Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai NEXT - Episode 10 Discussion / Poll

[ellessarr]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Ryu

Nobody is lying, big difference between lying and procrastinating. What is there for him to be truthful about? Unless you want him to just go to their face and tell them they have no chance with him and should just give up. That's too cruel, no matter how much truth is in it, and a real friend wouldn't do that at this stage of their relationships. What's even worst is that just as much as they have subtly hit on him, he has rejected them right back, they just can't take the hint.

It's cool they are being more truthful, but its not Kodaka's fault they developed feelings, that wasn't part of the deal. This was suppose to make friends, and they are doing that. But as I'm trying to say as well as potchip, friendship is not the issue here. It's the paths that opens after that is the issue. What happens when things don't go the way the girls want? Then what? Kodaka feels that what if is not worth losing his friends.

Remember what Rika was saying before Kodaka shut her off...she WANTS him to take the next step. She wants him to start choosing a girl. Why? Because she likes him and wants to have the possibility of being that girl. She's not speaking as a friend anymore, but a love interest and that's where things get messy. She'd rather him choose and the others get hurt, and Kodaka doesn't want that.

well in mine real experience with this the few cases i see this happened not ending good, ended with peoples really hurt more than if the people was true from the beginner.

this is the better moment to say, again i think you are overlooking to "what can happen" if him go to girls and just say who he want be friend for now and not interest in love, he dont need to really go and "i dont love you" he can just say well i want first have friends before goes by far but he dont does this the only person who is aware who their are friends besides him is rika this put her 1 step in front of the others girls who still think who kodaka is a dense or tsundere or still unsure, while the truth is other( and i dont believe who he really not interested in none of the girls if this is true then this put the romance in this anime pointless) again you are trying to say who if him gonna reject then, this gonna make the girls panickly, go wild, for what i get on that girls this dont gonna happen, i even believe who their dont gonna give up before he really choose one, this only show he is unsafe about the peoples.

well like i said for now he is on mine "black list" until i see he really doing something to deserve get removed from her i dont gonna forget easy.

[Tenchi Ryu]

And there lies the problem ellessarr. If these were normal girls, he could just go to them and do what you suggest. A simple "I don't want a relationship, lets just be friends".

But these aren't normal girls, in fact, they are persistent/stubborn as hell. Kodaka told Sena he wants a friendship before a girlfriend, she goes and tells her father wrong details and he sets up an engagment. The worst part is that she's not even trying to stop it, let alone think about Kodaka's opinion.

Yozora has been hinted to have hidden motives in the fact she only created the club to be with Kodaka, making friends wasn't exactly on her to do list.

Then you have Rika. Although she brought it to light, she's persistent in the fact that even though she knows the situation, she STILL tried to suggest he takes the next step, KNOWING what it would do.

So maybe Rika you can, but Sena and Yozora don't seem like the kind of girls to get calmly rejected and take it nicely. In fact, they might not want to be around him or worst, ignore it and still keep coming after him.

[ellessarr]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Ryu

And there lies the problem ellessarr. If these were normal girls, he could just go to them and do what you suggest. A simple "I don't want a relationship, lets just be friends".

But these aren't normal girls, in fact, they are persistent/stubborn as hell. Kodaka told Sena he wants a friendship before a girlfriend, she goes and tells her father wrong details and he sets up an engagment. The worst part is that she's not even trying to stop it, let alone think about Kodaka's opinion.

Yozora has been hinted to have hidden motives in the fact she only created the club to be with Kodaka, making friends wasn't exactly on her to do list.

Then you have Rika. Although she brought it to light, she's persistent in the fact that even though she knows the situation, she STILL tried to suggest he takes the next step, KNOWING what it would do.

So maybe Rika you can, but Sena and Yozora don't seem like the kind of girls to get calmly rejected and take it nicely. In fact, they might not want to be around him or worst, ignore it and still keep coming after him.

well at last if their gonna continue try, at last their will be aware of what he really want now, and not jut geting falses hopes,

ok i gonna give a chance for your point after all you try hard to prove me who kodaka deserves a second change, what really bother me is if indeed kodaka just want friends, and the anime focus of the anime is friendship why the writer keeping making kodaka mobile raising flags against his will with the girls, even outside club girls like maria sister(forget her name) and for what i see and believe who gonna also happen with the student concil president in the future, just for the sake of harem? why the point of forcing on him a unwanted marriage who he really give up yet(he just say who was a missunderstood but not asked to cancel yet the marriage still in game) he dont want to hurt pegasus-san???, for me is basic when someone come and say "its because i dont want to hurt"(it's exactly the opposite while their most hurt), who the things going worst who is exactly what is happen, the snowball start to rolling and grow and him dont really trying to stop her when he still have a chance he just try to slowdown her.

[potchip]

Another interesting point raised is, Rika. There's a sudden rush of appreciation of Rika in S2. However whilst commendable her perception is (which is a bad bad attribute in a zennen comedy, if you are too perceptive, then you are probably not the main character) she actually confronted Kodaka for it knowing the consequences. The word to describe this type of action is covert aggression.

I can draw a parallel in my own experience - my dad used operate a business in partnership with his best friend. Then one day both got tired of it all, and my father initiated the decision to go solo. He lets his best friend choose - buy the business outright, or sell his share to the other party outright. The only relevant outcome was they never spoke for the next 10 years. And do you think either choices matter? It does not. The hidden 3rd choice denied his former best friend, was to continue the status quo. And this is the choice Kokaka wanted, but not offered by Rika.

[Raviel]

I would beg to differ, Rika did specifically mention she would continue to act the way she has been if that was what Kodaka wanted.

Then she suggested that just maybe, it was time to take a step forward. In a way Rika is also quite conflicted, on one hand she likes Kodaka and on the other she's acting as the voice of reason for him/the club.

[mangatron]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Ryu

Their honesty with each other is on a completely different level than him though. Like with Sena and Yozora, they can take jabs from each other because they are learning how to be friends with each other. But at this point, most of the girls don't want to be friends with him anymore, they want more. Even Rika saying what she did was cause she wants more than friendship. Yet she will stay within boundaries because she knows how destructive it will be, so she will purposely stay ignorant just for Kodaka's sake.

Therein lies the problem. For Kodaka's sake, they are acting differently because he's not being up front with his answers. I don't mean to be a jerk, but that sounds a lot like having the world revolve around him.

He's not responsible for considering anything imo. They forced a marriage on him without even considering his opinion on the matter, and he's just suppose to accept? Of course Sena likes it cause once again, she's having her way. She's lucky that both her and her father didn't get a "Go to hell" from him, cause they'd definitely deserve it. But he's made it VERY clear that not only he doesn't want the engagement, he doesn't even consider them going out.

It's not about being responsible for the incident, read what I said, he just brushed off the Sena fiancee thing like a joke. It's about wording, and there's a lot better ways to reject someone than laugh about it. And if he really did do that on purpose, well, I'll never think highly of him.

With Rika, he's told her straight up that he thinks she's cute, but her personality kills it. Nothing much left to do there, especially since for the most part, she stays the same.

How many times have we seen her without her glasses? Lately I haven't been recognizing her quipping about these things is a normal part of friends, though that's probably just me. I told a bunch of guys the first thing I'd compliment a girl on is her hair, and they all laughed like "dude that's not going to work" And I'm like WTF Am I too old fashioned?

I don't think the issue is friendship, he can see that. Kodaka sees that the next step after friendship is in his face, and that's what he doesn't want.

Sena, Rika, Yozora, and even to a small extent Yuki are starting to pressure him with romance and I don't think they are the type to back down since they are unstable people who are pretty inexperienced themselves. Hell, they can't even take the hint that he might not even be interested in them since he ignores their advances everyday. I think the problem is that everyone wants a response to what they want, yet Kodaka gets blamed when he makes moves to assure he gets his...Sena and Yozora gets points for putting pressure on a situation that could potentially boil over, yet Kodaka gets criticized for wanting to keep stable what has made ALL these people a better person for the past few months.

I'm not sure about Yukimura. She's still on that road to being a man, thought it seems the objectives changed

What I want to point out is the bolded part. He doesn't get his way, since when has he made himself clear? You can't have your way if you can't be honest about it, and the way I've been seeing this second season so far is he changes the subject, that's not a nice way to get ones way.

One example I like to give is that Kobato present episode. Every one of those girls texted him for a moment of his time. You know what's his answer? "Whatev's". When questioned about it, he "forgot to tell them" and he wanted them all to go together. To what? Status quo? Maintain the club's existence? What the hell is wrong with telling everyone before hand that "sure, why don't we all go get a present together"? If either of the girls didn't like it, hey, their loss and he'd go with whoever was up for a group excursion.

That's not helping them to be friends, that's dictating the club. I should probably note the ending of that trip was somewhat disastrous.

[Marcus H.]

That's not helping them to be friends, that's dictating the club. I should probably note the ending of that trip was somewhat disastrous.

Oh god, that trip. That was a very strong reminder that their relationship moves at the speed of continental drift, and is a completely similar outcome as the public pool episode in Season 1, even to the point of "who enjoys the trip the most", who is none other than Sena.

[mironicus]

Originally Posted by Marcus H.

Oh god, that trip. That was a very strong reminder that their relationship moves at the speed of continental drift, and is a completely similar outcome as the public pool episode in Season 1, even to the point of "who enjoys the trip the most", who is none other than Sena.

They are making group activities but at the end Kodaka spends the most time alone with Sena. Is this just a coincidence? No...

[Johnny]

Really, not sure which episode you saw but he spent the most time with Rika...

[Marcus H.]

^ However, even Rika gave up hanging out when everyone else except Sena decided that the mall trip was worthless.

[Johnny]

I was referring to this episode which is well this episode thread...

[ele-ene-ene]

Originally Posted by Anime Online

Its rather extreme that Yozora would wish the tragedies of King Lear on someone she doesn't even know. It's one thing to wish such a thing on your worst enemy, but on that student council president? It's impossible to feel any empathy for Yozora when the target of her bitchy behavior is, by her own account, a competent and helpful student.

It's like the anime is purposely putting all these extreme behavior of the characters out there and the audience is supposed to blindly accept it without knowing just what went wrong.

Shakespearean reference is useful. Think Yozora as Shylock. Or Satan in Milton’s Paradise Lost. Or the mythical Prometheus. From the viewpoint of Yozora, Kodaka’s condition is unfair. Why Hinata Hidaka is universally loved and respected, while Kodaka is feared and scorned?

[thundrakkon]

Originally Posted by Johnny

I was referring to this episode which is well this episode thread...

Discussions about previous episodes are fine as long as they add to the discussion of this episode. However, if you go back to previous threads, you cannot discuss events about this episode since it would be spoiling it in reference to that thread.

Yes, in the episode, Kodaka spent the most time with Rika, since it is a Rika centric episode. Like all previous "girl of the episode", Kodaka will spend most of that episode with that girl. However, what others have tried to say is that Sena is probably someone he spends the most of his alone time with out of any girl. Not only to talk, but also to just have fun. While other girls tend to leave, Sena will still remain with him.

I guess in a way, it might be symbolic. Kodaka might fear change. He might fear the others might leave him. They have done so during events. They might do so permanently. However, it always seems like Sena will still be there. I guess people are right when they say Sena represents the future, since even if he loses it all, Sena is still there.

[potchip]

Err...you are reading way too much into this. It's simply a result of Sena recklessly asks as per her personality trait, and Kodaka always meekly accepts as the standard harem lead who cannot choose. So to trigger a 'flag' with Kodaka, it's a case of first come first served.

Had any other girls done the same and it so happens no1 else took that time slot, it'll be the same outcome, whether it be inviting to one's room or to a movie. The difficult part is to invite Kodaka out whilst everyone else is present as majority of the interaction is around the club time. Sena got away with it a few times because she invited Kodaka to her house - which is exclusive and with the added connection of her dad, and that she doesn't care about what other's will think.

[thundrakkon]

Uhh.. yeah, and that is why Sena is the future. You haven't really made a point saying otherwise, besides downplaying what I wrote.

Yozora has not done anything that has helped her character or improved Kodaka, and has plotted only to try and get her way without regards to anyone not named Kodoka. Even when Yozora had her alone time with Kodaka, she does not make the most of it. She hates crowds, and that is her current downfall. In fact, she is a ball of hate. Case in point, as has been mentioned multiple times in the thread, Yozora hates the president for no other reason than the fact that she is popular, even helping people selflessly as far as we know. She does not know or interact with the president. She just hates.

Really now. Anyone else could do what Sena did? They first need to get over their fear of crowds first. At least Sena is moving Kodaka forward a little bit more than anyone else had, as far as going out and experiencing life. Rika has helped Kodaka in this episode to try and accept the present and what is reality. Yozora, well, she still hates.

[Johnny]

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

Discussions about previous episodes are fine as long as they add to the discussion of this episode. However, if you go back to previous threads, you cannot discuss events about this episode since it would be spoiling it in reference to that thread.

I'm perfectly aware of that and was just subtlety trying to move away from the delusion some have that Kodaka planned all these one on one interactions with Sena because he's so in love with her...

[Marcus H.]

Images

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Lols, even the doujin community picks up on Kodaka's infamous line.

[BladeEntity]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Ryu

I haven't read all the previous pages, but it seems Kodaka is getting some rage towards his way. Personally, I can definitely understand where he's coming from.

@Anh_Minh, I don't think Kodaka doesn't think they are friends, its just the status quo he wants. With the girls thinking they don't have friends, they keep coming after school hanging out with each other, in essence, being friends with each other. Kodaka probably wants to keep it that way, if he lets it be known they are friends, they will probably try to take it further with him, that's where problems will come up.

I've always had a feeling Kodaka values friendship more than a relationship, and this episode seems to prove it. This guy just wants some friends, and for it to all go to ruin because he chose one of them romantically, it would tear him up inside. But at the same time, straight up rejecting them will also make them distance themselves from him, these are unstable people we are talking about. Status Quo is really the best method at the moment for Kodaka to keep his friends. Well actually, True harem would be the best, but that's probably not possible.

Agree with you all this post and all the following post.

You really are a true fan of a harem end.

In this situation, his friends definitely mean more to him, he even tells us to the face he wants to worry about getting friends first before thinking about a girlfriend which in turn links to his behavior and choices this episode. If Sena or Yozora accept the label of being friends, Sena will think that now that he has friends he should get a girlfriend. Yozora whos only real claim and something she feels really strongly about is being childhood friends with Kodaka, if she loses that the consequences would be dire.

Of course its about how each character develops and grows which in turn will move the plot themselves.

Rika points out the obvious but also provides the support he may need. Which is seriously great for her character who has been my favourite since the first season. She likes him but respects his decision. It kind of should be a easy choice.

Originally Posted by Tenchi Ryu

As for Rika, I've been a fan of her since the beginning cause I LOVES me a glasses girl, but the character development was a huge bonus for me this season lol

I concur and second that Megane girls FTW.

[Sackett]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

And here it is. Kodaka's not actually dense. He has some kind of "issue".

Let me guess. Kodaka actually did have a large set of friends at sometime in the past. Then something happened, and it all blew up and he lost all of his friends. Now he's terrified of the same thing happening again.

Originally Posted by Anime Online

Its rather extreme that Yozora would wish the tragedies of King Lear on someone she doesn't even know. It's one thing to wish such a thing on your worst enemy, but on that student council president? It's impossible to feel any empathy for Yozora when the target of her bitchy behavior is, by her own account, a competent and helpful student.

It's like the anime is purposely putting all these extreme behavior of the characters out there and the audience is supposed to blindly accept it without knowing just what went wrong.

Yeah... something weird happened to Yozora. I think she really was bullied. To the extent that she actually no longer sees her treatment of Sena as bullying.

Maybe it had something to do with Yozora being a such a tomboy? Maybe she was bullied by other girls, and Yozora didn't know how to deal with bullies who didn't actually punch you and who you couldn't punch back. Girls can be pretty vicious as bullies, far beyond boys. Even far beyond stuff Yozora has done. Yozora's tomboy instincts of immediate violent retribution being forced into the non-violent methods of girls might explain the really sharp edge Yozora has to her. Might also explain her obsession with being seen as a boy, or at least as asexual. (Yes, Yozora has repeatedly demonstrated a desire to be viewed by others as a boy.)

I hoping for that, as the only other reasonable suggestion I've seen put forward is rape as backstory, which I really don't want.

[novalysis]

Originally Posted by Sackett

Maybe it had something to do with Yozora being a such a tomboy? Maybe she was bullied by other girls, and Yozora didn't know how to deal with bullies who didn't actually punch you and who you couldn't punch back. Girls can be pretty vicious as bullies, far beyond boys. Even far beyond stuff Yozora has done. Yozora's tomboy instincts of immediate violent retribution being forced into the non-violent methods of girls might explain the really sharp edge Yozora has to her. Might also explain her obsession with being seen as a boy, or at least as asexual. (Yes, Yozora has repeatedly demonstrated a desire to be viewed by others as a boy.)

I hoping for that, as the only other reasonable suggestion I've seen put forward is rape as backstory, which I really don't want.

This raises a very interesting question. Had Yozora been male, no doubt. Kodaka would have had the "harem wingman" that is prominently absent in Hagani. Might Yozora well be in the unfortunate position of being a caustic, cynical, anti-social inversion of the sociable, happy go-lucky the harem Wingman, trapped in the wrong gender?

If Sora was Male, I suspect people would be shipping "him" and Sena twice as hard as the Beta couple.