Subtitled VS. The English dubbed debate

[Kirarakim]

Okay first of all there are many dubs I highly enjoy even love as much as the original Japanese language track. It is also nice sometimes to watch a favorite series and have it on in the background (something I can't really do when I watch it in Japanese).

However if I have only one choice I will always choose the Japanese subbed version. I want to watch the film/series as it was originally intended.

I actually got in an argument on ANN when I said you can't hold a bad dub for or against a series (this seemed to go over the people's head). Of course you can praise the dub itself, but the dub has nothing to do with original creation of the series. Whereas the original language track is part of the creation of that series:

Now I am not sure how much the producer or director has a hand in the seiyuu performances but I assume those performances don't come from nowhere. Just like the animation, art design, script, etc is part of the series...aren't those seiyuu performances as well? At least that is how I personally see it.

[Blaat]

I've been a sub-only anal person since I first watched the Lion King subbed back when I was 9 or something (my grandmother accidentally bought the subbed VHS) haven't look back since than really.

[Kyuu]

Not to limit this discussion to anime -- which is like beating a dead horse...

How about Chinese Kung Fu?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmNK9gfKJyg

[sweet-d]

It doesn't matter you get both if there is a dubbed version.

[Lord of Fire]

In my experience, while there can be a good dub, there is no way in hell it can ever surpass the original language.

I used to watch the animated Disney movies dubbed. I had no problem with those, actually thought they were good, and they were pretty much the only version available in my area. Then Aladdin came along. I had the sheer fortune to find out that they were showing a subbed version in my city, and since I had already seen the dubbed version and liked the movie, I thought I'd give the original a try as well. The moment I came out of the theater, my life was changed forever. I liked the subbed version a LOT more and never went back to see a dubbed version of any upcoming Disney movie again.

Later, they started showing cartoons I used to like a lot in their original language, dubbed. It instantly ruined everything I liked about the shows for me and while I managed to get used to some of the dubs, never did I think they were better than the original. With this past experience in mind, I don't think anyone will ever get me to like dubbed anime as much, if not more than the original, subbed version, especially since I've grown accustomed to the Japanese version (even if I don't understand it without subtitles).

IMO, the fact that a lot of people prefer dubs is a sign that they keep clinging to their childhood, back to a time where they weren't fully capable of reading (subtitles) yet and had to rely on their ears to understand what was going on. I think it's pure laziness and unwillingness to move past these childhood memories that they don't give subs the credits they deserve.

[FRS]

I am sub lover, be it for anime, movie, series, an actor is also chosen for it's voice and it's part of the charm for to me to watch it on its original track.

[Kyuu]

Originally Posted by Lord of Fire

In my experience, while there can be a good dub, there is no way in hell it can ever surpass the original language.

Baccano.

For this series, the characters are all American. Therefore, it's best to have American voices, using the various accents across the country. It's impossible to emulate the various American accents in Japanese.

[aohige]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

Baccano.

For this series, the characters are all American. Therefore, it's best to have American voices, using the various accents across the country. It's impossible to emulate the various American accents in Japanese.

So you're saying nearly every single Disney movies suck at it too?

Or is it ok only when Amreicans do it. Because it's.... God Bless America.

[Kyuu]

Originally Posted by aohige

So you're saying nearly every single Disney movies suck at it too?

Or is it ok only when Amreicans do it. Because it's.... God Bless America.

What the hell are you asking?

[aohige]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

What the hell are you asking?

Originally Posted by aohige

If setting is all that matters, then:

Aladdin: Crap. Not Arabic.
Little Mermaid: Crap. Not Danish.
Beauty and the Beast: Crap. Not French.
Pinoccio: Crap. Not Italian.
Mulan: Crap. Not Mandarin.
Lion King: Crap. No Lionese.

Bonus:
Afro Samurai: Crap. Not Japanese.
Samurai Jack: Crap. Not Japanese.
TMNT: Crap. Not.... not... wait, TMNT can't be crap. It's impossible.

Go ahead. Refute.
Give me one good reason why these are ok, and when non-Ameican cartoon does it, it's not.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Lord of Fire

In my experience, while there can be a good dub, there is no way in hell it can ever surpass the original language.

Actually i liked the US cast for metal gear solid series more than the original japanese version.

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by Lord of Fire

IMO, the fact that a lot of people prefer dubs is a sign that they keep clinging to their childhood, back to a time where they weren't fully capable of reading (subtitles) yet and had to rely on their ears to understand what was going on. I think it's pure laziness and unwillingness to move past these childhood memories that they don't give subs the credits they deserve.

I watch nearly everything with subtitles, but those comments are really unfair and rather insulting. Some people prefer not to have the distraction of subtitles so they can concentrate on the visual image. Some people have vision impairments which make watching with subtitles difficult. Some people like to watch a show and do other things at the same time. Not everyone watches anime by staring at a computer; some folks use regular TVs in living rooms. In those settings it can be easier to watch with a dub. Some people just prefer dubs for whatever reasons they may have.

Over at the Amazon anime forum is a nice lady about my age who only watches dubs. I think she's missing out on some things, but it's her choice. Do you really think someone in her sixties is "clinging to her childhood?"

Criticising people for watching dubs is snobbish. I'll reiterate my original point. People should watch what they want however they want.

Why is this so hard to understand?

[aohige]

Well yeah.

But we can argue which is better. My dad pwns yours.

[NoemiChan]

Well, I like the subtitled.. because I couldn't understand Japanese but could read fast English...

My young nephew wants dubbed (preferably Filipino), she can't read fast and not good in English..

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by aohige

Well yeah.

But we can argue which is better. My dad pwns yours.

You can argue all you like. But insulting people for having a preference for subs or dubs is, to use a recent term, childish.

[aohige]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

You can argue all you like. But insulting people for having a preference for subs or dubs is, to use a recent term, childish.

Yes, I agree with you.
But my attempt to humor the mood apparnetly went deadpan.

You'll have to ellaborate for this playground.

Acceptable:
( insert your preference ) is better!
Nuh uh, clearly (insert alternative) is better! Because blah blah.
Oh cut me a break, clearly blah blah

Not-acceptable:
( insert your preference) is better!
Nuh uh, clearly you're a loser for liking that crap!

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by aohige

Yes, I agree with you.
But my attempt to humor the mood apparnetly went deadpan.

Nah, I'm just a grumpy old man.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Lord of Fire

IMO, the fact that a lot of people prefer dubs is a sign that they keep clinging to their childhood, back to a time where they weren't fully capable of reading (subtitles) yet and had to rely on their ears to understand what was going on. I think it's pure laziness and unwillingness to move past these childhood memories that they don't give subs the credits they deserve.

Even as somebody who now watches much more subbed anime than dubbed anime, this comment also strikes me as snobbish.

People don't watch dubs because "they keep clinging to their childhood". They watch dubs for a variety of reasons, as Seiji Sensei pointed out. And I think one reason why some people prefer dubs is because the vast majority (if not all) of the visual entertainment they absorb does not have subtitles, so they're just not used to subtitles. If there's a way to watch anime that allows them to watch it the way they watch all the other shows they watch (including shows meant for adults), then they'll take that way.

[Blaat]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Do you really think someone in her sixties is "clinging to her childhood?"

Criticising people for watching dubs is snobbish. I'll reiterate my original point. People should watch what they want however they want.

Why is this so hard to understand?

There is a cultural difference here, Lord of Fire comes from a country in which dubbing is only used for children shows and shows aimed at teenagers/adults are subbed. From his perspective people who prefer dubs are clinging to their childhood.

Also I'm curious to know why is it harder to read subtitles on television than on a computer screen?

Originally Posted by Kyuu

Baccano.

For this series, the characters are all American. Therefore, it's best to have American voices, using the various accents across the country. It's impossible to emulate the various American accents in Japanese.

The spoken language matching the setting makes the setting seem more authentic but that doesn't make it better.
Although I wouldn't mind seeing the Gladiator in Vulgar Latin.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Blaat

There is a cultural difference here, Lord of Fire comes from a country in which dubbing is only used for children shows and shows aimed at teenagers/adults are subbed. From his perspective people who prefer dubs are clinging to their childhood.

I am pretty sure the Netherlands had some live action shows more meant for teenagers that were dubbed. Some movies like Harry Potter also have a dubbed version.
But i agree that Holland uses far less dubbed shows than other countries in Europe.