Why Retire From Fansubbing?

[RainyDZ]

As someone else has said, people retiring from fansubbing is really a non-issue. Since when does *this* affect the quality and speed of releases? As long as Japan is churning out animes, there WILL be people fansubbing them, since retired fansubbers are always replaced by new and enthusiastic ones.

There are still people who love anime. Me being one of them.

[ruinevil]

In time, American production companies will start financing the Japanese animation industry, so all anime will become automatically licensed in the US. This will lead to fansubbers getting raped by the MPAA, 'cause Sony and Disney will probably be the major financers.

THEN FANSUBBING WILL BE OVER.

The real reason Tellu54 dropped whatever anime he dropped was 'cause Sony licensed it, and Sony is a member of the MPAA, with all their l33t lawyers. MPAA is an actual threat in the US, unlike the pansy ass legal departments of ADV, Geneon, and Media Blasters.

[zalas]

Originally Posted by RainyDZ

As long as Japan is churning out animes, there WILL be people fansubbing them, since retired fansubbers are always replaced by new and enthusiastic ones.

There are still people who love anime. Me being one of them.

You have to make sure that the average quality of the fansubbers entering the trade are at least the same level of those retiring.

[deathbygirl]

Originally Posted by ruinevil

MPAA is an actual threat in the US, unlike the pansy ass legal departments of ADV, Geneon, and Media Blasters.

Any company who has considerable access to legal power is a quote-unquote threat in the United States. But I question the diction in your claim; aren't fansubbers the "threat" against their intellectual properties?

ADV, Geneon, Media Blasters, FUNimation, etc. all have considerable legal power (at least enough power to shut down mere fansubbing groups), but they're not dumb. They know the consequences of their actions, and they actively choose to exercise leniency toward groups instead of actively suing anything and everything that moves (i.e. MPAA, RIAA). Sony doesn't give a damn 'cause they're practically drowning in money and could care less about customer consensus. They're here to make money, not win over a (relatively small) crowd.

[TougeSil80]

Yeah, I wouldn't worry too much about people retiring, there will be new fansubbers that take their place, initially their quality might not be as good, but they'll get better with more experience. I think the decline of available fansubs are more due to less unlicensed shows (in the US), and most of the new shows are pre-licensed now, so something has to change. Either distribute fansub on a more anonymous P2P system, or the sites will have to based out of US.

[NoSanninWa]

All 22 posts about "Fansubbing: the RPG" have been moved to their own thread. That was a massive off-topic flood.

[LytHka]

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

I think the fact people are retiring is a myth...And if it isn't a myth looks like soon as somebody leaves there 5 guys ready to step in their place...I mean you have countless amounts of anime being made each year and no matter what it is I want to see or check out there is ALWAYS someone out there fansubbing it...

Originally Posted by RainyDZ

As long as Japan is churning out animes, there WILL be people fansubbing them, since retired fansubbers are always replaced by new and enthusiastic ones.

Originally Posted by TougeSil80

Yeah, I wouldn't worry too much about people retiring, there will be new fansubbers that take their place,

You three have just proven that leechers take fansubs as something for granted. And you're proud of that? Fansubs will always be there and you guys could care less what happens to the burnt-out fansubbers because there will always be someone to take their place, right? But wait, stop for a second, and think: Are fansubs really something to take for granted? Don't they require a bit of work to produce them? Can a simple 'thank you' really make a fansubber's day? Can I fansub and dedicate my time as fansubbers do to anime? Am I really a good human being because I keep leeching and leeching but never contribute any real effort, money or dedication to the things I like? As long as I can play anime on my comp, my inner ego is satisfied and I can call myself an anime fan, right? Do I have the right to live?

So, in the end, people just take my work on fansubbing as something for granted. I can quit all my projects and so can other fansubbers. We don't have to worry. EVERYONE will be replaced and we can rejoice, leech and have sex while watching fansubs now, since we'll have enough time to get ourselves some girlfriends.

I'm so~ going to address the issue of ungrateful leechers on my fansubbing lecture on tuesday.

[TougeSil80]

Well, I don't mean it like that. No disrespect to the old time fansubbers. But the point I was trying to make is that as fansubbers grow older, they have more important things to do than anime. So they retire. But there's no need to panic, because there will be new younger anime fans that would like to do fansubs.

[RainyDZ]

So, in the end, people just take my work on fansubbing as something for granted. I can quit all my projects and so can other fansubbers. We don't have to worry. EVERYONE will be replaced and we can rejoice, leech and have sex while watching fansubs now, since we'll have enough time to get ourselves some girlfriends.

Your post is brimming with sarcasm to a sickening degree.

Yes, I am an anime leecher because I download fansubs. And I am not ashamed of being one. Let's see, without any audience, what's the point of fansubbing anime at all? Fansubbers sub an anime series because they intend to spread anime to (in this case) English-speaking population. I don't think any fansubbers will be overjoyed to see a torrent with zero leechers.

Second of all, it is as plain as daylight that the absence of retired fansubbers is NOT likely to leave a mark on the anime community. Prove me otherwise. Does reiterating this hard cold fact hurt your feelings? So that in a burst of bitterness and dissapointment, you seek to channel your anger into belittling anime leechers in general?

Too much negative comments have been made about leechers already, a considerable amount of them inaccurate. And I am afraid the notoriousness stems from "some people's" less-than-pure urge to feel superior to those "ungrateful leechers".

As for your pompous claim about leechers "never contribute any real effort, money or dedication", my jaw almost fell off in a fit of laughter: Hmm... actually, I am self-studying Japanese right now in hopes of becoming a translator myself. How could you make a sweeping generalization? Doesn't uploading more than what you downloaded count? Doesn't simply loving anime count? Or should every anime leecher send a thank-you note to for every file they download?

However, *even* if I were to never buy a single anime DVD, have atrociously low upload rate in bittorrent, do take anime fansubs for granted, the severity of those "crimes" is still not enough for me to forfeit my right to live. Let alone reminding a bitter fansubber that his/her absence has but the tiniest, negligible impact on the anime community.

Yes, the Truth hurts. I know.

[Sairai_X]

You're not getting it. It wasn't the fans who never uploaded, or never said thank you, that we cared about. I've never met anybody who expected a thank you from every leecher, and I'd like to think I've met the majority of the people doing this.

It was the insults and threats from people who not only saw us as machines to make anime, but got mad when their "machines" failed to produce, that really got to me.

[LytHka]

Originally Posted by RainyDZ

Your post is brimming with sarcasm to a sickening degree.

Sickening? You have no idea.

Yes, I am an anime leecher because I download fansubs. And I am not ashamed of being one.

Then I suggest you bow down to the ground and lick it infront of every fansubber that cares for the 'thank-yous'. I don't, I'm just an advisary of those that wish retribution would be taking place in this community.

Let's see, without any audience, what's the point of fansubbing anime at all? Fansubbers sub an anime series because they intend to spread anime to (in this case) English-speaking population.

This has been said many many times before but there is only a small number of fansubbers that actually do it for the fans. The word fansub does NOT automatically mean "translations by fans for fans". I fansubbed for those fansubbers who have subbed anime before me and now that I finally feel my due was paid, I exclusively fansub for myself because I do consider myself as a hardcore anime otaku. I am, nonetheless, one of the most vocal people who think fansubs should be distributed in a closed environment (IRC and not BitTorrent) to fansubbers and a handful of their friends only, for the sake of keeping fansubbing alive.

Second of all, it is as plain as daylight that the absence of retired fansubbers is NOT likely to leave a mark on the anime community. Prove me otherwise.

You noticed my sarcasm yet you didn't notice the word "EVERYONE"? I'm sure the absence of every current fansubber will leave a power vacuum for you to fill.

Does reiterating this hard cold fact hurt your feelings?

What cold fact? o_O

So that in a burst of bitterness and dissapointment, you seek to channel your anger into belittling anime leechers in general?

Leechers are a non-issue to me since I consider them, as leechers, scum. The fact that I composed this post in the manner you see is only what you truly deserve. Scum!

Too much negative comments have been made about leechers already, a considerable amount of them inaccurate. And I am afraid the notoriousness stems from "some people's" less-than-pure urge to feel superior to those "ungrateful leechers".

In the fansubbing world there is a hierarchy where on the top, there is the fansubbers and below them distro, and below those leechers. No fansubbers = no translated anime -> no anime to distro = no distro -> no distro = no anime for leechers -> no fansubbers and/or distro = no leechers and no hierarchy.

As for your pompous claim about leechers "never contribute any real effort, money or dedication", my jaw almost fell off in a fit of laughter:

In my case, the jaw is staying in place, yet an evil grin has taken place on my face.

Hmm... actually, I am self-studying Japanese right now in hopes of becoming a translator myself. How could you make a sweeping generalization?

First, learn it to a degree that you feel you can contribute, then talk about contributing. I've been self-learning japanese for the last two years and I'm still nowhere near a level where I could translate a series.

Doesn't uploading more than what you downloaded count? Doesn't simply loving anime count? Or should every anime leecher send a thank-you note to for every file they download?

You have a very narrow understanding of how much a leecher means to the fansubber. The fansubber has all the anime translated, he gives out rations to the hungry leechers where he could just keep them for himself. The *least* the leechers could do is bring their food to their wormholes and help their neighbours. No seeders = no fast BitTorrent distribution -> leechers give up on acquiring rations -> a decrease in leeching population -> I can rejoice, fansubbers who share the same view with me can rejoice, the licensing companies rejoice.

However, *even* if I were to never buy a single anime DVD, have atrociously low upload rate in bittorrent, do take anime fansubs for granted, the severity of those "crimes" is still not enough for me to forfeit my right to live.

Forgetting the sarcasm again? Maybe not your right to live, but *definitely* your right to call yourself an anime fan.

Let alone reminding a bitter fansubber that his/her absence has but the tiniest, negligible impact on the anime community.

Yes, the Truth hurts. I know.

And finally: I think an absence of *you* or any other anime leecher would mean nothing to the anime community. The truth hurts?

[RainyDZ]

The fact that I composed this post in the manner you see is only what you truly deserve. Scum!

Please, LytHka, your outright name-calling infuriates nobody; proves nothing, and breaches web etiquette. Let's keep it civil, shall we?

As for your claim about the closed distribution that "those fansubbers" desire, I strongly suspect they are the minority of the fansubbing community. If I recall correctly, just about on every fansub group webpage I visited, they have bittorrent, which would automatically make them having an open distribution method, quite the antithesis of the type of philosophy you believe in, right?

And I second your opinion that "I'm sure the absence of every current fansubber will leave a power vacuum", however, unless you posess extraordinary persuasive power or has developed a monopoly on the fansubbing community, I highly doubt this scenario's likelihood. It's not about what you wish could happen, it's about the reality.

It's generally understood that fansubbers are on top of totem pole when it comes to anime community hierarchy, but really... what does it have to do with the negative image leechers have? I couldn't find the connection for the life of me.

I really think you are being too subjective and impassioned about deprecating the integrity of anime leechers, to the point where you would rather continue to stubbornly look down upon leechers' supposed inferiority than to face the fact that leechers (the great majority of anime community) are really ordinary fans like you and me, and they come nowhere as shameless as "scums", as you put it.

The anime community thrives precisely thanks to the contribution of anime leechers, whether it be a simple forum post, silent gratitude for fansubbers or just a little love for anime in their hearts.

Just take a deep breadth and calm down a little please.

[LytHka]

Originally Posted by RainyDZ

Please, LytHka, your outright name-calling infuriates nobody; proves nothing, and breaches web etiquette. Let's keep it civil, shall we?

Civil? I'm being very civil with you. I've explained already: leechers = scum, therefore I'm being civil on the scum-level like you are. Anything above that and I'd be considered elitist.

As for your claim about the closed distribution that "those fansubbers" desire, I strongly suspect they are the minority of the fansubbing community. If I recall correctly, just about on every fansub group webpage I visited, they have bittorrent, which would automatically make them having an open distribution method, quite the antithesis of the type of philosophy you believe in, right?

And I second your opinion that "I'm sure the absence of every current fansubber will leave a power vacuum", however, unless you posess extraordinary persuasive power or has developed a monopoly on the fansubbing community, I highly doubt this scenario's likelihood. It's not about what you wish could happen, it's about the reality.

I'm glad your tiny brain is finally percepting reality. My wishes are utopian and not shared by many. But I guess anything good these days is called utopia.

It's generally understood that fansubbers are on top of totem pole when it comes to anime community hierarchy, but really... what does it have to do with the negative image leechers have?

I really think you are being too subjective and impassioned about deprecating the integrity of anime leechers, to the point where you would rather continue to stubbornly look down upon leechers' supposed inferiority than to face the fact that leechers (the great majority of anime community) are really ordinary fans like you and me, and they come nowhere as shameless as "scums", as you put it.

The anime community thrives precisely thanks to the contribution of anime leechers, whether it be a simple forum post, silent gratitude for fansubbers or just a little love for anime in their hearts.

It has something to do with you leechers not scrubbing the toilets as you should be, yet you rather come here, on this forum, and preach how much you do for the anime community, how you are the integral part of it, the alpha and omega elements of it, and somehow believe that you'll get into an intelligent conversation with fansubbers when in fact you credit yourself, your deeds and your kin in this community too high. Right in this very moment I respect the "silent" leecher more than I respect you, the vocal minority who thinks your feelings matter on this issue.

[Ilpalazzo-sama]

"leechers = scum"...this attitude is just wrong. Very wrong. This is one of the worst generalizations I've ever seen.

[Maceart]

I fansubbed for those fansubbers who have subbed anime before me and now that I finally feel my due was paid, I exclusively fansub for myself because I do consider myself as a hardcore anime otaku.

Lythka, just what kind of animated hatred do you have with leechers? In a way every one of us, down to the last fansubber were once leechers. You can't escape from them. You sub anime, people watch them. Besides, what is this BS about the "fansubbing for fansubbers". Those "fansubbers" you talk about were once leechers! Gasp! Hypocrisy! If you don't like it, then just stop. You're not helping out with your angst and emo in trying to put down aspiring people who also want to fansub.

[ladholyman]

Hahaha, the emotional level in here is running up high. The question I have is, how does someone "retire" from a hobby? Fansubbing is not a job, it does not roll in the dough. You can only "give up" on a hobby, not "retire." Oh semantics schmantics. Anyways, until all of Ojamajo Doremi gets subbed, I'm not giving up. Even if it takes me till 2008.

[Enragin_Angel]

I know a few people that release internally only. Though the reasons aren't to just spite the leechers.

[Ledgem]

Originally Posted by zalas

You have to make sure that the average quality of the fansubbers entering the trade are at least the same level of those retiring.

Not really. There'd just be a cycle period. If all of the "old generation" of fansubbers retired, there'd likely be a period of fewer anime releases and unstable groups forming. Leechers would likely become irritable over this, especially after being used to the group saturation that we currently have.

Then people would likely form groups again, and to a more stable degree. The quality could be terrible, it wouldn't matter. I say this because then, as long as the quality were poor enough, some other group would emerge with the goal of not only fansubbing, but producing high-quality releases. The only reason why a cycle like or similar to this would not occur would be if the technological means of fansubbing were obstructed, or if the anime fanbase dwindled to very, very low numbers. It's a negative feedback mechanism, if you want to go into Daisy World-like theory over fansubbing. (Which would be a bit ridiculous.)

But really, what's it matter? As I said, people retire for a number of different reasons, but what's the big deal over it? It isn't like the president is resigning - people are leaving a hobby. Is everyone so drama-starved that they want to make an issue over this now?

[bayoab]

Originally Posted by Maceart

In a way every one of us, down to the last fansubber were once leechers. You can't escape from them. You sub anime, people watch them. Besides, what is this BS about the "fansubbing for fansubbers". Those "fansubbers" you talk about were once leechers! Gasp! Hypocrisy! If you don't like it, then just stop. You're not helping out with your angst and emo in trying to put down aspiring people who also want to fansub.

Why would anyone want to aspire to fansub? Especially reading a thread like this? This thread should make it very clear why nobody would ever want to fansub. There are too many fansubbing groups out there as it is. Every single group I have been in has had internal drama, cross group drama, or something else stupid. I think some people actually enjoy this crap.

As for the leechers, not everyone one of us was the type that LytHka is describing. The problem that LytHka is refering to is that most leechers (i.e. 95%, maybe higher) are simple minded, act as if we are gods, bitch and whine about how "the company fucked me over by licensing this show, only say "thank you", "I never would have heard of this show if it wasn't for you", etc etc. The kind that need to get out of their parents basement and go see the world. They have this sense of entitlement and faux loyalty which is horrifying and needs to be broken. (I could keep ranting on this on this for a page.)

The above is what makes me think everytime I start doing a script, "do I really want to give these bastards/batards more stuff." Then I remember I need the Japanese practice and I am interested in the show and continue.

You can escape from leechers very easily. You just give your scripts to the people who you know will appreciate them and like the show and will talk about it with you. I've done this for a movie trailer.

[LytHka]

Originally Posted by Enragin_Angel

I know a few people that release internally only. Though the reasons aren't to just spite the leechers.

Hook me up with them (unless they're DVD rippers).