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GDB · 2011-06-17, 18:06

But she made a wish for it, so it was a quick/instant change. Theoretically, shouldn't it merely speed her up, rather than slowing everything else down, if that's how they wanted to go about it?

Dark Wing · 2011-06-17, 20:15

I think that the whole changing herself maybe a mistranslation are we sure it wasn't a wish to be able change the world around her?

Scarletknive · 2011-06-17, 20:43

Now how about a fight?
Slow-Down Time vs Time stop...who will win?

Witched · 2011-06-17, 21:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by GDB

But she made a wish for it, so it was a quick/instant change. Theoretically, shouldn't it merely speed her up, rather than slowing everything else down, if that's how they wanted to go about it?

Most likely, Kirika's speed of changing involves the world going to slow down, apparently.

Let's make it the simple way.

A kid is depressed for a long time; When will the depression stop? Usually a long time, I think

In Kirika's case, she wanted to change, basically, a rapid change of time for her and she will become something different more faster.

Unless I made the example go wrong, it should somehow make sense.

Also, Homura still wins.

Riga92 · 2011-06-17, 23:59

Chapter 5 is up surprisingly quick: http://anonscanlations.blogspot.com/...gica-ch-5.html

Oriko and Kirika attack Mitakihara Middle School, unleashing a witch. The witch slaughters many of the students, and also Kazuko-sensei. Homura protects Madoka, but Madoka wonders why Homura is only protecting her. Homura says she can't save everyone, leaves Madoka in a protective barrier, and goes to find Oriko and Kirika. She finds them and tries to attack them, but a barrier seems to protect them. Oriko reveals that she knows Madoka turns into Gretchen and will destroy the world if she allows her to live. Kirika fights Homura, but of course she can't touch Homura. Kyouko, Mami, and Yuma also arrive on the scene, and Kirika realizes she can't protect Oriko if she fights all four of them in her current state. Kirika knows she won't harm Oriko when she turns into a witch, so she willingly becomes one.

Dark Wing · 2011-06-18, 05:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riga92

Chapter 5 is up surprisingly quick: http://anonscanlations.blogspot.com/...gica-ch-5.html

Oriko reveals that she knows Madoka turns into Gretchen and will destroy the world if she allows her to live.

I kinda figured that was the case.

Snork · 2011-06-18, 05:46

Quote:

She was once a shy person, who couldn't approach Oriko after a random act of kindness. So she decided her wish was to change herself, which gave her a new personality.

Now who does she remind me of?

This is odd indeed, however. Two different wishes basically led to similar powers.
Then again, common powers are not, well, uncommon (

), since in the whole Madokaverse we've seen at least three girls with healing abilities (even if in Sayaka's case they seem to be limited to auto-recovery), and besides, the nature of Homura and Kirika's powers may be different (Homura's device gives her limited control over the timeflow of the period within her loop, while Kirika has none of this)

Quote:

The witch slaughters many of the students, and also Kazuko-sensei.

woah, Woah, WOAH! WTQB are you doing, Urobuchi?!!!11

Quote:

Kirika knows she won't harm Oriko when she turns into a witch, so she willingly becomes one.

I wonder what she bases her belief on. IIRC, Octavia didn't seem to have any qualms against squashing Madoka into puree.

Dark Wing · 2011-06-18, 06:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snork

woah, Woah, WOAH! WTQB are you doing, Urobuchi?!!!11

What we always dose...

Quote:

I wonder what she bases her belief on. IIRC, Octavia didn't seem to have any qualms against squashing Madoka into puree.

Maybe she has a lot of faith in her infinite love...

Snork · 2011-06-18, 07:10

Quote:

What he always does...

Good job, then. Writing a franchise that Petite Cossette seems bright and fluffy in comparison with.

Quote:

Maybe she has a lot of faith in her infinite love...

Apparently so. The only problem is, Sayaka's case pretty much hints that a witch does NOT retain the conscience and personality of the girl she's born from.
Of course, Kirika with her headlong approach had all chances to become a witch anyway. but doing it willingly? She undermined Oriko's plans and sent her over the edge at the same time.

EDIT: just read ch 4 and 5. Great, now I'm worrying for Sayaka, too.

If she falls victim to the system after spending the timeline uninvolved, too... that will be overboard.

Still, I also feel sympathy for both Kirika and Oriko. And damn, do I want this all adapted into an OVA (although my imagination has some trouble rendering the new girls from Mura style to Aoki style

).

Dark Wing · 2011-06-18, 12:19

One thing I find kind of interesting is how this story would play out post Madoka's wish...With no witches around

- Yuma's parents wouldn't have been killed by a witch...of course that would mean that she wouldn't have been saved by Kyouko and left in that abusive home...

However I like to think that Oriko stilll lead Kyuube to her with her powers and she found her escape as a magical girl.

- Oriko and Kirika wouldn't have to go on their suicide mission to kill magical girls before they became witches and lived happily ever after as a magical girl due.

oh and above all else poor Kazuko-sensei doesn't get eaten alive...

Snork · 2011-06-18, 12:45

Basically, the theory remains the same - in previous timelines, there might be no need for Oriko to act up, ditto in TL5 (Gretchen had no chance/time to destroy the world), and TL4... depends on how it's placed related to PMOM timeline (after such a finale, I'm afraid Homura would be inclined to secure this factor in most radical ways

... and Madoka dreaming about the previous timeline only is more logical, so TL4 probably DOES come after PMOM events).
Yuma's case is unclear, since we don't quite know what prevented Kyouko from running into her in the timelines where she comes to Mitakihara (she should be hanging around, but she's not). While it's possible she never becomes a magical girl (since it was Oriko who urged her to do that), I'm curious about her fate. And worried, too - demons also have barriers and can attack people...

xizro345 · 2011-06-18, 14:13

That's why I don't like the way Oriko ended. They added new characters that for some unfathomable reason won't show up even if they could.

Witched · 2011-06-18, 21:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snork

Yuma's case is unclear, since we don't quite know what prevented Kyouko from running into her in the timelines where she comes to Mitakihara (she should be hanging around, but she's not). While it's possible she never becomes a magical girl (since it was Oriko who urged her to do that), I'm curious about her fate. And worried, too - demons also have barriers and can attack people...

I guess Yuma contracting does help 'em heal, you know.

If they're about to die, Yuma can heal them before they die. But I'm not sure about that.

Though I find pretty weird that Kirika decided to become a witch, why didn't Oriko just send the grief to that grief seed before that witch was going to be summoned! >,<

Evil Oriko is evil.

Riga92 · 2011-06-21, 01:19

Chapter 6 is up: http://anonscanlations.blogspot.com/...gica-ch-6.html

It first starts off with another flashback of Oriko's past. It turns out that Oriko's father was actually a corrupt politician. Because of this, people stopped associating with Oriko and treated her with contempt at her school. Oriko felt betrayed by her father and everyone, and that despair was what led to Kyubey finding her and making her contract.

Back in the present, the girls battle Witch!Kirika and Oriko. Homura figures out that Oriko has prescience powers, meaning she can predict their moves. Homura also makes a note to herself that this timeline is irregular. Oriko realizes Homura's time-manipulation powers and states that Homura cannot defeat her.

Despite the girls efforts, Oriko and Witch!Kirika have the upperhand, with Homura, Kyouko, and Mami wounded. Kyouko and Mami realize the truth of the witches, and Mami says its probably better if they die here. Yuma however heals them, and gives them a little speech:

"When I was being bullied by mama, I always thought it would be better if I died. But when I was attacked by the witch, I desperately tried to survive. We'll turn into witches someday you know. SOMEDAY ISN'T TODAY. Everyone dies someday. Kyouko, Mami, will you really die today?"

Homura almost believe she failed again, but because of Yuma, Kyouko and Mami fight again with renewed spirit, and with teamwork, they manage to take down Witch!Kirika.

Homura regains confidence, and she tells Oriko to give it up. She again notes how irregular this timeline is, that Kyouko and Mami miraculously didn't fall to despair and united, and that maybe this timeline may be the end of her long journey.

Kyubey then shows up and reveals Oriko's plan. Oriko was trying to locate Madoka and kill her before Kyubey contracted her. In order to divert his attention, Oriko told Kyubey to contract Yuma and then started the magical girl killing spree. Despite this, Kyubey ultimately saw through her plan and notes how Oriko didn't include Homura as a factor in her plan. Kyubey, with that evil emotionless expression, states that he has found Madoka.

The chapter then ends with Madoka somehow breaking through her protective barrier and then runs off to find Homura.

Scarletknive · 2011-06-21, 02:35

Did...did i just see Kirika's graveyard?It reads like this?

Spoiler for chapter 6:

she was born in 1995, the year which all my friends are born in

dun tell me kyubey is up to no good again...

Snork · 2011-06-21, 05:23

Quote:

She again notes how irregular this timeline is, that Kyouko and Mami miraculously didn't fall to despair and united, and that maybe this timeline may be the end of her long journey.

Darn you, Urobuchi...

Quote:

Though I find pretty weird that Kirika decided to become a witch, why didn't Oriko just send the grief to that grief seed before that witch was going to be summoned! >,<

I think she did (presumably that's how you summon a witch from her grief seed). But Kirika used up her magic anyway by keeping a barrier.

MartianMage · 2011-06-21, 05:39

Too much deviation(kirika not attacking oriko as a witch and homura's timestopping not timestopping... i mean come on so what if you can see what's gonna happen if you can't move) for me to treat this as another canon timeline. For me oriko feels like a code geass spin off <_<

omimon · 2011-06-21, 07:54

At least now we know Yuma's existence is important since she is the key that can leads to a future where no one dies from despair. (Sayaka aside)

Liddo-kun · 2011-06-22, 06:25

Spoiler for Finished reading chapter 6:

ChronoReverse · 2011-06-22, 10:26

Chapter 7 was a bit of a downer. Just as Homura thought there was a solution after all. She gets soul crushed in every timeline huh?

2011-06-17, 20:15	Link #222
Dark Wing Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Age: 38	I think that the whole changing herself maybe a mistranslation are we sure it wasn't a wish to be able change the world around her? __________________

2011-06-17, 23:59	Link #225
Riga92 The Spear of Destiny Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: A place where the stars cross. Age: 31	Chapter 5 is up surprisingly quick: http://anonscanlations.blogspot.com/...gica-ch-5.html Oriko and Kirika attack Mitakihara Middle School, unleashing a witch. The witch slaughters many of the students, and also Kazuko-sensei. Homura protects Madoka, but Madoka wonders why Homura is only protecting her. Homura says she can't save everyone, leaves Madoka in a protective barrier, and goes to find Oriko and Kirika. She finds them and tries to attack them, but a barrier seems to protect them. Oriko reveals that she knows Madoka turns into Gretchen and will destroy the world if she allows her to live. Kirika fights Homura, but of course she can't touch Homura. Kyouko, Mami, and Yuma also arrive on the scene, and Kirika realizes she can't protect Oriko if she fights all four of them in her current state. Kirika knows she won't harm Oriko when she turns into a witch, so she willingly becomes one. __________________

2011-06-18, 12:19	Link #230
Dark Wing Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Age: 38	One thing I find kind of interesting is how this story would play out post Madoka's wish...With no witches around - Yuma's parents wouldn't have been killed by a witch...of course that would mean that she wouldn't have been saved by Kyouko and left in that abusive home... However I like to think that Oriko stilll lead Kyuube to her with her powers and she found her escape as a magical girl. - Oriko and Kirika wouldn't have to go on their suicide mission to kill magical girls before they became witches and lived happily ever after as a magical girl due. oh and above all else poor Kazuko-sensei doesn't get eaten alive... __________________

2011-06-18, 12:45	Link #231
Snork Twilight lander Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Minsk, Belarus	Basically, the theory remains the same - in previous timelines, there might be no need for Oriko to act up, ditto in TL5 (Gretchen had no chance/time to destroy the world), and TL4... depends on how it's placed related to PMOM timeline (after such a finale, I'm afraid Homura would be inclined to secure this factor in most radical ways ... and Madoka dreaming about the previous timeline only is more logical, so TL4 probably DOES come after PMOM events). Yuma's case is unclear, since we don't quite know what prevented Kyouko from running into her in the timelines where she comes to Mitakihara (she should be hanging around, but she's not). While it's possible she never becomes a magical girl (since it was Oriko who urged her to do that), I'm curious about her fate. And worried, too - demons also have barriers and can attack people... __________________

2011-06-21, 01:19	Link #234
Riga92 The Spear of Destiny Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: A place where the stars cross. Age: 31	Chapter 6 is up: http://anonscanlations.blogspot.com/...gica-ch-6.html It first starts off with another flashback of Oriko's past. It turns out that Oriko's father was actually a corrupt politician. Because of this, people stopped associating with Oriko and treated her with contempt at her school. Oriko felt betrayed by her father and everyone, and that despair was what led to Kyubey finding her and making her contract. Back in the present, the girls battle Witch!Kirika and Oriko. Homura figures out that Oriko has prescience powers, meaning she can predict their moves. Homura also makes a note to herself that this timeline is irregular. Oriko realizes Homura's time-manipulation powers and states that Homura cannot defeat her. Despite the girls efforts, Oriko and Witch!Kirika have the upperhand, with Homura, Kyouko, and Mami wounded. Kyouko and Mami realize the truth of the witches, and Mami says its probably better if they die here. Yuma however heals them, and gives them a little speech: "When I was being bullied by mama, I always thought it would be better if I died. But when I was attacked by the witch, I desperately tried to survive. We'll turn into witches someday you know. SOMEDAY ISN'T TODAY. Everyone dies someday. Kyouko, Mami, will you really die today?" Homura almost believe she failed again, but because of Yuma, Kyouko and Mami fight again with renewed spirit, and with teamwork, they manage to take down Witch!Kirika. Homura regains confidence, and she tells Oriko to give it up. She again notes how irregular this timeline is, that Kyouko and Mami miraculously didn't fall to despair and united, and that maybe this timeline may be the end of her long journey. Kyubey then shows up and reveals Oriko's plan. Oriko was trying to locate Madoka and kill her before Kyubey contracted her. In order to divert his attention, Oriko told Kyubey to contract Yuma and then started the magical girl killing spree. Despite this, Kyubey ultimately saw through her plan and notes how Oriko didn't include Homura as a factor in her plan. Kyubey, with that evil emotionless expression, states that he has found Madoka. The chapter then ends with Madoka somehow breaking through her protective barrier and then runs off to find Homura. __________________

2011-06-17, 18:06	Link #221
GDB Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Age: 38	But she made a wish for it, so it was a quick/instant change. Theoretically, shouldn't it merely speed her up, rather than slowing everything else down, if that's how they wanted to go about it?

2011-06-17, 20:43	Link #223
Scarletknive Meister Join Date: Jul 2010	Now how about a fight? Slow-Down Time vs Time stop...who will win?

2011-06-18, 14:13	Link #232
xizro345 King's Justice Join Date: Apr 2004	That's why I don't like the way Oriko ended. They added new characters that for some unfathomable reason won't show up even if they could.

2011-06-21, 02:35	Link #235
Scarletknive Meister Join Date: Jul 2010	Did...did i just see Kirika's graveyard?It reads like this? Spoiler for chapter 6: Kirika Kure 1995- 2011 DEAD she was born in 1995, the year which all my friends are born in dun tell me kyubey is up to no good again...

2011-06-21, 05:39	Link #237
MartianMage Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006	Too much deviation(kirika not attacking oriko as a witch and homura's timestopping not timestopping... i mean come on so what if you can see what's gonna happen if you can't move) for me to treat this as another canon timeline. For me oriko feels like a code geass spin off <_< __________________ Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world! Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute. Homura: Tribute? You steal girls' souls, and make them your slaves! Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions. Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you! Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!

2011-06-21, 07:54	Link #238
omimon Professional Hikkikomori Join Date: Feb 2009	At least now we know Yuma's existence is important since she is the key that can leads to a future where no one dies from despair. (Sayaka aside)

2011-06-22, 06:25	Link #239
Liddo-kun is this so? Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Gradius Home World	Spoiler for Finished reading chapter 6: Poor Oriko, her only friend is dead and she's left all alone - it's my tendency to sympathize with villains who care for their loved ones, but have a tragic end (example: Caster from FSN). And it was so mean for people at her school to treat her like that, didn't give a chance at all to prove that she isn't like her dad. She probably went to school thinking that someone might sympathize with her, but they treated her like garbage. The only thing I seriously didn't like in this chapter is Kyubey seems to have a facial expression. In the anime he can only open and close his eyes. Aside from that, I enjoyed reading the manga. Hoping they would consider an OVA for this. __________________ Clearing 4 domain with Qiqi / MTGNexus - Magic Art Gallery / AnimEVO 2020 - EFZ tournament / Cool Japan Festival 2015 Last edited by Liddo-kun; 2011-06-22 at 08:03.

2011-06-22, 10:26	Link #240
ChronoReverse Senior Member Join Date: May 2004	Chapter 7 was a bit of a downer. Just as Homura thought there was a solution after all. She gets soul crushed in every timeline huh?