2011-04-09, 11:53 | Link #1081 | ||
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2011-04-09, 15:56 | Link #1082 | ||
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Alto has his reasons for staying on Frontier, and he never abandons those feelings. That being said, this isn't quite the same as Alto's "purpose", any more than Sheryl's "purpose" is to allow herself to be protected... Quote:
Heroism isn't so much about the virtuousness of an act as it is about the inspiration that we, as observers, decide to draw from it. Personally, the fact that Sheryl was dying held little influence on me when watching that scene - we'd known about that for two weeks prior. What really made that scene for me was the simple and earnest way in which Sheryl expressed the hopes and fears of the people around her in the shelter, as well as those fighting for them outside (without the demonstrating any abstract song powers or unnecessary flashiness). It felt very honest and very human, in a way that I'm yet to see replicated elsewhere. |
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2011-04-10, 00:06 | Link #1083 | |||
さっく♥ゆうきゃん♥ほそやん
Join Date: Nov 2009
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Before I get to the commentary backlog, let me just pick out something that is relevant to some of the recent discussions...
---- From the commentary for episode 18 Quote:
...besides the fact that Sheryl's age is 'self-proclaimed' (at least, that's what was written in the character description at the Sunshine 60 tower exhibition a month ago), Sheryl has had a wealth more experience than either of them. That's why they both took so much inspiration from her. It's called character development... I know I personally wasn't that 'together' when I was 17, and I'd be very surprised if any of you claim you were. ====== And going back a bit further... Quote:
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======= And the rest of the episode 18 commentary! with Yoshino Hiroyuki (Screenplay), Kikuchi Yasuhito (Director), Endou Aya (Sheryl) and Inoue Kikuko (Grace) Spoiler for length:
oh, and p.s. I'd have loved a commentary for this episode. And 23 and 24 too...pity...
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Last edited by karice67; 2011-04-10 at 01:30. |
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2011-04-10, 00:50 | Link #1084 | |||
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Anime predominantly has teenage protagonists. A lot of that is playing to the expected audience, of course, but given the sort of stories anime tells, adult protagonists also would fit very well, so it always seemed to be more of a cultural thing to regularly put teenagers as the only ones who can pilot giant robots. As such, shows that have a more adult tone ( and I'd put Macross Frontiers latter episodes squarely into that category ) most times gloss over the age of their protagonists. In the specific case of Alto, he was shown as hotheaded and unsure of his way of life in the earlier part of the show, but by this point this has mostly receded and I think waving off his self-reflection because of his age is a mistake. And I remember that I was pretty much an idiot at seventeen, but I did have a lot of self-reflective thoughts, only that I had much less life experience. But then I also wasn't a combat pilot who had killed multiple times by this point. So I am not sure which point Kikuchi was even trying to make here. And I don't think Sheryl is much older than the others. Maybe 18. Quote:
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Thanks, karice, for the translation!
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2011-04-10, 01:22 | Link #1085 | |||
さっく♥ゆうきゃん♥ほそやん
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There's some stuff on "Alto being indecisive" in the ep 20 commentary, though I'm not sure how relevant that'll be to what you believe. It's not just Yoshino either, EVERYONE talks about how indecisive Alto is, whether in the commentaries, interviews, or on the radio show. Personally, I think they have a point, at least until 24/25 where Alto finally seems at peace with what he's decided to do. Quote:
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--- and you're welcome. Now to get to ep 20...orz
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2011-04-10, 02:33 | Link #1086 | |
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I'd much rather say that he is "tossed around by fate", stuck in a situation where he has enormous pressure on him from different angles and is forging ahead as best as he can. In that sense Ranka leaving lifted one pressure from ( not breaking her heart further, although he loved Sheryl ), while putting another pressure on him ( wanting to go rescue Ranka, but being needed so much at home ). I guess you can say that he was indecisive about confessing to Sheryl and even when he did, in episode 24, he botched the job somewhat by choosing a rather weak analogy. But except in deciding to go forward with his own feelings on the romantic front, in the latter episodes he did a rather excellent job in navigating the travails of the rest of his life. Yeah, I get that and that was what I was trying to express. The point is that the finale feels very differently from the preceding six episodes. There seemed to be a certain tone to the show and suddenly we got a very noticeable shift in gears.
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2011-04-10, 06:14 | Link #1087 |
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I think the moment where he stops to be unsure is when he had is duell in episode 22 against Ozma. Not later. It was not a loss for Alto but an answer / decision to stay with the Frontier fleet.
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Last edited by Father Hentai; 2011-04-10 at 06:15. Reason: think this makes more sense... |
2011-04-11, 02:24 | Link #1089 | |||
さっく♥ゆうきゃん♥ほそやん
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(Adding this since it's connected): Quote:
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======== And now for the Episode 20 Commentary, Part 1 with Nakamura Yuuichi (Alto), Kamiya Hiroshi (Michel) and Toyoguchi Megumi (Klan) Quick comments: because of the content of this episode, this really didn't have that much about the world of Frontier, or other 'useful' information. It's more akin to these three 'reflecting' on the episode and how they felt around the time they recorded it. I wish I could share it the way it was meant to be heard: here's a taste file removed (disclaimer: pardon the timing, it's the first time I've tried this, and having a Mac instead of a PC doesn't help when it comes to aegisub...pardon the hijacking of the THORA styling too...m(_ _ )m ), but...there's just no way in hell I'd sub an entire commentary episode, much less all 9 of them. And the rest of the first half or so...hm...the differences between some of the opinions posted here and those of the seiyuu, esp. with regards to Alto and Ranka, are quite interesting... Spoiler for length:
I'll see if I can finish this one tomorrow...
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Last edited by karice67; 2012-01-09 at 01:02. |
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2011-04-11, 03:55 | Link #1090 | ||
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2011-04-11, 06:18 | Link #1091 |
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Actually it would still make sense in the context, in the context that Ozma doesn't really know Alto. So he could say things to Alto without really knowing whether or not what he is saying applies to Alto. Remember the only thing Ozma knows about Alto is that he protects his little sister, but that's about it. Ozma is not the MF equivalent of Roy Focker, he is not Alto's mentor.
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2011-04-11, 06:31 | Link #1092 | |
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Following the complete conversation Ozma did not replied without any knowledge of Alto, he knew exactly how hard his words would hit him. The only thing what was uncertain was Altos decision to stay with Frontier (his shot hitting his rudder). And I don't think that Ranka was in the focus of their conversation although Ozma verbally slaps Alto (best way he knows to protect the women he loves). However Ranka is gone already and SMS is about to leave as well. So the last ones who still were open for a decision are Alto, Klan and Lucca.
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Last edited by Father Hentai; 2011-04-11 at 06:44. Reason: changed rooster to roster. Ozma does not command chickens -_- |
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2011-04-11, 07:58 | Link #1093 | |
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You can't exactly say differently when there isn't any basis for it. |
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2011-04-11, 10:21 | Link #1094 | |
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Look again at the point, when SMS faces the Alto/Lucca as opponents and rewatch the dialog slowly. Look more behind Ozmas word. It was indeed not because of Ranka. It was all about Alto. Again. Ranka decided and SMS decided. So there is no need for them to discuss this in the dogfight. And Alto already lost Ranka. So what is left for him to spread his wings? For SMS (the patriots) or for Frontier (defend those who are left behind).
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Last edited by Father Hentai; 2011-04-11 at 10:36. |
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2011-04-11, 10:34 | Link #1095 | |
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THORA still has the bad translation of that line by Klan, I fear. Unless they brought out a better version after I downloaded it months ago... And I got this feeling that the seiyuu don't really deeply engage with the story as we do.
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2011-04-11, 10:37 | Link #1096 | |
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I watched the dialogue and I paid attention but unlike you I did so while taking the character and their relationship to each other into account. Which is why I hold my position. Sometimes the face value really is all there is to it. I said it before and I'll it again Ozma is not Alto's mentor he is not MF equivalent of Roy Focker. Simply because they don't talk each other on a personal level on a subject matter that isn't Ranka. Ozma has a limited knowlodge of Alto which extends only to Alto's position in SMS and his position of Ranka's protector, that is all. |
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2011-04-11, 10:51 | Link #1097 | |
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I really don't think it has something to do with Ranka because she is gone already and not reachable for Ozma or Alto. Ozma has no personal goal if Alto still claims to be protector of Ranka. He just busted his chance and Ozma reminded him for that. As we both don't speak for the official version, I just wait what karice quotes. And if I am right, I hope you give me a cookie.
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2011-04-11, 11:00 | Link #1098 | |
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2011-04-11, 16:58 | Link #1099 | ||
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But it's probably a good thing I wasn't able to get to the commentary when you all covered the episode here! p.s. Nakamura does joke about 'who Alto likes', but that's mostly because they didn't set it in stone for him. Various comments elsewhere indicate that he's a Sheryl fan. He brings up a few interesting points in the commentary, there's one more in 20 and a couple in 25.
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2011-04-11, 17:40 | Link #1100 | |
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macross frontier, re-watch |
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