2008-01-25, 06:53 | Link #1 |
キズランダム
Join Date: Apr 2003
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Have I missed something? Hard vs Softsub
I haven't been involved in any projects for quite awhile now, but last I knew the general feeling on softsubs was "lol, softsubs" or people were neutral on it. Some liking it bc they could set their own fonts if they wanted to.
So I use hardsubs like I have for everything since 2001, and suddenly I'm getting hated on for not using softsubs now, or they "hate the font" etc. (Even though it's a very readable sans-serif font in plain black and white) More than anything I guess I just dislike the prospects of script-stealing groups. If they want to ask me for permission to use the TL for another language sub, I'd probably be willing to agree. It's the stealing without ever asking or thanking that unnerves me. |
2008-01-25, 08:44 | Link #4 |
翻訳家わなびぃ
Fansubber
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I look at it this way: softsub is a biproduct of h.264. They're not related, but they are.
When people started making h.264 releases, they had to do the right thing and use mkv container. And when they used mkv container, they had to do the right thing and use the softsub. As such, softsub became a part of higher quality package. And then, there also was a very vocal advocate of softsubs right when this transition started to happen. Also, as it was already mentioned, reasons to stick with hardsub such as "so it won't be stolen" is now laughed at. "It's so easy to steal anyway." "You stole the anime from the producers, but you don't want your subs to be stolen? You hypocrite." etc... And thus the one-sided holy war continues. |
2008-01-25, 09:37 | Link #6 |
Silent Warrior
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Netherlands
Age: 38
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Why all the hate on softsubs? It's basically the same as hardsubs, but you have the option to remove them. If subs are stolen they can also be stolen from hardsubs its just that it takes a little more time(A whopping 30mins more?).
Lets not talk about streaming sites. Since a little bit of rendering will get you the softsubs on them too. But streams are shitty how so I don't know why there is even a debate about that... >_> Not that I dislike hardsubs in anyway, but why the hate on softsubs? Since softsubs are superior to hardsubs. o_O |
2008-01-25, 10:56 | Link #7 |
キズランダム
Join Date: Apr 2003
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I'm not hating on softsubs. I'm hating on people hating on hardsubs.
But you are right I guess when it comes down to it we're splitting hairs about the work to animate the show vs the work to subtitle the show. If they want to steal the hardsubs then they have to spend the time sitting there writing the script down, still time the episode themselves, etc. Instead of clicking 1 button to strip the file from the MKV and slap it on theirs. Fansubbing has its roots in the grey where, yeah you're taking anime, but we still have a list of rules/ethics that are followed. So if they're not even willing to ask for the translation, I don't see why I should make it easy for them. |
2008-01-25, 12:14 | Link #9 | |
makes no files now
Join Date: May 2006
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Not really, you can rip hardsubs very easily too, maybe not one click, but ripping and editing the subs for a 24 episode show doesn't really take that long (with OCR). Obviously not as easy as with softsubs, but if someone wants to do it there is absolutely nothing stopping them from doing so.
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Last edited by martino; 2008-01-25 at 12:32. |
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2008-01-25, 12:41 | Link #10 | |
キズランダム
Join Date: Apr 2003
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But you're right about the softsubs -- VLC handles softsubs like crap. Using CCCP with Media player classic at least renders them properly and then you really can't tell a difference from normal hardsubs. I'll consider the softsubs, I'm still trying to catch up after having been out of the loop skills-wise for over 2 years now. |
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2008-01-25, 13:28 | Link #11 |
Senior Member
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The appeal of hardsubs for me, anyway, is that as the encoder, you know what the finished product will look like. Softsubs still have too many inconsistencies in playback across multiple platforms.
Other than that, softsubs are great and we do use them for a number of our group's releases. BTW, Jedi, come onto irc, we'll catch up on old times -Tofu |
2008-01-25, 16:10 | Link #12 |
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2006
Age: 38
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Two years or so ago I hypothesized about new ways to make subs harder to steal. It was a combination of both hardsub and softsub playback, splitting sentences into two different scripts with missing complementing characters and using ASS pixel spacing to visually place them back to a whole during playback. But my evul dreams were instantly shattered when I figured out you can load .avs files and OCR from there. ;_____________;
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2008-01-25, 20:52 | Link #14 | |
Part 8
IT Support
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2008-01-25, 22:23 | Link #15 | |
My E-Penis > Your E-Penis
Fansubber
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Age: 38
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as i've said before, the main reason softsubs are attractive is the flexibility. no more reencoding for each damn small error found in an RC, etc and obviously, multiple stream capacity. i personally hate notes, that is, when groups abuse them (which nearly every group ever does). when i had to put in notes to explain some stuff, i would just create 2 sub streams: one with notes and one without notes. anyhow, softsubs are more flexible and easier to use. even tho i don't really care about hardsubbing, i really can't imagine why fansubbers don't make more use of softsubbing.
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2008-01-26, 00:34 | Link #16 | |
キズランダム
Join Date: Apr 2003
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2008-01-26, 01:11 | Link #17 |
King of Hosers
Join Date: Dec 2005
Age: 41
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MPlayer. It wasn't created yesterday. It's been around awhile. It's had SSA/ASS support for over a year now. It is the same thing you would use to play the files on Linux, and only a few minute differences from VSFilter. Anything that would be in a normal main script is easily handled. When you get onto really krayzie signs it might not display them correctly, but it won't crash and they will still see the subs. But it is not like anyone puts complex signs into softsubs anyways, so it is pretty much a moot point. Not to mention the developers have not given up on the project (far from it, lol), so there is plenty of room for improvement and bugfixes. If there even are any major ones.
P.S. Lol @ xris. Really though, getfresh's troll thread on this exact subject eventually had plenty of useful information. You shouldn't have nuked the entire thing. Last edited by Nicholi; 2008-01-26 at 01:24. |
2008-01-26, 06:30 | Link #18 | |
Part 8
IT Support
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You can't just say "well if there are no rational reasons I'll be irrational!". Doing that just makes you Wrong -- and I don't mean wrong in any sort of poor-persecuted-peoples sort of way, I just mean fruity-loop-reality-ignorer wrong. |
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2008-01-26, 07:59 | Link #19 | |
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2006
Age: 38
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That being said, I'd go with softsubs because I don't need to use my machine for reencoding raws. But I really don't care as long as I'm not the one encoding. |
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