[MANGA] Bleach Chapter 325 Discussion

[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by Slayerx

Renji as well has Bankai but he doesn't hold a candle to Byakuya, and was getting beaten horribly but Espada #8... They may say Ikkaku could become a captain but that doesn't mean he would not be the weakest amongst them... Po probably is the strongest out of the 4; which would be saying a lot if Hisagi's enemy was really at captain level at the end...

Hisagi noted that Findor "couldn't be more wrong" about being captain-level. So it's doubtful there's much truth to his claims.

Still, I realize that Po may be much stronger than the others. I just think Ikkaku deserved a little more dignity, Po doesn't even have a scratch. But I'm also glad the shinigami don't get a flawless victory. Also, I wasn't really itching to see Ikkaku do much fighting. So if he's really beaten, then it's not a big problem for me. But if he comes back and defeats Po, then he'll be redeemed. Bonus points if he manages to do it without bankai.

And Hisagi's fight was pretty sweet. It's still kind of hard to enjoy it when you know there's a huge showdown between the captains and espada less than a mile away (What are the captains doing while all this fighting is going on, taking a coffee break?). But at least we saw his shikai.

Originally Posted by WONDERMIKE

That's true, but the "fact" that he wouldn't stand a chance, even with bankai, kind of erases his guilt. I don't think it's Ikkaku who will confront Po from now on, it would be pointless² to do so as the pillar is already gone, fans would only hate him for not going bankai from the start. By letting him stay dead Kubo can save his face. And don't forget what OD said, Ikkaku isn't in the position to show us something new, so there's no real reason to feature him this time.

There's still 3 pillars left standing though and Po's going to try and finish the job. I can see Ikkaku asking the others to allow him to make up for his failure by giving him the chance to protect the remaining pillars from the enemy alone. And Yumichika might convince Kira and Hisagi to actually let him do it.

[Crusader]

yay ikkaku failed, thats good. Is he beaten perhaps not, but it's still a good thing though. This slightly spices things up. still kind of dull, but it's okay.

[Amirali]

All this talk of Ikkaku and the fraccion reminds me of just how awesome Edorad was. He fought to the death without cowardice, whereas most of the others (including Findor, birdman , Szayel, Arroniero) break out in hysterics when the end is near.

[Ichimaru]

Hey anyone else disappointed in the fights so far? how come these arrancars arent using any other skills besides just brute strength? show us some demon arts damn it

[Ryuuken]

actually... I do believe that all pillars will be destroyed eventually

[WONDERMIKE]

Originally Posted by The Small One

Actually Yamamoto's choice is completely stupid.
Those pillars are the deciding factor in this battle, therefore he should have positioned all the captains there in the first place, instead of gathering them to great Aizen.

but Aizen's gang could simply go to SS right ahead if left alone, he said so himself(beat you now, then go to real Karakura)

[Casshern]

Well it seems to me that Kubo just wants to delay the story even more.

[unameit]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

I don't really like that concept. Bankai is supposed to be the result of being a superior fighter, not a way to turn mediocre fighters into captain-levels. Ikkaku not being able to win a fight against a fraccion when the others are easily beating their opponents w/ shikai makes him look weak and doesn't give enough credibility to him having bankai in the first place.

It might be that Po is just that strong and Ikkaku got the worst match-up. Don't even if Ikkaku is really down yet. But if he really was K.O.'ed this easily, I think it's kind of cheap.

That's exactly what i think, in fact when against grimjow fraccion-edoraldo already portrayed ikkaku as a weak character.. He needed bankai to beat him and not only he would havel lost but also he would have died hadn't he used his bankai that time.. Remember, he's 3rd-seat-officer so no RESTRICTION for his power...

[Slayerx]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

Hisagi noted that Findor "couldn't be more wrong" about being captain-level. So it's doubtful there's much truth to his claims.

not really, Findor was speaking of power levels... however Hisagi's comment amounts to their being more to being a captain than power, there's a mental thing to it aswell and probably skill as well... Findor did have the power but he sorely lacked the mentality, skill, and experience and such... This is also why Hisagi felt findor was beneath him because Findor had no fear

For instance, while he was gloating over his captain level power, he SHOULD have been watching out and dodging Hisagi's next attack.

Originally Posted by unameit

That's exactly what i think, in fact when against grimjow fraccion-edoraldo already portrayed ikkaku as a weak character.. He needed bankai to beat him and not only he would havel lost but also he would have died hadn't he used his bankai that time.. Remember, he's 3rd-seat-officer so no RESTRICTION for his power...

Speaking of Ikkaku's no restriction, one thing i'd like to add was how both Rukia and Masumoto did in their fights at the time... While Ikkaku was getting his ass handing to him using his shikai, both Rukia and Masumoto finished off their enemies quite easily with Shikai... Granted, Eldorado was likely the stronger than their enemies (especially Masumoto's whom i think was only gillian class arrancar), but i think it is still worth noting

[unameit]

Originally Posted by Slayerx

not really, Findor was speaking of power levels... however Hisagi's comment amounts to their being more to being a captain than power, there's a mental thing to it aswell and probably skill as well... Findor did have the power but he sorely lacked the mentality, skill, and experience and such... This is also why Hisagi felt findor was beneath him because Findor had no fear

For instance, while he was gloating over his captain level power, he SHOULD have been watching out and dodging Hisagi's next attack.


Speaking of Ikkaku's no restriction, one thing i'd like to add was how both Rukia and Masumoto did in their fights at the time... While Ikkaku was getting his ass handing to him using his shikai, both Rukia and Masumoto finished off their enemies quite easily with Shikai... Granted, Eldorado was likely the stronger than their enemies (especially Masumoto's whom i think was only gillian class arrancar), but i think it is still worth noting

That's my point.. (I was too lazy to write all )

And also for shikai special power thingy, I think all shikai should have special power otherwise it's no different with normal weapon... If I'm not mistaken, knowing your zanpakuto name will give you the special power so zaraki doesn't have as he doesn't know the name.. I expect hisagi to have it..

[kk2extreme]

shock, ikkaku lost, i thought that he is the strongest of the pillar group

[BleachOD]

Originally Posted by kk2extreme

shock, ikkaku lost, i thought that he is the strongest of the pillar group

I think his strength is overrated. He is good at swords and has the right attitude but he's a skilled swordsman who thinks like a brawler. He also is more brute strength than actual special ability. It just looks hot.

This chapter was better than I thought. Hisagi looked cool *Squee!*Ok I take it back. Sometimes skill is nice.


Did anyone else find it funny that Hisagi says. "I don't like the shape. Look at it. It's shaped like something meant to take life" Then tries shelling Findor for all he was worth? Talk about conflicted emotions...

Does anyone thinks that some of them are in an Illusion the Espada included? <--Random OD Theory.

@Scep...for my sanity I hope Ikkaku stays down. Someone ELSE needs to make an entrance. You can't win em all. (KT does it to Ichigo all the damn time! Why should Ikkaku be any different?! *Pant*)

[Scep]

If kubo actually has the guts to kill ikkaku, i'll cheer with delight, honestly, and not because i hate him or anything. Though realistically speaking, i don't see why anyone is even considering the probability that ikkaku's dead... if it were any other manga, i might think so.... but because its kubo... hell, he revived someone who was proclaimed to be dead by a 'expert' and had a elaborate 'death' (rukia), why the hell would he let ikkaku die without even giving him a proper final battle?

[MidnightViper88]

Originally Posted by Slayerx

Speaking of Ikkaku's no restriction, one thing i'd like to add was how both Rukia and Masumoto did in their fights at the time... While Ikkaku was getting his ass handing to him using his shikai, both Rukia and Masumoto finished off their enemies quite easily with Shikai... Granted, Eldorado was likely the stronger than their enemies (especially Masumoto's whom i think was only gillian class arrancar), but i think it is still worth noting

It's also worth note that Rukia has an elemental ice-type zanpakuto, and Matsumoto has an, uhh, ash-type zanpakuto, while Ikkaku has a melee-type zanpakuto... Nakim had no known special powers other than to grow large, and D-Roy was not only the weakest in his group, but couldn't even draw his zanpakuto before being killed by Rukia...Ikkaku had to go up against the more stronger arrancar Edorad Leones that had brute strength and defense and could also control fire-based attacks, and to be fair, Ikkaku could only rely on his melee zanpakuto that doesn't have any special abilities, like an elemental-based or kido-based zanpakuto does...But regardless of having a melee zanpakuto, Ikkaku made the use of it and throughout the majority of his battle, and incorporated tactical strategy...It wasn't until Edorad released his zakpakuto and pushed Ikkaku to the edge that Ikkaku gave up on his shikai and went bankai, and even then, Ikkaku's bankai has no special abilities, other than brute strength...

You have to give credit where credit is due; In the battle between Edorad and Ikkaku, he used mere strength and strategy in order to survive the length of time that he did, even insisting fighting a released Edorad with shikai before releasing bankai, given the relative circumstances Ikkaku's powers compared to others, both Edorad and the other shinigami that were fighting...

[BleachOD]

Originally Posted by MidnightViper88

You have to give credit where credit is due; In the battle between Edorad and Ikkaku, he used mere strength and strategy in order to survive the length of time that he did, even insisting fighting a released Edorad with shikai before releasing bankai, given the relative circumstances Ikkaku's powers compared to others, both Edorad and the other shinigami that were fighting...

Imo he just used Strength. He is a skilled fighter but he didn't really do anything different with Edorad than he did battling Ichigo. The only difference was the Bankai.

Even Edorad noticed that strategy wasn't in it. Ikkaku was just enjoying the fight. He's also a quick thinker and fake artist, but that wasn't too different from before. (Which is why I said he thinks like a brawler) Tactician he's not...

Once he went Bankai he won by Brute Force alone and I think he was lucky he got the opponent he got. Other than tough skin and fire attacks Edorad was more or less the same type. Brute Strength except he was a tactician just one who was guilty of forming stratagems based on his assumptions. That's how he lost to Ikkaku that and the Bankai.

"uhh, ash-type zanpakuto" made me lol....for that you deserve a cookie.

[Mortis]

What I liked the most in this chapter was Yumichika's expression when he realized Ikkaku was down Pure shock if you ask me. (And yes - I really DO like Yumichika... dont know why but still )

Just a random thought, dont mind me

[Amirali]

I loved the quote, "everything has made him what he is. His wounds, his tattoos, his sword.." Definitely tapping on hisgai's past here, as further reinforced by the min-flashback to Tousen. Would have been nice to see a thought of Kensei too, but oh well.

Hisagi's shikai was impressive, special ability or not. The swirling blades were reminiscent of Hichigo, except dual wielded.

[Hari Michiru]

If Kubo keeps Ikkaku down, I will send him chocolates

[Monkey D. Luffy]

Ikkaku losing was a little surprising but it would of probably been more so, if he did while some of the fights were still going on. It would of put the pressure of knowing that these guys could actually take out the pillars and especially for Yumichika knowing that Ikkaku has Bankai but still didn't manage to protect the pillar. Doing that would of probably lengthen the fights though, which wouldn't be the best of things for the progression of the story.

As things are right now, this doesn't really add that much drama since one pillar was destroyed but still three remain. If Po decides to take the three remaining ones down, then that would be something else. I don't know if Ikkaku is really down for good or was just overpowered for a second but seeing as how he has Bankai there's no excuse for giving up the pillar. (Which would make his own consideration and fear of being promoted to Captain because of his ability to perform Bankai, rather premature.) Unless, he did release his Bankai but was still defeated or perhaps the fight didn't last long enough for his Bankai to get fully powered and was simply defeated.

Po, if I remember correctly was shown right behind or standing next to Barragan maybe hinting that he was the strongest member of his Fraccion. Also, he doesn't seem to be a loud mouth like the rest of the other Arrancar talking about how powerful or pretty they are. So maybe, he was good and powerful enough to take out Ikkaku and deserves some credit.

[MidnightViper88]

Originally Posted by BleachOD

Imo he just used Strength. He is a skilled fighter but he didn't really do anything different with Edorad than he did battling Ichigo.

He can't use just strength...Ikkaku has no special powers, so he relies completely on strength for battle in conjunction with his melee zanpakuto, but he doesn't use strength strength, which would be the kind of strength to purely overwhelm the opponent with, a-la Kenpachi...Instead, along with strength, he uses some strategy and also agility...

You know, you people are complaining about Ikkaku's fighting style, but...Isn't Ichigo's fighting style practically the same? The only difference is Ichigo can execute a blast of compressed spiritual power from his blade for a special attack, but that's about it...Getsuga Tenshō, no kido, pure mass spiritual power, and flash steps; Nothing else or anything special, except for bankai and hollow powers, but those merely augment what skills he already has...