Higurashi - Game Discussion (spoilers lurk here)

[chaos_alfa]

TheGuraGuraMan are you planning to offer a patch with your sprites for the Higurashi Steam version?

[TheGuraGuraMan]

Dunno yet, but that's not really planned. Tough honestly, would be better if Mangagamer saw those and decided that those little changes are necessary.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by TheGuraGuraMan

Dunno yet, but that's not really planned. Tough honestly, would be better if Mangagamer saw those and decided that those little changes are necessary.

It seems Doddler is following you on twitter. Hopefully he can communicate it to the rest of MangaGamer.

[TheGuraGuraMan]

Was pretty hard seeing as how the base was garbage, but tried to improve a bit Rika's horrible sprite, what do you think, everyone ?

(couldn't do anything with this mouth, so gave her the default expression one)

[TheGuraGuraMan]

Originally Posted by FXtreme

EDIT: TheGuraGuraMan, if Doddler really is following you, tell him that over 100 people decided to boycott MangaGamer just a week after the new towel sprite of Satoko was revealed (no joke, that's really happening!).

I won't, because I don't find it inappropriate. I don't really see the problem about it, compared to the other things I tried to improve or couldn't (Rika's haircut) that are REALLY annoying/stupids and can be more or less easily fixed.

100 persons like the tumblr retards who posted those crazily stupids posts ?

T
O
P
K
E
K

Seriously, the scene doesn't even have any sexual allusion, and they removed the nude version, what are you so butthurt about ? What di you want them to do ? They won't remove the original's sprite either anyway, so wouldn't change anything.

And don't tell me "muh pedophilia", that's a manga drawing for god's sake.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by TheGuraGuraMan

Was pretty hard seeing as how the base was garbage, but tried to improve a bit Rika's horrible sprite, what do you think, everyone ?

(couldn't do anything with this mouth, so gave her the default expression one)

The hair color looks pretty good. I don't think changing her mouth is necessary for this sprite. Her face doesn't look much like the original look for Rika, but I think it is an interesting change. It makes her look more her age and it will probably make the sprite for when she acts confident and mature more sinister.

Originally Posted by FXtreme

I'm sorry, but after reading these comments, I just have to say this. If we are hypothetically complaining to MangaGamer about their sprites, I have to get Satoko's towel sprite on the list. That one absolutely HAS to be changed. Am I the only one here who thinks it's inappropriate? I find it ironic that people here are complaining about nitpicky details and no one is complaining about the downright inappropriate sprite (I don't mean to sound angry, I'm just stating this out of pure irony).

Maybe Doddler should send THAT message to MangaGamer.

EDIT: TheGuraGuraMan, if Doddler really is following you, tell him that over 100 people decided to boycott MangaGamer just a week after the new towel sprite of Satoko was revealed (no joke, that's really happening!).

I don't think it is necessary to remove the sprite, it has an important role in the scene it is being used in. I do agree with that Ryukishi07 could have presented it a bit more modest. It has also been more sexualized compared to the ordinal sprite. This is for the most part because the art style of the new sprites are more curvy compared to the more blocky and bad anatomy of the original style.

The biggest reasons I think we have are opinions class is because I think depicting a drawn child naked or semi naked doesn't have to be intrinsically bad. The first reason for this would be because I believe depicting a drawn child naked in a non sexual way should be possible if it can add something to a story. The second is that I'm not yet convinced that depicting a drawn minor will lead to harm done being done to real minors, for that I have to see some research which proves a clear causal link between depicting a drawn minor and harm being done to real minors.

[Levani]

The third is that I'm not yet convinced that depicting a drawn minor will lead to harm done to real minors, for that I have to see some research which proves a clear causal link between depicting a drawn minor and harm done to real minors.

Are you saying the sprite could do harm against minors? Do minors even read Higurashi? They're clearly not the audience Ryukishi wrote Higurashi for.

[Levani]

Honestly, when ugly conversations like this come up due to localization, it makes me want to say, ugh, if this is how you as a community are going to react when they bring JP content to you, then I'd rather it stay in JP, so that we don't have massive outcries over something that was never a problem until mainstream US got involved and started demanding changes to something that was culturally accepted in Japan.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by Levani

Are you saying the sprite could do harm against minors? Do minors even read Higurashi? They're clearly not the audience Ryukishi wrote Higurashi for.

No, I meant that I'm not convinced that adults who read loli hentai become sexual deviants towards real minors. My graduation thesis about transfer made it clear to me that it isn't easy for acts in one context to easily gets transferred to a context outside the work it is depicted in or executed in.

[Joly]

So tired of seeing this argument everywhere, I've started to avoid the Higurashi tumblr tag. Too bad it's getting over here too. I'm pretty excited for the Steam release. Anyway, just popping in to comment on those sprite changes.

I don't have much problems with Rika's sprite, even though it does look different from the original. I agree it's an interesting change and I don't think it's bad. Although, I do like your edit as well, Gura. The color changes are really nice. It was posted awhile back, but I like the change done for Rena's hat especially.

[TheGuraGuraMan]

You're totally right for the bruises, after all it was added in the Alchemist games, if there is one thing that could be changed for the Steam sprite, that's it.

About those not being present in the Vanilla one, that makes me think if he ended up setting them in Hou, maybe that's just something he forgot.


"she was so scared she dropped the towel and was too afraid to go back for it"
I'm 100% sure it HAS been said in the french text tough. Does Mangagamer's first release have the nude sprite ? Maybe they removed the line along with it, dunno.


"With those sprites, Ryukishi is basically saying, "I don't care that this character is an abused, scared, depressed child in a dire situation. The visual novel needs nudity somewhere, and no character is too young to be fanservice material!" It's disgusting, it's creepy, it's disrespectful to the character, and it undermines what is supposed to be the emotional climax of an otherwise well-written story arc!

Real child or not, what Ryukishi did is indefensible. Who cares if it's anime?
"

God, chill out, at worst that's just some mere fan service, like Rena in the introduction animation, like Shion's AM suit, and like the H game full of lolis Ryukishi made before, that's NOT THE FIRST TIME AT ALL.
And I think the actual "fan service" while it happening in such a creepy scene makes it even more creepy, maybe that was simply what Ryukishi was thinking.

[Dr. Casey]

To each their own as to whether the sprite's offensive or not (I don't mind it), but the chances of Ryukishi intending for the scene to be fanservice are pretty much zero. He's a good guy and a very liberal-minded one in most respects. Pretty much every single opinion he's ever given on anything paints him as the exact opposite of someone that would try to showcase child porn. There's also cultural differences to be accounted for here, since I don't believe Japan places as much of a taboo on nudity as the United States does for those who haven't developed sexual characteristics (similar to how the US doesn't consider there to be anything wrong with pictures of a naked newborn baby), though I'm not at all an expert on the subject.

[magnum12]

Just now saw the sprite differences and I must say, I find the original and manga gamer sprites in very bad taste. Its also not very faithful to how the novel itself describes the scene.

Gura, your works are pretty good. I'd actually like to see how you'd handle the PS2/ DS version sprites, which on a side note are actually the most accurate ones given the written text.

Edit: The comment above does make sense given how its a common theme in R7's works that child abusers are scum (especially the guy in Higanbana). Note that he also does not approve of vigilantess either. Leaves the possibility of intended increased creepiness due to dualistic nature of sprite and context being plausible, although if that was the case, I think it failed miserably in the delivery.

[TheGuraGuraMan]

Originally Posted by magnum12

Gura, your works are pretty good. I'd actually like to see how you'd handle the PS2/ DS version sprites, which on a side note are actually the most accurate ones given the written text.

Well, I recently began using Twiter, so whenever I'm finished making something i post a screenshot of it, made some comparisons of the Vanilla/Steam/ps2/ds sprites for example.
https://twitter.com/TheGuraGuraMan/s...969474/photo/1
https://twitter.com/TheGuraGuraMan/s...028352/photo/1

[TheGuraGuraMan]

Alright, tested some stuff on Satoko's towel sprite, added the bruises, set the towel in blue like the Vanilla version, removed the useless light reflections on her body (doesn't fit with the bruises), and changed her hair's colors.

[einhorn303]

Originally Posted by FXtreme

Have you read the new visual novel? I had some questions about it, and could not get answers yet.

Unfortunately, I don't speak Japanese. I have read Saikoroshi-hen, though, which was great. It provides some fascinating insight into the transition between Higurashi and Umineko's world.

I also CTRL'ed through all of the Hinamizawa Bus Stop story (which is much longer than I expected!), and a bit of Higurashi Outbreak. It's probably bad to spoil myself for a potential translation patch, but it is tempting to get a vague idea of the story through the sprites, music, and etc.

Originally Posted by Levani

I wonder if MangaGamer would care to add a textbox in the new release. I'd love to have it.

I already tend to prefer the original, but I'd rather they stick with the NVL-style text. The VN is primarily about the text, so why not bring it to the forefront and give it all the space it needs? I like how the NVL format brings out more the feeling of "novel" than "game."

Originally Posted by FXtreme

...I find it ironic that people here are complaining about nitpicky details and no one is complaining about the downright inappropriate sprite (I don't mean to sound angry, I'm just stating this out of pure irony).

To be frank, I don't care a single bit about the sprite. I believe that's how the silent majority of Higurashi fans feel about it as well.

[Levani]

I already tend to prefer the original, but I'd rather they stick with the NVL-style text. The VN is primarily about the text, so why not bring it to the forefront and give it all the space it needs? I like how the NVL format brings out more the feeling of "novel" than "game."

It could be a choice in the menu? That would be a great idea.

Personally I dislike NVL mode, that's why I'd like to have an option for textbox. Of course if they don't do it it's not going to ruin my experience with it. Just a personal preference.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by TheGuraGuraMan

Alright, tested some stuff on Satoko's towel sprite, added the bruises, set the towel in blue like the Vanilla version, removed the useless light reflections on her body (doesn't fit with the bruises), and changed her hair's colors.

The bruises do seem to make it more convincing that something bad has happened to her.

I wonder why the towel sprite has been flipped? In all the other towel sprites Satoko is facing left, but in the new one she is facing right.

Could you flip it? The inconsistency is a bit annoying.

[Levani]

^

Satoko's sprite in general is flipped not just the towel one.

Oh and that expression is pretty convincing that something bad happened to her.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by Levani

^

Satoko's sprite in general is flipped not just the towel one.

Ah, I see.

Oh and that expression is pretty convincing that something bad happened to her.

That is true, I just meant that the bruises make the the effect more convincing and decreases the sexualization a bit.