Steins;Gate - Episode 19 Discussion / Poll

[Elestia]

The series took a noticeable dive in pacing and quality ever since Okabe tried to undo Feyris and Ruka's D-mail, which was understandable since they barely got any character screen time in the past and was shoved into finishing their arc within one episode, but thankfully Steins;Gate returns with a vividly emotionally raw episode that just turned my gut inside and out. Simply watching Okabe and Moeka wrestle for the cellphone really put me at the edge of my seat, seeing how how desperate both characters were for their own reasons. Having Moeka screaming at the top of her lungs and banging at the door frantically, made me realize how pitiful she was and even garnered some sympathy from my heart.

The thing that really hit home with me was how Moeka chose to make herself so miserable and isolated when she ratted out to FB where the location of the IBN 5100 was. In doing so, she never became a lab member and could have provided herself with a home she could truly feel what was a warm, fun place to be.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Midonin

Two wrongs don't make a right, though.

Yeah, I know I am totally sure that he stopped a second and considered the place of women in society front of male chauvinism! Can we drop that topic please??

Know what? In his position I WOULD do it. If a friend's life is in danger, absolute equality of genders is in full swing for me!

[Midonin]

That Moeka is female is part of it, but if Rintaro punched some guy who was innocent, I think I'd have about the same reaction. The punch provides catharsis, but then what? Catharsis fades, and eventually, the person who was hurt will only hurt back. The cycle of revenge is a stupid thing that doesn't have to be. What's getting Moeka to change her mind is listening, to Rintaro by proxy through FB.

[GDB]

Who he wouldn't even know she listened to unconditionally if not for the punch and kick that gave him access to her phone, which led to the pinning and eventual talking. In case you didn't notice, she was completely snapped when he showed up and was acting like a raving lunatic. He tried talking to her when he first showed up, and she was completely engrossed in being insane.

[yuzen003]

If someone killed your friend does that make it okay to punch their twin sister? This Moeka never sent the d-mail, never killed Mayuri (she died before Mayuri), and hadn't even met her in this timeline so really the only thing she's done is get a text and pickup a computer. It was in everyone's best interest that he punch her and take the phone but this Moeka hasn't really done anything wrong.

[Archon_Wing]

Haven't seen the episode... but took a peek and saw this. :S

Originally Posted by Sheba

Yeah, I know I am totally sure that he stopped a second and considered the place of women in society front of male chauvinism! Can we drop that topic please??

Seriously. If someone's trying to kill me and people I know; I could care less if they have a penis, a vagina, or a coconut.

Bringing up this very issue is sexist, because it brings up gender where it should not be an issue.

Know what? In his position I WOULD do it. If a friend's life is in danger, absolute equality of genders is in full swing for me!

Same. I don't extend morals or kindness to murderers. Those that don't respect human life don't deserve to be respected as humans. Therefore them being whatever gender is irrelevant.

[Midonin]

Originally Posted by GDB

Who he wouldn't even know she listened to unconditionally if not for the punch and kick that gave him access to her phone, which led to the pinning and eventual talking. In case you didn't notice, she was completely snapped when he showed up and was acting like a raving lunatic. He tried talking to her when he first showed up, and she was completely engrossed in being insane.

Like I said, I realized that the situation had reached the point where it was probably the only thing that could be done. It was morally grey at best, though, and I feel like praising Rintaro for that over his talk is missing the point of the episode.

[Reckoner]

Are we seriously discussing the moral implications of that scene in this episode? There are some very important things at stake here. If Okabe doesn't get that phone from her, not only does Mayuri and Moeka end up dying, but the future becomes a complete dystopia.

Okabe has a lot of things riding here, and he also should be a little mentally deranged at this point over everything.

Moeka isn't innocent here either. She stole the computer from them and is leaking information to SERN about them that will inevitably lead to their demise. This isn't about beating women, and honestly why are women put on a pedestal above men when it comes to violence? If this was okabe punching some other dude would this be the same? Give me a break.

Okabe's actions are perfectly understandable. Furthermore, the morality of it here is of little consequence to what actually needs to be done.

===

Anyhow, this was a fantastically dark episode.

[Elestia]

Actually I'm surprised no one mentioned about the land lady checking up on Moeka and assumed it was her lover, rather than an attempted rape by some mysterious stranger, which was way more disturbing in my opinion.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Elestia

Actually I'm surprised no one mentioned about the land lady checking up on Moeka and assumed it was her lover, rather than an attempted rape by some mysterious stranger, which was way more disturbing in my opinion.

Unfortunately, this seems to be a symptom of general apathy in some places around the world, or "let's not get our nose in others' business" if you get what I mean.

[hoarfrost]

I don't celebrate women getting hurt, least of all one who clearly needs some mental intervention. But yeah, I'd say it's justified given the urgency of the situation to restrain her whatever way possible, especially since she's going berserk.

Myself, I was thinking he'd just sneak on in, whack her in the head and abscond with her phone. Under no circumstance would I have tried to reason with a person who would kill on command from a text message.

Meh, sometimes the ends do justify the means.

[Tsuyoshi]

Considering the situation and what would happen if Okaba hadn't really tried to take the phone away from Moeka, I would say that his action in hitting her are completely justified. If he didn't do it, Moeka would die. To all people who think hitting Moeka was wrong, think about that. Would you rather she not be hit only to die later, or would you prefer her to get hit so she can live later?

Also, Okabe was doing it for the girl who grew up to be like a sister to him (I won't say he has a romantic interest in her because at least in the anime, nothing like that has even been remotely hinted at). This is coming from someone who has a sister he values more than any other girl on this planet right now: if saving my sister's life entailed hitting another woman, I would do it. If it entailed going back in time 9000 times, I would do it. If it entailed losing an arm in the most literal sense, I would do it. This is how Okabe feels, and this is what he would do to save Mayuri. When it's a matter of life and death, particularly if the life is that of a person you value so much, morals have little to no value anymore.

With that said, this was a magnificently great episode, perhaps the best episode so far. It was dark, it was tense, and it was rich in emotion from start to finish, so much that I seriously felt that I'd been watching the ep for over an hour and could still do with more. The characters felt so real, and seeing Moeka shrivelling in a corner desperately calling out for FB sent deep chills in my back. It really brought out the motivations of both Okabe and Moeka splendidly, and the atmosphere was perfect for it to happen. This episode deserves 11/10 from me.

[David_The_Gnome]

I like it when S;G kicks it up a notch and creates these darker feel episodes.

But I can't believe that somebody's turning this into a gender abuse issue.

Unless you like raising non-issues for fun, I realize that this may be a personal for you. However, let's not over analyze this and twist this episode into something that it isn't.

I don't applaud Okarin for punching the daylights out of a "female". I applaud Okarin for punching the daylights out of "Moeka". If anything, it's about giving him props for breaking all the rules (society's chivalrous attitude) to fulfill his mission. In addition, this was personal regardless of Moeka's gender.

Unless somebody might forget, Moeka, Rounders, Sern, Whatever-ever-their-faces are terrorist enemies that have been spying on Okarin's crew. They won't hesitate to kill either.

Consider this a much warranted pre-emptive strike that'll lead to saving Mayuri and (ironically at the moment) Moeka in the process.

Episode's a 10/10 from me.

[Midonin]

You can refer to me by name, you know. I'm not a "somebody". I'm right here.

[yuzen003]

Originally Posted by David_The_Gnome

Unless somebody might forget, Moeka, Rounders, Sern, Whatever-ever-their-faces are terrorist enemies that have been spying on Okarin's crew. They won't hesitate to kill either.

In this timeline Moeka recovered the IBN 5100 before she ever met Okarin's crew, so she never spied on them. She's still a Rounder, but this version of her has not and will never interact with them since FB has the IBN she no longer needs to look for it.

It had to be done, but hitting her is not hitting the same person who spied on the group or killed Mayuri.

[David_The_Gnome]

Originally Posted by Midonin

You can refer to me by name, you know. I'm not a "somebody". I'm right here.

lol

Hey Midonin.

[ars89]

Yes Okarin beat the crap out of her! Finally some retribution for having to see Mayuri die over and over again. Lol at the land lady asking what the noise was but then went back as she thought they were a couple, nice save by Okarin with that kiss. Was surprised that she killed herself in the beginning. Still don't get why he wasn't able to undue the d-mail even when he found out what she had sent the first time. At least he knows where the ibn is now so he won't have to undue the d-mail. I wonder how he'll go about looking for FB.

[miroku2192]

So how does she know Okabe in this timeline if she knew about the IBN5100?

And god this episode was absolutely amazing. So much emotion. The only thing that bothered me was how the landlady was like "oh lawl, they're making out" despite the fact that she was kicking and screaming and crying. Yeah that looks like some typical making out alright.

GG landlady

[David_The_Gnome]

Originally Posted by yuzen003

In this timeline Moeka recovered the IBN 5100 before she ever met Okarin's crew, so she never spied on them. She's still a Rounder, but this version of her has not and will never interact with them since FB has the IBN she no longer needs to look for it.

It had to be done, but hitting her is not hitting the same person who spied on the group or killed Mayuri.

Good point. The worldline system throws a wrench in there in terms of morality.

However, she's not off the hook. Even by what you just said, she's still part of the same terrorist group who are willing and able to kill Okirin's crew. In many worldlines they already did.

In addition, she's a terrorist that just stole private property that's instrumental to SERN taking over the world and causing all hell to break loose.

From my perspective, that's just as justifiable even if originally, Okarin's intent for decking the crap out of her is debatable. Particularly since the outcome is sparing Moeka's, Mayuri's, and maybe even part-time warrior's life in the process (another angle).

[Wandering_Youth]

Wow, what an episode. I know Moeka is a bit loony, but this episode takes the cake. Whatever the case, Okabe's situation where he punched her was nothing to fuss over about. He's trying to save the one he cares about and will use almost anything method to do it.

I can understand Okabe's hatred at Moeka because she is going to kill Mayuri be it her present, past or future self because she has no will of her own and will follow FB's word to the letter.

I don't hate Moeka, but I pity her. I would rather hate FB because he or she is using Moeka to kill. It's like don't hate guns, hate the people who use the guns to kill people, but for some people that's just not good enough it seems.