Psycho-Pass 2 - Episode 6 Discussion / Poll

[HandofFate]

Poor enforcers

[zerriet]

Originally Posted by Casshern

A 0.22 caliber can easily incapacitate someone without killing them with a few shots. A bigger caliber can drop them without killing them as long as they don't hit any vital area. Having no weapon whatsoever other than a dominator, and being a sitting duck when it doesn't work, at this point doesn't make any sense storywise or any other way. It hasn't even occurred to an enforcer to secretly take a hidden carry so he wont be defenceless.

The fact that crime is occurring is already undermining the Sibyl system. It means that a high psychopass has slipped through the system undetected or that a low psychopass is committing crimes without increasing their crime coefficient. That was the whole point of imprisoning latent criminals - to prevent crime before it happens. The system is already a failure. That civilians aren't questioning Sibyl already is a plothole in itself.

Akane is a threat to the Sibyl system since she knows the truth. Taking her out of the way can mean the truth gets leaked out to the world. This hasn't changed since last season. Akane has Sibyl by the balls. There's no reason why she doesn't order Sibyl to disable or forcefully activate any dominator she wants.

It doesn't make sense that she didn't shoot him on the boat. So what if Tougane's or her coefficient increase or their hue changes colour? Kamui just manipulated civilians to commit mass murder, killed a bunch of enforcers himself, he's using a former inspector as his puppet and they just escaped with a bag of dominators. Akane managed to recover after shooting her own friend, there is absolutely no reason at all not to shoot Kamui in that scene, unless Akane is a psycho and secretly wants to see what he's planning.

You missed what thundrakkon said, What they did seems questionable in a real life context but in the context of their world, it would make sense. Akane stopped Tougane from using the gun because she wanted to prevent a repeat of the ending of last season. Bear in mind that even though they are latent criminals, it doesnt allow them to go against the law and using that fire-arm is going against the society's sense of justice.

[blakstealth]

Originally Posted by HandofFate

Poor enforcers

Hasuike(guy with that purple coat) didn't deserve that death. I kinda feel less sympathy for Division 3, however. They won't be missed.

[GDiddy]

Fuck this. I"m done. Hopefully they get better writers for the movie instead of whomever wrote this garbage.

[Boukenxha]

Why does Sybil not disable Shisui's Dominator? If there is a reason, disabling it will only make tracking Shisui difficult and what about Kamui who is invisible but only shows up when he activates Shisui's eye and start running around with a Dominator in hand?

Originally Posted by karice67

I hadn't actually thought it'd be made so relevant in this series, but I've seen the following figures around on the internet for months:

Paralyser : unlimited
Eliminator : 4 shots
Decomposer : 3 shots

The oldest comment I've found on it so far (5 minutes of searching) is from Feb 2013:

"According to the novels, it's only got 3 Decomposer shots. It's an issue of the battery, apparently."

(By-the-by, I didn't go looking for these figures out of curiousity. I was actually trying to find out if someone had made a count of how many times each Dominator mode had been used in the previous series. But in terms of numbers, the information about the number of shots the Dominator can fire is what kept coming up... Anyways, if anyone has made a tally, could you please post it somewhere? Though I suppose I could just make one when I finally watch the first series again...)

P.s. the novels are canon, btw...

Interesting find about the Dominator's limits and that it runs on batteries. I would think the first stolen Dominator would already be low on battery now? Probably the usage limits namely Eliminator and Decomposer mode nearly exhausted too (I'm speaking without making a count though)? And Kamui collecting Dominators now would actually be the simplest solution to counter this issue despite him having realized it or not, though I've also noticed that the enforcers that he and Shisui had taken down were purposely aiming at their lower limbs to incapacitate and not turn them into a pool of bloody pulp. I would speculate that the greater plan is to collect their eyeballs and build up a Dominator wielding force of their own with Kamui's puppets. If I'm him, I will want to hijack one of those police carrier van with the Dominator racks which might come with a build-in battery charger too! Now then we might really see if Sybil will be pushed to act and cancel the authorization that allow the fakes to wield the Dominators.

[Geburah]

Probably unlikely, they lacked the time to extract safely the eyes without damaging them in the process.

About why the need for more Dominators is still on the air, despite being almost impossible to hack i really doubt that they are hard to recharge, problem is of course to recharge them in combat which seems unlikely. In any case a single person carrying more than 2-3 Dominators at once for combat purposes seems not viable since they are quite bulky to carry around. One thing is to carry them and another to be ready to use them

[thundrakkon]

Originally Posted by Casshern

A 0.22 caliber *snip*

As I mentioned before, the gun issue is getting repetitive. It cannot be used by law enforcement in this ideal socialist/utilitarian society. It is illegal to use against others directly. If an Enforcer has a weapon other than a Dominator, then it defeats the purpose of having an inspector keeping check and the Dominator limiting the dangerous actions of those Latent Criminals (Enforcers). It also opens the possibility of the Enforcer going rebellious against the system, shooting the inspector without restraint, and undermining Sibyl.

Five_Overs makes a great point:

Originally Posted by Five_Overs

Um, the whole point of only allowing enforcers to use dominators is because they're latent criminals? They're presumed to cause harm if given any other weapon.

If inspectors are allowed to shoot paralyzer at will, it defeats the whole purpose of the sibyl system and would give an inspector too much power. That's against what the sibyl system is all about.

It's all about control and acceptable losses with Sibyl.

Originally Posted by Casshern

The fact that crime is occurring is already undermining the Sibyl system. *snip*

Crime has always been occurring. That is what the MWPSB (Ministry of Welfare Public Safety Bureau Criminal Investigation Department) is for. Their role is to reduce and prevent crime, detain latent criminals, and execute high CC criminals.

Kamui wants to undermine Sibyl and set people free from that system. If he does it on a large enough scale, then he hopes people will "wake up" from their day to day automation. Only when it is large enough, then Sibyl might take action. For now, the threat is within acceptable losses for Sibyl.

Originally Posted by Casshern

Akane is a threat to the Sibyl ... *snip*... Akane has Sibyl by the balls. There's no reason why she doesn't order Sibyl to disable or forcefully activate any dominator she wants.

Sibyl can eliminate Akane if Akane ever shows signs of rebellion. Since Akane is useful to Sibyl, they are letting her do her job. Sibyl controls everything... meaning drones, cameras, the media, and MWPSB. Akane is definitely not in control.

Originally Posted by Casshern

It doesn't make sense that she didn't shoot him on the boat.*snip*

It's already addressed, and it makes sense in the world they live in. I'm not going to continue to respond about the gun issues in Psycho-Pass.

@Kanon

I do agree with what you are saying and understand where you are coming from. It really does not make sense (to us) why Sibyl has not taken action. It is really up to Sibyl to decide if they want to lock the Dominators. The only thing I can think of is Sibyl wants to see how things go as an experiment, and they don't want the MWPSB to know that Sibyl can spy through Dominators.

As for why they could not locate it before, Kamui had them in a deactivated form, and he was in locations that were not easily detectable by the system.

[Boukenxha]

Originally Posted by Geburah

Probably unlikely, they lacked the time to extract safely the eyes without damaging them in the process.

About why the need for more Dominators is still on the air, despite being almost impossible to hack i really doubt that they are hard to recharge, problem is of course to recharge them in combat which seems unlikely. In any case a single person carrying more than 2-3 Dominators at once for combat purposes seems not viable since they are quite bulky to carry around. One thing is to carry them and another to be ready to use them

We don't know how Kamui does it but in this world's futuristic setting, there might be a way to extract an eye safely and preserve it in some kind of container. On the second point, you are probably right, finding an alternative to recharge the guns could definitely be possible with Kamui's seemingly unlimited talents lol.

As for why the need for more Dominators, Kamui usually formulates and executes his plans in a pragmatic way, that much we know. I might be wrong of course but going by that to guess his intentions, with more weapons you need more people to wield it, that is pretty logical to me. What other elaborate plans of his that need the additional man and firepower would be more difficult to guess though.

[HighGuard]

Going back to episode 3 of the first season, it would appear that user authentication is at the local level and not a network authentication, as it can be seen in the episode that Akane was authenticated as an authorized user before being told that it was unable to connect to the network. Which explains why sybil doesn't just de-authorize the now former inspector.

[Spectacular_Insanity]

Originally Posted by HandofFate

Poor enforcers

I know, right? It's totally expected though since when they're in the heat of action they're the ones with the highest likelihood of having their Crime Coefficients spike in the Lethal Eliminator range. They're not bad people... well, with the exception of Togane. He's obviously completely psychotic. But it *is* extremely impressive how he is so successful at hiding it behind a facade of demure gentility.

Originally Posted by GDiddy

Fuck this. I"m done. Hopefully they get better writers for the movie instead of whomever wrote this garbage.

I'm super tempted to say the same, but at the same time I really need to know if Tsunemori has a stronger... mental fortitude? (Still no fucking clue what Hues are really measuring in terms of long-term projections.) Rather doubtful, though she is a strong character overall.

...

...OR - if she is like Makishima where she could be strangling babies and not have her Hue change at all. Because that's the impression I'm getting considering how her Hue barely fluctuates past 50-or-so in high-stress situations where everyone else's goes into the low hundreds. It's been foreshadowed rather heavily thus far and I get the feeling the series is building itself up to that particular... "revelation". The writers have been laying on that idea so thick that I think it could be used for a metaphorical cake frosting at this point. (The way nearly almost every character with screentime has mentioned Tsunemori's clear Hue in some form or another is quite unsubtle.)

[Dengar]

Reading these topics is getting increasingly tiresome. Especially when you consider for all the complaints in the posts, over 75% of poll results give a passing to amazing grade.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Kanon

This is getting dumber by the episode. The writers seem to only care about the cool factor and shock value, disregarding everything else.

Why weren't Shisui and Ayonagi's dominators disabled as soon they realized they were missing? This should be standard protocol. It's already standard protocol everywhere in real life. If you lose an access card, the first thing IT does is to disable it. Happened to a colleague of mine this very week. It makes no sense to leave stolen dominators live.

I think Sybil's thinking here might be more cynical than simply dumb.

Here's the thing - Whoever is using a Dominator can only kill/stun latent criminals with it. It doesn't matter who's holding a Dominator, the only people that can be killed/stunned with it are those with high CCs. Well, unless Kamui can find a way to hack a Dominator and artificially raise/lower its CC scores, but at that point, the Dominator is probably completely out of Sibyl's control anyway.

But presuming the Dominator is still under some Sibyl control, Sibyl might think "So what if some latent criminals are getting killed? That's not entirely bad for the system, that is in fact completely consistent with the system, even if they are also Enforcers."

From Sibyl's perspective, Enforcers are probably a necessary evil. The "evil" part is why Sibyl likely doesn't care a great deal about the individual Enforcer.

Sibyl may be arrogantly thinking "Meh. Let Kamui kill off some Enforcers if he wants to. We'll just replace them with people currently in lock-up."

It is a bit strange that Sibyl appears so blasé over losing Inspectors to Kamui, but I can kind of get their seeming lack of concern over Enforcers.

Why couldn't they locate the stolen dominators before and find Kamui ridiculously easily?

Maybe Sibyl wanted to see if Akane could figure it out on her own, without such aid. Sibyl might see Kamui as an excellent test for Akane. Sibyl might be more interested in seeing just what they have with Akane than in being worried over Kamui.

[Five_Overs]

It was mentioned in episode 2 that sibyl could disable the dominators anytime they want actually. They chose not to presumably for reasons that would be stated later.

Those who watched episode 2 will also know that the dominators are tracked using GPS, which aren't reliable indoors or with obstacles.

[Tormenk]

Wasn't Mika supposed to run away screaming from Saiga? She's perfectly fine with him in the same room as her now.

As for people with the issue of why doesn't Akane take control of a Dominator, remember Sibyl requested her help to track down Makishima, someone they really wanted to add into the system. There's no such thing this time round. On the other hand the situation with Kamui smells like a Xanatos Gambit in the making. Or he's really an escapee from the system who was unwillingly drafted and now seeks to expose the entire system, and maybe that was why he was seeking Akane before?

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Five_Overs

Your first three points are addressed in episode 2, the conversation between akane and aoyanagi. Only sibyl have the right to disable dominators.

Yes. And why haven't they done so already? Shisui has been missing for days. You don't let a rogue inspector do whatever she wants.

If inspectors are allowed to shoot paralyzer at will, it defeats the whole purpose of the sibyl system and would give an inspector too much power. That's against what the sibyl system is all about.

They've already done so once in season 1. Special situations call for special measures. You really think it matters if they give inspectors a bit more power? Nobody is ever going to find out. What Sibyl wants is to maintain its facade as perfect system, this is the best way to accomplish that. Certainly better than to let a "ghost" raise hell everywhere. What's happening RIGHT NOW is what's truly undermining the Sibyl system. What are people going to think when they realize area stress level is up everywhere and the police has no means to deal with that?

It was fine in season 1 because it was presumably the first time such incidents happened. Sibyl wasn't prepared. But now that almost two years have passed, they should be. It makes no sense to me they haven't thought up a single countermeasure to this kind of threats. They're entirely powerless against individuals with low CC. I really hope this is going to be fixed soon, because this is starting to get seriously irksome. How the hell are Akane and the rest supposed to arrest Kamui and his disciples exactly? That we're six episodes in (more if you count S1's incidents) and there is no answer to that is a major problem.

[thundrakkon]

Originally Posted by Tormenk

Or he's really an escapee from the system who was unwillingly drafted and now seeks to expose the entire system, and maybe that was why he was seeking Akane before?

Oh wow, that's a really good theory. The reason why Kamui is undetectable to the system is because he is not fully human himself. That would solve a lot of questions. My only concern if he was an escapee from the Sibyl system is that he would not need to experiment on Dominators, since it should have been knowledge he knew. However, Kamui being artificial to a large capacity would make sense.

[Five_Overs]

@Kanon

Instead of thinking why Sibyl isn't using the authority it clearly has and disable the dominators, we should instead think of why Sibyl is letting Shisui do as she wishes. That conversation between Akane and Aoyanagi is there for a reason.

Regarding the weapons. Recall the conversation between Kasei and Akane. Kasei clearly doesn't believe in the existence of Kamui. Naturally, she wouldn't even let Akane use any of those countermeasures to begin with. To Sibyl, Kamui doesn't exist. Unless Akane can provide indisputable prove, Sibyl is not budging on that matter.

I don't think you get the implications of an inspector having free will to fire paralyzer. Hypothetically, if an inspector goes rogue and start shooting indiscriminately at the populace. Think for a moment what kind of damage it can cause. And that would only happen if their hue isn't clouded because they have "permission"

If their hue do get clouded, they wouldn't even want to fire the thing to begin with.

[Knightworld]

Anyone else thinking that's something odd with the collected dominator,kamui only got 7. 5 unused one kamui,one shisui. but if we think all in the division 3 is dead,then it's missing one right?
-2 inspector
-4 enforcer
-kaeda hasuike
-shisui original dominator

and in the boat scene,who's driving the boat? could be somebody doesn't dead and join them?or else?
but i think the one who's alive is the yellow jacket guy from division 3,he's the one who capable of shutdown the light in episode 4,so there's a chance that he's the one who create the hungry chicken game~

[Crontica]

You guys are really amazing, worrying about the "crappy plot points" instead of whether Akane is going to even be ok next episode. Keep talking it's obvious nothing i say is going to matter.

[Five_Overs]

Originally Posted by Crontica

You guys are really amazing, worrying about the "crappy plot points" instead of whether Akane is going to even be ok next episode. Keep talking it's obvious nothing i say is going to matter.

It's better to not get too attached to characters in this type of shows, else you'll get burned easily. I've taken a liking to Kagari and you know what happened to him in season 1. I have a feeling things aren't going to end well for Akane by the end of all of this, so always assume the worst.

Thank goodness the character in your signature is

Spoiler:

my favorite in the game. Else I'd be burned lol.