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Seiryuu · 2007-06-27, 01:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

We got an inspection coming up, as well as major screentime for both Genya and Ginga... At least that much is for sure

Chrono: "I don't know, Hayate... I'm still trying to decide whether you or the army of drone is the more dangerous of the two..."

My fault, I intend to crush random idea so as to avoid going down weird and highly unlikely paths...

... This one has been meant with high resistance.

@Seiryuu
Adding on from what Estavali has already said,

Spoiler:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

EDIT:

Where the F are those chinese subs....

I admitted it was a random idea and I doubt they'll go down that path, but I still think it would work. For one thing, what I described was not a LEGITIMATELY revived Alicia, but rather a reproduction of Fate's birth with the heightened technological capabilities Scaglietti now has. I agree that, if Fate's power has absolutely nothing to do with her birth/creation or her being made from Alicia's genes, that is, if Fate's powers came from random luck or some unknown extra processes performed by Precia, then there is no way an Alicia clone would have any value. But if there is any relation at all between Fate's method of birth and her abilities, then replicating Fate would be good. If any such relation exists then replicating Fate would be very valuable indeed, since past research could allow a more thorough enhancement of any inherited abilities and memory manipulation could result in a child that kills without encouragement.
As far as project F, I looked back over the first series and I'm pretty sure they said that Precia had already been working on some shady project involving creating living fighters to replace familiars, that Alicia had died in an accident related to her research, and that Precia then used the discoveries made in the project to produce Fate. If that is a correct interpretation, then Project FATE probably was already underway before Alicia died.
Please forgive me. If someone asks a question or argues an idea I present, I naturally try to either find my error or better present my case. This is particularly true when I hear a repetition of an argument I'd tried to answer. Honestly, when I make these "random" suggestions, I really don't mean to go into meaningless discussions about whether a hypothetical situation is feasible. Please, if anyone wants to continue this ridiculous debate, find or make some other thread to do it in so we can return to talking about the episode. It's a great episode with lots of great story elements, so it's sort of a waste to have this stuff popping up throughout.
So, back to the actual topic, I got a higher-quality RAW and listened carefully to the prophecy. The prophecy clearly says "KA no tsubasa". There is no "re" between the "ka" and the "no". Kare no tsubasa would be obvious but it would require one to imagine an additional syllable that simply does not exist. So again I ask, what does the phrase "ka no tsubasa" mean?

Meophist · 2007-06-27, 01:16

Well, one meaning I know of for "Ka" is mosquito…

Seiryuu · 2007-06-27, 01:18

So the mosquito's wings are resurrected, and the tower of law and the ships that protect the vast seas will fall before them? Something tells me Carim's from the southern states...

Meophist · 2007-06-27, 01:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seiryuu

So the mosquito's wings are resurrected, and the tower of law and the ships that protect the vast seas will fall before them? Something tells me Carim's from the southern states...

That's just one meaning, I doubt it's the intended one. When talking about a mosquito's wings, the word is usually "hane", not "tsubasa" anyways… I think.

Chaos2Frozen · 2007-06-27, 01:39

Off topic and random, but all this talk about the wings somehow brings me back to the song 'Moments" by Ayumi

Spoiler for Off-topic:

WHy this sons? I don't know, it's just the one that made the most impression... And if things get dark and heavy near the end it would fit the mood

Ultima_Rasengan05 · 2007-06-27, 03:42

I think I like the idea of having Project F be the basis of reviving someone using someone else's memories, who had passed away...(kinda has that whole Kingdom Hearts/"Heartless"/"Nobody" kind of element to it...)

Although Fate was suppose to have no powers, seems like Scaglietti likes to revive deceased people using their memories in a body created to have mage powers...since Erio is a result of Project F, he could have someone else's memories and maybe, a very important person's memories...this can also go for Vivio as well, she could have some important memories stored in that head of hers...although, we can't be certain if she directly came from Scaglietti's lab...maybe she did, but there was no confirmation on that in the show, other than Shamal classifying her as an artificial being....maybe Erio might know more about "Project F" than we all thought...hhmmm

Nemesis · 2007-06-27, 03:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ultima_Rasengan05

I think I like the idea of having Project F be the basis of reviving someone using someone else's memories, who had passed away...(kinda has that whole Kingdom Hearts/"Heartless"/"Nobody" kind of element to it...)

Although Fate was suppose to have no powers, seems like Scaglietti likes to revive deceased people using their memories in a body created to have mage powers...since Erio is a result of Project F, he could have someone else's memories and maybe, a very important person's memories...this can also go for Vivio as well, she could have some important memories stored in that head of hers...although, we can't be certain if she directly came from Scaglietti's lab...maybe she did, but there was no confirmation on that in the show, other than Shamal classifying her as an artificial being....maybe Erio might know more about "Project F" than we all thought...hhmmm

Hmm,if erio gets captured and mindraped for his memories, i wonder how Caro would react to this news?

ps. but just who is such an important figure the doc's looking for?

Chaos2Frozen · 2007-06-27, 03:55

You know, it was never really said that the Numbers were clones...

In fact, it was never really said that Jail was working on Project F

There's still one more faction out there remember? They are the ones transporting the relics, and they are the one who are messing around with Project F.A.T.E.

Ultima_Rasengan05 · 2007-06-27, 04:04

yea, after episode 12, I think most of us got the idea of the Numbers not being clones of anyone, especially to the members of RF6...they were just uh, relic beings??

but we have yet to see what this Project F was all about and yea, forgot about those shadowy ones transporting the relics in the background...but how are they messing around with Project F?

Chaos2Frozen · 2007-06-27, 04:13

They're genetically engineered, that's for sure.

What the numbers are exactly... Will be revealed next week

Ultima_Rasengan05 · 2007-06-27, 04:26

I've read that there is an inspection is taking place in next week's episode also (haven't seen episode yet, but will see it soon in RAW)...is it orders from that ground forces general??
sounds serious...plus its titled "mothers and children".
Maybe some Vivio and Nanoha interaction to thicken the plot more on who exactly is Vivio or what she can do...

Chaos2Frozen · 2007-06-27, 05:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ultima_Rasengan05

I've read that there is an inspection is taking place in next week's episode also (haven't seen episode yet, but will see it soon in RAW)...is it orders from that ground forces general??
sounds serious...plus its titled "mothers and children".
Maybe some Vivio and Nanoha interaction to thicken the plot more on who exactly is Vivio or what she can do...

Yeah, there's an inspection by the Lt. General that's going to happen... And because RF6 has done nothing wrong, they're highly likely to be in deep trouble in this inspection...

Oh where's Chrono Nii-chan when you need him to cover them politically?

Anyway, from that title the focus is obviously going to be on Vivio, also from the spoilers we know that some revelation about the numbers would be revealed.

Thisguy · 2007-06-27, 05:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seiryuu

The prophecy clearly says "KA no tsubasa". There is no "re" between the "ka" and the "no". Kare no tsubasa would be obvious but it would require one to imagine an additional syllable that simply does not exist. So again I ask, what does the phrase "ka no tsubasa" mean?

Yep, it's "Ka no Tsubasa". Sorry Estavali but I'm not agreeing with you this time

Although whoever person that put up the transcript chose to use "彼の", or using 旧い instead of 古い for better looking, it was rather confusing I must say.

"Ka no (something)" in question, imho, is best translated to be "The (Whatever)", or something similer, for it's often prefixed for something that is known by everyone or close to.
One example is that "You Know Who" of Harry Potter is translated to "Ka no hito" in Japanese version of movie, if that can be an example.

So it's not necessarily His wing, it's not limiting gender at all.

Nemesis · 2007-06-27, 05:52

The episode preview are getting more vague as time goes by........sigh.

Seiryuu · 2007-06-27, 06:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thisguy

Yep, it's "Ka no Tsubasa". Sorry Estavali but I'm not agreeing with you this time

Although whoever person that put up the transcript chose to use "彼の", or using 旧い instead of 古い for better looking, it was rather confusing I must say.

"Ka no (something)" in question, imho, is best translated to be "The (Whatever)", or something similer, for it's often prefixed for something that is known by everyone or close to.
One example is that "You Know Who" of Harry Potter is translated to "Ka no hito" in Japanese version of movie, if that can be an example.

So it's not necessarily His wing, it's not limiting gender at all.

So "THOSE wings"...
Well, it certainly sounds more likely than the TSAB getting overthrown by mosquitoes.
Certainly makes me even more curious about the wings. Whatever they do I'm sure we'll all be shocked, and, so long as it doesn't involve Sakura, I think I'll like it.

Chaos2Frozen · 2007-06-27, 06:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seiryuu

So "THOSE wings"...
Well, it certainly sounds more likely than the TSAB getting overthrown by mosquitoes.
Certainly makes me even more curious about the wings. Whatever they do I'm sure we'll all be shocked, and, so long as it doesn't involve Sakura, I think I'll like it.

"Wings" from a "Holy Land" ?

How many people think that the mech parodies would still continue?

*coughsneezeangelcoughsneeze*

Nemesis · 2007-06-27, 06:46

hmm .......

lately ive noticed the dicussiont threads are getting shorter.the creators are leaving too many questions.

Chaos2Frozen · 2007-06-27, 06:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adr 00

hmm .......

lately ive noticed the dicussiont threads are getting shorter.the creators are leaving too many questions.

*Shrugged*

Sooner or later we'll just revert back to the usual conversions...

Ultima_Rasengan05 · 2007-06-27, 06:53

well I seen the episode in RAW form and well alot of things are starting to move, story wise, that is....

Spoiler for thoughts on this episode:

-Agito's past...seems like she was given those powers by those scientists...could those scientist be doing these experiments underground? and I wonder if they have a boss because if so, then he could be a client of Scaglietti's for this relic hunt.
-Signum driving Fate's car...I just found this amusing

-A visit to the church to visit Vivio. Until Schach comes out to tell Nanoha and Signum that she has disappeared from her room and somewhere around the area. So the search for Vivio starts!
-Ironically, its Nanoha that first finds Vivio and she's hiding outside of the Church behind a bush...
-Schach is FAST! and her weapon is two bladed tonfas...Cool! She scares Vivio due to the fact that they don't know if she's a threat, but then Vivio starts crying and so nanoha tells Schach that she'll take over from here and thanks her for her help and concern.
-Vivio first words are "where is mommy?" but Nanoha replies that she isn't here, so I guess thats the signal point for Vivio to look at Nanoha as a mother figure.
-seems like Nanoha took Vivio with her back to RF6 and the forwards made her cry because of their curiosity to see this kid.
-Fate comes in to help out Nanoha calm Vivio down, and of course, she has alot of experience handling kids.(Erio and Caro

)
-Erio and Caro doing babysitting duties for Vivio while Nanoha is out...I guess they need that type of training for their future!

-Ground forces General Regius appears again and he orders an inspection of RF6 to be executed soon. Looks like this guy despises Hayate and her formation of RF6.
-The visit to the church with Hayate, Nanoha, and Fate...and the Prophecy told by Carim...looks like things are not looking good in the near future. Plus the mention of Regius' name was included in this meeting...seems like they know about Regius' conspiracy against RF6.
-Chrono makes another appearance and his reaction to Fate's "onii-chan" is what everyone portrays it to look like....hahahahhaha

-Back on base, looks like Hayate is worried about something, maybe the prophecy and tells Nanoha and Fate that she'll protect everyone no matter what, and of course, Nanoha and Fate come back with a positive comment about them being in this together and will get through it no matter what. (I'm not sure if they said this exactly

)
-Hayate goes back to her office and takes out her device and a photo album and looks through it...we even get to see Graham in a very elderly state...did he past away?? we dont know, but it seems Hayate is really worried about what the Prophecy said and what is to come in the future...Maybe Hayate could be this "king" in the Prophecy??
-Preview for the next episode, looks like another talking episode, but full of new revelations and the inspection caused by Regius, plus more of the bonding between Nanoha and Vivio...and at the last scene of the preview, looks like Vivio is crying like she won't be able to see Nanoha again...I guess after the inspection, Vivio will be taken away due to RF6 not notifying TSAB about this child, or maybe will pretend about not knowing about it, since this inspection is Regius' doing.

Looks like it could be Regius vs. RF6, or to put more exact...Regius vs. Hayate...and this prophecy has too many meanings to make us fans speculate on whats to come if this Prophecy is set in motion in future episodes.

Chaos2Frozen · 2007-06-27, 07:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ultima_Rasengan05

Spoiler for thoughts on this episode:

Unfortunate, that seems most likely to be the case, as in episode 14's spoiler

Spoiler:

So chances are they'll gonna try to take her away.

The good news is however, that they won't suceed because we have SS02

The bad news is however, that Hayate would most likely have pissed Regius so much that he'll make it his personal war to get rid of them.

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2007-06-27, 01:39	Link #385
Chaos2Frozen We're Back Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Redgrave City Age: 35	Off topic and random, but all this talk about the wings somehow brings me back to the song 'Moments" by Ayumi Spoiler for Off-topic: tori no you ni habatakeru nara kimi no moto e tondeyuku deshou soshite kizu o otta sono se ni boku no hane o sashidasu deshou ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If I could flutter like a bird I would fly to you And offer my wing To your wounded back WHy this sons? I don't know, it's just the one that made the most impression... And if things get dark and heavy near the end it would fit the mood __________________ Devil Trigger , Subhuman , Crimson Cloud , Mad Qualia

2007-06-27, 03:55	Link #388
Chaos2Frozen We're Back Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Redgrave City Age: 35	You know, it was never really said that the Numbers were clones... In fact, it was never really said that Jail was working on Project F There's still one more faction out there remember? They are the ones transporting the relics, and they are the one who are messing around with Project F.A.T.E. __________________ Devil Trigger , Subhuman , Crimson Cloud , Mad Qualia

2007-06-27, 04:13	Link #390
Chaos2Frozen We're Back Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Redgrave City Age: 35	They're genetically engineered, that's for sure. What the numbers are exactly... Will be revealed next week __________________ Devil Trigger , Subhuman , Crimson Cloud , Mad Qualia

2007-06-27, 06:53	Link #399
Ultima_Rasengan05 Version 3.0 Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Hawaii Age: 36	well I seen the episode in RAW form and well alot of things are starting to move, story wise, that is.... Spoiler for thoughts on this episode: -Agito's past...seems like she was given those powers by those scientists...could those scientist be doing these experiments underground? and I wonder if they have a boss because if so, then he could be a client of Scaglietti's for this relic hunt. -Signum driving Fate's car...I just found this amusing -A visit to the church to visit Vivio. Until Schach comes out to tell Nanoha and Signum that she has disappeared from her room and somewhere around the area. So the search for Vivio starts! -Ironically, its Nanoha that first finds Vivio and she's hiding outside of the Church behind a bush... -Schach is FAST! and her weapon is two bladed tonfas...Cool! She scares Vivio due to the fact that they don't know if she's a threat, but then Vivio starts crying and so nanoha tells Schach that she'll take over from here and thanks her for her help and concern. -Vivio first words are "where is mommy?" but Nanoha replies that she isn't here, so I guess thats the signal point for Vivio to look at Nanoha as a mother figure. -seems like Nanoha took Vivio with her back to RF6 and the forwards made her cry because of their curiosity to see this kid. -Fate comes in to help out Nanoha calm Vivio down, and of course, she has alot of experience handling kids.(Erio and Caro) -Erio and Caro doing babysitting duties for Vivio while Nanoha is out...I guess they need that type of training for their future! -Ground forces General Regius appears again and he orders an inspection of RF6 to be executed soon. Looks like this guy despises Hayate and her formation of RF6. -The visit to the church with Hayate, Nanoha, and Fate...and the Prophecy told by Carim...looks like things are not looking good in the near future. Plus the mention of Regius' name was included in this meeting...seems like they know about Regius' conspiracy against RF6. -Chrono makes another appearance and his reaction to Fate's "onii-chan" is what everyone portrays it to look like....hahahahhaha -Back on base, looks like Hayate is worried about something, maybe the prophecy and tells Nanoha and Fate that she'll protect everyone no matter what, and of course, Nanoha and Fate come back with a positive comment about them being in this together and will get through it no matter what. (I'm not sure if they said this exactly) -Hayate goes back to her office and takes out her device and a photo album and looks through it...we even get to see Graham in a very elderly state...did he past away?? we dont know, but it seems Hayate is really worried about what the Prophecy said and what is to come in the future...Maybe Hayate could be this "king" in the Prophecy?? -Preview for the next episode, looks like another talking episode, but full of new revelations and the inspection caused by Regius, plus more of the bonding between Nanoha and Vivio...and at the last scene of the preview, looks like Vivio is crying like she won't be able to see Nanoha again...I guess after the inspection, Vivio will be taken away due to RF6 not notifying TSAB about this child, or maybe will pretend about not knowing about it, since this inspection is Regius' doing. Looks like it could be Regius vs. RF6, or to put more exact...Regius vs. Hayate...and this prophecy has too many meanings to make us fans speculate on whats to come if this Prophecy is set in motion in future episodes.

2007-06-27, 01:16	Link #382
Meophist Member Join Date: Oct 2006	Well, one meaning I know of for "Ka" is mosquito…

2007-06-27, 01:18	Link #383
Seiryuu Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003	So the mosquito's wings are resurrected, and the tower of law and the ships that protect the vast seas will fall before them? Something tells me Carim's from the southern states...

2007-06-27, 03:42	Link #386
Ultima_Rasengan05 Version 3.0 Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Hawaii Age: 36	I think I like the idea of having Project F be the basis of reviving someone using someone else's memories, who had passed away...(kinda has that whole Kingdom Hearts/"Heartless"/"Nobody" kind of element to it...) Although Fate was suppose to have no powers, seems like Scaglietti likes to revive deceased people using their memories in a body created to have mage powers...since Erio is a result of Project F, he could have someone else's memories and maybe, a very important person's memories...this can also go for Vivio as well, she could have some important memories stored in that head of hers...although, we can't be certain if she directly came from Scaglietti's lab...maybe she did, but there was no confirmation on that in the show, other than Shamal classifying her as an artificial being....maybe Erio might know more about "Project F" than we all thought...hhmmm

2007-06-27, 04:04	Link #389
Ultima_Rasengan05 Version 3.0 Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Hawaii Age: 36	yea, after episode 12, I think most of us got the idea of the Numbers not being clones of anyone, especially to the members of RF6...they were just uh, relic beings?? but we have yet to see what this Project F was all about and yea, forgot about those shadowy ones transporting the relics in the background...but how are they messing around with Project F?

2007-06-27, 04:26	Link #391
Ultima_Rasengan05 Version 3.0 Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Hawaii Age: 36	I've read that there is an inspection is taking place in next week's episode also (haven't seen episode yet, but will see it soon in RAW)...is it orders from that ground forces general?? sounds serious...plus its titled "mothers and children". Maybe some Vivio and Nanoha interaction to thicken the plot more on who exactly is Vivio or what she can do...

2007-06-27, 05:52	Link #394
Nemesis Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006	The episode preview are getting more vague as time goes by........sigh.

2007-06-27, 06:46	Link #397
Nemesis Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006	hmm ....... lately ive noticed the dicussiont threads are getting shorter.the creators are leaving too many questions.