The Character Discussion Thread of SOS団 Member: Itsuki Koizumi

[Ithekro]

That page is seriously long.

[Sute443]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Also, where is this idea that Koizumi is a great actor coming from in the first place? What evidence is there for that? It strikes me as pure speculation.

Lone Island Syndrome and some part of Sighs that I'm having trouble locating right now.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

This idea that Koizumi is constantly putting on this great flamboyant act for Kyon and Haruhi, but then is so incredibly careful that when he actually acts in a movie he goes out of his way to deliberately degrade his acting ability just to put off possible suspicion... man, I'm not buying that at all. That's insane levels of facade-casting. It really is right up there with Light Yagami.

Consider that he (believes he) constantly faces the risk of an unstable god destroying the world. I believe an insane level of facade-casting is justified.

[Heatth]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

That in and of itself, no. But to pretend to be a bad actor just so that somebody else won't catch on that you're actually a good actor just so that this same somebody won't start to grow suspicious and start guessing at things...

That's either extreme paranoia on Itsuki's part, or meticulously planning out everything he does in a very L and Light Yagami way.

You have a point. I can see the organization being that paranoic, though. Entreteining Haruhi is Serious Business.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Also, where is this idea that Koizumi is a great actor coming from in the first place? What evidence is there for that? It strikes me as pure speculation.

Lone Island. No one noticed he was playing the wholle thing. Never said he is a great actor. But better then he showed in the movie, where it was really obvious he was acting. Also, you could say more or less his entire life is a act, yet, Haruhi don't noiced it. And he (almost) never make his true feeling slip behind his cherful mask. Not a great actor, but enough to hide his own emotions.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

It's more than pure speculation, Heatth.

This idea that Koizumi is constantly putting on this great flamboyant act for Kyon and Haruhi, but then is so incredibly careful that when he actually acts in a movie he goes out of his way to deliberately degrade his acting ability just to put off possible suspicion... man, I'm not buying that at all. That's insane levels of facade-casting. It really is right up there with Light Yagami.

This... was not responding to the quote right? I was talking about his behaviour on novel 5 and 9, not about his possible chess maestry.

Spoiler for novel 6, I believe:

About he be constantly actng, it is not specuation. It ws on Charmet at First Sight LOVER, I believe, he adimits he is always acting and envy Kyon and Mikuru for not needing to.

Also, if it is true, I think the plan is not his, but of the Organization.

PP:

Originally Posted by Sute443

Consider that he (believes he) constantly faces the risk of an unstable god destroying the world. I believe an insane level of facade-casting is justified.

Good point. For Itsuki, and the organization as a wholle, Haruhi is pretty unstable and they afraid anything that might angry/bore/unplease her. He even told Kyon, in Day of Sagitarous, he envy Kyon for not being afraid Haruhi might destroy the world if they lose the game.

[Simplicity]

De-lurking because of the awesome character threads

Spoiler for Novel 2+9 Spoilers:

Honestly the exchange in Novel 9 just reads to me as nothing more than attempt to get Kyon to understand Haruhi's train-of-thought regarding Sasaki. If one of my friends had a friend of the opposite gender who introduced herself as a "close friend" I'd think, "Hmm, maybe something went on between them."

Course Kyon doesn't get it because he doesn't give a damn about Koizumi and his past. So I took Itsuki's reaction to Kyon's lack of understanding as nothing more than irritation. I understand why people would see it as Koizumi "testing the waters" with Kyon though.

As for Itsuki as an actor, I think he is a good actor, as shown in Lone Island Syndrome. In Sigh I thought the bad acting came from a combination of pretty much nothing to go off of other than Haruhi's orders, no time to practice, and having other things to worry about, i.e. class play, the world possibly being permanently changed, etc. The conversation with Yuki was made up on the spot, right? So of course it would come off awkward.

[Heatth]

Originally Posted by Simplicity

De-lurking because of the awesome character threads

Yeah, they are awesome. Thanks Crow.

Originally Posted by Simplicity

Spoiler for You should hide this kind of thing in a spoiler tag, edit you post, please:

Honestly the exchange in Novel 9 just reads to me as nothing more than attempt to get Kyon to understand Haruhi's train-of-thought regarding Sasaki. If one of my friends had a friend of the opposite gender who introduced herself as a "close friend" I'd think, "Hmm, maybe something went on between them."

Spoiler for book 9:

The point is, using he as an exemple don't make any sense. It wasn't only to show Haruhi thought there was something about then (Kyon probably knew that already, as every one thinks the same and he knows it). But to tell he about the jelously feeling. That is why he uses Mikuru just after, because he knows Kyon lusts her.

Originally Posted by Simplicity

As for Itsuki as an actor, I think he is a good actor, as shown in Lone Island Syndrome. In Sigh I thought the bad acting came from a combination of pretty much nothing to go off of other than Haruhi's orders, no time to practice, and having other things to worry about, i.e. class play, the world possibly being permanently changed, etc. The conversation with Yuki was made up on the spot, right? So of course it would come off awkward.

Yeah, this is more simple and make sense.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Simplicity

*snip*

As for Itsuki as an actor, I think he is a good actor, as shown in Lone Island Syndrome. In Sigh I thought the bad acting came from a combination of pretty much nothing to go off of other than Haruhi's orders, no time to practice, and having other things to worry about, i.e. class play, the world possibly being permanently changed, etc. The conversation with Yuki was made up on the spot, right? So of course it would come off awkward.

This I can buy into a bit easier. Itsuki's bad acting was due to Haruhi's atrocious Directing.

I dislike the idea that all of Koizumi's actions towards Kyon is pure acting because, well, I tend to very much dislike highly pretentious characters, and if this is all acting, then Koizumi is a highly pretentious character. I'd rather not dislike him because he strikes me as a good person in general.

Oh... something else to keep in mind, though - there have been times when Koizumi has acted very chummy towards Kyon... and Haruhi wasn't there. No need for acting then, right?

For example, when Koizumi dragged Kyon off to see a closed space, I got a distinct feeling that Koizumi wanted to show off in front of Kyon. I really did get that impression from him.

[Heatth]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Oh... something else to keep in mind, though - there have been times when Koizumi has acted very chummy towards Kyon... and Haruhi wasn't there. No need for acting then, right?

For example, when Koizumi dragged Kyon off to see a closed space, I got a distinct feeling that Koizumi wanted to show off in front of Kyon. I really did get that impression from him.

True. He even smile less when they are alone (btw, he usually acts more gay when they are alone ). Well,

Spoiler for book 6:

Here where he said he is always pretending:

Spoiler for Charmed, fro Baka-Tsuki:

"Don't you think it's about time that I take off this harmless looking mask and change this image that I don't even know when I created it for myself? It is after all very tiring trying to talk courteously to a classmate all the time."

If you feel so tired, then stop it already. I completely didn't feel like controlling his expression.

"That won't do. My present image fits perfectly with how Suzumiya-san would imagine me to be. I am quite an expert in understanding her mental conditions, after all,"

Koizumi sighed in an exaggerated way,

"On just this basis alone, I feel very envious of Asahina-san. She doesn't even need to pretend, she only needs to be herself,"

"Didn't you once say Asahina-san could be making up this appearance of hers as well?"

"Oh, did you actually believe what I said? If I can win your trust, then my hard work may have produced some fruit after all."

Just as pretentious as ever. It's nearly a year already, and his flamboyant way of speech still hasn't changed a bit. Even Nagato's heart has gone through some changes, but you're still as fake as ever. Asahina-san doesn't need to change, it is best that she remains the same for now. This is because I've met the other Asahina-san, and know that it's a pre-determined fact that she would grow both physically and mentally.

"If I were to take on a different appearance..."

Koizumi began to wipe faster,

"Then it would not be a good omen. Keeping the status-quo is my duty. I'm sure you wouldn't want to see me look serious."

"Yeah, I certainly wouldn't want to. Since you're always grinning idiotically all the time, you're ideally suited to stick closely around Haruhi and help her clean up her mess or plan stuff for her. I'm really looking forward to the mystery play in the snow mountain this time. That's more than enough, right?"

It is kinda anbiguous. Kyon's comments can be seen as Itsuki is aways pretending also is the first line from Itsuki. But is not hard read in another way, though.

Well, in the end, he is a 'mysterious transfer student'

PP:
Also, you too, Triple, edit Simplicity spoilers to be under the spiler tag. If we do not take care, we might angry teh mods. Andspoil the poor aime viewers.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

... You must think that Koizumi is on an intellectual and careful detail level with L and Light Yagami.

I suppose that's possible, but he never struck me as that brilliant.

I'd say he's more on a "Lelouch" level, actually. While Light and L are certainly masters at what they do, Lelouch is capable of turning even negative scenarios to his favor.

Heck, he even managed to put on two completely separate personae, and at least once did so at the same time. Something not unlike Koizumi during the school festival.




... And no, I'm not just making the comparison because they're both voiced by JYB in their respective dubs.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Kogetsu Shirogane

I'd say he's more on a "Lelouch" level, actually. While Light and L are certainly masters at what they do, Lelouch is capable of turning even negative scenarios to his favor.

Lelouch totally screwed up the final two episodes of the original season anime. He...

1) Allowed his emotions to get the better of him.

2) Failed to make sure that his top soldier/mecha pilot was loyal to the core for him.

He would have failed miserably if Charles didn't like stupidly messing around so much.

Lelouch is a great character, but his competency is a bit over-rated. So is Koizumi's, it appears to me...



If Koizumi is all that, why hasn't he figured out Haruhi yet? Why hasn't he conceived of a method to keep her entertained into perpetuity?

[Heatth]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Lelouch is a great character, but his competency is a bit over-rated. So is Koizumi's, it appears to me...



If Koizumi is all that, why hasn't he figured out Haruhi yet? Why hasn't he conceived of a method to keep her entertained into perpetuity?

I think it is you who are exaggerating what people think

See, that faking act in the movie might be too much, I agree. However, he is, by own admission acting full time to Haruhi and, yet, she haven't discovered yet. It make he, at last, a good actor (not great, or wonderful, but good).

He is also pretty competent, at last to follow Harui's weird orders, so he migh be competent in the Organization as well (not that competent, though)

Nothing to do with be able to keep Haruhi entertained perpetuity.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Lelouch totally screwed up the final two episodes of the original season anime. He...

Spoiler for Another recent anime, use spoiler tags wisely!:

1) Allowed his emotions to get the better of him.

2) Failed to make sure that his top soldier/mecha pilot was loyal to the core for him.

And Koizumi totally screwed up as well, did he not? I'm pretty sure being forced into writing mysteries for Haruhi to solve until she eventually gets bored of it was not something he intended.

He would have failed miserably if Charles didn't like stupidly messing around so much.

Actually there's another reason for that, but this isn't a Code Geass character discussion thread.

Lelouch is a great character, but his competency is a bit over-rated. So is Koizumi's, it appears to me...

... Why did you post something in agreement with my argument if you're trying to go against it?

If Koizumi is all that, why hasn't he figured out Haruhi yet? Why hasn't he conceived of a method to keep her entertained into perpetuity?

He has, it's just that Kyon doesn't want to go along with it.

[Triple_R]

First of all... do you honestly think that there's a Code Geass fan in existence, and posting/browsing on Anime Suki's Haruhi board, that doesn't know the end to Season 1 yet? I mean, it's all been English Dubbed even, right?

For anything in R2, I'd feel compelled to put up spoiler tags, but for Season 1?

Originally Posted by Kogetsu Shirogane

And Koizumi totally screwed up as well, did he not? I'm pretty sure being forced into writing mysteries for Haruhi to solve until she eventually gets bored of it was not something he intended.



Actually there's another reason for that, but this isn't a Code Geass character discussion thread.

Yes... Charles had his reasons, but they proved rather costly in the end.

... Why did you post something in agreement with my argument if you're trying to go against it?

I mostly was going against the idea that Lelouch > Light & L. Koizumi just got caught into that with you equating him with Lelouch. So, I felt compelled to argue, more or less, that Lelouch & Koizumi are not > Light & L. Or, well, not Light anyway. L made some significant errors as well. Light was absolutely unreal in his battle with L, though.

He has, it's just that Kyon doesn't want to go along with it.

Honestly, I think it would take more than HaruhiKyon as a couple to keep Haruhi entertained. I really do.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

First of all, I'm a bit skittish when it comes to spoilers of any anime within the past five years, even those that should be considered well known. Second, there's not even a full year between the initial airdates of the end of CG and the beginning of R2, so if you're going to say one's not okay, then the other shouldn't be either. (conversely, if one's okay, they both should be.)


Third... perhaps I could've made my initial argument a little better. I apologize for that. I was more interested in trying to prove Koizumi is more along the lines of Lelouch than the DN characters than I was in actually thinking the point through.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Kogetsu Shirogane

First of all, I'm a bit skittish when it comes to spoilers of any anime within the past five years, even those that should be considered well known. Second, there's not even a full year between the initial airdates of the end of CG and the beginning of R2, so if you're going to say one's not okay, then the other shouldn't be either. (conversely, if one's okay, they both should be.)

Well, it's just that we constantly make references to the Haruhi 2006 anime (only three years old), and nobody is saying anything about that when it comes to using spoiler tags, so...

Personally, if it's really popular, and it's English dubbed, I feel it's fair game for non-spoiler tag discussion. That's just my view, though.

I don't think that R2 has been English dubbed yet, but I stand to be corrected on that. I haven't bothered to check really, as my love of Code Geass went downhill big-time with the 2nd half of R2...

Third... perhaps I could've made my initial argument a little better. I apologize for that. I was more interested in trying to prove Koizumi is more along the lines of Lelouch than the DN characters than I was in actually thinking the point through.

You have nothing to apologize for, Kogetsu.

In fairness, Koizumi's acting (if you view it as that) is closer in style to Lelouch's acting than it is to L or Light's, yes, I'll agree with you there.


If anything, I got a bit too animated. Code Geass is one anime that really hits a nerve with me for various reasons...

Spoiler for Code Geass spoiler tags out of respect for Kogetsu:

The cliffhanger ending to Season 1 being one of them.

[OkamiNoKaze]

R2 had been dubbed and ran on Adult swim, not sure about the where the DVDs are though. In fact they've restared from the beginning a quite a while ago.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by OkamiNoKaze

R2 had been dubbed and ran on Adult swim, not sure about the where the DVDs are though. In fact they've restared from the beginning a quite a while ago.

Thanks for the info. Wow... they ran through R2 pretty fast. I thought it was only about a year ago or so that the airing of the dub Code Geass began.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

They were airing it two episodes at a time. They had to restart it a few times because BZ! couldn't keep up with the broadcast schedule.



And Haruhi is slightly different in this case, as that's the series this forum is for. If we were talking in the Code Geass forum, I'd be doing the same thing with 06 Haruhi. (But that's not likely to ever happen, as I never leave this one, and you said you don't really like the series. )

[yezhanquan]

Itsuki ala Lelouch or L/Light.... My, that's alot of names beginning with L.

I think at the start of the series, Itsuki is at best indifferent to the Brigade. But, as the story progresses, this indifference moves towards the "at worst" section. At best, he seems willing to stick with the Brigade.

[quigonkenny]

No one has suggested the most obvious (to me) reason for Itsuki acting the way he does around Kyon, one that some of you may have heard from me before, so I'll say it again.

He does it simply to annoy Kyon.

Why, you might ask? Any number of reasons. 1) Haruhi seems to enjoy giving Kyon a hard time and seeing him in distress, so more Kyon distress (esp. on behalf of a romantically unthreatening character) means happy Haruhi. 2) The specific manner of his annoyance keeps Kyon from knowing too much about him or asking too many questions about him, even when prompted to. 3) He's jealous of Haruhi's attraction to Kyon. And so on...

I do side with the idea that everything Itsuki does (not just regarding Kyon) is calculated toward a certain result. His admitted farcical personality hints at it. I don't know if it's on the "wheels within wheels" level of Light or L, though.

[ac195]

Originally Posted by quigonkenny

No one has suggested the most obvious (to me) reason for Itsuki acting the way he does around Kyon, one that some of you may have heard from me before, so I'll say it again.

He does it simply to annoy Kyon.

Well you have to keep in mind that the story is being told from Kyon's point of view. From the moment he met Koizumi, he really wasn't too fond of him... so all of Koizumi's actions are seen through "Kyon-shaded-glasses."