Gundam 00 Mecha, Weapons, and Technology

[kakakka]

If I am not wrong, Euclides in 00F can support Tau Drive's system. From that, I think it's not that far fetched that Ptolemy 2 can too.

[SonicSP]

Originally Posted by Vash1306

After the Sol Brave Squadron and Celestial Being escaped from the ELS. There was a scene with Lasse talking to a Brave pilots about recharging the braces particles. Does the Ptolemaios 2 Kai have equipment to recharge GN Drive Taus now?

Hard to say, it could be that they simply provided the electricity through a less conventional hard to do method as opposed to those special recharging machines.

What I find more intrguing is that Egyptian woman thanked CB for the "particle supply". I recall watching the movie in the cinema and the official subs mentioned the same thing, which I find a bit intriguig even then.

She could be speaking casually, as opposed to a technicaly manner bit it still bothers me a bit nevertheless.

[kakakka]

They also took in Raphael. I think the possibility that they could support GN Tau Drive is there.

[Rising Dragon]

With their dwindling funds, the loss of two original GN-Drives, and the advancements made in GN-Drive[T]s, the Ptolemaios crew probably realized that they may have to rely on GN-Drive[T]s alongside their original GN-Drives.

[SonicSP]

It still bothers me that she used the word particles though.

[bio9205]

Originally Posted by kakakka

They also took in Raphael. I think the possibility that they could support GN Tau Drive is there.

Well, Raphael does have 3 drives, it wouldn't need much recharging, really, despite the huge amounts of particles it used.

[kakakka]

It does though. It Trans-Amed its way to Ptolemy's location, then used another one there while using huge amounts for its weapons.

[bio9205]

Originally Posted by kakakka

It does though. It Trans-Amed its way to Ptolemy's location, then used another one there while using huge amounts for its weapons.

Well, like I said, that's what its 3 drives are for.

[kakakka]

... Which gives it more reason to recharge after, adding the fact that it also ran out of particles after that run.

[SonicSP]

At least for the Raphael, its hard to determine whether it definitively recharged or not especially with three Drives on total on it.

[Kuroi Hadou]

Originally Posted by SonicSP

At least for the Raphael, its hard to determine whether it definitively recharged or not especially with three Drives on total on it.

I always thought that Raphael drained the first Tau Drive to get there, and then used the Seravee II's simultaneously the rest of the time.

[SonicSP]

Originally Posted by Kuroi Hadou

I always thought that Raphael drained the first Tau Drive to get there, and then used the Seravee II's simultaneously the rest of the time.

That's the thing, with a three Drive mobile suit any of the forementioned scenarios are possible.

But I've always been of the believe that you can just plug a wire unorthodoxly into the Tau Drive to provide it power, not necessrily relying on a start up machine for the recharging though the method is much easier and efficient. In order for this theory-scenario is to be true though than the Raphael and Brave Drives likely possess their own compact start up mechanisms inside them since without these compact start up machines the Drives cannot start up without those large recharging machines. The Gundam Thrones have them but they are lacking in the Throne Veranus, GN-Xs and Aheads, though every other Tau series after this is a big unknown.

[Kuroi Hadou]

Originally Posted by SonicSP

But I've always been of the believe that you can just plug a wire unorthodoxly into the Tau Drive to provide it power, not necessrily relying on a start up machine for the recharging though the method is much easier and efficient. In order for this theory-scenario is to be true though than the Raphael and Brave Drives likely possess their own compact start up mechanisms inside them since without these compact start up machines the Drives cannot start up without those large recharging machines. The Gundam Thrones have them but they are lacking in the Throne Veranus, GN-Xs and Aheads, though every other Tau series after this is a big unknown.

So, to sum up, your theory is that the Raphael and Braves can essentially "restart" their Tau Drives after Trans-Am in mid-battle?

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

What I don't follow is why the Braves (not Raphael) would need recharging anyway. Don't Taus last at least a few days before they need to recharge?

[console65]

Originally Posted by GN0010 Nosferatu

What I don't follow is why the Braves (not Raphael) would need recharging anyway. Don't Taus last at least a few days before they need to recharge?

Braves used a lot of particles in their attack against the ELS. They probably had their GN Drive's particle output at maximum of normal operations when executing all those maneuvers and charged beam attacks. Graham did say to go "full burst."

GN Drive Tau powered suits have to adjust their output to different situations since they have a limited operation time due to power concerns. For just traveling around and not getting anywhere fast they reduce output and for battle they increase output to resupply particles as fast as possible to keep up on their beam attacks and speed.

[fizzmaister]

I am of the opinion that any well-designed combat machine that requires recharging should have something like this: "In case of no specialized recharging equipment, apply X volts across these terminals."

We know that the only thing the Tau drives need the special machines for are start up. So long as the braves didn't use up all of their power, their drives should go into a low-power mode. They should be able to simply hook up their batteries (or whatever it is they use in the future), and recharge. However, that doesn't explain why they're thanking for particles, rather than energy.

Another possibility is that they got particles without a recharge. The Vashtis could have cludged something up that connected to the taus on the braves, but for one reason or another (safety, or not wanting to recharge and power the drives at the same time), only powered the drives on each suit until it produced enough particles to get back to their mothership.

The final possibility is that some of the braves did run out of energy and their drives shut down. In that case, they could have done a transfusion of particles (think Drei to Einz), from the Raphael (which would be hooked up the cludged recharging station) to the Braves that had their drives shut down. Right, the Raphael was destroyed at this point. Same idea, but a brave that didn't run out of energy, resupplied the ones that did, while being powered by the recharging station that the Vashtis must have build to recharge the Raphael after its first sortie.

One more idea, I don't like it, and I'm sure it will drive Sonic nuts, but its possible that the braves that ran out of energy, got a condenser or two charged with green particles, and only used those particles to propel themselves to their mothership. At which point they flushed the condensers (no mixing of different particles), and recharged the taus, and restarted them. I don't know what was in the chapter of 00N (I think), the one with Zombie Kyrios. I remember that the federation had issues getting it to work because the Kyrios was designed for green GN particles. But I want to point out that the biggest difference between the red and green particles is compressibility and beam potency (which have an inverse relationship, in the range that we know about, red: low compressibility, high beam potency; green: high compressibility, low beam potency). I propose that that the issue with Zombie!Kyrios was that it was designed to highly compress green particles, but it choked on red particles which wouldn't compress as much as it wanted them too. This would mean that GN hydraulics, and beam weapons wouldn't work, but propulsion should.

In further defense, let's say that red particles can be compressed to five times some standard value, orange 10 times, and green 15 times (disclaimer: numbers are for example only). A machine trying to compress red particles to 15 times the standard, would choke up, since red particles can't be compressed beyond the five time limit. A machine trying to compress green particles to 10 time the standard wouldn't have a problem. It wouldn't be as efficient as possible since the particles could still be compressed more, but it would work.

[fizzmaister]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

On the entire issue of "Particle Tank" vs "Condenser", in my opinion it really is just a semantics issue, much like "Solar Furnace" vs "GN Drive" where both terms are more or less interchangeable given all the usage we see in the series.

and a lot of other people on the same topic.

I think that the best theory is that they are two names for the same thing. However, I also have an alternate. I think that particle tanks are optimized for steady discharges, while condensers are optimized for quick charge/discharge. We all know that the suits use condensers to smooth out the power requirements (that is a condenser allows a GNMS to smooth out a large instantaneous particle requirement over time so it doesn't prevent other systems from getting particles temporarily). Also, suits that are expected to recharge during combat (0-Raiser, GN-Archer), use condensers rather than P-tanks. Also, third generation and older Gundams, used P-Tanks as drive replacements. Sepher, 0 Gundam (Rasiel and Artemie, maybe, I'm not sure), since they could be used in a slow discharge mode. The only Gundams that I'm aware of that use L-Condensers as drive replacements are the 00 repairs, which due to high particle consumption rates, use them in quick discharge (especially if trans-am of some variety is wanted). In fact I think trans-am is the reason that we don't see P-tanks after 3rd gen, since steady output optimization is antithetical to trans-am.

To tie this up in a nice analogy, it's like alkaline and NiMH batteries. Alkaline batteries can store more total charge (mAH) than NiMH batteries, but in high drain (mA) situations, NiMH batteries are more efficient as seen here. In high drain situations, a NiMH battery can output 3.5 times the energy of an equally rated alkaline battery. Since NiMH usually have 2/3 of the total capacity of a comparable alkaline, that means that a NiMH battery will output twice as much as a comparable alkaline battery. Also, NiMH batteries can be recharged, while alkaline batteries can't. Of course alkaline batteries shine at low output levels, where they can fully utilize their higher capacity.

In short, P-tanks are like alkaline batteries, higher capacity, but optimized for lower output, and hard to recharge. Condensers are like NiMH batteries, lower capacity, but much more efficient at higher power levels than the other choices, and easily rechargeable.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

http://www.thatanimeblog.com/wp-cont...emories-79.jpg

"Warship" you say?

[console65]

Originally Posted by GN0010 Nosferatu

http://www.thatanimeblog.com/wp-cont...emories-79.jpg

"Warship" you say?

Unlikely. The only "weapon" that ship would have is they attune their GN Field into a cutting particle field and ram straight through something. Also, I'm sure they have a huge mass of ELS on board that can split up and turn into combat mobile suits and other forms if they feel the need to go on offense.

[bio9205]

Remember the picture Nos posted in the models thread of the RD Brave? I recall seeing its forearm/wrist can slide out, like the Enact and Flag. Is that a beam saber in there?

EDIT: Here it is. It's the fourth photo.