who felt Kira's wrath.

And I'd disagree on Kira being manipulated if Lacus were to bite it; Durandal can only manipulate him indirectly,and that's quite a bigger risk than manipulating Shinn and Rey because even then, Kira's still a wildcard.

I am in the opinion that Kira knows exactly what he wants to achieve, with or withuot Lacus, even if the latter is extremely dear to him. If Dully made a mistake, it was to pull him out of retirement.

IMO, the only wild-card in SEED/Destiny is Yzak. That guy switches sides faster than you can blink!

- Tak

[monster]

Originally Posted by Tak

IMO, the only wild-card in SEED/Destiny is Yzak. That guy switches sides faster than you can blink!

- Tak

Yzak has nothing on Athrun in that department.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by monster

Yzak has nothing on Athrun in that department.

Not quite, Athrun actually tells you or hints when he is switching sides. For example, he tells Cagali that he was going to plant, and later had a big argument with Dully, which led to that big escape where he seemingly eloped with someone's sister... etc.

Yzak? None of that, he just does it on a whim, in battle.

- Tak

[monster]

Originally Posted by Tak

Not quite, Athrun actually tells you or hints when he is switching sides. For example, he tells Cagali that he was going to plant, and later had a big argument with Dully, which led to that big escape where he seemingly eloped with someone's sister... etc.

Yzak? None of that, he just does it on a whim, in battle.

- Tak

LOL, well, at least Yzak never had to change his uniform. So technically, he's always been on the same side, the non-losing side.