Star Wars: The Old Republic (MMO)

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Nixl

Well to be fair BW *marketing* did promise more than "4th Pillar" gameplay. To my memory of all the hype videos, they also promised "heroic combat," new and engaging boss fights that did not rely on giant NPCs, a non typical endgame, an alternative to raiding/PVP, and a next generation experience. Beta did much to narrow those expectations for those who played it, but those who only listened to the hype videos probably got swindled by the typical marketing bullshit.

They also said from day one that they weren't going to reinvent the wheel, but that message got buried under the hopefulness and denial of the fanbase.

I never base my judgment of a game on review scores anymore. Rather, I base it on what the review says about the game. Scores are misleading, and a high score does not automatically translate to a game I would enjoy. Actual gameplay videos also help a lot.

[MeisterBabylon]

Originally Posted by Keroko

They also said from day one that they weren't going to reinvent the wheel, but that message got buried under the hopefulness and denial of the fanbase.

I never base my judgment of a game on review scores anymore. Rather, I base it on what the review says about the game. Scores are misleading, and a high score does not automatically translate to a game I would enjoy. Actual gameplay videos also help a lot.

This.

Also, dps meters.

And people who actually tried to play a dps vanguard without Stock Strike. But alas...

[Mr Hat and Clogs]

Has anyone else had random, and horrible lagspikes? I seem to get them (just recently - last week or so) on occasion spiking upwards of 300,000ms. it made the game immensely annoying to play for a couple hours until it settled down.

But it did it tonight while I was trying to do hard modes, and it really ticked me off. It would happen as soon as I entered combat in an instance or in a warzone rendering the game completely unplayable. It was weird too, because I was able to browse websites still, however they took much much longer to load (sometimes not at all), but the instant I alt-F4'd the game the pages would load instantly which leads me to believe that its something up with TOR maxing out my connection as Torrents are want to do when I run them occasionally.

[Kyero Fox]

I get them quite a bit. Its annoying that it just keeps going up like its taunting you... something to do with IP or what ever.

[Kyral]

Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon

Also, dps meters.

What? There are no DPS meters in this game and I hope they stay the heck out!

Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon

And people who actually tried to play a dps vanguard without Stock Strike. But alas...

Ok this made me chuckle. Was the Nr. 1 reason I made my Trooper a Commando. Didn't wanted to play a Rifle class that had to go into melee.
Ok on the other hand, my Agent is a Operative so I'm often forced to walk up to people just to jam my knife in there... lucky she's a medic...

Originally Posted by Mr Hat and Clogs

Has anyone else had random, and horrible lagspikes? I seem to get them (just recently - last week or so) on occasion spiking upwards of 300,000ms. it made the game immensely annoying to play for a couple hours until it settled down.

Hm... I seem to be one of the lucky ones... I often hear about FPS spikes in this game but never had one myself.

[MeoTwister5]

In my experience in WoW, DPS meters are more often used by douchebags to symbolically represent their e-peens and their leet gearz. Nothing more annoying than going into a raid and having people brag about how they lead the raid DPS ranking.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon

This.

Also, dps meters.

I'm actually enjoying my flashpoints without people hounding me with DPS charts thankyouverymuch.

Originally Posted by Mr Hat and Clogs

Has anyone else had random, and horrible lagspikes? I seem to get them (just recently - last week or so) on occasion spiking upwards of 300,000ms. it made the game immensely annoying to play for a couple hours until it settled down.

*raises hand* I blamed it on my wlan though...

[Nixl]

Am I the only one who liked DPS meters? I found DPS Meters and Latency Delay indicators really useful, especially the Latency Delay addon. I can see those same mods becoming a point of contention in PUGs, but ultimately they seemed helpful for guilds that are struggling through content.

I realize some may hate it, but it seems like a necessary evil at least. I guess I had a very different experience with addons and macros.

[MeoTwister5]

In WoW the only addons I really used was AtlasLoot, quest givers and target indicators, and the radio that allowed me to play my own music while playing.

Though when I finally get to play retail TOR I'd at least want a loot addon.

[Nixl]

That is the type of non serious mods I think TOR is missing out on.

Have they given a definite no to addons and macros?

Oh god, I do not know what I would do without macros. The /target macros were so damn useful.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Nixl

I realize some may hate it, but it seems like a necessary evil at least. I guess I had a very different experience with addons and macros.

I've always found mods that tend to annoy me even when I don't have them installed myself to be anything but necessary, just evil. Despite the claims, mods aren't needed. They never are. Convenient, yes, but not needed.

That being said, many find my opinion of mods to be rather... radical. As I consider most mods to be cheating. Exceptions are always present, but mods like decursive, deadlybossmod or hell, even mods that completely change the UI to make everything easier are really just cheats in my book.

Which is why it always amuses me when people complain content is too easy in mod-heavy MMO's. Yes of course the content is easier, you're making it easy! Try uninstalling all your mods, then try again.

[Skane]

Originally Posted by Keroko

I've always found mods that tend to annoy me even when I don't have them installed myself to be anything but necessary, just evil. Despite the claims, mods aren't needed. They never are. Convenient, yes, but not needed.

That being said, many find my opinion of mods to be rather... radical. As I consider most mods to be cheating. Exceptions are always present, but mods like decursive, deadlybossmod or hell, even mods that completely change the UI to make everything easier are really just cheats in my book.

Which is why it always amuses me when people complain content is too easy in mod-heavy MMO's. Yes of course the content is easier, you're making it easy! Try installing all your mods, then try again.

Actually, just need to remove one. Disable the healing ui mods, watch the chaos unfold.

Cheers.

[Ithekro]

In WoW I pretty much only really use Bartender. I have DBM and Recount for raiding because they are "standard" now. But Bartender is the only one I "need".

[Nixl]

Originally Posted by Keroko

I've always found mods that tend to annoy me even when I don't have them installed myself to be anything but necessary, just evil. Despite the claims, mods aren't needed. They never are. Convenient, yes, but not needed.

That being said, many find my opinion of mods to be rather... radical. As I consider most mods to be cheating. Exceptions are always present, but mods like decursive, deadlybossmod or hell, even mods that completely change the UI to make everything easier are really just cheats in my book.

Which is why it always amuses me when people complain content is too easy in mod-heavy MMO's. Yes of course the content is easier, you're making it easy! Try installing all your mods, then try again.

True, Deadly Boss mods is definitely a hand holding mod, but I do believe DPS meters and Latency Indicators ultimately exist to help players, casual or not, and impose some order in regards to helping both players and guilds raid. While I know the moment it exists in TOR that such mods will become a requirement if not an exclusionary tool, I think the collective benefit outweighs the negatives. Hell, even if BW wants to avoid mods, I do think they should offer some way for players to calculate their DPS and Latency Delay.

[Sugetsu]

Speaking of carbon copies of WoW, I never tried Rift, I saw a lot of video game footage but what do you guys think when comparing that game to TOR?

[Nixl]

Hmm, is there a Rift thread?

I never played Rift, but compared to TOR the class system *appears* more complex. You have 4 archetypes (warrior, cleric, rogue, mage). Each archetype has 9 branches (specs?) to choose from and so forth. Here,

http://www.riftgame.com/en/classes/

Wish I could help you out more, but I am fuzzy on a lot of MMO details still.

edit: Well, I did find what some Rift forum goers had to say about the difference, although they are probably heavily skewered in certain respects.
http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...ter-month.html
http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...r-vs-rift.html

[Mahou]

Originally Posted by Nixl

True, Deadly Boss mods is definitely a hand holding mod, but I do believe DPS meters and Latency Indicators ultimately exist to help players, casual or not, and impose some order in regards to helping both players and guilds raid. While I know the moment it exists in TOR that such mods will become a requirement if not an exclusionary tool, I think the collective benefit outweighs the negatives. Hell, even if BW wants to avoid mods, I do think they should offer some way for players to calculate their DPS and Latency Delay.

The suggestion to allow combat logs you can view only by yourself (so that they would indeed help to self-improve) instead of "spamming" in group chat or where ever seems fair enough to me. Then again, I tend to avoid running instances due to various reasons.

I'm a terribad player myself, though. Bad reaction time, hopeless "clicker" and losing easily the overview in hectic combat (like when I was dragged into a few instances in WoW), etc. When I told my sister's husband that I managed to control my WoW character by using a, w, d, s due to the laptop keyboard, he asked me naturally "How would you control the chara otherwise" and I "With the direction buttons on the keyboard" *friend receives an figurative heart attack* . So getting spammend by loads of skills in SWTOR is hard to get used to for my unskilled self, let's not to speak of keybinding or whatnot /hides.

[Nixl]

Originally Posted by Mahou

The suggestion to allow combat logs you can view only by yourself (so that they would indeed help to self-improve) instead of "spamming" in group chat or where ever seems fair enough to me. Then again, I tend to avoid running instances due to various reasons.

I'm a terribad player myself, though. Bad reaction time, hopeless "clicker" and losing easily the overview in hectic combat (like when I was dragged into a few instances in WoW), etc. When I told my sister's husband that I managed to control my WoW character by using a, w, d, s due to the laptop keyboard, he asked me naturally "How would you control the chara otherwise" and I "With the direction buttons on the keyboard" *friend receives an figurative heart attack* . So getting spammend by loads of skills in SWTOR is hard to get used to for my unskilled self, let's not to speak of keybinding or whatnot /hides.

I can understand that, but I sincerely believe that all the mods, the macros, and the keybindings are meant to help, even if other players are not using them as such.

There are many things that BW can do, I just think it is for the best they add avenues of self improvement, even if it comes with jackasses using it for the wrong reasons.

[Keroko]

It's not just people using them wrong, it's that people often force others to use them. What I install on my system is not of anyone's business but my own, but in WoW I've even had parties demand I have certain mods in the final days of my playtime.

Mods, once accepted by the general community, are forced upon players by said community. Don't want to use mods? Welp, then you won't get into the guild.

The apparent need to dumb down the game with third party software is one of the reasons I don't like raiding. Second to the whole turning gaming into a chore thing. And also one of the reasons I was cheering when Bioware announced no mods. I can guarantee that the moment mods are allowed, the voices of "it's too easy" will increase drastically.

[Xacual]

Anyone that hates a form of combat meter probably didn't do much hardcore raiding. It's pretty essential for maximizing your output as a player. Who cares what idiot players do with it, put them on ignore or get a better guild if it bothers you. I never had people in my raids spamming meters.

Also they've already said they are adding a lot of these kinds of things.