Claymore - General Discussion Thread

[toxic_trance]

I think if the series makes a good adaptation of the manga..we will be begging for a sub-forum by episode 4 or something

[Glitch87]

doubt it.... gintama or d gray man or buso renkin or a ton of the other useless comedy/romance shows will get a subforum before claymore...

[Sonhex]

It's not without it's problems, the pacing did feel rushed; Raki's expulsion from the town and subsequent entrapment in the woods all went in such a blur. The action though is nicely done, brutal and furious and despite purple blood, pretty gory (Clare yanking the Youma's arm from her guts was particularly memorable). There's a good sense of bloodlust in the action and cruelty in the script (Raki's brother's tears) and that sells it to me.

I think they made the right decision - opt for detailed characters and a gloomy brooding atmosphere rather than clean, slick wow!animation. In the end the world feels quite convincing as a late medieval land under constant threat from the hidden Youma. The scene with the villagers launching into witch-hunt type hysterics through accusations and suspicions was very well handled.

Some of the music was...odd. Especially the bgm when Raki and Clare walking though the town. But the ED rocked, the celtic melodies used kept 'on theme' (something some shows fail at). I think that's certainly my favourite ED of the current batch of new anime.

[Lost]

Originally Posted by Sonhex

The scene with the villagers launching into witch-hunt type hysterics through accusations and suspicions was very well handled.

I felt that was well done too. I remember thinking at that scene that it would have only been natural of them to do that, the poor people. And history pays testament to instances of such suspicion, and sometimes greed, leading to witch-hunts and the like. At the same time I liked how that suspicion spilled over in them kicking Rika out of the village, more than that actually, it seems they left him for dead; just because he was related to the Youma. A very believable turn of events.

//Yep, seeing his "brother" cry was very sad.

[Jazzrat]

doubt it.... gintama or d gray man or buso renkin or a ton of the other useless comedy/romance shows will get a subforum before claymore...

Having a subforum or not doesn't necessarily means it's a good anime, just popular with the forum community. I'll take good over popular anytime of the day

[Eclipze]

Originally Posted by Mentar

Especially the latter is a very big claim (and IMHO a wrong one to boot). With all due respect, how can you feel even remotely competent to judge the contents and merits of a show after watching a single episode? Boggles my mind.

After one episode, there are a couple of points which you can realistically judge. Quality of the seiyuus, for example. And also the technical merits of a show (animation, character designs, music - and even all that can be misleading in ep1). But anything beyond that, particularly plot and characters of non-comedy shows, take at least 3 (if not 5-6) episodes before you can cast a credible judgement on. Whoever does that after 1 episode is completely oblivious.

I guess I've touched a wrong nerve here. Let me explain:

As of now, judging through just 1 episode is indeed unfair, but that is what's being done by many. At the same time, manga readers/fans are also judging based off the manga material later on and demanding a sub forum based on their excitment for the show as well as just one episode.

You tell me if anyone can qualify being "fair" here (Well, except the mods). Having double-standards just cause manga readers can better judge a series (And not the anime yet) doesn't really help in the "sub-forum" argument. Manga readers may be able to judge the MANGA version of a series well, but we are talking about the ANIME here. As much as it is done by the oh-so-faithful-till-they-dont-bother-changing-much MADHOUSE, it still remains that there will be changes (There already are), so both mediums will be different one way or other, hence complete dominance in terms of judgement of a series cannot apply. It is a fact that quite often, people treat both Mangas and Anime differently, and have different opinions on them. Some prefer either or, so it is entirely possible that no-one might like how the anime turns out.

And do note that I did not cover ANY technical discussion for the anime. Yes, I do know that in terms of animation, art, as well as the fact that the anime is produced by a relatively well-known and well respected studio (MADHOUSE), it has been done superbly. I left out this point because TECHNICALLY ASPECTS does not equate to a sucessful anime, nor does the opposite hold true (and mainly because thats not the point I am trying to make).

Originally Posted by Mentar

Fans who know the story will definitely have alot to debate and speculate about - however, I can't go into details about what, because that would be some uber-spoiler, and I hate it when other people wave tasty "SPOILER!!! DON'T READ THIS UNLESS YOU WANT TO KNOW ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING" buttons in front of me, continuously testing my self-control. It would be very helpful to make the Kanon-style distinction between spoiler-free episode threads and 1-2 "veteran discussion and speculation" threads where they can freely exchange their thoughts.

And if an issue such as technology/morality is only obvious at a later part of the series, shouldn't it be obvious that it should be treated more of a sub-discussion of the plot itself, rather than a seperate entity?

Morality in DeathNote is something that can be discussed even without watching beyond the first episode (Or just knowing the summary of what the DEATHNOTE does/is about) - Killing people is a rather big issue with or without supernatural elements, so what happens in the plot doesn't affect such a discussion much.

On the other hand, from what you've said, the "discussion-capable" factor is a huge spoiler? - so how does that compare to a morality or even technology discussion? Unless of course, it is indeed a "technology" factor (which, from ep1, seems fairly impossible unless the claymore's weapons somehow have special devices in them), independent discussion, aka discussion without the need for watching/reading the storyline in the series to generate (which a morality/technology thread is capable off), it would not quality.

And finally...for god's sake, I wasn't even bashing/judging the series as a whole. All I did was to point out that more episodes needs to be aired in order to judge whether or not there should be a sub-forum for this show. As others have pointed out, such an action was done in the past (Giving a sub-forum for a series merely based on the first few episodes's post count) and as I have pointed out, quite a few gave bad results (Asatte, Pumpkin Scissors), so its only natural that this (giving a sub-forum to Claymore right now) has not been done for this or any new series for that matter.

...sigh.

[Lost]

Originally Posted by Jazzrat

Having a subforum or not doesn't necessarily means it's a good anime, just popular with the forum community. I'll take good over popular anytime of the day

Hear, hear. coughMushishicoughBartendercough.

[Budweineken]

Can we stop these "pro's and con's" of having a sub-forum now or later for this series? The mods/admins of animesuki already have a system in place to select which series will get a sub forum, they are even familiar with this series in particular, so what you guys discuss here about this issue is rather pointless and a bit off-topic.

As for the series... I wonder where Raki got that scar next to his left eye from. Looking at the flashbacks, he already has the scar, so they weren't from when the Yoma attacked his family.

[M.D. Geist]

Btw. I found it strange, that Claymores HD-Raw looked worse than the normal SD-avi... Kinda disappointing.

[Zu Ra]

The title track is Raison D’être by Nightmare is catching on to me many people here have liked Ed ( Danzai no Hana~Guilty Sky by Riyu Kosaka ) over the op . Personally I preffered the Op its catching onto me I even made a wav of the op from the show : D

[Daniel E.]

Originally Posted by Budweineken

As for the series... I wonder where Raki got that scar next to his left eye from. Looking at the flashbacks, he already has the scar, so they weren't from when the Yoma attacked his family.

A birthmark perhaps?

[ZombieSheep]

Man, ep 1 was hard to watch for me, not because it's bad, but because I read Angel Densetsu (by same author, a kick ass comedy too) before.

It was really weird to see these familiar faces on such difference setting, I just have to stop watching every now and then, took me like 2 days to finish it. on the positive side of things, that means I have to wait less time for the next episode.

[Lost]

Originally Posted by Daniel E.

A birthmark perhaps?

I dont think so, it looks a lot more like a scar. Just above his left eyebrow.

[Zu Ra]

Yeah its a scar its too big to be a birthmark . Think Raki got it when he was younger as the scar is fading/diminishing

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Eclipze

As of now, judging through just 1 episode is indeed unfair, but that is what's being done by many. At the same time, manga readers/fans are also judging based off the manga material later on and demanding a sub forum based on their excitment for the show as well as just one episode.

As far as I can tell, there is no argument for a sub-forum. If a show generates enough discussion, it'll get one, and if it doesn't, then it won't. It's as simple as that, and no amount of debating will change it.

However, this doesn't make any more sense to discuss the merits of the plot based off of a single episode. Claymore obviously hasn't shown anywhere near all of its cards yet, so any premature judgement is going to be inaccurate. Mentar's point is exactly this, that there's no point making sweeping statements without knowing how the story is going to unfold. I don't believe that he said anything about only manga readers having a right to critique the Claymore anime.

Originally Posted by Eclipze

And do note that I did not cover ANY technical discussion for the anime. Yes, I do know that in terms of animation, art, as well as the fact that the anime is produced by a relatively well-known and well respected studio (MADHOUSE), it has been done superbly. I left out this point because TECHNICALLY ASPECTS does not equate to a sucessful anime, nor does the opposite hold true (and mainly because thats not the point I am trying to make).

I think that you misunderstood Mentar's meaning. He didn't claim that you were talking about the technical aspects of Claymore. Instead, he said that that's one area where it's reasonable to comment on, provided that it's understood that the technical aspects can change.

Originally Posted by Eclipze

Morality in DeathNote is something that can be discussed even without watching beyond the first episode (Or just knowing the summary of what the DEATHNOTE does/is about) - Killing people is a rather big issue with or without supernatural elements, so what happens in the plot doesn't affect such a discussion much.

Death Note is a bit of a unique case in that it presents its moral issues up front. Morally speaking, Light is a very simple character, so it's not necessary to know very much about the story to judge him. In most other stories, this is nowhere nearly as obvious, so it's necessary to know more details before being confident enough to analyze the characters.

I haven't read any of Claymore's manga, but I doubt that it's very similar to Death Note in this regard.

Originally Posted by Eclipze

And finally...for god's sake, I wasn't even bashing/judging the series as a whole. All I did was to point out that more episodes needs to be aired in order to judge whether or not there should be a sub-forum for this show. As others have pointed out, such an action was done in the past (Giving a sub-forum for a series merely based on the first few episodes's post count) and as I have pointed out, quite a few gave bad results (Asatte, Pumpkin Scissors), so its only natural that this (giving a sub-forum to Claymore right now) has not been done for this or any new series for that matter.

Perhaps, but the following quote seems to a fairly sweeping condemnation:

Now tell me, what does Claymore have to offer? (Besides the main plot and episodes)
It definitely doesnt look like material for image-spam, doesn't have a long history (only 10 volumes of manga has come out, no other animated/live version adaptations), nor does it have a (distinct) factor that can be discussed severly (morality, technology-blaber, etc).

Note that the main plot and the episodes themselves may well be worthy of discussion. And there may well be straightforward answers to your questions, but they appear to involve spoiler territory, and that just wouldn't be fair for the rest of us. Finally, there's no hard and set rules for what will and will not generate discussion, so it's best to take your own advice and wait and see.

[Super Ska Master]

Originally Posted by Glitch87

doubt it.... gintama or d gray man or buso renkin or a ton of the other useless comedy/romance shows will get a subforum before claymore...

I didn't know D.Gray-man and Buso Renkin were comedy/romance.

[Zu Ra]

Was making some avtaars from Bleach made one for Claymore too

[Defiled one]

Don`t know....Claymore Episode one missed some chapters of the manga but, considering these scenes lacked anything relevant. I can not criticize them, for the budget is not so big.
By logic, they are saving the budget money, taking off irrelevant scenes that don´t interfere with the plot at all.

I really doubt anybody in here, would enjoy seeing Clare take a bath

[Mentar]

Really? Are you sure? ^_^

Personally, I have a hunch that they only swapped the order, and that the chapter they omitted in episode 1 will be shown in episode 2.

[Defiled one]

Yup...

The next episode is entitled, for those who have seen it on Tv. "The Black Card"

Thus , no bath.

If I`m thinking what I`m thinking and they are thinking, of doing what I think they are thinking of doing.



They better start saving a lot of money Cause that animation style is not cheap, in fact. What kind of technique did they use to make it? Never seen that style before.