2013-03-14, 19:09 | Link #3321 |
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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Liking Shizuno aside, I don't think anyone could look at that ending and call it "good" from a technical perspective, so I don't see the point of the backlash against people voicing such sentiments. It's all a matter of believability and consistency.
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2013-03-14, 19:15 | Link #3322 | |
エーレンフェストの聖女
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Dollars
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2013-03-14, 19:30 | Link #3323 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Except there's nothing subjective about the fact that Achiga in general, and Shizuno, in particular DID NOT GET ENOUGH PAGE TIME devoted to them. Just compare the number of scenes of Saki and her mahjong games at Kiyosumi, with Fujita-pro, at training camp, at the regionals vs how many we get of Shizuno. It's no accident that many on the forum were (jokingly) calling this side story Senriyama-hen...
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2013-03-14, 19:50 | Link #3324 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
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Basicly, you don't think that Achiga and Shizuno get enough page time BUT I am find with the amout of time they got.
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2013-03-14, 19:59 | Link #3325 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
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My point is compare the percentage of scenes that feature Saki in the main Saki story, vs percentage of scenes with Shizuno in Achiga. It's objectively true that Shizuno got a lot less scenes devoted to her development. Whether you find that level of development adequate or not is subjective, but that one is a lot less than the other is not.
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2013-03-14, 20:25 | Link #3327 |
エーレンフェストの聖女
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Dollars
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I don't think it's even relevant to bring the fact that Shizu got less screen time compared to a certain demon in main manga. In then end, people still has different opinions about it. Even if the fact is that she has less actions, there are still people out there that thinks it's acceptable.
Now if people starts thinking that she has the same amount of screen time or even more than Saki, then that fact is important to the debate. I don't think no one here disagree with the fact that she has less screen time; they just disagree whether that it's enough for her development or not.
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2013-03-14, 20:27 | Link #3328 | |
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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2013-03-14, 20:29 | Link #3329 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
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What's Senriyama got to do with anything? I don't think anyone is seriously claiming they're the protagonists; that was all just joking around. However, they did get a lot of attention that in hindsight should've gone to Achiga. For example, even though Ryuumonbuchi got significant development in Saki, they never overshadowed Kiyosumi the same way that Senriyama did Achiga. Also, spending that much time on Toki's PoV ended up being a bit of a two-edged sword, IMO.
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2013-03-14, 20:31 | Link #3330 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Age: 32
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...wouldn't all of the supernatural mahjong powers from both main and sidestory come from 'absolutely nowhere', or am I misunderstanding your point?
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2013-03-14, 20:40 | Link #3332 |
エーレンフェストの聖女
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Dollars
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But you said that 'I don't think anyone could call----', which means you hold a certain thinking that everyone should have the same opinion as you.
Yes I agree that there are certain things here that when you like it, it just means that you have a shit taste regardless of what they think about it.. but people are entitled to have different opinions in any matters. By which I mean that there's certainly a group of people that thinks the ending is good in their opinion, just like cedec0 here.. I think? I'm just pointing that out because I disagree with your view. Certainly most people would find the ending in a bad taste, but I know some people that find it acceptable. Are you denying their existence? tl;dr I'm just nitpicking your post
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2013-03-14, 20:47 | Link #3333 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Age: 32
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...but powers have to come from somewhere, right? It's not like the moment Saki was born she knew that she had auto-rinshan Kaihou or the very first mahjong game Kuro played all the dora suddenly gathered in her hand, or when Toki first picked up a mahjong tile she saw into the future or did whatever her three army ability was? I mean, logically speaking, these abilities would have to appear at some point after they already started playing?
*Thinking about it, I think FutaQ even mentions that often third years will just suddenly randomly develop abilities in the tournament, or something along those lines.
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2013-03-14, 20:52 | Link #3334 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: tamagawa
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It seemed to me that originally Achiga was planned to lose in the semifinal. Reasons: 1. Two major flags set that had to be cleared for the story were cleared soon after the first match of the semifinal. a) Akado Harue recovered from her trauma sustained during her Inter High when Kokaji said she remembered very well when she played into Harue's hand in the match she got the trauma. b) Shizuno and co. reunited with Nodoka. 2. Achiga team wasn't described so competent initially, at least not as competent as the teams which are monstrous and then Shizuno suddenly got her supernatual power with little indication (I think Koromo's comment given to Saki was first). On the other and Senriyama team had been fleshed out very well for a one-off team and was really impressive (might be more impressive than Achiga). 3. That two teams, which have club members only enough to entry the tournments and are virtually made just before the tournaments, and conveniently they are old friends, go to the final at the same time is rather silly for the story or diminishes the value of the nationals Saki's team participates in. |
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2013-03-14, 21:00 | Link #3335 | ||
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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Even despite all that, I enjoy this series for its delightful cast of characters, each with their own dilemmas and motivations for playing mahjong. The crazy interactions between lesbian mahjong powers are another definite plus. And for me, it's these factors that still made the ending very much enjoyable. Quote:
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2013-03-14, 21:00 | Link #3336 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
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2013-03-14, 21:00 | Link #3337 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Age: 32
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2013-03-14, 21:09 | Link #3338 | |
エーレンフェストの聖女
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Dollars
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..seriously though, it's hard to keep cool and do a proper debate when things gone like this... especially in a certain imageboard
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2013-03-14, 21:28 | Link #3339 | ||
Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
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However, if Saki had been hated the way Shizu is hated, there most likely would have been endless comments here calling her victory an asspull (because the "removing your socks" wasn't foreshadowed, etd...) Because Shizu is hated, Achiga-hen's "believability and consistency" is being held up to an abnormally high standard. -------- The point I am trying to make is that, in any manga where the main character is hated, fans will find endless flaws in the story. -------- Last edited by cedec0; 2013-03-14 at 21:49. |
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2013-03-14, 21:39 | Link #3340 | |
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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Saki, on the other hand, has been an established monster since the first episode. That's how she was introduced, and that the point from which she developed.
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Tags |
mahjong, nopan, seinen, sport, yuri |
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